You may be correct about SOE's role in the game but do you really think they are not gonna have ANY say in what happens in the game?
I find it funny that you would spend time discussing the difference between a review and a preview rather then address that actual content of the preview. The fact was the Vanguard devs have been told to play WOW, not how I described the article (review or preview). I would say my facts are straight. But thanks for your input.
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
Originally posted by Talonsin You may be correct about SOE's role in the game but do you really think they are not gonna have ANY say in what happens in the game? I find it funny that you would spend time discussing the difference between a review and a preview rather then address that actual content of the preview. The fact was the Vanguard devs have been told to play WOW, not how I described the article (review or preview). I would say my facts are straight. But thanks for your input.
Well...I haven't read the preview, so I didn't think it wise to try and talk about it....you know...cause I know nothing of it.
And, no...I don't think SOE will have any say, because I know how buisness contracts work, and I know the history of those involved and I know about Developer/Publisher relationships.
Right now, SOE is in a pretty good position to make an easy buck without fronting any of the development costs or taking on new employees or any of that crap. They'll get quick returns and they'll turn a profit long before Sigil does. The only reason it would be smart for SOE to consider buying Sigil is if Vanguard turned out to be a complete flop all by itself (in which case, I doubt anyone would care that SOE bought the rights to the game or the company)...so if it flops, I could see Sigil wanting to get rid of it, and SOE would (in it's own interest) buy the game and try to fix it to bolster their Station Pass revenues.
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
Originally posted by finnmacool1 Originally posted by Vengeful
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
Some people don't have the patience to read a novel...so you're saying that those who do aren't entertained?
All I said was that if you like playing games for hours on end (6 hour Halo runs, Beat games in one sitting, have a minifridge next to your computer) and you enjoy games that are a little more subtle, slower paced (as opposed to the "Entertainment on Demand" style of games) then this one is for you.
Way to distort what I said for your own ends.
Note: I'm not saying that Vanguard can't and won't appeal to casuals, but it is definately going to appeal to the type of gamer I described above. Best bet: try it out yourself or watch your friend play or something and see if you like it.
Well...I haven't read the preview, so I didn't think it wise to try and talk about it....you know...cause I know nothing of it.
And, no...I don't think SOE will have any say, because I know how buisness contracts work, and I know the history of those involved and I know about Developer/Publisher relationships.
Right now, SOE is in a pretty good position to make an easy buck without fronting any of the development costs or taking on new employees or any of that crap. They'll get quick returns and they'll turn a profit long before Sigil does. The only reason it would be smart for SOE to consider buying Sigil is if Vanguard turned out to be a complete flop all by itself (in which case, I doubt anyone would care that SOE bought the rights to the game or the company)...so if it flops, I could see Sigil wanting to get rid of it, and SOE would (in it's own interest) buy the game and try to fix it to bolster their Station Pass revenues.
You make some good points about the relationship. It will be interesting to watch and see how this one turns out...
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
[quote]Originally posted by Talonsin [b]You may be correct about SOE's role in the game but do you really think they are not gonna have ANY say in what happens in the game? b][/quote]
i used to think the same thing until i read some of the Dev's posts and came to realize that at this point they cannot touch the game because they are under contract.
could this change in the future? I'm sure it can, but why worry about what could happen? i could die tomorrow but I'm not going to let that chance stop me from enjoying life today.
Originally posted by Vengeful Originally posted by finnmacool1 Originally posted by Vengeful
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
Some people don't have the patience to read a novel...so you're saying that those who do aren't entertained?
All I said was that if you like playing games for hours on end (6 hour Halo runs, Beat games in one sitting, have a minifridge next to your computer) and you enjoy games that are a little more subtle, slower paced (as opposed to the "Entertainment on Demand" style of games) then this one is for you.
Way to distort what I said for your own ends.
Note: I'm not saying that Vanguard can't and won't appeal to casuals, but it is definately going to appeal to the type of gamer I described above. Best bet: try it out yourself or watch your friend play or something and see if you like it.
If you are having fun or being entertained there is no need for patience. If someone cant manage to read a novel its because it doesnt interest/bores them. So yes it would require patience for someone to endure a novel that bores them, just as it does with a game that bores them.
