In mmos it's danger that builds a commuity. An example is EQ, with horrendous corpse runs to find your gear with a timer ticking down, no in-game maps, no handy arrows or sparkly trails to guide you, and with entire zones to cross on foot to get to a new town.
By the time you'd died on your fourth corpse run into Nektulos Forest to try and find your original dead body you were damn grateful for help from another player. You also helped others in similar predicaments because it could well be your turn to be in the manure next time. Assisting others was routine.
Characters in current games have things so much easier. There's no real risk any more and no incentive to go out of your way to interact with anyone. Whether that's good or bad is a personal thing.
Oh, I agree. I didn't play EQ, but the same sort of thing happened in UO. MOBs would loot your corpse, making a more instantaneous help a thing. And I met a lot of good peeps in dungeons and around the game world, whether it was me helping them or them helping me. Usually that was a one time meeting with another player, but sometimes I got to know other characters and build a little trust with them because of repeated instances, often with a third party needing the help.
That's a good way to find a good guild, too.
I think that might be sort of true. Maybe it's instinctive. Maybe it's one of the only ways to force us into a social stance. However, I think in light of modern living and modern gaming, danger is more of an enthusiast sport. In gaming, there's the survival genre. Many games have different flavors or amounts of survival, whether or not they're part of the survival genre. In terms of MMORPGs, I think some of us are just more drawn to MMORPGs with more danger in them. We might see the social forcing as a positive thing because danger is also welcome. With other players, the response might be very negative becayse danger or something else is unwelcome.
To tell you the truth people do help in the current games. Yesterday I asked for help for my poison quest in Barrens and several people responded immediately and finally one actually flew from another region to Crossroads because the character in Barrens was too low level. I asked only once. So no there are people who help in classic anyway.
Would you say the majority, or minority of players are "social?" I think everyone can relate a "social story", but I find that to be the exception rather than the rule
Isn't that how it is in real life too? Do we really encounter that many nice people in real life? Why expect it in games?
Well, it "used to be" ( I dislike saying those words) common interests and hobbies that "seemed" to make it easier to be more amenable. Just like real life, though, now we have more players with differing interests, goals, and ways of approaching MMOs.
Maybe I'm just a curmudgeon, but I rarely "worked" at being social when I started playing MMORPGs (`2001). Now, it is either my cynical attitude or just not as much in common with most players I come into contact with.
Well, one thing's for sure. MMORPGs have become very easy to play and be made to feel like the player is a "winner." I mean, it's guaranteed that when you run through levels, you are exactly equal to your level (until a player tries PvP and gets their arse handed to them by someone with PvP skill). And in the end the player is among the "leet" at the top. There's no doubt about it, it's in the design like a legal contract.
So with that, what we have is millions of gamers who don't need anyone else. Oh, sure, players need to group. But their group has no more meaning to them than NPCs. Group and forget, that's the mantra. After that it's time to chase more levels, there will always be another group. Just click the button, in some cases. They'll even cross shard your "can-of-fellowship."
It's a "can-of-worms" as far as player interaction goes.
But something about people. Once you make things so artificially easy, just try to take it away from them. The mature might see the benefits and actually want that. Maybe not. But the immature, they will !! Scream Bloody Hell !! !! Rock The Walls !! !! Unfair !!
However, with so many hundreds of millions of gamers today, and many of them having matured in life as well as gaming, you can bet that a great socially interactive game has plenty of prospects among them.
It doesn't have to be a game for everyone. Just something a decent percentage of mature gamers like.
Following Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen for a while now something I've seen come up a lot is a belief that older mmo's were inherently social and that returning to "old school" values will revive the "lost"social components of the genre.
Firstly my position is that mmo's have always been and continue to be as social as a person wants to make them. I've been involved in busy guilds in games people generally point the finger at as being on-rails themepark games responsible for dumbing down the genre and I spent a lot of my time while in game chatting on Skype or Discord. I've played sandbox games where people claim you can't accomplish anything on your own as a lone wolf because I was more focused on enjoying the world or game mechanics than making friends. I've also shifted between all kinds of different social phases between those poles through different kinds of games.
