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The Official "We're Angry at SOE" thread
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Stradden I do understand what you are saying, however, the OVERWHELMING members of this community here is anti$OE and antiNGE. I mean think about it ... 500,000 SWG accounts in July '03 and what 30,000 +/- now leaves a hell of alot of people out there pissed off.
When someone voices their feelings and/or their negative experieinces regarding $OE in this forum there is always a few that tell them that they don't know what they are talking about and so starts the flame wars. Thus, other will chime in on both sides ... BUT .... there is INFINITELY more anti$OE and antiNGE people here than pro people.
Now this also works in reverse. People posting stuff like: "SWG is GREAT", "NGE is better than preCU", "the population is increasing", "The game is getting better. Just give it another 6 months" and stuff like that are lying thru their teeth. IF all these things were true then why the mass exodus from the game? Why are people STILL leaving the game? WHY are they HERE instead of playing the game that is so great?
As far as people seeking help here .... in these forums???? Wrong place to ask for help. Most people here don't play anymore. The BEST place to seek help is in the Official SWG Forums as most of the current" players that KNOW how to answer their question can be found there.
I would venture to say that the people that are pro$OE and proNGE are usually the people that start the flaming first. Not always .... just usually, probably due to frustration for being so outnumbered. Obraik is one of the few that really doesn't get into the personal attacks too much ... if at all. Because he doesn't, I have rarely seen him personally attacked by someone else (attacked = name calling and such. Having a differing opinion does not qualify as an "attack".) (Unless you are an $OE forum moderator ... sorry had to say it LOL)
This such a false statement , There are three "SOE loyalists" here I know of . Obraik , Elnator and Pirrg . Not one of them Goes into threads calling people idiots or morons for their opinions . WHich I know for a fact you do you have done it to me . There are a substanial amount of SOE haters here who constantly do such things .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Malick ... what in hell is your problem???? This is an "I hate $OE" thread. Why are you continually in here flamming people for anti$OE comments when this thread was established for that EXACT reason?
I made a post that it is the pro$OE and proNGE'rs that are causing most the problems here. Thank you for making my point.
Sago Mactow
Former SWG 2yr 7 month Vet
6/26/03 - 1/26/06
Jedi, Master Shipwright, Master Architect
DFR Councilman
Tarq Server
ROFL hey look at this guys...our bitching and whining got us an officail thread lol
Cool beans, so I guess that means if I or anyone else feels like saying SOE licks the redrocket" in here its ok?
I dont have any objection to this thread, sounds like a plan :P
You expect this site and its employees to jump on your crusade ? There are plenty of people who hate Blizzard , Ncsoft , CCP and many other developers . Do you see them here yelling for this site to write up an article about them ?
Join the crusade? No.
But this purports to be a news site. The fact that this much rage STILL exists after this much time, so bad that it even has fans of other upcoming MMO's up in arms just by ANY involvement by SOE with their product is a NEWS STORY.
_ALL_ the anger at SOE comes from the CU and NGE debacles with SWG. No one wants SOE involved with their MMO that they play because they don't want such things happening to THEM AND THEIR communities.
In fact, the only people who play SOE MMO's who are happy are the EQ players.
That again, is a news story.
Indeed, the legacy of SWG is that there is already a built in base of MMO players out there who will automatically reject the idea of playing a MMO just because of SOE involvement.
Not only that, others who never played SWG, but who know someone who has/does, or who has seen one of the many mainstream news media stories about the unethical treatment of SWG players probably avoid SOE.
SOE's repuation for shitting on customers has probably hurt their subscription numbers in all theri games.
Again, studying that, interviewing people, seeing if that is true or not (it most assuredly is) is a news story...
Yes but opinions are not news , News is what this site does . If SWG has a change in place they will make an article about it . The same deal goes for darkand light , WHen they report on the game , They mention the disappointment of the fans thus far . But leave it at that . The second they go any further They jump from a news piece to an opinion piece .
So what? They (no just mmorpg.com) give plenty of voice to the companies, interviews, interviews, interviews. If that's not company opinion, I don't know what is.
Player opinion should also be included in articles and not just be left to the forum landscape.
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/features/loadFeature/325/gameID/6
Yes but when they interview it is for the fans , They try and get an idea of its progress and features . That is News in the gaming world that is all any magazine or site usually does .
Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen it. Unfortunatly, it's not clear whether he is writing with the NGE already in mind or not. He mentions only the CU and I don't see NGE mentioned anywhere. The date (November 23, 2005) is already post-NGE (Nov 15th accodring to wikipedia) so I presume it was already minding the NGE.
