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Wow! Any MMORPG have a worse mechanism than Reaper?

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Comments

  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    Ungood said:
    *sigh* You guys still do not get it.

    One. If you enter a quest on, say, Hard difficulty, you should not have to be worrying that three harder Champions will appear and turn it into R1 difficulty. It defeats the whole point of levels, earning experience and ranking the quests.

    Two, publishers monetize as much as they can get away with of their games. It's a cheaper solution than actually improving the game. This is normal behaviour for most MMO's unfortunately. But DDO is the very first MMO I have played where they have monetised so much, they have also monetised griefing. That's just bad.

    Now, I get it, if you have played for sixty trillion years and have two million past lives this stuff doesn't matter. You get to swing your giant flaming todgers around and you love it, but for normal players? Well, the DDO forum is once again full of NEW threads complaining about this issue.
    Champions on hard are not that hard, in fact, all things said and done, Hard is not that hard really. And the Champions are annoying at best, and nowhere boost the difficulty to Reaper 1.

    Also, yes, Reaper is for the players that have a bunch of past lives, the best of the best of the best shit at their disposal, wearing their Armor of Giant Epeen, and swinging their Sword of Massive Ballsack, and have zerged that dungeon so many times they could be making dinner, watching porn, and still cake walk it on elite.

    What that means is.. if that is not you.. then don't click Reaper.

    not only that elite you can still solo, worse case hire a healer npc to heal you, reaper, serious I can't solo that thing, though i'm looking to get back since tehy did some changes on paladin knight of chalice, so i'm wanting to check

    btw there is a way to transfer the account from the old launcher to steam? gonna need to check that one
    Yah.. last time I played, Reaper was a eye opener in difficulty, like, the "Oh shit that killed me" kind of situation, whereas on Elite I could just Zerg Rush through it with my Warpriest, jump into a pile of spawns, and discover after the fight, one of them was a champion because it took me a few extra hits to kill it.

    I have no idea what they have done with KotC, to be honest, haven't played in about a year.

    As far as Steam goes, I don't think you ever could play through steam, you could download the client and the game, but the account was still through SSG only.
    katzklaw
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

  • katzklawkatzklaw Member UncommonPosts: 101
    oh yeah... was great when you didn't realize there was a champ in the mix till you found the coin after the fact... the red crowns were the only ones ya really had to watch out for. 
    Ungood
  • yucklawyersyucklawyers Member UncommonPosts: 240
    katzklaw said:
    yucklawyers said:
    ....

    Now, I get it, if you have played for sixty trillion years and have two million past lives this stuff doesn't matter. You get to swing your giant flaming todgers around and you love it, but for normal players? Well, the DDO forum is once again full of NEW threads complaining about this issue.
    again with the grand claims.  

    *goes to DDO forums and peruses new posts*

    new 64 bit client, paladin build, tempest discussion, titan raid borked?, bard song changes (wait, what? i need to go check that out. grrrrr), bank changes, cerulean hills changes, loot from epic deleras.... 


    Chap,  I replied to at least two myself in the last coupla days. Not surprising they sunk behind the update 45 threads now is it *rolls eyes*.

    katzklaw
  • yucklawyersyucklawyers Member UncommonPosts: 240
    Ungood said:
    *sigh* You guys still do not get it.

    One. If you enter a quest on, say, Hard difficulty, you should not have to be worrying that three harder Champions will appear and turn it into R1 difficulty. It defeats the whole point of levels, earning experience and ranking the quests.

    Two, publishers monetize as much as they can get away with of their games. It's a cheaper solution than actually improving the game. This is normal behaviour for most MMO's unfortunately. But DDO is the very first MMO I have played where they have monetised so much, they have also monetised griefing. That's just bad.

