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This site has become another MOP

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  • TheDalaiBombaTheDalaiBomba Member EpicPosts: 1,372
    cheyane said:
    Reddit, the downvote system is quite cruel. It really buries threads because people don't like what is discussed rather than on any merit.
    That's the part of Reddit I dislike.  Include a kudos system and allow folks to sort by the most hourly rated, but downvotes and the negative reinforcement side provides little.
    Mendel[Deleted User]AlBQuirky
  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,509
    cheyane said:
    Reddit, the downvote system is quite cruel. It really buries threads because people don't like what is discussed rather than on any merit.
    That's the part of Reddit I dislike.  Include a kudos system and allow folks to sort by the most hourly rated, but downvotes and the negative reinforcement side provides little.

    There's always the train wreck mentality -- some people will look at posts that have a million down votes just to see what was said.  Kinda like GDemami's Lol ratings.



    TheDalaiBombaAlBQuirky

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,893
    eoloe said:
    Kyleran said:
    Far too many of the frequent posters have been banned..  A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  Too many folks have "won" their arguments by having the other person banned.

    Meh, reddit mods ban scores more people than this site ever did, heck several of those frequent posters took themselves out of the game.

    Besides, no one can get someone else banned, that's entirely on the poster to keep control of their mouths.

    Difference is reddit keeps replenishing their losses, unlike this site who can't seem to attract interest from younger gamers.




    You can tell yourself that a million times and it wouldn't make it any more right.

    You literally made a thread complaining that the only activity here is created by the admins and then brush off the FACT that people who created content on this site and no longer here.

    Seen any BCBully threads lately?
    Delete is still here but mostly a watcher..
    Seen any posts from Wizardry?

    I mean.. those are thousands of posts a year.. from 3 people.. gone.  No threads, with hundreds of responses... nothing.  But thats OK...

    Just look at the logic of your response.  You say the difference between Reddit and this place is that Reddit replaces its members and we do not.   So.. if we take that as face value.. every time we BAN someone we eliminate a non-replenishing resource.  That means we take ourselves 1 step closer to The Nothing.

    Like Charlie used to say " WINNING!!!!"



    Well the first question is "why they got banned" (if they got banned) ? There might be good reasons?
    Are there good reasons to ban people? In my book yes.


    There IS a difference between disagreements and some offensive behaviors.

    A forum needs disagreements but not fostering hatred for example.


    PS: I am not implying that the aforementioned posters have been guilty of anything. I simply don't know what happened to them.

    That was just a tiny sample of the top of my head.  Go back a year or two and find the big discussion threads.  You will find countless BANNED people. (Screenshot snapshot below.. note some of those threads also include Delete who is no longer banned but barely posts topics)


    Winning!
    [Deleted User]cheyaneScotBrainyAlBQuirky

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • maskedweaselmaskedweasel Member EpicPosts: 11,894
    eoloe said:
    Kyleran said:
    Far too many of the frequent posters have been banned..  A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  Too many folks have "won" their arguments by having the other person banned.

    Meh, reddit mods ban scores more people than this site ever did, heck several of those frequent posters took themselves out of the game.

    Besides, no one can get someone else banned, that's entirely on the poster to keep control of their mouths.

    Difference is reddit keeps replenishing their losses, unlike this site who can't seem to attract interest from younger gamers.




    You can tell yourself that a million times and it wouldn't make it any more right.

    You literally made a thread complaining that the only activity here is created by the admins and then brush off the FACT that people who created content on this site and no longer here.

    Seen any BCBully threads lately?
    Delete is still here but mostly a watcher..
    Seen any posts from Wizardry?

    I mean.. those are thousands of posts a year.. from 3 people.. gone.  No threads, with hundreds of responses... nothing.  But thats OK...

    Just look at the logic of your response.  You say the difference between Reddit and this place is that Reddit replaces its members and we do not.   So.. if we take that as face value.. every time we BAN someone we eliminate a non-replenishing resource.  That means we take ourselves 1 step closer to The Nothing.

    Like Charlie used to say " WINNING!!!!"



    Well the first question is "why they got banned" (if they got banned) ? There might be good reasons?
    Are there good reasons to ban people? In my book yes.