After playing Classic something I noticed was that initially there was a large surge in people being more social. People chatted in dungeons and gave advice and traded crafted goods in low level towns. It was nice, only it was a construction built of people's desire to recreate what they believed the good old days were like. That is fine though and I'd like to see more of that. Sadly as the weeks have gone by it has dwindled, on the server I was on at least. Doing low level dungeons on alts the chats have mostly stopped again, people just want to get it done for that character and move on. I joined a guild which was quite social but just didn't have the energy to try get into the vocal inner circle that dominates chat....I have plenty of social outlets already.
So what have other people's experiences been like? And also, any ideas on how mmo's can better keep random social interactions alive going forward? I feel like repetition of content is one of the enemies of staying socially engaged but then repetition is generally woven into the very fabric of mmo's. I haven't thought that hard about it, just looking to start a discussion.
Level grinding is the problem. When you all going to see that?
Following Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen for a while now something I've seen come up a lot is a belief that older mmo's were inherently social and that returning to "old school" values will revive the "lost"social components of the genre.
Firstly my position is that mmo's have always been and continue to be as social as a person wants to make them. I've been involved in busy guilds in games people generally point the finger at as being on-rails themepark games responsible for dumbing down the genre and I spent a lot of my time while in game chatting on Skype or Discord. I've played sandbox games where people claim you can't accomplish anything on your own as a lone wolf because I was more focused on enjoying the world or game mechanics than making friends. I've also shifted between all kinds of different social phases between those poles through different kinds of games.
After playing Classic something I noticed was that initially there was a large surge in people being more social. People chatted in dungeons and gave advice and traded crafted goods in low level towns. It was nice, only it was a construction built of people's desire to recreate what they believed the good old days were like. That is fine though and I'd like to see more of that. Sadly as the weeks have gone by it has dwindled, on the server I was on at least. Doing low level dungeons on alts the chats have mostly stopped again, people just want to get it done for that character and move on. I joined a guild which was quite social but just didn't have the energy to try get into the vocal inner circle that dominates chat....I have plenty of social outlets already.
So what have other people's experiences been like? And also, any ideas on how mmo's can better keep random social interactions alive going forward? I feel like repetition of content is one of the enemies of staying socially engaged but then repetition is generally woven into the very fabric of mmo's. I haven't thought that hard about it, just looking to start a discussion.
Level grinding is the problem. When you all going to see that?
Level grinding is such a fallacy anyways. You gain power (and far too extreme) but then they bump you into another power range and you are back to even. It's a cheap trick. The only thing you really gain is new options that are fun to play.
This has been my argument all along. Developers killed the social mmorpgs, NOT THE PLAYERS !
Their was never a demand for easy solo games, their just easier to make. Make them easy and they don't have to balance anything. Marketing departments started a propaganda to make everyone think people asked for easy.
If you remember old MMO's in 2000 they had social hubs for people to hang out in. It was a huge part of playing the game. In Anarchy Online you had night clubs all over the cities that player would chill out all weekend long. I remember a lot of cool Saturday nights in the night clubs packed with players. Today's devs have just left this part out. All players do is hang around the AH and don't interact at all. And the games have become about raiding and gear. That has taken the place of the social part.
Following Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen for a while now something I've seen come up a lot is a belief that older mmo's were inherently social and that returning to "old school" values will revive the "lost"social components of the genre.
Firstly my position is that mmo's have always been and continue to be as social as a person wants to make them. I've been involved in busy guilds in games people generally point the finger at as being on-rails themepark games responsible for dumbing down the genre and I spent a lot of my time while in game chatting on Skype or Discord. I've played sandbox games where people claim you can't accomplish anything on your own as a lone wolf because I was more focused on enjoying the world or game mechanics than making friends. I've also shifted between all kinds of different social phases between those poles through different kinds of games.
