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A Milestone of Innovation?

KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484

Seed your Destiny$560,000

Take hold of the threads of fate and play an active part in shaping your character's destiny! During the character creation process you will be able to use Story Points to indicate your desire for certain types of story arcs to the Story Engine. As a bonus, all Bloodline+ package holders will be able to use this system for free during Exposition!

After reading through a discussion on the COE forums I have to wonder if SBS has reached a new milestone of innovation, well in monetization at least.

Looks like this item will be offered in a cash shop potentially after release, would this be the first sighting of Paying to Adventure? (P2A)

Not many details have been confirmed how it works and considering it interacts and modifies their yet to be seen in action story book engine it's hard to say.

I saw someone else call this Paying to have Fun, (P2F) but I think this term fits almost any game, or form of recreation, we usually pay for "fun."


"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






AnOldFartjonp200bcbully[Deleted User]Azaron_Nightblade
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Comments

  • AnOldFartAnOldFart Member RarePosts: 554
    Between this, the map and next week's hinted at item I'm disappointed Caspian didn't explain about p2adventure in the kickstarter
    Kyleran
  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,496
    That sounds an awful lot like they are trying to sell something else that they will never be able to deliver.  A feature for another yet to be implemented feature.  What's the odds that SBS will not be able to generate enough of these "story arcs" to meet the number that they sell?  We have seen that trick before.



    KyleranSlapshot1188[Deleted User]

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • LokeroLokero Member RarePosts: 1,514
    SBS has really gone "all-in" on the feature creep flood, haven't they?

    That's the problem with fund-raising.  People are more willing to give money if you keep promising new things.
    And it certainly seems like SBS is desperate for money.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484
    edited October 2019
    Mendel said:
    That sounds an awful lot like they are trying to sell something else that they will never be able to deliver.  A feature for another yet to be implemented feature.  What's the odds that SBS will not be able to generate enough of these "story arcs" to meet the number that they sell?  We have seen that trick before.



    Yeah, others were saying it's probably just a refinement of another planned story book system, basically letting players influence the types of story arcs they are presented with instead of whatever default algorithm would normally be used.

    Nothing official so this all is just mostly armchair quarterback musings.

    (Yes, I'm baiting a bit, I know he's back)

     :D 

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484
    Kyleran said:
    Mendel said:
    That sounds an awful lot like they are trying to sell something else that they will never be able to deliver.  A feature for another yet to be implemented feature.  What's the odds that SBS will not be able to generate enough of these "story arcs" to meet the number that they sell?  We have seen that trick before.



    Yeah, others were saying it's probably just a refinement of another planned story book system, basically letting players influence the types of story arcs they are presented with instead of whatever default algorithm would normally be used.

    Nothing official so this all is just mostly armchair quarterback musings.

    (Yes, I'm baiting a bit, I know he's out there)

    ?

    I think you are giving these people to much credit on the f's they give at this point, I hate seeing good people get ripped off, it kills me to see this happening. People could say but Star Citizen Ma .. Prime Directective.. I say I can login and play it.
    Yeah, been feeling more charitable today, I'm sure it will quickly pass. :)

    While others often try to equate SC to COE I really don't, people have had regular access to test what has been done for several years and anyone can join in now if they wish.

    Yeah, they both milk their backers a bit too much IMO, but hey, people are free to spend their money as they wish and SC is a far better bet at this point.




    gervaise1

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,577
    I think that item is borderline breach of agreement from CoE devs: Basic game package already includes access to the game, and that access is normally thought to include the freedom to choose what content you wish to play, to the extend players can make that choice in-game.

    The devs are allowed to sell access to extra content, extra items, and such. But if the game has something like story engine that generates a story, for example when you enter a dungeon some kind of story generated within that dungeon, then access to that is not extra it's part of the basic package.

    The devs are likely allowed to sell expanded story sets where you character could gain access to additional stories. But they have already sold people access to whatever basic stories the game's story engine comes with, and that purchase already included the ability to choose your story as far as the game allows anyone to choose out of those basic stories.
    KyleranMendel
     
  • AnOldFartAnOldFart Member RarePosts: 554
    Just a little bit of knowledge on this item, should have probably posted this before.

    So apparently this item is more of a customisation item.

    Everyone will get a destiny assigned to their character based on multiple factors. That destiny (storyline) will activate if certain circumstances are met. Now the player doesn't know what these requirements are but apparently the story "engine" will push the player towards it.


    This item allows the player to customise how their destiny will present itself so that they can go with their chosen play style and still get the adventure.
    Next week apparently there will be an item similar to this but for nobility.
    VrikaKyleran
  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916
    The standard "LOL" emote doesn't do this justice, I need a LMAO emote ! :)
    [Deleted User]
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,865
    AnOldFart said:
    Just a little bit of knowledge on this item, should have probably posted this before.

