Any MMO can be role played. Nothing in an MMO forces role playing.
Therefore all MMOs are MMORPGs and all MMORPGs are MMOs. It just depends on your playstyle, not your stupid perception of the term.
If you said "what type of MMO", I would reply "the MMO type, what kind of question is that?"... because it's a ridiculous question.
Yeah, and pigs can fly just as well as eagles.
He's right, assuming by role-play he means the portraying of his character as a persona other than himself. Such can be done in any game, even single-player ones that provide choice if the player selects options based on what he feels his character would do rather than what he himself would choose in that same situation.
At the same time, I see little in terms of role-play in the vast majority of the MMORPGs I have played and it has no effect on the game continuing to grind along.
The only inherent RPG element of MMORPGs is that of JRPG console games, where it is more a reference to the progression of the character over time than actual role-play.
I can't "roleplay" in an action combat based MMO. No matter what skills my avatar has, it's based on my own mouse/keyboard skills
Of course you can. Role-play is not confined to one's game performance or the numerical values associated to a character, or by necessity linked to them at all. It is a product of one's imagination and the ability to suspend disbelief. It is the taking on of the persona and outlook of another for a time to vicariously experience from other perspectives. It is the pretending of being someone else simply for the fun of it. None of that is dependent on mouse/keyboard abilities.
You can't role-play game skill, but nothing prevents a person from role-playing in a game dependent on player skill. For example, if I was so inclined yet lacked the action skills to perform as well as would be expected by my character I could attribute my shortcoming to a lasting effect from previous injury that makes me less than I was, yet I am determined to go on regardless.
Easily done.
Well, you are right, but that's at such a low level that it isn't much depth of RP at all. And you need more than just player statements for depth. You need actions and props. Otherwise, it pretty much falls on deaf ears, so to speak. Your example is about as good as it gets, without such support from the game.
That's you RPing, but the game isn't what anyone would call a RPing game. So, yes, you are right, but it's effect with other players has no support from the game whatsoever. No feedback.
As an example of game support: In UO players could make tables and chairs, and set them up as one long table with chairs all around. They could make plates, silverware, and goblets. They could set these around in front of each chair. Then they could cook ribs and bowls of peas and set one of each on the long table in front of each char. The could make a pitcher, fill it with wine from 'wine bottles' found in the game. Players could sit in the chairs around the table. Then some players acting as servants could go around to each player and fill their goblet with wine from the pitcher. The each player could eat their food while they chatted. Then the host or guild leader could ask everyone to pick up their goblet of wine and stand for a toast. All of this was and is supported by UO's code, except that the wine goblet is in the backpack and not in their hand. This is where the support starts to run thin. Now the host says "Raise your goblet for a toast" And each player types (/raises goblet) and the game "speaks" for them *raises goblet*. This was UO's way of using text in place of animations. Better than nothing, and still support at least minimally. One player might even decide to (/spills a drop of wine) to get text *spills a drop of wine*. Another might type (/coughs) to get text saying *coughs*, or anything a player might want to emote. Then the host makes a toast, and they all drink their wine. No animations, the goblet is actually in their backpacks, but you do hear a slurp sound from each player.
See, that's a RPing game, as opposed to just players roleplaying on their own and just typing out what they are doing with no visuals or other game support. And it's much more immersive, aiding the players on their stage.
That's an Eagle soaring, vs. a Pig that can't fly. (per my comment above)
There is a lot of neat stuff there, and it's handy to have I'm sure.
It is also unnecessary.
That entire scenario could have been done solely through text emotes. If it had, it would have allowed for more descriptive depth than the mechanical emotes provided by the game.
Depending on the person, doing without could easily be more immersive. What I must imagine is always more involving to me than what I can simply observe. It requires more focus, more engagement, more of me in general and thus tends to return more.
Any MMO can be role played. Nothing in an MMO forces role playing.
Therefore all MMOs are MMORPGs and all MMORPGs are MMOs. It just depends on your playstyle, not your stupid perception of the term.
If you said "what type of MMO", I would reply "the MMO type, what kind of question is that?"... because it's a ridiculous question.
Yeah, and pigs can fly just as well as eagles.
He's right, assuming by role-play he means the portraying of his character as a persona other than himself. Such can be done in any game, even single-player ones that provide choice if the player selects options based on what he feels his character would do rather than what he himself would choose in that same situation.
At the same time, I see little in terms of role-play in the vast majority of the MMORPGs I have played and it has no effect on the game continuing to grind along.
