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Asheron's Call sells 3,958 digital downloads its first week topping the online sales for Direct2Driv
radlin
Member Posts: 266
It's first week as a digital download option, AC1 sold a staggering 3,958 digital download purchases.
Now some of these are very likely additional "mule" accounts and such for existing players that won't increase server popluations. But surely some of them are new players as well.
Good for Turbine.
Comments
Check the numbers for Asheron's call in MMOGChart.com . It is sad.
how is it possible to even try to use that site as reference to anything?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
It's actually pretty simple but let me summarize it for you.
(This is all info I'm taking from the MMOGChart)
AC1 Launched last half of '99.
It went up in subscribers quickly, and slowed down around 100k subscribers.
It stayed around 100k for a while before peaking at approx 125k around Jan '02.
It then went through a steady decline and now appears to have approx. 10k subscribers. (That's not simultaneous players, it's total number of people with active subscriptions)
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
explain the simple stuff behind all the other charts other than the main one that has dates and numbers on it.
seriously, why is anyone taking that site as anything other than a bad joke?
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
If you would like to, please tell us why it is a joke.
It's a pretty simple idea. He asks the companies for their subscriber count. He then takes that number and puts it in a database with a date. He then makes a simple chart comparing the subscriber counts to the dates.
It's rather simplistic and anyone could do it, except that this guy has taken the time to get the numbers.
"Because it's easier to nitpick something than to be constructive." -roach5000
Except for the fact that in his own words bruce (I think that was his name) states that he very rarely gets subscriber numbers (he says he does know some of the ceo's and sometimes does get the numbers). Rather these are his best estimates from press releases where the wording is always shady, revenue generated in annual reports again where the wording is shady from revenue to accrued revenue to forecast...
So there is nothing really sure about those numbers, they are best guesses.
Venge Sunsoar
Which FF Character Are You?
Originally posted by fgetce And don't bother with MMORPGCHART.com that guy is just a
guy, like you or me, with a site. He does not have any deep throats
spilling their guts about their companys to him. He simply guesses
when there isn't any official word from these gaming companies. Only
once has SOE spouted about their SWG when it broke 300,000 and he
posted it on his chart. Since than they have never announced their
subscriber numbers, and now he is just guessing (and a very poor guess
it is). They did anounce they sold 1 milion units, but like I said
that number means nothing.
but hey, maybe you think he's got the inside track on a lot of stuff. i mean, just look at all the numbers he DOESN'T have.
but from the horse's mouth, let's see:
Firstly, I rely on the companies and employees themselves to
provide the bulk of the data. The
numbers they give could be completely made up, and as Enron taught us, even
financial reports could be misleading.
However, given that none of claims seem highly outrageous, and that all
companies are equally capable of lying, it would seem that the numbers given
are pretty close to the truth. There is
probably some minor fudging involved when a company wants to claim a major
milestone, rounding up to the nearest 5K or 10K increment. But at the very least, the relative
comparison between MMOGs is retained, even if individual data points may be off
10% or more.
Secondly, there’s no universal consensus on what constitutes
an active subscriber. Some companies
may count players currently on their traditional first “free month” as a
current subscriber, whereas others might not start counting them until after
that period and the customer actually chooses to subscribe. Although the accounts that don’t subscribe
get “subtracted’ a month later, such accounting could create a continuous
effect of inflating the overall subscription total. Most MMOGs probably do this, but some may not, and this may make
them appear slightly larger than they actually are. Still, after the initial launch of a game or an expansion, the
actual monthly effect of such accounts should be relatively minor… perhaps on
the order of 10%.
Finally, a “subscriber” is generally counted as anindividually numbered account currently in a company’s billing system. In some instances, one person may maintain
multiple accounts, and thus be double or even triple-counted. Some MMOGs may even encourage this behavior
more than others. There isn’t much I
can do about this fact; again, the effect is probably minor compared to the
overall population of a given MMOG, and in any case it’s certainly valid to
count such multiple subscriptions if your goal is to evaluate the relative
market share of each MMOG.
now, add to the multiple subscriber thing - gold farmers. whom exactly is he contacting at the various companies? he updates on whims. i see where it says that when games gets updated he'll update, but i also see a months-long gaps where he did no updating at all.