Anyways, yes the interview is indeed for the fans. However, the interviews are not just informative listings of facts. They are companies' opinion mixed with the facts. They state the changes/facts, and they state the companies' reasons for those changes/facts as well. In other words, when SOE says there will be only 9 classes post NGE, it also states along with it that this is to make the game more iconic and more true to the SW experience.
That is opinion, and it comes mixed in with the news. Now, if a site keeps producing only interviews repeatedly pushing forth only the company's opinion, it becomes biased. A site for the community must have both articles about the company's perspective, as well as the community's perspective.
I don't think that adding brief and vague statements like "the fans are disappointed thus far" while allowing multiple lines of company perspective is fair. That is not a site for the community, it's for the industry.
That's all.
I am pretty sure , That article is all about NGE ,though it doesn't mention it by name.
Hey don't get me wrong , It would be nice to see a site like what you are seeking . But It is obvious (atleast to me ) why there isn't one so to speak . These writers need a positive appearence to the industry to get their work done . Now if they had an O'reilly so to speak , Do you think Devs would be willing to give those interviews ? I highly Doubt it .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Malick ... what in hell is your problem???? This is an "I hate $OE" thread. Why are you continually in here flamming people for anti$OE comments when this thread was established for that EXACT reason?
I made a post that it is the pro$OE and proNGE'rs that are causing most the problems here. Thank you for making my point.
I am not flaming anyone . I am saying stop crticizing MMOrpg For not being what you want them to be . They have allowed you a place to speak your mind . Now that they are doing a little moderating of the activity on "their" forums people want to jump on them .
I even put a smile to come across as non offensive . That post has nothing to do with SOE thank you .
WHat point did you make ? I am not For or against sony . Therefor I am not included in your post .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Pirrg? The current rendition of pirrg* - I could agree with your statement on but before the recent? You may want to read up. But still, that inclusion makes your statment as false as well.
*this is in no way asking for the return of the old pirrg. Just a statement from previous experience.
Pirrg? The current rendition of pirrg* - I could agree with your statement on but before the recent? You may want to read up. But still, that inclusion makes your statment as false as well.
*this is in no way asking for the return of the old pirrg. Just a statement from previous experience.
I have really only seen him say such to people who are flaming present subscibers . Which kinda makes it a defensive move IMO .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You expect this site and its employees to jump on your crusade ? There are plenty of people who hate Blizzard , Ncsoft , CCP and many other developers . Do you see them here yelling for this site to write up an article about them ?
Join the crusade? No.
But this purports to be a news site. The fact that this much rage STILL exists after this much time, so bad that it even has fans of other upcoming MMO's up in arms just by ANY involvement by SOE with their product is a NEWS STORY.
_ALL_ the anger at SOE comes from the CU and NGE debacles with SWG. No one wants SOE involved with their MMO that they play because they don't want such things happening to THEM AND THEIR communities.
In fact, the only people who play SOE MMO's who are happy are the EQ players.
That again, is a news story.
Indeed, the legacy of SWG is that there is already a built in base of MMO players out there who will automatically reject the idea of playing a MMO just because of SOE involvement.
Not only that, others who never played SWG, but who know someone who has/does, or who has seen one of the many mainstream news media stories about the unethical treatment of SWG players probably avoid SOE.
SOE's repuation for shitting on customers has probably hurt their subscription numbers in all theri games.
Again, studying that, interviewing people, seeing if that is true or not (it most assuredly is) is a news story...
Yes but opinions are not news , News is what this site does . If SWG has a change in place they will make an article about it . The same deal goes for darkand light , WHen they report on the game , They mention the disappointment of the fans thus far . But leave it at that . The second they go any further They jump from a news piece to an opinion piece .
So what? They (no just mmorpg.com) give plenty of voice to the companies, interviews, interviews, interviews. If that's not company opinion, I don't know what is.
Player opinion should also be included in articles and not just be left to the forum landscape.
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/features/loadFeature/325/gameID/6
Yes but when they interview it is for the fans , They try and get an idea of its progress and features . That is News in the gaming world that is all any magazine or site usually does .
Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen it. Unfortunatly, it's not clear whether he is writing with the NGE already in mind or not. He mentions only the CU and I don't see NGE mentioned anywhere. The date (November 23, 2005) is already post-NGE (Nov 15th accodring to wikipedia) so I presume it was already minding the NGE.