The only inherent RPG element of MMORPGs is that of JRPG console games, where it is more a reference to the progression of the character over time than actual role-play.
I can't "roleplay" in an action combat based MMO. No matter what skills my avatar has, it's based on my own mouse/keyboard skills
Of course you can. Role-play is not confined to one's game performance or the numerical values associated to a character, or by necessity linked to them at all. It is a product of one's imagination and the ability to suspend disbelief. It is the taking on of the persona and outlook of another for a time to vicariously experience from other perspectives. It is the pretending of being someone else simply for the fun of it. None of that is dependent on mouse/keyboard abilities.
You can't role-play game skill, but nothing prevents a person from role-playing in a game dependent on player skill. For example, if I was so inclined yet lacked the action skills to perform as well as would be expected by my character I could attribute my shortcoming to a lasting effect from previous injury that makes me less than I was, yet I am determined to go on regardless.
Easily done.
You can RP in any single-player game then as well. That is not the point of an online multiplayer game. Yes many play them solo, but are they RP lone-wolf hermits? If you try to actually role-play with other people in these games you will most likely be laughed at or ignored.
Why would a person role-playing a hermit seek to interact with others.
That would be rather out of character, don't you think?
No, of course not. Hermits have to run into people every once in a while too. Food, blankets, tools, etc. Being a hermit does not require one to have ZERO contact. Are you just arguing to argue?
Any MMO can be role played. Nothing in an MMO forces role playing.
Therefore all MMOs are MMORPGs and all MMORPGs are MMOs. It just depends on your playstyle, not your stupid perception of the term.
If you said "what type of MMO", I would reply "the MMO type, what kind of question is that?"... because it's a ridiculous question.
Yeah, and pigs can fly just as well as eagles.
He's right, assuming by role-play he means the portraying of his character as a persona other than himself. Such can be done in any game, even single-player ones that provide choice if the player selects options based on what he feels his character would do rather than what he himself would choose in that same situation.
At the same time, I see little in terms of role-play in the vast majority of the MMORPGs I have played and it has no effect on the game continuing to grind along.
The only inherent RPG element of MMORPGs is that of JRPG console games, where it is more a reference to the progression of the character over time than actual role-play.
I can't "roleplay" in an action combat based MMO. No matter what skills my avatar has, it's based on my own mouse/keyboard skills
Of course you can. Role-play is not confined to one's game performance or the numerical values associated to a character, or by necessity linked to them at all. It is a product of one's imagination and the ability to suspend disbelief. It is the taking on of the persona and outlook of another for a time to vicariously experience from other perspectives. It is the pretending of being someone else simply for the fun of it. None of that is dependent on mouse/keyboard abilities.
You can't role-play game skill, but nothing prevents a person from role-playing in a game dependent on player skill. For example, if I was so inclined yet lacked the action skills to perform as well as would be expected by my character I could attribute my shortcoming to a lasting effect from previous injury that makes me less than I was, yet I am determined to go on regardless.
Easily done.
Of course I can't, for when my "supposed" master swodsman whiffs much of the time, I am reminded it is AlBQuirky in the game rather than Sven Swordthrust.
I don't play games to be "me in games", which is exactly what player skill based combat/games do.
Skyrim is hard to roleplay in because I can unlock master locks at 1st level. That's me, AlBQuirky, not my avatar. Many games including Skyrim require thought, so a roleplay of a dimwitted character will end the game quickly.
Many players have no trouble with this. I do. Just because YOU tell me I can does not make it so.
Hmmm, it seems to me that what your saying is such a role-play within the context of Skyrim would transcend your suspension of disbelief to the point where doing so would be unacceptable to you. Fair enough, if my read is correct, and totally understandable.
Plenty of old style MMOs around. People just want to complain.
I agree, the problem is people mentality has evolved over the years and stuff we once thought were mandatory are seen as a burden. Such as Level grinds. Most new MMOs with heavy level grinding like old school MMOs, die fast. Its an old grandfathered feature that need to go.
I guess i am unlike most others,i do NOT have a hard stance on ANY design but i do have a stand on that design being done very well. Example a Class design,is NOT done well when you are forced to play ONLY one class.it makes no sense at all,it would be like saying your a Carpenter so you cannot do anything else in your life ever.Or your a Doctor so forget working on your car,forget being a poker pro,forget being anything other than a Doctor.
Characters in games SHOULD have a certain amount of versatility with just the right amount of restrictions to make the term CLASS still hold some value.I am not saying taking the CLASS/ROLE out of role playing games,i am saying offer up the versatility and quit putting 100% restrictions on characters and ideas.