After playing Classic something I noticed was that initially there was a large surge in people being more social. People chatted in dungeons and gave advice and traded crafted goods in low level towns. It was nice, only it was a construction built of people's desire to recreate what they believed the good old days were like. That is fine though and I'd like to see more of that. Sadly as the weeks have gone by it has dwindled, on the server I was on at least. Doing low level dungeons on alts the chats have mostly stopped again, people just want to get it done for that character and move on. I joined a guild which was quite social but just didn't have the energy to try get into the vocal inner circle that dominates chat....I have plenty of social outlets already.
So what have other people's experiences been like? And also, any ideas on how mmo's can better keep random social interactions alive going forward? I feel like repetition of content is one of the enemies of staying socially engaged but then repetition is generally woven into the very fabric of mmo's. I haven't thought that hard about it, just looking to start a discussion.
Level grinding is the problem. When you all going to see that?
Level grinding is not the problem , level lock is .
So what have other people's experiences been like?
Similar, in that the ‘pure’ social interactions have dropped off somewhat in favour of 'getting things done'. However, the chat channels on my server are still very active; people trading, looking for groups, asking for help, talking in dungeons (even if it’s just about the dungeon), etc.
Also compared to FFXIV, which I went back to for a day after 5.1, WoW Classic is extremely social, and not just social, but friendly... I know it's a small sample, but almost the only words I saw spoken in FFXIV were someone berating a tank for not knowing the new content; even low-level dungeons in WoW Classic aren't that toxic (at least in my experience).
And also, any ideas on how mmo's can better keep random social interactions alive going forward?
Keep things challenging... when players are regularly challenged it seems to setup the expectation that cooperation and positive social interaction are a required part of the game (edit: or at the very least will make your life significantly easier). And even better, when things don’t go as expected players seem far more likely to work through any issues than to instantly become negative and / or give up.
Conversely, when everything is 'easy' (or seen to be so) it seems to setup the expectation that cooperation and social interaction (much less positive social interaction) are not required. And when things don’t go as expected... well, I’m sure we’ve all met ‘that person’ who behaves very negatively.
Note: This is not to say everyone and every interaction in WoW Classic is 'positive' and everyone and every interaction in FFXIV is 'negative', but on the whole the design of each game does seem to have a very significant effect on how, and how much, players interact.
Megasevers and class balance. Every class feels the same and everybody you see is a random. + getting rewards every 5 minutes. And me getting older with younger kids having a different mindset of my own.
Megasevers and class balance. Every class feels the same and everybody you see is a random. + getting rewards every 5 minutes. And me getting older with younger kids having a different mindset of my own.
Getting old is definitely a factor for me. The world being what it is these days, with the constant media attention on "online grooming" and online predators, I worry about socialising even briefly with someone in-game and finding out that they're a kid. Nope, not taking even the slimmest of chances, which is my main reason for not socialising in mmorpgs nowadays.
I tend to think pacing is the most important thing in creating space for socializing. If a game has fast paced action combat there's no time to sit around and shoot the breeze; your hands and mind are constantly busy and there's no opportunity to joke around.
Even a relatively slow game like Classic can be turned into a hectic mess by speed running dungeons and having to account for the tank pulling 10 mobs at once despite nobody having AoE, because that's what the youtube video said to do. When it first released people played the dungeons normally. Mark targets, CC adds, avoid patrols, etc. You had all the time in the world to chit chat while the tank did his job.
Now everybody wants to be "meta" and run dungeons at hyper speed to finish them in 40 minutes instead of 45.
I've never really thought that MMORPGs did anything exceptional in terms of socials. At the most basic end, there are chat channels and emotes. Even mail came later in EQ1, so not all of the earliest days really had any inherently social tools, and not more than other games. Voice chat came in the form of external applications, which ate system memory (and bandwidth). Playing with a minimal system over dialup made voice a less then desirable option.
The tools really haven't evolved much. There's still chat channels for those inclined to type, and canned emotes. Many modern (and updated) games now offer voice channels.
Communication tools in games haven't really matured. The controls for each type are still drastically primitive -- an ignore, a boot option, and occasionally a mute. You can't build custom emotes with animation: an animated Roman-style salute while saying "Hail Caesar". And you certainly can't share custom emotes with others to make your own guild's "secret greeting". There's no control to adjust the voice volume of a specific person, and no voice filters for role-playing. Most people don't like voice chat anyway, as it immediately reveals if a person's real sex.