Anyways, yes the interview is indeed for the fans. However, the interviews are not just informative listings of facts. They are companies' opinion mixed with the facts. They state the changes/facts, and they state the companies' reasons for those changes/facts as well. In other words, when SOE says there will be only 9 classes post NGE, it also states along with it that this is to make the game more iconic and more true to the SW experience.
That is opinion, and it comes mixed in with the news. Now, if a site keeps producing only interviews repeatedly pushing forth only the company's opinion, it becomes biased. A site for the community must have both articles about the company's perspective, as well as the community's perspective.
I don't think that adding brief and vague statements like "the fans are disappointed thus far" while allowing multiple lines of company perspective is fair. That is not a site for the community, it's for the industry.
That's all.
I am pretty sure , That article is all about NGE ,though it doesn't mention it by name.
Hey don't get me wrong , It would be nice to see a site like what you are seeking . But It is obvious (atleast to me ) why there isn't one so to speak . These writers need a positive appearence to the industry to get their work done . Now if they had an O'reilly so to speak , Do you think Devs would be willing to give those interviews ? I highly Doubt it .
I understand what you mean. It doesn't need to be an interview. It can an editorial, updating, for the record, how the community is currently reacting to the most controversial decision ever taken in mmo history after 6 months after its inplementation. That's worthy of following imo. It could have some relevant quotes from the forums.
I also wanted to see how narrow I could get those first quotations to be, haha looks like I got them down to single words/line
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
Personally been on the recieving end of a few hit and runs back a few months ago. Wasn't flaming anyone at the time. But still, that is my experience which is different from your observations and I don't feel right talking about him with him not being here to defend himself - let alone that he has adopted a somewhat kinder gentler approach as of late.
Next post, please.
It's about SOE and how they substituted a mmo for another.
-virtual tourist
want your game back?
You expect this site and its employees to jump on your crusade ? There are plenty of people who hate Blizzard , Ncsoft , CCP and many other developers . Do you see them here yelling for this site to write up an article about them ?
Join the crusade? No.
But this purports to be a news site. The fact that this much rage STILL exists after this much time, so bad that it even has fans of other upcoming MMO's up in arms just by ANY involvement by SOE with their product is a NEWS STORY.
_ALL_ the anger at SOE comes from the CU and NGE debacles with SWG. No one wants SOE involved with their MMO that they play because they don't want such things happening to THEM AND THEIR communities.
In fact, the only people who play SOE MMO's who are happy are the EQ players.
That again, is a news story.
Indeed, the legacy of SWG is that there is already a built in base of MMO players out there who will automatically reject the idea of playing a MMO just because of SOE involvement.
Not only that, others who never played SWG, but who know someone who has/does, or who has seen one of the many mainstream news media stories about the unethical treatment of SWG players probably avoid SOE.
SOE's repuation for shitting on customers has probably hurt their subscription numbers in all theri games.
Again, studying that, interviewing people, seeing if that is true or not (it most assuredly is) is a news story...
Yes but opinions are not news , News is what this site does . If SWG has a change in place they will make an article about it . The same deal goes for darkand light , WHen they report on the game , They mention the disappointment of the fans thus far . But leave it at that . The second they go any further They jump from a news piece to an opinion piece .
So what? They (no just mmorpg.com) give plenty of voice to the companies, interviews, interviews, interviews. If that's not company opinion, I don't know what is.
Player opinion should also be included in articles and not just be left to the forum landscape.
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/features/loadFeature/325/gameID/6
Yes but when they interview it is for the fans , They try and get an idea of its progress and features . That is News in the gaming world that is all any magazine or site usually does .
Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen it. Unfortunatly, it's not clear whether he is writing with the NGE already in mind or not. He mentions only the CU and I don't see NGE mentioned anywhere. The date (November 23, 2005) is already post-NGE (Nov 15th accodring to wikipedia) so I presume it was already minding the NGE.
Anyways, yes the interview is indeed for the fans. However, the interviews are not just informative listings of facts. They are companies' opinion mixed with the facts. They state the changes/facts, and they state the companies' reasons for those changes/facts as well. In other words, when SOE says there will be only 9 classes post NGE, it also states along with it that this is to make the game more iconic and more true to the SW experience.
That is opinion, and it comes mixed in with the news. Now, if a site keeps producing only interviews repeatedly pushing forth only the company's opinion, it becomes biased. A site for the community must have both articles about the company's perspective, as well as the community's perspective.
I don't think that adding brief and vague statements like "the fans are disappointed thus far" while allowing multiple lines of company perspective is fair. That is not a site for the community, it's for the industry.