April 11, 2006
Wow, okay, so it’s been a while. I updated my data last November, but for some reason the data
never got pushed to the web site.
I’ve temporarily released a new Version 19.0 with some of that data,
going up to approximately January.
I’m going to try to complete a fully revised set of data and analysis
as soon as possible. In the meantime,
enjoy the new release.
October 20, 2005
Yes, I am alive.
I’ve been completely out of action for the past few months, so I’m
afraid I’ve been unable to update my research, or keep previous commitments,
or answer all of my email enquiries.
I’m trying to get caught up this weekend, however, so apologies all
around and I hope to have a new update out soon.
let me tell you, i'm impressed with how much time and effort is put nto making sure this site is highly accurate and reflects numbers that actually tell me something. he made a note in october 05, then in april 06, he says he updated stuff in nov 05 but it never showed... um, yeah, highly reliable here.
now, where in any of this are actual census readings? do i want to play a game that has 90% of it's playerbase under the age of 15? or 75% of the players are unemployed and play 12+ hours a day? is the game attractive to women? older people? what in these charts actually tells me anything worthwhile other than randomly updated guesses at numbers?tell me EXACTLY what use these numbers are? do i play doom or any of the doom-esque fps' out there? let's see numbers for things like those so that folks can say *ooo X number of players play my game* --- what is the point in that?
5 billion chinese are buddhist. does that make THAT religion the best in the world? because the only things you can infer from the limited, questionable, information on this site are on this EXACT line of thinking.
but it's really very simple to simply input information that you find on company sites or that they tell you. yet, for some reason it's incredibly complicated to input that information into a document and put it on the web? even these overly simplistic numbers which represent nothing other than subs? so i have to ask just HOW reliable is anything coming from this guy? if i wanted people to go to my site and actually believe things, i'm pretty sure i'd be updating a lot more than a couple of times a year and a lot more than once a quarter. but hey, maybe it's cool to think you added something in november and then go back 6 months later and realize you hadn't.... not cool if you're relying on this guy to provide you with actual information that you're using for ANYTHING.
as a caveat - if you can't follow the simple lines of thinking represented in this post, please don't pretend to and post asinine statements which have no relevance to anything other than your feet.
edited to add: someone stated that the numbers on that site also include gamecards...
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
"Trust everyone; and cut the cards."
His charts are good for another source of information to add to what exeperinced gamers already know from playing those games.
edited to add:
i'm looking around, i see no stats/numbers for things like...
people who play because they like the crafting (or think it's craptastic in X game)
or for pvp, raiding, end game, graphics, et cetera. it shows none of these things as being things the people like/dislike.
so the ONLY thing you can use this site for is to make comparisons along the lines of: 5 billion chinese are buddhists, that means it's the most numerous religion in the world, that means it's the best religion.
if anyone is unable to comprehend the analogy of the numbers to religion and apply it to game numbers equalling the best game, then please, shh.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Originally posted by fgetce And don't bother with MMORPGCHART.com that guy is just a
guy, like you or me, with a site. He does not have any deep throats
spilling their guts about their companys to him. He simply guesses
when there isn't any official word from these gaming companies. Only
once has SOE spouted about their SWG when it broke 300,000 and he
posted it on his chart. Since than they have never announced their
subscriber numbers, and now he is just guessing (and a very poor guess
it is). They did anounce they sold 1 milion units, but like I said
that number means nothing.
but hey, maybe you think he's got the inside track on a lot of stuff. i mean, just look at all the numbers he DOESN'T have.
but from the horse's mouth, let's see:
Firstly, I rely on the companies and employees themselves to
provide the bulk of the data. The
numbers they give could be completely made up, and as Enron taught us, even
financial reports could be misleading.