    So apparently this item is more of a customisation item.

    Everyone will get a destiny assigned to their character based on multiple factors. That destiny (storyline) will activate if certain circumstances are met. Now the player doesn't know what these requirements are but apparently the story "engine" will push the player towards it.


    This item allows the player to customise how their destiny will present itself so that they can go with their chosen play style and still get the adventure.
    Next week apparently there will be an item similar to this but for nobility.
    I will say this again... at this point they have by far the most P2W (P4Advantage) system I have ever seen.  They should just stop with the tissue paper justifications and embrace it.
    AnOldFart[Deleted User]

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    It seems easier to raise money than to make a mmorpg.
    [Deleted User]Slapshot1188Kyleran[Deleted User]

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    edited October 2019
    No, pay to adventure has been done way worse with Wiz 101 another game in the lost list of deceptive developers who claim f2p yet is nowhere near f2p.You can play about 1% or less of w101 for free,so how is that remotely free?

    This example sounds to me more like pay to use systems.

    To me more importantly is not the scummy money ideas but these ideas ruin the immersive feeling of being in a game world.It would be like seeing some giant hand pierce through the clouds,come down and grab your money our of your wallet.

    This has been the sad reality for a VERY long time,dev studios are far more interested in ways to make money than to actually make a AAA immersive game.Cash shops should NEVER enter inside the game world,if they do that game is right off my list.


    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • jonp200jonp200 Member UncommonPosts: 457
    edited October 2019
    Kyleran said:

    Seed your Destiny$560,000

    Take hold of the threads of fate and play an active part in shaping your character's destiny! During the character creation process you will be able to use Story Points to indicate your desire for certain types of story arcs to the Story Engine. As a bonus, all Bloodline+ package holders will be able to use this system for free during Exposition!

    After reading through a discussion on the COE forums I have to wonder if SBS has reached a new milestone of innovation, well in monetization at least.

    Looks like this item will be offered in a cash shop potentially after release, would this be the first sighting of Paying to Adventure? (P2A)

    Not many details have been confirmed how it works and considering it interacts and modifies their yet to be seen in action story book engine it's hard to say.

    I saw someone else call this Paying to have Fun, (P2F) but I think this term fits almost any game, or form of recreation, we usually pay for "fun."


    I agree.  I am awed at their ability to continue to raise cash on this vaporware AND to do so with an arrogant, condescending tone throughout.... BRAVO! It baffles the mind...

    Suggestion to the development team:  Trading cards that can be purchased for real cash that turn into weapons, land, armor and other items in game.  The more you buy, the greater your advantage when the game "launches."  Can't miss!

    Seriously, I went from despising this team to being in awe of them.  Can't even compare them to Star Citizen.  There's a couple playable modes over there....

    Own that pay to win!  Capitalism baby!  Te more you have, the better your chance to step on the necks of those who don't.  Definition of chaos (Should it ever come to pass):  Launch Day for COE.
    KyleranSpottyGekko[Deleted User]

    Seaspite
    Playing ESO on my X-Box


  • Nubz_UniteNubz_Unite Member UncommonPosts: 30
    Kyleran said:

    Seed your Destiny$560,000

    Take hold of the threads of fate and play an active part in shaping your character's destiny! During the character creation process you will be able to use Story Points to indicate your desire for certain types of story arcs to the Story Engine. As a bonus, all Bloodline+ package holders will be able to use this system for free during Exposition!

    After reading through a discussion on the COE forums I have to wonder if SBS has reached a new milestone of innovation, well in monetization at least.

    Looks like this item will be offered in a cash shop potentially after release, would this be the first sighting of Paying to Adventure? (P2A)

    Not many details have been confirmed how it works and considering it interacts and modifies their yet to be seen in action story book engine it's hard to say.

    I saw someone else call this Paying to have Fun, (P2F) but I think this term fits almost any game, or form of recreation, we usually pay for "fun."



    That is some suspicious wording for sure, but I would like to offer the alternative reading that the cost of this seed your destiny thing will solely be based on Story Points, which players wouldn't be able to generate before expo hence the free cost of it during expo. IIRC Story points are generated based on your activity and participation in storylines and events within the game. Most likely those in positions of nobility will have a much easier time generating story points thus enabling them to always use this feature on their new lives while a blacksmith might only get to use this feature every third character or something like that. Personally I think it's just a bad feature if they want players to influence I would prefer it if it influenced the direction of an overall server story rather then their own little personal ones.
    Kyleran
  • bcbullybcbully Member EpicPosts: 11,818
    AMAZING
    "We see fundamentals and we ape in"
  • kitaradkitarad Member LegendaryPosts: 7,460
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,865
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    bcbully

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484
    edited October 2019
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    Well Jeromy is basically following the same playbook used by Garriott and Roberts, keep feeding the ardent supporters hope by doling out new content every now and then.