If sitting on my ass for 15 minutes waiting on a boat then spending another 15 minutes "riding" the boat(hoping a bug didnt knock me off into the ocean) was fun i wouldnt need the patience to endure it. If spending 40+ mins getting to an area to hunt in was fun and still fun after doing it a million times i wouldnt need patience.
There is a difference between boring sinks and challenging and/or entertaining content/mechanics.
If you are having fun or being entertained there is no need for patience. If someone cant manage to read a novel its because it doesnt interest/bores them. So yes it would require patience for someone to endure a novel that bores them, just as it does with a game that bores them.
If sitting on my ass for 15 minutes waiting on a boat then spending another 15 minutes "riding" the boat(hoping a bug didnt knock me off into the ocean) was fun i wouldnt need the patience to endure it. If spending 40+ mins getting to an area to hunt in was fun and still fun after doing it a million times i wouldnt need patience.
There is a difference between boring sinks and challenging and/or entertaining content/mechanics.
If you are having fun or being entertained there is no need for patience. If someone cant manage to read a novel its because it doesnt interest/bores them. So yes it would require patience for someone to endure a novel that bores them, just as it does with a game that bores them.
If sitting on my ass for 15 minutes waiting on a boat then spending another 15 minutes "riding" the boat(hoping a bug didnt knock me off into the ocean) was fun i wouldnt need the patience to endure it. If spending 40+ mins getting to an area to hunt in was fun and still fun after doing it a million times i wouldnt need patience.
There is a difference between boring sinks and challenging and/or entertaining content/mechanics.
Alot of people like fun video games...not eveyone can stand to rent a game a beat it in one sitting. I can I save alot of money that way.
If you are having fun or being entertained there is no need for patience. If someone cant manage to read a novel its because it doesnt interest/bores them. So yes it would require patience for someone to endure a novel that bores them, just as it does with a game that bores them. If sitting on my ass for 15 minutes waiting on a boat then spending another 15 minutes "riding" the boat(hoping a bug didnt knock me off into the ocean) was fun i wouldnt need the patience to endure it. If spending 40+ mins getting to an area to hunt in was fun and still fun after doing it a million times i wouldnt need patience. There is a difference between boring sinks and challenging and/or entertaining content/mechanics.
but, not everyone defines that difference the same way. Especially not when taking the overall game into account. What's entertaining in the immediate sense is not necessarily what makes a game more fun overall. Just the contrary, non-stop fast paced action can become even more monotonous in the long run. Consider the meaning of "monotonous," it's about lacking variation and contrast, often used synonymously with "boring."
Doesn't just apply to games, either. Similar dynamic in other forms of entertainment, too. Not everyone wants to watch action all the time, and even action movies can benefit from having slow parts, which might get boring if viewed seperately from the rest of the movie. The action can be made more effective by contrast, and slower parts can add depth and meaning, only seeming boring if viewed as seperate from the rest of the movie.
And yet, some people will never appreciate anything like that. It's all a matter of preference, but either way, good entertainment is a more complicated art than many seem to think. Of course, I'm not saying slow parts can be thrown in carelessly. Like every other aspect of the game, they'd need to be done well, or they do just plain suck.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Comments
You may be correct about SOE's role in the game but do you really think they are not gonna have ANY say in what happens in the game?
I find it funny that you would spend time discussing the difference between a review and a preview rather then address that actual content of the preview. The fact was the Vanguard devs have been told to play WOW, not how I described the article (review or preview). I would say my facts are straight. But thanks for your input.
Well...I haven't read the preview, so I didn't think it wise to try and talk about it....you know...cause I know nothing of it.
And, no...I don't think SOE will have any say, because I know how buisness contracts work, and I know the history of those involved and I know about Developer/Publisher relationships.
Right now, SOE is in a pretty good position to make an easy buck without fronting any of the development costs or taking on new employees or any of that crap. They'll get quick returns and they'll turn a profit long before Sigil does. The only reason it would be smart for SOE to consider buying Sigil is if Vanguard turned out to be a complete flop all by itself (in which case, I doubt anyone would care that SOE bought the rights to the game or the company)...so if it flops, I could see Sigil wanting to get rid of it, and SOE would (in it's own interest) buy the game and try to fix it to bolster their Station Pass revenues.
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
Some people don't have the patience to read a novel...so you're saying that those who do aren't entertained?