    Now, I get it, if you have played for sixty trillion years and have two million past lives this stuff doesn't matter. You get to swing your giant flaming todgers around and you love it, but for normal players? Well, the DDO forum is once again full of NEW threads complaining about this issue.
    Champions on hard are not that hard, in fact, all things said and done, Hard is not that hard really. And the Champions are annoying at best, and nowhere boost the difficulty to Reaper 1.

    Also, yes, Reaper is for the players that have a bunch of past lives, the best of the best of the best shit at their disposal, wearing their Armor of Giant Epeen, and swinging their Sword of Massive Ballsack, and have zerged that dungeon so many times they could be making dinner, watching porn, and still cake walk it on elite.

    What that means is.. if that is not you.. then don't click Reaper.

    Yes, you keep swinging your todger. The irony, lol :).

    katzklaw
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    edited February 2020
    Ungood said:
    *sigh* You guys still do not get it.

    One. If you enter a quest on, say, Hard difficulty, you should not have to be worrying that three harder Champions will appear and turn it into R1 difficulty. It defeats the whole point of levels, earning experience and ranking the quests.

    Two, publishers monetize as much as they can get away with of their games. It's a cheaper solution than actually improving the game. This is normal behaviour for most MMO's unfortunately. But DDO is the very first MMO I have played where they have monetised so much, they have also monetised griefing. That's just bad.

    Now, I get it, if you have played for sixty trillion years and have two million past lives this stuff doesn't matter. You get to swing your giant flaming todgers around and you love it, but for normal players? Well, the DDO forum is once again full of NEW threads complaining about this issue.
    Champions on hard are not that hard, in fact, all things said and done, Hard is not that hard really. And the Champions are annoying at best, and nowhere boost the difficulty to Reaper 1.

    Also, yes, Reaper is for the players that have a bunch of past lives, the best of the best of the best shit at their disposal, wearing their Armor of Giant Epeen, and swinging their Sword of Massive Ballsack, and have zerged that dungeon so many times they could be making dinner, watching porn, and still cake walk it on elite.

    What that means is.. if that is not you.. then don't click Reaper.

    Yes, you keep swinging your todger. The irony, lol :).

    You really should learn how to quote correctly.

    Equally this does explain why you are having such a hard time with Hard difficulty, my advice is , you should stick with Normal if that is really all you can handle.

    So, play at your own pace.

    If you can't handle Reaper, don't click Reaper.
    If you can't handle Elite, don't click Elite.
    If you can't handle Hard, don't click Hard.

    That is, after all, why they have Easy, Normal, Hard, Elite, and Reaper, difficulties, so you can play at your pace.

    Just keep stepping down till you find your pace.
    katzklaw
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

  • NeblessNebless Member RarePosts: 1,835
     edit yeah looks like you still use the same account on steam, need to check now if it shows others payment models to use, because the one's on turbine and stating stone are crap
    Yes, all Steam does is take you to the SSG launcher, same game, so same account log in info. 

    There's a box to click in the game options; something like 'open outside game payments', between that and having the Steam overlay enabled you can pay for stuff with your Steam account.

    Not sure how well it works, but it's been talked about on the Steam forums in the past.
    Ungood

    SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    I do not believe in sudden random spawns,i think it is a cheap mechanic and looks fake.
    However mobs getting tougher was also done with some FFXI bosses,it was called umm Enraged,a term i am sure many have heard before.It really wasn't too bad and made sure to keep CHEAP kills at bay because all it really was is a mechanic that if you din't kill the Boss within a timely fashion it would become enraged "more powerful".
    Of course i have also witnessed the several spawn idea over many games and can be ok but not to the point your spawning bosses,typically they would be called ADDS.Adds,linking keep players/groups in check because we really don't want long drawn out kiting fights where there is really very little interaction,mostly just distance control management.
    katzklaw

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 9,067
    Nebless said:
     edit yeah looks like you still use the same account on steam, need to check now if it shows others payment models to use, because the one's on turbine and stating stone are crap
    Yes, all Steam does is take you to the SSG launcher, same game, so same account log in info. 