However, given that none of claims seem highly outrageous, and that all
companies are equally capable of lying, it would seem that the numbers given
are pretty close to the truth. There is
probably some minor fudging involved when a company wants to claim a major
milestone, rounding up to the nearest 5K or 10K increment. But at the very least, the relative
comparison between MMOGs is retained, even if individual data points may be off
10% or more.
Secondly, there’s no universal consensus on what constitutes
an active subscriber. Some companies
may count players currently on their traditional first “free month” as a
current subscriber, whereas others might not start counting them until after
that period and the customer actually chooses to subscribe. Although the accounts that don’t subscribe
get “subtracted’ a month later, such accounting could create a continuous
effect of inflating the overall subscription total. Most MMOGs probably do this, but some may not, and this may make
them appear slightly larger than they actually are. Still, after the initial launch of a game or an expansion, the
actual monthly effect of such accounts should be relatively minor… perhaps on
the order of 10%.
Finally, a “subscriber” is generally counted as anindividually numbered account currently in a company’s billing system. In some instances, one person may maintain
multiple accounts, and thus be double or even triple-counted. Some MMOGs may even encourage this behavior
more than others. There isn’t much I
can do about this fact; again, the effect is probably minor compared to the
overall population of a given MMOG, and in any case it’s certainly valid to
count such multiple subscriptions if your goal is to evaluate the relative
market share of each MMOG.
now, add to the multiple subscriber thing - gold farmers. whom exactly is he contacting at the various companies? he updates on whims. i see where it says that when games gets updated he'll update, but i also see a months-long gaps where he did no updating at all.
April 11, 2006
Wow, okay, so it’s been a while. I updated my data last November, but for some reason the data
never got pushed to the web site.
I’ve temporarily released a new Version 19.0 with some of that data,
going up to approximately January.
I’m going to try to complete a fully revised set of data and analysis
as soon as possible. In the meantime,
enjoy the new release.
October 20, 2005
Yes, I am alive.
I’ve been completely out of action for the past few months, so I’m
afraid I’ve been unable to update my research, or keep previous commitments,
or answer all of my email enquiries.
I’m trying to get caught up this weekend, however, so apologies all
around and I hope to have a new update out soon.
let me tell you, i'm impressed with how much time and effort is put nto making sure this site is highly accurate and reflects numbers that actually tell me something. he made a note in october 05, then in april 06, he says he updated stuff in nov 05 but it never showed... um, yeah, highly reliable here.
now, where in any of this are actual census readings? do i want to play a game that has 90% of it's playerbase under the age of 15? or 75% of the players are unemployed and play 12+ hours a day? is the game attractive to women? older people? what in these charts actually tells me anything worthwhile other than randomly updated guesses at numbers?tell me EXACTLY what use these numbers are? do i play doom or any of the doom-esque fps' out there? let's see numbers for things like those so that folks can say *ooo X number of players play my game* --- what is the point in that?
5 billion chinese are buddhist. does that make THAT religion the best in the world? because the only things you can infer from the limited, questionable, information on this site are on this EXACT line of thinking.
but it's really very simple to simply input information that you find on company sites or that they tell you. yet, for some reason it's incredibly complicated to input that information into a document and put it on the web? even these overly simplistic numbers which represent nothing other than subs? so i have to ask just HOW reliable is anything coming from this guy? if i wanted people to go to my site and actually believe things, i'm pretty sure i'd be updating a lot more than a couple of times a year and a lot more than once a quarter. but hey, maybe it's cool to think you added something in november and then go back 6 months later and realize you hadn't.... not cool if you're relying on this guy to provide you with actual information that you're using for ANYTHING.
as a caveat - if you can't follow the simple lines of thinking represented in this post, please don't pretend to and post asinine statements which have no relevance to anything other than your feet.
edited to add: someone stated that the numbers on that site also include gamecards...
This site is something that the guy does in his spare time, he has had accurate numbers for some mmo's available before the companies released it himself, his info is consistently accurate.
Either way the whole purpose of the site is to track the various populations of all of the MMO's on the market to give a rough overall picture of the entire market. It is for information purposes only.
