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Core Gamer = Hard Core Gamer
jonaku
Member Posts: 281
McQuaid keeps saying that his game is targetted to the "Core Gamer". But that is total bulls---. Don't believe it for a second. From the way he talks about his stupid "Vision" (how deluded is that?), you can tell that if you try to solo or play this game casually, you ain't gonna get anything accomplished. The game will require forced grouping to get anything done.
He says "core gamer" so as not to scare off the casuals, but it's just a weak, transparent euphanism for hardcore forced grouping sadomasochistic gamers who yearn for the days of crappy EQ.
Comments
You have a lot of anger, maybe you should use the Soe thread instead of the general forum like you tards have been repeatedly told.
Brad McQuaid invented the druid and necromancer in EQ.. you tellin me he aint gonna want to solo in this game? I bet we'll be able to!
And yes its for hardcore players not casual players in general. It's been stated that the core target is Hardcore players who like to group and raid - who don't want things handed to them.
Make a difference!
He mentions it a lot.
~ Ancient Membership ~
Yes it's all over the place
, the hater's are just getting very crafty.
One....more....time.
You want to casual, you want to play by yourself? I'd like to introduce you to Oblvion, or Morrowind. Great games. You'll love them, and you can play them at your own pace. You can even save!!!! =O
Secondly...
We've already been told you can solo to max Level, you just are only going to see 20% of the content available. That's your play style. That's your choice. 60% of the content will be for Groups, and last time I checked....that's about the population of people who group regularly is.
So everyone is happy.
Thirdly...
I play MMOs to play with my friends, my girlfriend, and other people I may meet. I play MMOs to play with other people, and I play games to have a little challenge. If I wanted mindless, I'd play Tetris, if I wanted only story, I'd watch a movie or read a book.
Even though "Casual" brings about more $$$ because it is more accessable to the public, GAMERS don't want to play casual games. You know...the people who identify ourselves with games. The ones that rent a game and beat it in one 6 hour sitting for a nice night in. Or break out the Xbox and Halo2 it up when all the friends are over. These are the people that Brad and company are targeting their game for. Not these "Casual" players.
I mean, I've played games casually. I'm casually playing EQII right now while I'm waiting for Vanguard to come out or a Beta. I'm also in the process of moving and other such distractions. I log on an hour or so a day, maybe a couple for a dungeon crawl on the weekend. Just something to get my mind of things and have a little fun. But I don't expect 100% of the content to be accessable by me. I don't expect the game to be aimed at players like me. Its a CASUAL AFFAIR!!!!! If 100% of the content IS accessable by me....I wouldn't notice. Likewise would I notice that it wasn't....because well....I don't see that content. o.O
And really...grouping isn't as hard as some people make it out to be. It takes like 10 minutes max to find a group to do something in almost any MMO i've played in, even barren ol' DDO...and if these "Casual" players would only stop bitching about how hard it is to find a group and actually try to, they'd be grouping and having fun before they new it.
Yay, Double Post
http://doublepost.ytmnd.com/
If you read the game play forums, you see that they are going to implement harsh corpse runs, little mapping assistance, most of the content will require a group otherwise you will be solo grinding the very little content left to you, a tough level grinding curve so that it takes a year to reach max level....
When they say "core gamer", they really do mean "hard core" gamer. The kind of person who spends 5 to 12 hours a day playing the game without fail. That's not core or moderate. That's obsessive.
Casuals need not apply.
Is this news? This has been the point of Vanguard since Brad first thought it up. It's going to be a hardcore gamers game. If you don't like that i suggest you try a more casual friendly title like WoW. You won't find many people agreeing or sympathizing with you in a forum dedicated to the game. We happen to like a game to be a test of our will. Thats what makes the game so gratifying.
Make a difference!
Bingo.
That's why I am interested in playing Vanguard in the first place.
Pretty sure it's already understood it will be a "hardcore" game.
~ Ancient Membership ~
Is this news? This has been the point of Vanguard since Brad first thought it up. It's going to be a hardcore gamers game. If you don't like that i suggest you try a more casual friendly title like WoW. You won't find many people agreeing or sympathizing with you in a forum dedicated to the game. We happen to like a game to be a test of our will. Thats what makes the game so gratifying.