    Ka-ching $$$

    Done correctly this could go on for many more years. 





    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 15,865
    Kyleran said:
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    Well Jeromy is basically following the same playbook used by Garriott and Roberts, keep feeding the ardent supporters hope by doling out new content every now and then.

    Ka-ching $$$

    Done correctly this could go on for many more years. 





    The difference is that portalarium made a fatal mistake and let people into the game.  That’s the point where reality starts to hit.  As long as it’s just hopes and dreams the money keeps flowing.
    Kyleran

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

  • AnOldFartAnOldFart Member RarePosts: 554
    Kyleran said:
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    Well Jeromy is basically following the same playbook used by Garriott and Roberts, keep feeding the ardent supporters hope by doling out new content every now and then.

    Ka-ching $$$

    Done correctly this could go on for many more years. 





    The difference is that portalarium made a fatal mistake and let people into the game.  That’s the point where reality starts to hit.  As long as it’s just hopes and dreams the money keeps flowing.

    Seems SC seems an exception to this rule, people have been in and enjoyed it.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 41,484
    edited October 2019
    AnOldFart said:
    Kyleran said:
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    Well Jeromy is basically following the same playbook used by Garriott and Roberts, keep feeding the ardent supporters hope by doling out new content every now and then.

    Ka-ching $$$

    Done correctly this could go on for many more years. 





    The difference is that portalarium made a fatal mistake and let people into the game.  That’s the point where reality starts to hit.  As long as it’s just hopes and dreams the money keeps flowing.

    Seems SC seems an exception to this rule, people have been in and enjoyed it.
    Well, perhaps what they see in SC when playing pleases them and doesn't suck?

    Might account for the different reception than SotA received 
    AnOldFarttweedledumb99

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,577
    AnOldFart said:
    Kyleran said:
    Kyleran said:
    kitarad said:
    I do love how both @Kyleran and @Slapshot1188 seem to enjoy pointing out all the dreadful things about the development of this game. Has been an enjoyable read. From where I'm sitting most of it has been warranted and soon it might come to pass far more productive than what the game has managed to put out.
    Glad you enjoy reading them.  As you might imagine our attempts at enlightenment on the official COE forums are met with a different reaction by many.

    But the tide seems to be slowly turning.


    They made over a million dollars in the last month.  Just like real life, folks don’t care about the truth or facts.  Just keep feeding them the Blue pills and their wallets are open.
    Well Jeromy is basically following the same playbook used by Garriott and Roberts, keep feeding the ardent supporters hope by doling out new content every now and then.

    Ka-ching $$$

    Done correctly this could go on for many more years. 





    The difference is that portalarium made a fatal mistake and let people into the game.  That’s the point where reality starts to hit.  As long as it’s just hopes and dreams the money keeps flowing.

    Seems SC seems an exception to this rule, people have been in and enjoyed it.
    I think it might be more about crossing the line where people start believing that this is about as good as the final product is going to get. I think even SotA got a lot of money through their telethons as long as people were testing clearly unfinished product and had easy time believing it was going to get better.
    KyleranMendelAnOldFarttweedledumb99
     
  • ZeekPlayzZeekPlayz Member UncommonPosts: 27
    CoE is either the best success or the crngiest and worst failure
  • CostaniusCostanius Member UncommonPosts: 231
    In SC there actually is a playable alpha version universe with two huge planets and about a dozen moons, space-stations,  many of their ships they sold as concept art years ago are now finished, in and are flyable, there are missions, pvp, trading, multiplayer, VOIP, FOIP and there was significant progress especially the last two years. There are several SC-only twitch streamers having fun playing the current alpha versions together with their communities.
    You can't really compare SC to CoE...
    Slapshot1188KyleranAnOldFarttweedledumb99

    -----------------------------------
    Life is too short to play bad games.

  • goldboyy45goldboyy45 Member UncommonPosts: 296
    Costanius said:
    In SC there actually is a playable alpha version universe with two huge planets and about a dozen moons, space-stations,  many of their ships they sold as concept art years ago are now finished, in and are flyable, there are missions, pvp, trading, multiplayer, VOIP, FOIP and there was significant progress especially the last two years. There are several SC-only twitch streamers having fun playing the current alpha versions together with their communities.
    You can't really compare SC to CoE...
    Agreed with you, CoE, NO ONE has ever set foot in the game, other than what the studio will tell you, 7.5M cash raised, you can't even login in the game, think about that.
    Kyleran
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