    There IS a difference between disagreements and some offensive behaviors.

    A forum needs disagreements but not fostering hatred for example.


    PS: I am not implying that the aforementioned posters have been guilty of anything. I simply don't know what happened to them.

    That was just a tiny sample of the top of my head.  Go back a year or two and find the big discussion threads.  You will find countless BANNED people. (Screenshot snapshot below.. note some of those threads also include Delete who is no longer banned but barely posts topics)


    Winning!
    Pretty sure this is why they started locking so many threads, and won't let some comments right away on threads that might be controversial. 

    Sometimes people just can't help themselves and post stuff that breaks the rules, other times maybe it's just a little overzealous mod stuff, like BCbullys ban, which still doesn't make sense to me. 

    I feel like they should definitely hand out many more temp bans, and make it clear that that's what they are. Even though half the time permanent bans just come back under a different account, if they know that, and that's what happens, what good is the ban anyway?
    [Deleted User]KyleraneoloeAlBQuirkydragonlee66



  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,893
    tzervo said:
    Xiaoki said:
    Probably what happens when you cultivate a forum for the old whiney vets that constantly talk about the "good ol' days"

    No one cares how great you think the PvP in DAoC was, that was 20 years ago.
    Is there something about that which prevents you from creating a topic about how great you think new game XYZ is?  And explaining why?  And being able to withstand some folks who might feel differently?  And perish the thought, maybe actually persuade someone to your viewpoint?

    The whole point of a discussion forum is to have different points of view.
    Two behaviours I have observed or even been on the receiving end of that discourage discussion:

    - People saying directly that they do not want to hear unpopular opinions, often followed by insults (we do not want to hear you shill/make threads for NFT/Star Citizen/P2W games). There is no point or motivation in trying to persuade a mob that behaves like this and people that face such responses in bulk will simply leave. It has nothing to do with being able to withstand resistance. Just a "what's the point".

    - Echo chamber mentality: many people here openly admit to being fans of old school mmo's, especially Everquest, and are resistant and sometimes downright hostile to newer designs and trends, and their players (snide comments about "attention spans" , "lazyness" etc). People that are interested in newer trends simply find nothing interesting in the discussions taking part in these forums. 
    I love unpopular opinions :)

    For point 2... I think we need ALL kinds of games.  Why would I want Everquest model followed in all games?  Why would I want WoW model followed in all  games?  When it comes to gameplay I say the more the merrier!  All I really dislike is the payment models.  These usually end up poorly for the consumer IMHO, but even though I strongly disagreed with @BCBully I would always want his viewpoint to be heard.   That is the basic difference I see.  Some folks not only want to disagree, but do not want you to be even able to speak because your view is different.  Thus you are "trolling" or you "hate"...

    [Deleted User]ScotKyleranKidRiskBrainyAlBQuirky

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • ArChWindArChWind Member UncommonPosts: 1,340
    Times change and people change some lose interest, others find other things to do with their spare time. It's life.
    AlBQuirky
    ArChWind — MMORPG.com Forums

    If you are interested in making a MMO maybe visit my page to get a free open source engine.
  • harken33harken33 Member UncommonPosts: 78

    It’s all related and has been happening for some time. Ever look through one of the older threads the adbots necro, older being even 5 years ago. There are many posters (aka content generators) who used to regularly contribute that have just faded off into the nether for whatever reason, site ban’s, moved on to different communication format, just stopped posting, are no longer interested in MMORPG’s, you name it, and no doubt a few real-life deaths.

    A stagnant genre that’s long in the tooth, and I think forums themselves are well past their peak. Microsoft knows how to make a profit, bought Bethesda for several billion dollars, a few months later the Bethesda forums were shuttered and moved to Discord. If there were any value in them Microsoft would have reversed / not made the decision to shutter them.

    As far as the site itself, as an infrequent to say the least poster, but common lurker, I also don’t disable the ad’s, and go to the home page instead of right to the forums to *support* the site. The video popups can be very annoying on phone, and in at least one case some creepy ad’s, soul something last year with scantily clad anime teenagers, I actually enabled AdBlock for a month then.