All I said was that if you like playing games for hours on end (6 hour Halo runs, Beat games in one sitting, have a minifridge next to your computer) and you enjoy games that are a little more subtle, slower paced (as opposed to the "Entertainment on Demand" style of games) then this one is for you.
Way to distort what I said for your own ends.
Note: I'm not saying that Vanguard can't and won't appeal to casuals, but it is definately going to appeal to the type of gamer I described above. Best bet: try it out yourself or watch your friend play or something and see if you like it.
Well...I haven't read the preview, so I didn't think it wise to try and talk about it....you know...cause I know nothing of it.
And, no...I don't think SOE will have any say, because I know how buisness contracts work, and I know the history of those involved and I know about Developer/Publisher relationships.
Right now, SOE is in a pretty good position to make an easy buck without fronting any of the development costs or taking on new employees or any of that crap. They'll get quick returns and they'll turn a profit long before Sigil does. The only reason it would be smart for SOE to consider buying Sigil is if Vanguard turned out to be a complete flop all by itself (in which case, I doubt anyone would care that SOE bought the rights to the game or the company)...so if it flops, I could see Sigil wanting to get rid of it, and SOE would (in it's own interest) buy the game and try to fix it to bolster their Station Pass revenues.
You make some good points about the relationship. It will be interesting to watch and see how this one turns out...
[quote]Originally posted by Talonsin
[b]You may be correct about SOE's role in the game but do you really think they are not gonna have ANY say in what happens in the game?
b][/quote]
i used to think the same thing until i read some of the Dev's posts and came to realize that at this point they cannot touch the game because they are under contract.
could this change in the future? I'm sure it can, but why worry about what could happen? i could die tomorrow but I'm not going to let that chance stop me from enjoying life today.
If you aren't really casual and are one of the few left with the virtue of patience....this game is for you!
(Seriously though, looks good...hope they pull through)
Darn here ive been playing games to have fun and be entertained. I guess whats been lacking in my playstyle is the patience to endure tedius,boring, frustrating sinks and mechanics. Guess ill never be "hardcore".
Some people don't have the patience to read a novel...so you're saying that those who do aren't entertained?
All I said was that if you like playing games for hours on end (6 hour Halo runs, Beat games in one sitting, have a minifridge next to your computer) and you enjoy games that are a little more subtle, slower paced (as opposed to the "Entertainment on Demand" style of games) then this one is for you.
Way to distort what I said for your own ends.
Note: I'm not saying that Vanguard can't and won't appeal to casuals, but it is definately going to appeal to the type of gamer I described above. Best bet: try it out yourself or watch your friend play or something and see if you like it.
If you are having fun or being entertained there is no need for patience. If someone cant manage to read a novel its because it doesnt interest/bores them. So yes it would require patience for someone to endure a novel that bores them, just as it does with a game that bores them.
If sitting on my ass for 15 minutes waiting on a boat then spending another 15 minutes "riding" the boat(hoping a bug didnt knock me off into the ocean) was fun i wouldnt need the patience to endure it. If spending 40+ mins getting to an area to hunt in was fun and still fun after doing it a million times i wouldnt need patience.
There is a difference between boring sinks and challenging and/or entertaining content/mechanics.
Alot of people like fun video games...not eveyone can stand to rent a game a beat it in one sitting. I can
I save alot of money that way.
Don't matter what they say bout beta now!
Don't matter if the release is somewhat later then expected
Don't matter that it does not have as many subscribers as WOW
Even don't matter that SOE does the marketing (and that's a tough one for me since they destroyed SWG
)
I will still play VANGUARD, and I still think it will be great!!
http://www.theseraphimguild.com/
Doesn't just apply to games, either. Similar dynamic in other forms of entertainment, too. Not everyone wants to watch action all the time, and even action movies can benefit from having slow parts, which might get boring if viewed seperately from the rest of the movie. The action can be made more effective by contrast, and slower parts can add depth and meaning, only seeming boring if viewed as seperate from the rest of the movie.
And yet, some people will never appreciate anything like that. It's all a matter of preference, but either way, good entertainment is a more complicated art than many seem to think. Of course, I'm not saying slow parts can be thrown in carelessly. Like every other aspect of the game, they'd need to be done well, or they do just plain suck.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.