The pacing and delays built into the early game systems gave the players plenty of free time which could be used for chatting. Or, just as likely, eating a sandwich, as seemed to be a habit among healers I grouped with. It wasn't anything inherently social about the pace and pauses, I tend to credit it to many early players probably came from a face-to-face role-playing tradition where talking was expected.
/Minor aside
I find it odd that no company has ever tried to "reward" role-playing. First thing, it had to define what role-playing is for the purposes of that game. Most appear to be happy to call a game an RPG and let the players worry about what that actually means. That was something I was really keen on for my (aborted) MMORPG effort, and had some specific ideas along those lines. Maybe not for everyone, but that was the thought.
/end aside
These days, players have changed. They are too impatient, wanting a faster game session. They are also intolerant about voice chat, and most don't participate. (I don't either in most games). Oddly, the bias against voice chat appears to be largely with PC players. Console players are more tolerant of trying it. Bad behavior tends to hurt usage, too.
Bad behavior is rampant in games. Games provide a remote, impersonal communication, most all of the social norms and mores deal with face-to-face, personal communication. Its one thing to yell at Nooby_1721 on the voice chat over the internet, it's another thing to do so in person. Different rules, resulting in different behavior.
So, my take is that games are far less social than they used to be. But that really isn't anything the games did, it's all on the players.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
When we speak of older, traditional mmorpgs, this does not to me include WoW. WoW was released as a much easier game than ones that went before. The WoW world was much less dangerous. The consequences of failure were much less. Enemies were easier to defeat. Soloing was much more prevalent. Navigation was much easier. There was a ton of hand holding. Players were less dependent on one another. I could list 50 more e-z mode features.
So you can't say that new games emulating old school games won't produce socialization and then play the WoW card as if it means anything. WoW removed a ton of game design that stimulated socialization.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
WoW removed a ton of game design that stimulated socialization.
Either that or it invited a bunch of people for whom socialization is a very low priority. Perhaps both. I didn't initially stop socializing in WoW, but WoW is definitely where I started to regret trying to socialize.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
To tell you the truth people do help in the current games. Yesterday I asked for help for my poison quest in Barrens and several people responded immediately and finally one actually flew from another region to Crossroads because the character in Barrens was too low level. I asked only once. So no there are people who help in classic anyway.
Would you say the majority, or minority of players are "social?" I think everyone can relate a "social story", but I find that to be the exception rather than the rule
Isn't that how it is in real life too? Do we really encounter that many nice people in real life? Why expect it in games?
Contextually, that's the whole thing in a nutshell isn't it?
If you're walking down the street in a huge city you wouldn't expect it. If you're walking down the street in a small village, you'd expect it a bit more. But if you walked into your private Ferret Enthusiasts club you'd expect to find many other ferret lovers there just as "nice" as you.
A lot of you guys keep banging your heads against the wall trying to re-discover the secret sauce that made those pre-WOW MMOs feel all friendly and warm when the reason for it is sitting right in front of you: when they got successful and the mainstream came to play them you lost that loving feeling.
You're not in your small club anymore. You're now walking down the street in NY city.
WOW Classic doesn't have a nice community because of its clunky mechanics. It has it because of its limited appeal. Furthermore it's not even all that great compared to the norm pre-WOW simply because it's still WOW with its millions, not DAoC or AC with its 10s of thousands.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
When we speak of older, traditional mmorpgs, this does not to me include WoW. WoW was released as a much easier game than ones that went before. The WoW world was much less dangerous. The consequences of failure were much less. Enemies were easier to defeat. Soloing was much more prevalent. Navigation was much easier. There was a ton of hand holding. Players were less dependent on one another. I could list 50 more e-z mode features.
So you can't say that new games emulating old school games won't produce socialization and then play the WoW card as if it means anything. WoW removed a ton of game design that stimulated socialization.