It is news. Here's why.
Brad keeps saying that the game is NOT for hardcore gamers, it's for, what he euphemistically calls "core gamers" which are somewhere between "hard core" and "casual".
But there is no "core gamer" mentality in the game mechanics they are proposing with painful corpse runs and XP debt or loss upon death and little mapping assistance, and so forth. This is not for some theoretical "moderate core gamer", this is definitely for the bleeding edge hard core gamer.
I just think it's disingenuous, don't you?
jonaku i appreciate your freedom to post whatever you like but clearly you don't like Vanguard and will not be playing it. We don't care if you agree with Brad's vision for the game. WE DO! Thats why we are fanboi's. He's not going to make it more casual no matter how much you whine. But don't worry theres hope. In a few years after us hardcore gamers have had our fun SOE will purchase the game in full and turn it into some sappy casual friendly PoS like they did EQ. Just wait your turn please.
Make a difference!
jonaku i appreciate your freedom to post whatever you like but clearly you don't like Vanguard and will not be playing it. We don't care if you agree with Brad's vision for the game. WE DO! Thats why we are fanboi's. He's not going to make it more casual no matter how much you whine. But don't worry theres hope. In a few years after us hardcore gamers have had our fun SOE will purchase the game in full and turn it into some sappy casual friendly PoS like they did EQ. Just wait your turn please.
I don't mind if Brad calls the game "for hard core only". It's his game.
But i do mind when he says "No, no, no, no, this game is NOT for hard cores. It is for "core gamers" which are neither hard core nor casuals. So you casual players, please feel free to play my game, it's not gonna be that hard core. Except for corpse runs. And XP loss/debt upon death. And 12-month long grinds to max level. And very little mapping assistance. And no teleporting or hearth stones under any circumstance."
My problem here is NOT that the game is hard core. My problem is that it seems to me that they tricking people into thinking the game is NOT hard core, when it really IS.
Don't you have a problem with that?
Core gamer = Core gamer. A group is needed for tough enemies, it's just logic. If you want to solo you can go play WoW. You can solo to level 60. WE DON'T WANT THAT!
When Brad says Core gamer, that's what he mans. Most gamers like to solo a little bit but mostly group. That's what the core gamer is.
Nice flamebait though.
So you casual players, please feel free to play my game, it's not gonna be that hard core. Except for corpse runs. And XP loss/debt upon death. And 12-month long grinds to max level. And very little mapping assistance. And no teleporting or hearth stones under any circumstance
Go play WoW then! You can get to max level in 16 days (Wingbane on my first server got to level 60 in 16 days) and you can solo all the way to the top! Also there are NO death penalties and you can fly birdies and teleport home all you want! Sounds like the perfect game for you.
Funny, even you though seem to know that Vanguard is the place to be.
So you casual players, please feel free to play my game, it's not gonna be that hard core. Except for corpse runs. And XP loss/debt upon death. And 12-month long grinds to max level. And very little mapping assistance. And no teleporting or hearth stones under any circumstance
Go play WoW then! You can get to max level in 16 days (Wingbane on my first server got to level 60 in 16 days) and you can solo all the way to the top! Also there are NO death penalties and you can fly birdies and teleport home all you want! Sounds like the perfect game for you.
Funny, even you though seem to know that Vanguard is the place to be.
Look, I am AGREEING with you.
I wish Brad would TELL people that casuals need not apply and that they should stick to WOW.
But he's not.
He's telling all these casuals "Come into Vanguard, it's not hard core, it's for 'core gamers'. You casuals are almost like 'core gamers' so you'll enjoy my little game."
But you know what's gonna happen? All these casuals will join the game and freak out at the XP loss upon death, impossible-to-solo corpse runs, mind deadening level grinding solo, no way to teleport out of a dungeon if you're unexpectedly called for dinner, and so forth. Then the casuals will start whining that the game is too hard.
You hard core gamers don't want that. We can all agree on that.
So why is Brad misrepresenting the game and tricking casual players into testing out Vanguard? To me, it's just deceptive marketing. Don't you agree?
What you should do is read the FAQ, and check out some fansites like http://www.silkyvenom.com where the information is a little more strait forward and isn't tainted by the fanboi fever.