    There's a box to click in the game options; something like 'open outside game payments', between that and having the Steam overlay enabled you can pay for stuff with your Steam account.

    Not sure how well it works, but it's been talked about on the Steam forums in the past.
    Must work like the overlay used to work on Path of Exile. Put money in your steam wallet and then pay.
    Chamber of Chains
  • katzklawkatzklaw Member UncommonPosts: 101
    edited February 2020
    Wizardry said:
    I do not believe in sudden random spawns,i think it is a cheap mechanic and looks fake.
    However mobs getting tougher was also done with some FFXI bosses,it was called umm Enraged,a term i am sure many have heard before.It really wasn't too bad and made sure to keep CHEAP kills at bay because all it really was is a mechanic that if you din't kill the Boss within a timely fashion it would become enraged "more powerful".
    Of course i have also witnessed the several spawn idea over many games and can be ok but not to the point your spawning bosses,typically they would be called ADDS.Adds,linking keep players/groups in check because we really don't want long drawn out kiting fights where there is really very little interaction,mostly just distance control management.
    to clarify a little bit... the Champion spawns in DDO are random, but they are not sudden, and they are not additional. any time a mob spawns in a dungeon on any difficulty harder than "normal" there is a chance one will spawn as a champion instead of a normal mob. champs also have different difficulties and they have a visual indicator 1. that they ARE a champion, and 2. how hard they will probably be  (i mentioned red crowns previously).  a small barely visible yellow crown indicates a weak champ, an orange crown is a middleweight, and a large glowing red crown is "danger Will Robinson" territory... kill it FIRST usually.

    champs are basically the same (roughly) difficulty as a miniboss (orange named mob in DDO) usually... with the exact type governing how much it will hurt, and how much it will hurt you. if you target them, they have a "title" which tells you what sub-type of champion they are.  for example, a "stoneguard" champion will have extra DR on top of whatever else it has, can't be knocked down, and if it's a red crowned champ, it has true sight... but it's vulnerable to electric... time to pull out the lightening weapon and have the wizard cast lightening bolt!  a "Hero's Soul" champ is annoying, because you beat it down, and it heals itself back to full (once), and you gotta beat it down again.  the most truely dangerous one in my opinion is any caster mob that is also a red crowned "elemental fury" (on any hit, even spell hits, add random elemental damage... and if it's a red crown...ADD a fire DOT) recipe for death from afar and everyone having a real bad time till it's dead.


    all that said... reapers are much more random. any mob spawn can also spawn a reaper, and this includes adds, respawns, and the "spawn" of creatures that summon more of the same as themselves (mephits) or mobs that split when struck with certain weapons (oozes and anything other than blunt).  so, if you're running a quest on reaper and you nail an ooze with manyshot and rip it into 2 dozen little oozlets, each one of them also has a chance to spawn a reaper.  (and if you do THAT habitually, you're too stupid to be running reaper. i won't begrudge anyone the occasional lapse in judgement.. yeah, ask me how i know about the 2 dozen oozlets and loads of reapers thing... ahem >.>  BUT I ONLY DID THAT ONCE.)

    altho to be fair, SSG has stated that reaper mode is distinctly supposed to be "the GM is mad at you and trying to kill you" mode. so it's SUPPOSED to  be HARD.
    Ungood
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    edited February 2020
    Wizardry said:
    I do not believe in sudden random spawns,i think it is a cheap mechanic and looks fake.
    However mobs getting tougher was also done with some FFXI bosses,it was called umm Enraged,a term i am sure many have heard before.It really wasn't too bad and made sure to keep CHEAP kills at bay because all it really was is a mechanic that if you din't kill the Boss within a timely fashion it would become enraged "more powerful".
    Of course i have also witnessed the several spawn idea over many games and can be ok but not to the point your spawning bosses,typically they would be called ADDS.Adds,linking keep players/groups in check because we really don't want long drawn out kiting fights where there is really very little interaction,mostly just distance control management.
    It works pretty good for DDO, as all the spawns are pre-set when you enter the dungeon as most dungeons in DDO have a fixed number of spawns, which is directly affected by the difficulty that a player selects. IE: The harder the difficulty you select, the more&stronger the mobs will be. IE: the general mobs in Hard difficulty will stronger than the generic mobs on Normal, and weaker than the generic mobs on elite. And this applies to all difficulties.