That's all.
I am pretty sure , That article is all about NGE ,though it doesn't mention it by name.
Hey don't get me wrong , It would be nice to see a site like what you are seeking . But It is obvious (atleast to me ) why there isn't one so to speak . These writers need a positive appearence to the industry to get their work done . Now if they had an O'reilly so to speak , Do you think Devs would be willing to give those interviews ? I highly Doubt it .
I understand what you mean. It doesn't need to be an interview. It can an editorial, updating, for the record, how the community is currently reacting to the most controversial decision ever taken in mmo history after 6 months after its inplementation. That's worthy of following imo. It could have some relevant quotes from the forums.
I also wanted to see how narrow I could get those first quotations to be, haha looks like I got them down to single words/line
I love forum trees LOL
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
(besides a hard hitting article about soe and the nge)
but anyways. Yes, thanks for this sticky.
oh yeah, i hate SOE!
For the Horde!
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Sony you deserve this for screwing up alot of good game
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Just move on guys, that's what the UO players did.
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Shayde - SWG (dead)
Proud member of the Cabal.
It sounds great, so great in fact, I pitty those who canceled
I don't like it when you say things. - A Vanguard fan who does too.
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Thanks for that link, I hadn't seen it. Unfortunatly, it's not clear whether he is writing with the NGE already in mind or not. He mentions only the CU and I don't see NGE mentioned anywhere. The date (November 23, 2005) is already post-NGE (Nov 15th accodring to wikipedia) so I presume it was already minding the NGE.
Anyways, yes the interview is indeed for the fans. However, the interviews are not just informative listings of facts. They are companies' opinion mixed with the facts. They state the changes/facts, and they state the companies' reasons for those changes/facts as well. In other words, when SOE says there will be only 9 classes post NGE, it also states along with it that this is to make the game more iconic and more true to the SW experience.
That is opinion, and it comes mixed in with the news. Now, if a site keeps producing only interviews repeatedly pushing forth only the company's opinion, it becomes biased. A site for the community must have both articles about the company's perspective, as well as the community's perspective.
I don't think that adding brief and vague statements like "the fans are disappointed thus far" while allowing multiple lines of company perspective is fair. That is not a site for the community, it's for the industry.
That's all.
Guys,
We ran that editorial on the same day as a brief interview with Casey Keefe on the NGE (http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/features/loadFeature/324/gameID/6) and our review of the NGE on its own merits (http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/reviews/loadReview/26/gameID/6).
It is most definitely about the NGE.
The core point is, we covered the story, we came out with a clear stance and made it public at the time. I think we covered it very well. If we kept covering the story to the point you guys suggest, only anti-SOE fans would still visit the site.
Is your story unworthy of attention? No. Will we ever do a follow-up story? Maybe. But both these questions are beside the point.
This thread was created to try and funnel some of the poison off the boards. You're free to warn people all you want, all we want is that you stop hijacking semi-related or unrelated threads and cluttering the boards wiht the same message over and over. All this thread is for is when someone feels the need to make a random rant against SOE as a result of what they did.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
"Working as intended." Move along. Move along.
Hey, don't hijack this thread, save it for the "Official 'We're Angry at the Pre-CU whiners' Thread" sticky.
-d
Waiting on: Pirates of the Burning Sea and Pirates of the Carribean Online
yea what SHAYDE said! and...lots of the people who played SWG actually were people who moved on to it FROM uo buddy. So PfFfFfFfffFT :P
LOL @ HU and NSE
Thanks, that really got me laughing. Ok well I'm on your side then I guess. I think SOE in some form should be punished for pulling the NGE out of the hat in the way they did. Maybe then everyone could have the emotional space to forgive them. Even though I rather liked it, I think some form of retribution would be in order. I think Sony should be forced by a court of law to maintain at least one Pre-NGE server, even if no new content was written. The poor souls who ground (use?) Jedi all those hours and days and months do have a genuine case for willful infliction of emotional distress. Same as all those people who wasted their lives trying to unlock the froglok race in EQ2 when it was impossible, if indeed that rumour is true.
Until Sony admits their wrongdoing I am not going to bitch about people bitching anymore, except when it comes to Vanguard. Sony will have absolutely nothing to do with the development of said game and therefore doesn't deserve the constant haranguing of upset former SOE customers.
Thanks for responding in such a mature manner Kai. You're good peeps.
lol look at this
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=tradereng&message.id=11043
cl 2 ENGINEER solos rancor lair :P