There's absolutely no reason that you needed to be a complete tard about it.
Either way the whole purpose of the site is to track the various populations of all of the MMO's on the market to give a rough overall picture of the entire market. It is for information purposes only.
There's absolutely no reason that you needed to be a complete tard about it.
there's even less a reason why in about every thread i've read the past couple of days people are referring to THAT site as if it contains some great information which proves something.
it doesn't prove anything.
an your statement isn't accurate. the guy that runs the site, himself, says that on a lot of games he's just taking a rough guess at numbers. so no, it's not highly accurate and there's no way of telling which games he's really taking a guess at (and just guessing a lot) or which are from whatever supposedly official means.
after the 5th thread i'd read today referring to this site, i got tired of it. this site tells you nothing useful.
oh, X people play that game. ok thanks. Y people eat macaroni and cheese. neither one of these facts tells me anything about the game at all, other than numbe of subscribers.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Either way the whole purpose of the site is to track the various populations of all of the MMO's on the market to give a rough overall picture of the entire market. It is for information purposes only.
There's absolutely no reason that you needed to be a complete tard about it.
there's even less a reason why in about every thread i've read the past couple of days people are referring to THAT site as if it contains some great information which proves something.
it doesn't prove anything.
an your statement isn't accurate. the guy that runs the site, himself, says that on a lot of games he's just taking a rough guess at numbers. so no, it's not highly accurate and there's no way of telling which games he's really taking a guess at (and just guessing a lot) or which are from whatever supposedly official means.
after the 5th thread i'd read today referring to this site, i got tired of it. this site tells you nothing useful.
oh, X people play that game. ok thanks. Y people eat macaroni and cheese. neither one of these facts tells me anything about the game at all, other than numbe of subscribers.
It's not SUPPOSED to tell you anything about the games listed. It is for information purposes only, and in the cases where he doesn't get direct information from the publisher or an employee he at least tries to get info from financial records or other sources and makes an educated guess from there.
As for the site having no usefull information, that's not true either. The section on the total worldwide subscriber numbers and the genre distribution are both usefull pieces of data and provide a lot of information about the industry in general. So while it may not be usefull to you, it IS usefull to someone.
As for the site having no usefull information, that's not true either. The section on the total worldwide subscriber numbers and the genre distribution are both usefull pieces of data and provide a lot of information about the industry in general. So while it may not be usefull to you, it IS usefull to someone.
i hope you're not insinuating it's of use to people who create games, or their marketing folks.
there's so many holes with that site, and i only touched on a few of the obvious ones. but hey, whatever. you're right, i'm sure there's someone out there in need of (doubtfully) accurate information that's updated on a random basis from mystery sources.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
Ignore this thread. Radlin is spreads nothing but lies:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/79925
Asheron's Call sells 3,958 digital downloads its first week topping the online sales for Direct2Drive.com!
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/78407
Turbine to invest 50 million with a 2007 graphically superior remake of ASHERONS CALL!
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/64222
Turbines' D&D Online HUGE success with pre-sales topping 1.5 million !!
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/71137
Magazine article: Turb **** JOKE **** quoted ASHERONS CALL's plug to be pulled OCT 06!!
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/53483
It's official from EA.. "Ultima Onlines' days are numbered" UO saying goodbye Spring of '06!
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/69408
F'N Darkfall, the game in production for upteen years and STILL no beta in sight!
~PD
www.TheChippedDagger.com My 90-day 2D Java MMORPG project
They that can give up essential liberty for temporary safetey deserve neither. -- Ben Franklin
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door. -- Milton Berle
No post what ever you like, but do the rest of us a favor and disclaim your fiction as such or better yet make your posts in the rumor mill or the spam forum. Your posts are not helpful to the community; they are a disservice.
~PD
www.TheChippedDagger.com My 90-day 2D Java MMORPG project
They that can give up essential liberty for temporary safetey deserve neither. -- Ben Franklin
If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door. -- Milton Berle
As far as I'm concerned Sir Bruce's estimates are as close to relaible as are available. Obviously there are not perfect, but there is every reason to beleivee that the numbers he gives are correlated with the real subscriber numbers overall. He states for each game how confident he is in his estimate and why.
