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  • Are vague release dates the next legal battleground?

    blamo2000 said:
    I really don't understand all the anger everyone seems to have towards crowd funding.  If it angers you, don't participate.  

    I bet the same people that get mad when a dev misses a release date would also get out the pitchforks and join the angry mobs when a publisher forced a dev to release a buggy game "early."

    I hate when there is no tentative release date for a game.  So much so I do not contribute to funding games that don't seem to have even a the ability to make a guesstimate (with a few exceptions).  But I don't want them taken to court or sued, or limit other people's ability to freely and openly make a decision to make a funding contribution or not.

    I really don't understand why people seem so hellbent on forcing their view on the world and how things should be on others.  If a game is asking for crowd funding and doesn't have a project management track record of being able to release a game within a reasonably competent frame of time and budget, just ignore it.  Problem solved.  Stick to only buying finished products or developers with proven track records of generally being able to release on time and budget - like inXile.  

    In Troika got back together and crowd funded a game I would throw money at them hand over fist knowing full well their track record.  Sometimes the higher risk is worth it for the possible reward.  Live and let live and stop trying to force the world and everyone in it to comply with how you think things should be.  Freedom to choose always trumps authoritarianism.  
    So you think there should be ZERO accountability for developers that publish a date, take money from customers,  have no refund policy, and then push back release dates by YEARS?

    It seems like a strange and one-sided way to look at things.  These transactions have TWO parties.  Both should have some accountability.
    How did you feel when a publisher forced a developer to release a game before it was finished because the dev went over budget and missed milestones?

    Did you side with the publisher holding the developer accountable?  The publisher being the funder and all?  The second party in the transaction.  

    Quizzical said:
    I have a solution.  If you don't like paying for games without knowing when they'll release, then don't.
    Have you ever celebrated mother's day?  Father's day?  Had a dinner with your SO for Valentine's Day?  Worn deodorant?

    Then you've fallen prey to the same influences of marketing folks who buy into these EA/Crowdfunding titles have.  I've said elsewhere, giving it this reaction is essentially: "I don't feel it affects me directly, so I refuse to give it deeper thought."  That's your right, but it makes you poorly qualified to address the issue in general.

    The inequity of verifiable and straightforward information between consumers and producer in these instances is an issue.

    It does affect me directly - when a dev looking for funding is unable to give an estimated release date, or seems to not have any project management experience, or any track record to speak of regarding keeping to a budget and time constraints - I don't fund because of it.  If they do, and it is a game I want to play and don't think I will get without contributing, then I don't.  

    Also, I celebrate mother's day because my mother would be sad if I just ignored her on her special day.  She, and all mothers, deserve a special day of recognition.  I don't do it because of marketing.  And I didn't celebrate father's day when my father was alive because he gave a shit about it as much as I do.  My father's day present from my wife to me is a day of peace.  My wife is not allowed to yell at me or force me to do anything or go anywhere - for one day.  It costs zero dollars and benefits every company zero dollars.  Sometimes my kid's art class at school has them make me something - but my kids have spent zero dollars on me on father's day.  

    I don't know why you are trying to use such twisted logic saying people are somehow pressured into funding games with poor project management.  Its not true.  

    Funding is a risk.  Be smart and don't fund any games if it causes everyone so much anxiety and butthurt and enough rage to sue crowd funding into oblivion.

    Let the rest of us use our brains to make smart and/or stupid decisions as we want.  Its risk/reward.  

    Crowd funding is around because publishers/capitalists analyzed the game or developers were too risky or not profitable enough to fund.  We can decide if the game is interesting enough to us, we can fund the risky project, usually be non or semi-professionals with no project management experience.  

    Magic isn't real - making a law stating people without the experience to know the correct budget or time needed to make a game have to magically accurately know this information isn't going to help anyone on either side of the transaction.  Period.  Even companies with experienced project managers who have put out tons of games have big issues with this.  Especially when it comes to getting out physical goods from what I have read.  
  • Clicker Heroes 2 Beta Kicks Off with Infinite Adventures for Aspiring ARPGers - MMORPG.com News

    Anyone else think it should be illegal to turn a noun into a verb?
  • Beta Delayed 'Between Days and Weeks' - Adherence to EU Regulations Caused Some Delay - Camelot Unch

    You actually left out what might be the crux of it at the beginning of the paragraph you cite.  The system cannot provide the privacy as an addition to an already existing system; it must be built from the ground up to include the privacy requirements needed to comply with GDPR.  If the system they were using was not built from the ground up to meet the GDPR standards, they would've had to migrate to a new system for storing PII and other consumer information.

    Not saying that's it, but that's one way I immediately spotted a problem arising that would take time to correct.
    But that assumes they have a reason for the PII information being tied to the beta client.  Are there purchases allowed in-game during the beta?  If not, why is any of it tied to the client?  

    I agree they would have to change their database and storage, but that wouldn't involve moving game developers to work on it I wouldn't think.  One person above stated the "beta" patch is being released and just the beta date being pushed back, which makes me think the delay was, rightfully, on the admin side/non-game dev side.  The changes in data storage/collection took up admin/non-game dev hours, and not game dev hours.

    But what I still want to know from the horses mouth is that they didn't have and won't have any of the ESO data collection crap in the game in the US/NA. 

    I have to say, I like the key elements of GDRP.  I hope we can pass something like that in the US.  
  • Beta Delayed 'Between Days and Weeks' - Adherence to EU Regulations Caused Some Delay - Camelot Unch

    blamo2000 said:
    "They said they could call it beta and put it out but it's not 100% what they promised. They need time to get the crash rate down a pinch and a small amount of polish. They said if they didn't have to do the new euro regulations, they feel they would have hit it".

    What regulations?  I read through the first page of posts and someone said it was just privacy stuff.  If so, did the game have coded-in systems that sold personal information?  If not, then couldn't they just not sell private information, or share it?  Not doing something shouldn't cause a delay.  Not doing something should give them more time logically.  

    What I'd really like information on is these EU regulations because I am having a hard time understanding this if it really is just protecting privacy rights.  
    CU undoubtedly stores financial information (Debit/credit cards) as well as the PII needed to verify charges to those cards.  Would you rather your card and billing information NOT be subject to privacy rules?
    No.  Of course not.  Why would you have such an irrational and hostile reaction to my simple question?  

    Are you saying that outside of the EU there are no privacy rules and the US version of this game isn't going to protect my CC or other personal datadata?  What specifically regarding the EU rules caused the delay.  What is different?  

    I want none of my private information shared to anyone for any reason.  I just see a lot of hyperbole and nonsense and little actual facts.  

    I am not a coder.  I know nothing about coding.  But a delay means something had to be changed or removed.  What was it?  If it is something like data sharing coded into the game, like ESO recently did, that they removed only for the EU version - I want to know.
  • If there was a Mount Rushmore for MMO Devs ...

    They should switch it from being MMO devs to game devs and it would have Tim Cain on it four times.