I observe. I describe. I never claim(ed) to represent everybody.
"Because I was - and am - there."
You discount arguments that exist outside your anecdotal experiences, and you use statements like that quote you wrote, as the excuse.
Your words, your mistake.
I was and I am in the SC playtester forum. My words. No mistake.
And you don't represent all of them, so you cannot claim what other playtesters do and do not do.
Which you tried to do, as you said exactly this;
"Playtesters do not "kick" things into lower priority. And we are pretty good at finding out if something was really fixed or not."
Which is an observably false statement because you tried to claim what "playtesters" do (not) do, and tried to make a claim with the collective "we" (which remains false any ways since, clearly, you missed the above bug).
I like how you've fixated on the video and are ignoring things like the gif that has to come from this year, but won't even take a moment to look at when it was published, nor look at the video for the dialogue or state of the game.
And still won't acknowledge that the whole point either of those got mentioned was your erroneous claim you haven't owned up to.
I like how you've fixated on the video and are ignoring things like the gif that has to come from this year, but won't even take a moment to look at when it was published, nor look at the video for the dialogue or state of the game.
And still won't acknowledge that the whole point either of those got mentioned was your erroneous claim you haven't owned up to.
There is no dialogue. There is no information when the video was made. The information when it was uploaded is not useful - I can upload videos that are many years old. It is hard to evaluate the „state of the game“ from such a focused scene of only a few seconds duration.
But as I said - if you know this information feel free to share and it can be used to write a bug report.
I like how you've fixated on the video and are ignoring things like the gif that has to come from this year, but won't even take a moment to look at when it was published, nor look at the video for the dialogue or state of the game.
And still won't acknowledge that the whole point either of those got mentioned was your erroneous claim you haven't owned up to.
There is no dialogue. There is no information when the video was made. The information when it was uploaded is not useful - I can upload videos that are many years old. It is hard to evaluate the „state of the game“ from such a focused scene of only a few seconds duration.
Ah yes... The video published in 2019, titled "Star Citizen Experience in 2019" A 15 minute long video, yet you talk about "only a few seconds". One with many such scenes, but you say only one "focused" one. Where the player's avatar is also female, which should be a hint. While dude is constantly talking, yet you claim there's no dialogue. And the creator notes that he was approached and filmed this experience only a few days prior to posting the video.
But all you can do is claim that a specific scene is only "a few seconds long"?
You aren't even trying to pose a valid argument any more.
"Playtesters do not "kick" things into lower priority. And we are pretty good at finding out if something was really fixed or not."
Your words. Disowning your own comments is quite the act of desperation.
And this is a simple observation. Finding bugs is what the voluntary playtesters do. This is not a claim by me to by a Tyranid hivemind synapse creature for all of the playtesters ;-)
In some people's opinion, SC can do nothing right.
In my opinion, SC is far too expensive for an incomplete game.
So, in my opinion, money put into SC at this time is a sunken cost. I didn't buy a car with the intention of driving it in 5 years, nor have I bought a ticket to Mars. Money for future consumer goods is a sunken cost to me. Please don't try to insist that these cases are similar to the futures/options market, they aren't -- money put into SC (and other crowd-funded games) isn't protected by laws and SEC regulations (in the US).
In some people's opinion, SC can do nothing right.
In my opinion, SC is far too expensive for an incomplete game.
So, in my opinion, money put into SC at this time is a sunken cost. I didn't buy a car with the intention of driving it in 5 years, nor have I bought a ticket to Mars. Money for future consumer goods is a sunken cost to me. Please don't try to insist that these cases are similar to the futures/options market, they aren't -- money put into SC (and other crowd-funded games) isn't protected by laws and SEC regulations (in the US).
Hello Mendel,
were you or are you Star Citizen backer?
Do you participate in any game crowdfunding?
Have fun
I did not give money to Star Citizen, and have never participated in any game crowdfunding.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
In some people's opinion, SC can do nothing right.
In my opinion, SC is far too expensive for an incomplete game.