People used to and likely still THINK you have to play a game for weeks before grading a game.I can spot how good or bad a developer is within the first 5-20 minutes of a game.I can tell by how they think,design the systems ,it tells me weather they have a clue or not.MOST games turn me off in the first 5 minutes,that is how far away mmorpg design is from where i want it to be.Single player rpg's also bad,shooters are really bad,genres have NOT improved,if anything they have got worse.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Plenty of old style MMOs around. People just want to complain.
I agree, the problem is people mentality has evolved over the years and stuff we once thought were mandatory are seen as a burden. Such as Level grinds. Most new MMOs with heavy level grinding like old school MMOs, die fast. Its an old grandfathered feature that need to go.
Classic WoW has almost all grind and is popular than most folks. It's not obscene but leveling pace is similar to Velious era EQ. But yea, hard to blame someone for not wanting to spend 200-300 hours just to start playing the game.
Any MMO can be role played. Nothing in an MMO forces role playing.
Therefore all MMOs are MMORPGs and all MMORPGs are MMOs. It just depends on your playstyle, not your stupid perception of the term.
If you said "what type of MMO", I would reply "the MMO type, what kind of question is that?"... because it's a ridiculous question.
Yeah, and pigs can fly just as well as eagles.
He's right, assuming by role-play he means the portraying of his character as a persona other than himself. Such can be done in any game, even single-player ones that provide choice if the player selects options based on what he feels his character would do rather than what he himself would choose in that same situation.
At the same time, I see little in terms of role-play in the vast majority of the MMORPGs I have played and it has no effect on the game continuing to grind along.
The only inherent RPG element of MMORPGs is that of JRPG console games, where it is more a reference to the progression of the character over time than actual role-play.
I can't "roleplay" in an action combat based MMO. No matter what skills my avatar has, it's based on my own mouse/keyboard skills
Of course you can. Role-play is not confined to one's game performance or the numerical values associated to a character, or by necessity linked to them at all. It is a product of one's imagination and the ability to suspend disbelief. It is the taking on of the persona and outlook of another for a time to vicariously experience from other perspectives. It is the pretending of being someone else simply for the fun of it. None of that is dependent on mouse/keyboard abilities.
You can't role-play game skill, but nothing prevents a person from role-playing in a game dependent on player skill. For example, if I was so inclined yet lacked the action skills to perform as well as would be expected by my character I could attribute my shortcoming to a lasting effect from previous injury that makes me less than I was, yet I am determined to go on regardless.
Easily done.
You can RP in any single-player game then as well. That is not the point of an online multiplayer game. Yes many play them solo, but are they RP lone-wolf hermits? If you try to actually role-play with other people in these games you will most likely be laughed at or ignored.
Why would a person role-playing a hermit seek to interact with others.
That would be rather out of character, don't you think?
No, of course not. Hermits have to run into people every once in a while too. Food, blankets, tools, etc. Being a hermit does not require one to have ZERO contact. Are you just arguing to argue?
Do they? Primitive weapons and tools can be hand crafted. Food can be hunted with primitive weapons and gathered by hand. The materials for clothing and blankets can be obtained through hunting, and can be made with primitive tools. Shelters can be either natural, such as caves, or crafted out of basic materials collected with primitive tools.
Being a hermit does not require zero contact, but it can be done that way.
Even if the person chose to have contact it could be kept to most surface level business interactions (npcs, auction houses, and such) with the hermit departing immediately after without interacting with any player characters.
Of course I'm arguing for the sake of it. Are you not as well? What topic on a gaming forum would be so serious that one would debate at a level beyond that.
Comments
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Example a Class design,is NOT done well when you are forced to play ONLY one class.it makes no sense at all,it would be like saying your a Carpenter so you cannot do anything else in your life ever.Or your a Doctor so forget working on your car,forget being a poker pro,forget being anything other than a Doctor.
Characters in games SHOULD have a certain amount of versatility with just the right amount of restrictions to make the term CLASS still hold some value.I am not saying taking the CLASS/ROLE out of role playing games,i am saying offer up the versatility and quit putting 100% restrictions on characters and ideas.
People used to and likely still THINK you have to play a game for weeks before grading a game.I can spot how good or bad a developer is within the first 5-20 minutes of a game.I can tell by how they think,design the systems ,it tells me weather they have a clue or not.MOST games turn me off in the first 5 minutes,that is how far away mmorpg design is from where i want it to be.Single player rpg's also bad,shooters are really bad,genres have NOT improved,if anything they have got worse.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.