More relavent to the idiotic flame war occuring in this thread (pot kettle, yeah i know...haven't had my caffeine yet and I'm cranky) . . . Even if we assume, for the sake fo argument, that AC has 3x the subscribers that are listed on Sir Bruce's site, it's still far from a wild success right now (at least in terms of subs, I'm not saying the game itself isn't the bee's knees). The only reason I can see for anyone to be bitching about his estimates is that they don't want to admit that game X is doing really well or that game Y is tanking. Sounds like fanboy whining to me.
I don't want to write this, and you don't want to read it. But now it's too late for both of us.
In my experience when someone wants to disregard what little data there is on a subject it’s normally because they want to substitute their own completely unsupported conclusions and the data contradicts these.
If data gathering methods are less then perfect, but there is no other source you need to keep it in the back of your mind, and be ready to change your opinion on a dime but by no means should you ignore the only data you have.
explain the simple stuff behind all the other charts other than the main one that has dates and numbers on it.
seriously, why is anyone taking that site as anything other than a bad joke?
Possibly because over the past several years that he's been doing it his site has been remarkably accurate? Nah that wouldn't have anything to do with it. His accuracy rating for his numbers on AC, by the way, is a B (which means they're pretty damn accurate).
Maybe you should bother reading the site instead of just bad mouthing it. Just cuz you don't like the numbers doesn't mean they're wrong.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
Sorry, your credibility was shot long ago. You constantly post hoaxes and then later say you were just kidding. Sorry... prove that your statements are true or go away.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
That shows there is alot of dummies out there.No not because they play AC but because they used D2D.Once using there D/L you are stuck with them ,relying on them when updates come out.You have no control over the program whatsoever and yet you purchased it..make any sense? not to me it doesn't.
I know what is prolly the main reason for them using this setup,but it's not a fair take for taking your money.This prolly started after all the lineage players were just downloading software to play on private servers.The game doesn't make enough money this way if the majority are not paying to play on the ...example NCsoft servers.
I don't know how reliable D2D is on updating there software ,but i wouldn't like to rely on them IMO anyhow.
I just bought a serial for a game i am currently playing and if my HD screws up or i lose the game due to a virus or whatever,i am not screwed.I can download the game again and just re-insert the serial code,good luck with D2D if you ever have a prob.RE_CHARGE cha ching..thanks for coming out.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
This statement alone verifies the incredible inaccuracy in his charts. The logic he uses is this: because none of the claims are outrageous and all are capable of lying, therefore it would seem the numbers are close to the truth. This is completely illogical.
It does not follow on any form of logic that the numbers must be close to the truth because the claims are not outrageous or everyone is capable of lying. Big Logical Fallacy.
Venge Sunsoar
This game has the best dynamics i've seen (excuse me if missuse of the word). It has the best pvp controls and player skill needed to be involved which is mostly the reason you see the DT players playing, or hell even pk's on white worlds.
But I dont recommend this game for anyone coming in clean fresh to the market. This game is for people who have played, or have hook ups IG. The lack of good hunting spots and the constant grinding for leveling. And the imbalance.
This game needs alot of work which would enly in the mechanics coding which was horribly done they looked to doing it and just scrapped that idea cause they said it was just put together so randomly it seemed. Jessica Muligan, a former developer, admitted multiple times of hating pvp and the things she implemented did nothing but ruin what pvp had goign for it. Its been fairly balanced with the recent pvp patch but there is still alot wrong seeing how you need to hunt for items, get the salvage for hte items, find a trustworthy player and then tinker it which is extremely bugged (Failing at 100% chance for success, hmmmmmm odd anyone?)
I love this game to death and I will actually be pleased if the sales numbers are correct for it may give them a reason to look back into the game and make it LIIIIIIIIVE. But untill some major fixes come into it, i cant wait for darkfall to be released.