I don't consider WoW as an old school, traditional MMORPG. It was far closer to the first of the modern MMORPGs. UO, AC, EQ1 are the games I consider 1st Gen. DAoC, EQ2 are 2nd Gen -- not quite the same as the first generation, but not quite modern, either. WoW jumped the track and went all EZ mode.
I'd agree that the WoW auction house and item mail systems removed a lot of the socialization opportunities from the genre. It was far more convenient, but far less social than the "East Commons Tunnel" experience. Odd thing, that EC Tunnel thing had nothing to do with the game's mechanisms, more the players inventing a solution to a problem (trading) that the game neglected.
I sold a lot of the early Jade jewelry in EC, but it gradually became less likely for people to interact other than "/t Mendel 1 ring". No real conversation, no response to my marketing blather ("/s An excellent choice, %T. Can I interest you in another for a special friend?" "/shout Just a few rings left, a bargain at 15pp! Hurry if you need one", nothing social at all. (Hotkeys were great fun, and beyond useful for a merchant).
In an odd way, the Bazaar was an improvement as it facilitated comparison shopping in a more centralized place. I always wished the Bazaar had a some promotion feature to periodically call out to the bazaar zone to advertise my wares. Especially if it were tied to the character's inventory. Today, the Bazaar feels so lifeless and solitary, especially with the addition of Offline mode.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Socializing in older MMOs was difficult compared to modern MMOs. Communication was either broad (yelling/region/faction/etc.) or targeted (private message/whisper).
Nowadays, there are whole screens dedicated to various types of socialization from massive chat options to auto-grouping.
People simply chose not to socialize. 1) because they games often don't require it and 2) people are often a pain in the ass to deal with.
WoW removed a ton of game design that stimulated socialization.
Either that or it invited a bunch of people for whom socialization is a very low priority. Perhaps both. I didn't initially stop socializing in WoW, but WoW is definitely where I started to regret trying to socialize.
People, on the whole, will take the easiest path. It's in our makeup, a survival mechanism to save energy. Easy mode in games light the torch of "Race To Finish."
If an MMORPG wants to create a more social world, it has to provide reasons for the players to be more social.
“You must understand, young Hobbit, it takes a long time to say anything in Old Entish. And we never say anything unless it is worth taking a long time to say.” : some tree
People, on the whole, will take the easiest path...
I hear what you are saying, but why didn't we just see only Necromancers and Druids in EQ? Easiest classes to use. MMORPGs were not always easy. Computers were not always easy to use. Ease of use in these key areas definitely opened the door to players who previously did not “belong” there. Perhaps these are largely the “race to finish” crowd you speak of.
I think overall players still like a challenge (not the easiest path), but the dynamics of the socialization have changed to suit the faster action desired by the newer generation. Nobody wants to hear about your cat or your favorite band. Some are happy for that and believe it has no place in video games.
Perhaps more players only play with people they know already these days. As the activity, and the genre specifically, has become more popular, it isnt as awe inspiring to “play D&D with someone from across the country or the globe”. It’s expected. Old news. Nobody cares what the weather is like in Denver. Either that or they already know.
Post edited by Palebane on
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
I started playing EQ shortly before the Luclin expansion. I remember going to the Nexus and porting down to Antonica, where I had never been (as a noob). There were dangerous creatures galore (dangerous to me that is, since I was low level). I got the crap kicked out of me. I sent a tell to a player nearby, asking for help. He did and I got back to the Nexus safely. That led to us talking, etc.
The EQ world was dangerous. People needed each other. That helped create a community. People looked out for each other.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
People, on the whole, will take the easiest path...
I hear what you are saying, but why didn't we just see only Necromancers and Druids in EQ? Easiest classes to use. MMORPGs were not always easy. Computers were not always easy to use. Ease of use in these key areas definitely opened the door to players who previously did not “belong” there. Perhaps these are largely the “race to finish” crowd you speak of.
I think overall players still like a challenge (not the easiest path), but the dynamics of the socialization have changed to suit the faster action desired by the newer generation. Nobody wants to hear about your cat or your favorite band. Some are happy for that and believe it has no place in video games.