    DDO has 6 very distinct difficulties, Easy, Normal, Hard, Elite and Reaper, with Reaper, having it's own difficulty scale from 1 to 10. So you bring all the struggles upon yourself, of your own choice and own volition. 

    So no one is forced to deal with anything they do not want to deal with, you can always go down in difficulty in anything outside a Raid, which bottom caps at Normal.

    What this means, is that mobs will be selected at random to be champions at the start of the dungeon, but the dungeon will have the same number of spawns it always had, nothing is added, just some mobs got tougher. Which is what challenge is really all about.

    Even the Reapers are taken randomly from the fixed spawns and upgraded to Reapers when you enter the dungeon, while they may never be in the same places twice, they do not just pop up at you, they are there, like all the other mobs, waiting for you, so you can see them ahead of time if you play with any tactical  common sense at all.

    Also, Champions come in 3 tiers, where they can be as unremarkable as just Veteran level mob, to near Mini-Boss difficulty, but again, if you play with any level of tactical common sense, they are not overly amazing or difficult, and can very easily be overcome with some prep/planning/ and tactics, and assuming you were not already in a bit over your head.

    If you are just blindly running through the zone trying to mindlessly zerg rush it, and not paying attention, yes, they can blind side you pretty good and given even veteran players a sound ass kicking, and that is exactly what the veteran players wanted, something to keep them on their toes that was not overly predictable.

    For people that are looking for a cake walk, DDO was never the game for them.

    It's a complex game by any MMO's standards to begin with, and requires thought to play and plan, even at a normal difficulty setting, having many of the mechanics you talk about wanting @Wizardry
    So, overall, DDO was never the game for anyone that didn't want to think about what they were doing, so IMHO, it just makes sense that as you go harder in your dungeon difficulty you will need to think more about the encounters you face.

    katzklaw
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

  • katzklawkatzklaw Member UncommonPosts: 101
    indeed. if you just try to faceroll it, you will, in turn, get rolled. 


    just a quick example of what i was talking about before, and what @Ungood mentioned...

    you can SEE that mobs are champs from quite some distance, and you can see what kind they are and prep for it ahead of time. if you aren't being stupid, you can sometimes even do it before they agro you (of course if you come around a corner and there's mobs, nothing you can do about that... but long straight corridor and they haven't noticed you yet? yeah...)

    this was an orange crowned champ. not attacking me. if i were unfamiliar, i could at my leisure examine it and find out exactly what it's powers are. 

    ok... on-hit fire damage. ouchie. don't let it touch me if i can help it...

    damage boost. definitely don't let it hit me. 

    oh look. it takes extra damage from cold. i'm already using an axe with ice on it, i'm good there. cool

    so then i move into that room, fully prepared for the fight... and immediately CC said dangerous mob... in this case with a bardic "freezing ice" ability, but there are plenty of CCs of all kinds that could be used here.

    and now i have an easy fight because i didn't just zergrush faceroll blindly into a room. 

    group running nowadays is mostly a faceroll unless it's a raid, but for solo or extreme shortman in DDO.. tactics are still king for most. planning. prep. knowledge. gear (yes, even if you aren't a multi TR you can still get together appropriate gear)... it all comes together. 
    Ungood
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    Also, as with a game like DDO. If you know the Champion uses Fire, you can equip some Fire Resist items, or use a consumable to grant fire protection/resist. 

    Again, this is a game for thinkers, not people that just want to Left Click their way to victory.