    ScotKyleranTwistedSister77AlBQuirkydragonlee66
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 19,954
    edited March 2022
    harken33 said:

    It’s all related and has been happening for some time. Ever look through one of the older threads the adbots necro, older being even 5 years ago. There are many posters (aka content generators) who used to regularly contribute that have just faded off into the nether for whatever reason, site ban’s, moved on to different communication format, just stopped posting, are no longer interested in MMORPG’s, you name it, and no doubt a few real-life deaths.

    A stagnant genre that’s long in the tooth, and I think forums themselves are well past their peak. Microsoft knows how to make a profit, bought Bethesda for several billion dollars, a few months later the Bethesda forums were shuttered and moved to Discord. If there were any value in them Microsoft would have reversed / not made the decision to shutter them.

    As far as the site itself, as an infrequent to say the least poster, but common lurker, I also don’t disable the ad’s, and go to the home page instead of right to the forums to *support* the site. The video popups can be very annoying on phone, and in at least one case some creepy ad’s, soul something last year with scantily clad anime teenagers, I actually enabled AdBlock for a month then.

    I never used adblock until they got the video ad that followed you around the screen, early last year I think? That was just too much for me until then not bothered by the ads at all.

    That was a bad move by Microsoft which I think showed a lack of respect for Bethesda fans. To me it shows that they are not concerned about the old fans as "Bethesda" will not be making the sort of games the old fans loved.

    The site has moved to be more inclusive, everything from rpg's to hardware, I am not sure the range of content is an issue though perhaps perception of the range by the public is? But if they rebranded they will lose a well recognised name, so that would be a bad idea.
    Kyleranharken33AlBQuirky
  • RungarRungar Member RarePosts: 1,132
    mmo's are being displaced by survival games/hybrid survival that simply make better worlds than most mmo's because you can do alot more. 

    At one time the players were the greatest strength of mmo's. Now they are its greatest weakness. 
    TheDalaiBombaKyleranBrainyAlBQuirkyMMOman101
    .05 of a second to midnight
  • TheDalaiBombaTheDalaiBomba Member EpicPosts: 1,372
    Rungar said:
    mmo's are being displaced by survival games/hybrid survival that simply make better worlds than most mmo's because you can do alot more. 

    At one time the players were the greatest strength of mmo's. Now they are its greatest weakness. 
    This is lethally accurate.

    Technology has helped small multiplayer games out a LOT more than it's helped out massively multiplayer games.
    KyleranAlBQuirky
  • WordsworthWordsworth Member UncommonPosts: 116
    I have to disagree that the genre is anywhere near dead or off it's peak.  In fact, people are so thirsty for MMOs that they swarm to every one that comes out - even when they know that it's not going to be a great experience. 

    Retention is a huge problem for the genre, though.  It always has been an issue, but the problem has gotten worse through the years.  It doesn't matter that everyone is over Valheim after 6 months, but it means the collapse of entire game systems in MMOs.

    I'm old, so I'm still of the mind that the consolidation of any internet platform is counter to it's initial ideals.  I only go to Discord or Reddit to read and never post.  I prefer forums in most cases and think the discussions here are much better than the site's content.  Agreed that I'm a dying breed, though.
    KyleranAlBQuirky
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,524
    cheyane said:
    Reddit, the downvote system is quite cruel. It really buries threads because people don't like what is discussed rather than on any merit.
    Amen, I've made what I felt were perfectly reasonable replies on some topics only to be furiously downvoted if my opinion didn't agree with the subs norm.


    [Deleted User]Slapshot1188AlBQuirky

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • blackthornnblackthornn Member UncommonPosts: 611
    edited March 2022
    I've been on this site since around 2004, I just don't bother posting cuz the mods have always been favorite playing assclowns, even back "in the day".

    This site had degraded, full force, into clickbate articles and pointless fluff posts promoting whomever is throwing ad dollars around, killing any real topics for discussion.  But instead of writing anything worthwhile for us to discuss, let's do part 56 of the new new review in progress for genshin, written by "an industry vet" who can't spell, can't use proper grammar, but has 200k hrs in club penguin as his gaming resume highlight. 