Death Penalty: Debt, Corpse Run /w mount and any secondary gear kept in saddlebags. There's a glowy trail leading you to your corpse. If you are resurrected, you lose some of your debt.
XP Curve: Long (it's true) but it is long to accomodate for the size of the world. The focus is on "Adventuring" and "Exploring" and "Experiencing" instead of hitting max level and experiencing "End Game".
Map: Yes...there is a map, there's an extremely helpful map.
Content: A huge part of what this game is attempting to become is the game that you play with friends and families, and make new, lasting friendships. 60% of the content is geared for 3-6 person groups, and there are quite a few mechanisms that are in the game to help groups stay together and remain static. This is an age old argument, but...if you simply prefer to play by yourself, then perhaps an MMO just isn't for you.
20% of the content is allegedly aimed at Solo/Casual players. That does not mean that 20% of the mobs are soloable mobs that you "Grind". It means that 20% of the quests are Soloable.That means 20% of the game is soloable, and that 20% of the game can get a character to max level (even though at a slightly slower pace) without much repitetion. And that is just the adventuring...there is also Diplomacy and Crafting, that you can do by yourself (for the most part).
If you had read the FAQs, you'd know that the team is very interested in making Solo/Casual viable, but not the focal point. If you truely want to enjoy this game...you'd need to make a few friends, or bring some existing ones and group, and to see yourself progress at a pleasing rate, you'd need to devote more than just an hour or two a night....and if you can't stand to devote more than that...then it sounds like you don't like your own hobby that much. And if you don't have time for it...then it sounds like you don't really have enough time to be playing video games in the first place =P
So, just for clarification...
Solo/Casual: Plays by themselves or only once in a while.
Core Gamer: Generaly plays 3-6 hours a day, and groups in groups of 3-6 on a regular basis. MMOs are their primary source of entertainment.
Hardcore: Plays 6-12 hours a day, raids in groups of 20-40, must experience all content.
Vanguard is aimed at the Core Gamer. "Hardcore" isn't refering to the sadomasichistic mechanisms of the game, it's refering to the playstyle and the level of organization put into that playstyle. It is true that Vanguard is a "tougher" game, in that it isn't easy and everything isn't spoon-fed to you, but that doesn't mean it's geared towards the "Hardcore"....it just means it's harder =P
You can still be a Solo/Casual player and totally dig the Corpse Runs, XP Debt, Level Curve, and Travel times.
He mentions it a lot.
That's freaking hilarious right there... well done.
Damn.. I did it once in that one sentance alone!
Oh no.. again! Somebody Stop Me!
GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Disclaimer: I have no horse in this race. I don't ever intend on playing this game and I only read about it becausse of idle curiosity. I also don't care about game that think they are "hardcore" having played MUDs with much worse penalties than any MMO I have ever heard of its all just academic to me.
I have to say that the OP has a point. I have seen many people who seem to think Vanguard will be the solution to their WoW non-raiding woes and various other people who seem to think this game will be casual friendly in some way. I don't know where they get this idea since even a cursory glance at the FAQ should make them think twice. I'm not gonna blame Brad "The Vision", I mean he has a FAQ right there. Hah "vision", that cracks me up. Is that like "design"? Maybe its a design you get on peyote?
But either way the OP is right you guys are gonna get flooded with a buncha of WoW'ers under some kinda misimpression. Its all well and fine that you want a "hardcore" game, but I'm telling you right now there seems to be a number of people out there who don't think that is what the "Vision" is. They may be wrong, but the point is they don't know they are wrong.
Agreed.
But to elaborate on a point, Brad himself has posted on the Vanguard boards basically saying "This game is NOT for hard core only. It is for 'core gamers' who are NEITHER hard core NOR casual." This gives false hope to people who are more to the casual end of the spectrum because they'll be in for rude surprise that this game is in reality very hard core.
Insert generic anime quote/My Chemical Romance lyrics here.
That's only because EQ "jumped the shark" when the Vision died.
LoL I've noticed that too =P
I love Woody at GU's take on "The Vision". It's a large rolled up piece of paper with eyes and a mouth that works at Sigil.