    I wager the OP took a break for a while, during a time when the Veteran TR players were chiding SSG/Turbine at what a snore fest cake walk their Elite Mode was (and yes, with all the power creep over the years, as well as very static dungeons, the players were very easily able to over power the dungeons without much thought) and, as you can imagine, these same egotistical gameers with their thousands of hours of play time, being what they are, and how nasty that can be, SSG responded with Reaper Difficulty, basically saying "Cake Walk this Bitch"

    Then we have the OP. Who no doubt has returned from taking a break and thinks they are going to cake walk the game like they have in past. Oblivious to the changes in the game, and how SSG ramped up the difficulty to match the power creep, thinks, "I can do Reaper because I am great" and quickly gets their ass firmly handed to them on a platter, with a side of humiliation. 

    As opposed to realizing that they need to improve to handle the new difficulties, they have opted to complain.

    Trust me... SSG is not going to change things, as the players that have stayed around, like it this way, and SSG knows they are the people they need to keep, no some flash in in the pan player that will no doubt wander off in short notice.
    katzklaw
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

  • SkrankenSkranken Member UncommonPosts: 100
    Ungood said:
    Also, as with a game like DDO. If you know the Champion uses Fire, you can equip some Fire Resist items, or use a consumable to grant fire protection/resist. 

    Again, this is a game for thinkers, not people that just want to Left Click their way to victory.

    I wager the OP took a break for a while, during a time when the Veteran TR players were chiding SSG/Turbine at what a snore fest cake walk their Elite Mode was (and yes, with all the power creep over the years, as well as very static dungeons, the players were very easily able to over power the dungeons without much thought) and, as you can imagine, these same egotistical gameers with their thousands of hours of play time, being what they are, and how nasty that can be, SSG responded with Reaper Difficulty, basically saying "Cake Walk this Bitch"

    Then we have the OP. Who no doubt has returned from taking a break and thinks they are going to cake walk the game like they have in past. Oblivious to the changes in the game, and how SSG ramped up the difficulty to match the power creep, thinks, "I can do Reaper because I am great" and quickly gets their ass firmly handed to them on a platter, with a side of humiliation. 

    As opposed to realizing that they need to improve to handle the new difficulties, they have opted to complain.

    Trust me... SSG is not going to change things, as the players that have stayed around, like it this way, and SSG knows they are the people they need to keep, no some flash in in the pan player that will no doubt wander off in short notice.

    I just need to say I agree with you Ungood.

    So many games get their "dumbed-down-treatment" because devs think thats what is needed to get more players into the game.

    Some of us like to fail, read, try again, fail, read more, learn, and then maybe succeed. It gives a much more rewarding feeling.. And yes, the game lasts longer :D
    katzklawUngood
  • katzklawkatzklaw Member UncommonPosts: 101
    for all the crap that people have given DDO over the years, and all the times people have doom and gloomed and cried that it was dying.... it's still plugging along.. and still releasing new content. the latest update just came out this week, even. and it's because it's a game that makes you think, and challenges you... it's 14 years old this month, and i keep finding myself circling back to it... there's something about the mechanics that modern games just aren't hitting the same notes on.
    Ungood
  • katzklawkatzklaw Member UncommonPosts: 101
    edited February 2020
    srsly. if they sorted the spaghetti code to thin the rampaging herd of bugs, and gave it a graphic update to modern standards... it would totally be competitive with any modern AAA game, and then some, with no further changes needed. the mechanics are that solid already (for the most part)
    Ungood
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    katzklaw said:
    srsly. if they sorted the spaghetti code to thin the rampaging herd of bugs, and gave it a graphic update to modern standards... it would totally be competitive with any modern AAA game, and then some, with no further changes needed. the mechanics are that solid already (for the most part)
    Yah.

    Not sure why this game tanked as hard as it did when it started, or why it never really took on.
    katzklaw
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

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