Perhaps more players only play with people they know already these days. As the activity, and the genre specifically, has become more popular, it isnt as awe inspiring to “play D&D with someone from across the country or the globe”. It’s expected. Old news. Nobody cares what the weather is like in Denver. Either that or they already know.
People always play the "Race To Finish" game to one extent or another. It's natural. The problem comes in when the game in question offers nothing to counter that, leaving it highlighted as the play style.
And that's part of the anti-social issue in these massively multiplayer games, which has really turned into simply multi-player.
Comments
I mean, it's guaranteed that when you run through levels, you are exactly equal to your level (until a player tries PvP and gets their arse handed to them by someone with PvP skill). And in the end the player is among the "leet" at the top. There's no doubt about it, it's in the design like a legal contract.
So with that, what we have is millions of gamers who don't need anyone else.
Oh, sure, players need to group. But their group has no more meaning to them than NPCs. Group and forget, that's the mantra. After that it's time to chase more levels, there will always be another group. Just click the button, in some cases. They'll even cross shard your "can-of-fellowship."
It's a "can-of-worms" as far as player interaction goes.
But something about people. Once you make things so artificially easy, just try to take it away from them.
The mature might see the benefits and actually want that. Maybe not.
But the immature, they will
!! Scream Bloody Hell !!
!! Rock The Walls !!
!! Unfair !!
However, with so many hundreds of millions of gamers today, and many of them having matured in life as well as gaming, you can bet that a great socially interactive game has plenty of prospects among them.
It doesn't have to be a game for everyone. Just something a decent percentage of mature gamers like.
Once upon a time....
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
You gain power (and far too extreme) but then they bump you into another power range and you are back to even. It's a cheap trick.
The only thing you really gain is new options that are fun to play.
Once upon a time....
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
Even a relatively slow game like Classic can be turned into a hectic mess by speed running dungeons and having to account for the tank pulling 10 mobs at once despite nobody having AoE, because that's what the youtube video said to do. When it first released people played the dungeons normally. Mark targets, CC adds, avoid patrols, etc. You had all the time in the world to chit chat while the tank did his job.
Now everybody wants to be "meta" and run dungeons at hyper speed to finish them in 40 minutes instead of 45.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
So you can't say that new games emulating old school games won't produce socialization and then play the WoW card as if it means anything. WoW removed a ton of game design that stimulated socialization.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
If you're walking down the street in a huge city you wouldn't expect it. If you're walking down the street in a small village, you'd expect it a bit more. But if you walked into your private Ferret Enthusiasts club you'd expect to find many other ferret lovers there just as "nice" as you.
A lot of you guys keep banging your heads against the wall trying to re-discover the secret sauce that made those pre-WOW MMOs feel all friendly and warm when the reason for it is sitting right in front of you: when they got successful and the mainstream came to play them you lost that loving feeling.
You're not in your small club anymore. You're now walking down the street in NY city.
WOW Classic doesn't have a nice community because of its clunky mechanics. It has it because of its limited appeal. Furthermore it's not even all that great compared to the norm pre-WOW simply because it's still WOW with its millions, not DAoC or AC with its 10s of thousands.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
If an MMORPG wants to create a more social world, it has to provide reasons for the players to be more social.
“You must understand, young Hobbit, it takes a long time to say anything in Old Entish. And we never say anything unless it is worth taking a long time to say.”
: some tree
Once upon a time....
I think overall players still like a challenge (not the easiest path), but the dynamics of the socialization have changed to suit the faster action desired by the newer generation. Nobody wants to hear about your cat or your favorite band. Some are happy for that and believe it has no place in video games.
Perhaps more players only play with people they know already these days. As the activity, and the genre specifically, has become more popular, it isnt as awe inspiring to “play D&D with someone from across the country or the globe”. It’s expected. Old news. Nobody cares what the weather is like in Denver. Either that or they already know.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
The EQ world was dangerous. People needed each other. That helped create a community. People looked out for each other.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
The problem comes in when the game in question offers nothing to counter that, leaving it highlighted as the play style.
And that's part of the anti-social issue in these massively multiplayer games, which has really turned into simply multi-player.
Once upon a time....