    The sites dead, the horse isn't just being beaten, it's rotted, became fertilizer,  been reborn and died again.  There are tons of off radar games in the genre they could be writing about, hell the only enjoyable articles "lately" were "let's go back to" types for older games.  Be a jour Alistair, you claim to be one.  Create articles bot assigned by ad revenue,  seek out a lead and follow it. What's up with blue protocol?  Why did funded to launch jot equate to funded to launch for pantheon (and why is it turning from brads vision)?, what is the next eastern game Amazon will bring over to try to buy new world faster into the dumpster?
    AlBQuirky
     Grouping in Old school mmo's: meeting someone at the bar and chatting, getting to know them before jumping into bed.  Current mmo's grouping: tinder.  swipe, hookup, hope you don't get herpes, never see them again.
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,457
    Wargfoot said:
    A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  
    I agree.

    It's how we disagree where the problems can arise...Some posters just have to insult other people...That's just how they do things in RL too.....They can't hold a simple discussion without trying to bully people or insult them.
    SovratheoloeAlBQuirky
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,893
    Wargfoot said:
    A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  
    I agree.

    It's how we disagree where the problems can arise...Some posters just have to insult other people...That's just how they do things in RL too.....They can't hold a simple discussion without trying to bully people or insult them.
    I agree certainly, and also some people are overly sensitive and feel that criticizing a game they like is some sort of attack.  But the BEAUTY of this site is that with a click of the button you can literally ignore anyone that annoys you!  That is certainly a better option than the circular firing squad (banning) path we have taken up.
    BrainyAlBQuirkydragonlee66

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    Shut up Scorch ...


    I'm not going to comment further in this thread as I am already at 29 bans since 06 .... 
    [Deleted User]SovrathKyleranWargfooteoloeTheocritusAlBQuirkydragonlee66
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,524
    edited March 2022
    Wargfoot said:
    A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  
    I agree.

    It's how we disagree where the problems can arise...Some posters just have to insult other people...That's just how they do things in RL too.....They can't hold a simple discussion without trying to bully people or insult them.
    I find most people aren't terribly offensive in real life due to potential consequences it's usually behind the internet's veil which often encourages bad behaviors.

    Not always though, friend of mine gets into rousing political debates on the internet using his real Facebook profile, something I would never do if planning to troll..err, I mean debate a sensitive topic.

    Scorchien said:
    Shut up Scorch ...


    I'm not going to comment further in this thread as I am already at 29 bans since 06 .... 

    Between you and @delete5230 one of you has to have won the "keeps coming back" award.  Well done guys.

    ;)
    [Deleted User]eoloeTheocritusAlBQuirky

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • WargfootWargfoot Member EpicPosts: 1,804
    Scorchien said:
    Shut up Scorch ...


    I'm not going to comment further in this thread as I am already at 29 bans since 06 .... 
    You have a gift.
    ScorchienAlBQuirky
  • MadBomber13MadBomber13 Member UncommonPosts: 84
    I can only speak from my experience and opinion. I was on this site from 2005 or so until about 2016. Just recently came back and had to create a new account because I couldn't remember my credentials and apparently this site doesn't keep records for long inactive accounts or couldn't be bothered to help me locate my old account. Regardless, I came back.

    There wasn't any one reason that finally made me quit the site but many small niggles that made me not care/want to keep checking back in. Most prominent niggles were the very uneven and what I viewed as unfair moderation on the forums, decline of the MMO genre, reduction in quality of articles/reviews and the general negativity of the community.

    I will say some posters need to understand that an opposing viewpoint in not a personal attack, that it's okay for someone not to like a game you like and that arguing with someone on a forum doesn't need to turn into a scorched earth, take no prisoners personal battle of ego/good vs. evil battle royal we end up with here. It will raise your post count but does little for the community or retaining new members who may pass through.

    Just my 2 bits... 
    AlBQuirky
  • OldKingLogOldKingLog Member RarePosts: 456
    Kyleran said:
    Far too many of the frequent posters have been banned..  A discussion forum needs people to disagree.  Too many folks have "won" their arguments by having the other person banned.

    Meh, reddit mods ban scores more people than this site ever did, heck several of those frequent posters took themselves out of the game.

    Besides, no one can get someone else banned, that's entirely on the poster to keep control of their mouths.

    Difference is reddit keeps replenishing their losses, unlike this site who can't seem to attract interest from younger gamers.




    You can tell yourself that a million times and it wouldn't make it any more right.

    You literally made a thread complaining that the only activity here is created by the admins and then brush off the FACT that people who created content on this site and no longer here.

    Seen any BCBully threads lately?
    Delete is still here but mostly a watcher..
    Seen any posts from Wizardry?

    I mean.. those are thousands of posts a year.. from 3 people.. gone.  No threads, with hundreds of responses... nothing.  But thats OK...

    Just look at the logic of your response.  You say the difference between Reddit and this place is that Reddit replaces its members and we do not.   So.. if we take that as face value.. every time we BAN someone we eliminate a non-replenishing resource.  That means we take ourselves 1 step closer to The Nothing.

    Like Charlie used to say " WINNING!!!!"



    Well thanks for dredging up this old memory. Seems rather fitting actually.



    AlBQuirky
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,893
    Thanks :)
    Yes I have used that analogy previously.  We are going to Win ourselves into The Nothing

    Glad you made the connection!
    OldKingLogAlBQuirky

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • LuidenLuiden Member RarePosts: 328
    I have to disagree that the genre is anywhere near dead or off it's peak.  In fact, people are so thirsty for MMOs that they swarm to every one that comes out - even when they know that it's not going to be a great experience. 

    Retention is a huge problem for the genre, though.  It always has been an issue, but the problem has gotten worse through the years.  It doesn't matter that everyone is over Valheim after 6 months, but it means the collapse of entire game systems in MMOs.

    I'm old, so I'm still of the mind that the consolidation of any internet platform is counter to it's initial ideals.  I only go to Discord or Reddit to read and never post.  I prefer forums in most cases and think the discussions here are much better than the site's content.  Agreed that I'm a dying breed, though.
    Your entire post basically negates your first sentence.  :)  Why are people so thirsty every time a new MMORPG comes out.. it's because everything that is currently out is terrible, atrocious.  Why is retention such a huge problem for the genre.. because MMORPGs made today are terrible, atrocious and are not worth gamers investment.

    It's so bad right now that sites like these are suffering because there are no games to really support a conversation.  We can all talk about what we think would make up a great MMORPG but after years and years of posts and no games coming out that try to implement these ideas.. well people just give up.

    Think about this, WoW came out in the early 2000's.. they get up to 10+ million subscribers... that was 2 f'ing decades ago!  That was before the f'ing IPhone was out!  Can you imagine what a brand new.. real MMORPG would get if somebody was actually brave enough to put one out there?  In today's market with so many people digitally connected.. 50+ million plus in the US?  During COVID, who knows how many people would have played.

    Instead, we get something like Lost Ark.  Terrible leveling system, quests so boring that I never had to read a single word.  A game so linear that it feels like you are riding a train with the same people in front of you and the same people behind you.  So easy that you can basically get to level 50 with 0 deaths.  Massive cash shop of course.  So many confusing worthless currencies and then many boring, mindless grindy mechanisms tacked on for the end game where players are expected to just run the same crap over and over.  Is this what we have come to?  I got to 50, took one look at the end game and just had to stop, I'm not investing my time in a game like this.  Let's not get started about the 'lore'.

    Anyway, MMORPGs are dead, period.  What we have today are console like games that are focused on cash shops and getting people to pay more money.  It's a real shame that young gamers over the past 10 to 15 years haven't had the opportunity to actually play a real MMORPG during it's prime.  


      
    BrainyAlBQuirky
  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,346
    MMO genre is dead, and this site after it changed is hard to navigate. 
    BrainyAlBQuirky

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,524
    edited March 2022
    MMO genre is dead

    Yeah thats why millions of people are playing Lost Ark...it gets to be pretty annoying to hear this. Just because some life-changing supergame hasn't been released to perfectly match your tastes doesn't mean MMORPGs are dead.
    Oh snap....did not see that coming.

    Going to head for my lightning shelter.

     :# 
    [Deleted User]OldKingLogAlBQuirky[Deleted User]

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,893
    Oh the irony… right in this very thread…
    [Deleted User]harken33AlBQuirky

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

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