So, in my opinion, money put into SC at this time is a sunken cost. I didn't buy a car with the intention of driving it in 5 years, nor have I bought a ticket to Mars. Money for future consumer goods is a sunken cost to me. Please don't try to insist that these cases are similar to the futures/options market, they aren't -- money put into SC (and other crowd-funded games) isn't protected by laws and SEC regulations (in the US).
Hello Mendel,
were you or are you Star Citizen backer?
Do you participate in any game crowdfunding?
Have fun
I did not give money to Star Citizen, and have never participated in any game crowdfunding.
I like how you've fixated on the video and are ignoring things like the gif that has to come from this year, but won't even take a moment to look at when it was published, nor look at the video for the dialogue or state of the game.
And still won't acknowledge that the whole point either of those got mentioned was your erroneous claim you haven't owned up to.
There is no dialogue. There is no information when the video was made. The information when it was uploaded is not useful - I can upload videos that are many years old. It is hard to evaluate the „state of the game“ from such a focused scene of only a few seconds duration.
Ah yes... The video published in 2019, titled "Star Citizen Experience in 2019" A 15 minute long video, yet you talk about "only a few seconds". One with many such scenes, but you say only one "focused" one. Where the player's avatar is also female, which should be a hint. While dude is constantly talking, yet you claim there's no dialogue. And the creator notes that he was approached and filmed this experience only a few days prior to posting the video.
But all you can do is claim that a specific scene is only "a few seconds long"?
You aren't even trying to pose a valid argument any more.
Ahhh, NOW I understand what you talk about. We are talking about two different videos. YOU talk about the 15:20 video of TheYamiiks. The „long neck“ bug does not appear in that video. Ever.
I talk about the 15 second clip in another post, with the „long neck“ bug on a female avatar (with no dialogue and no additional information).
In the video of TheYamiks he basically goes through the list of known and reproducable bugs that are already earmarked for being patched out (he likes elevator and stair bugs ;-) ). And claims that this is the state of SC in 2019. And as commentators already mention in his thread „I got to experience all the worst bugs that I heard about, but never seen first hand.“
I talk about the 15 second clip in another post, with the „long neck“ bug on a female avatar...
You mean you were talking about the gif, which still displays the female avatars that implies it has to have come from this year. Which remains a massive step from your prior "that was solved four years ago" claim.
You, the person that claimed "And we are pretty good at finding out if something was really fixed or not.", couldn't find a bug in four years that clearly still exists as of this year.
I talk about the 15 second clip in another post, with the „long neck“ bug on a female avatar...
You mean you were talking about the gif, which still displays the female avatars that implies it has to have come from this year. Which remains a massive step from your prior "that was solved four years ago" claim.
Yes, I am talking about the gif showing the elongated neck bug.
Female characters are in SC as early as spring 2017 (e.g. watch the YouTube video of „BoredGamer“ from 27th March 2017 from Alpha 3.0. With no elongated neck bug in his video.
Feel free to share if you have more information on the SC version relevant for this gif
I talk about the 15 second clip in another post, with the „long neck“ bug on a female avatar...
You mean you were talking about the gif, which still displays the female avatars that implies it has to have come from this year. Which remains a massive step from your prior "that was solved four years ago" claim.
Yes, I am talking about the gif showing the elongated neck bug.
Female characters are in SC as early as spring 2017 (e.g. watch the YouTube video of „BoredGamer“ from 27th March 2017 from Alpha 3.0. With no elongated neck bug in his video.
The biggest stretch you have would be claiming that female characters were in SC as of 2017. The reality being, that they were internally testing them, and the video you mention(as well as the one that comes just before it) only shows demo footage of some in-editor and in-tool tests, as well as in-engine stills of the model still-posed. No player had access to the model at the time, and they did not have access to playing one until much later with 3.5, which launched at the end of March this year. You just tried to send people on a goose chase with a stupidly soft claim.
It's clearly been a habit of yours. Trying to make some remark, then backpedaling into a softer version that gives you wiggle room for the moment when someone catches you trying to fool them. What, are you going to backpedal into saying "Well the assets were in the game..."?
A still image of an asset in the game for a render demo means next to nothing. It won't even tell you the state of the rig because it's more than likely just been hand-posed for the screengrabs.
Worth also noting in the March 25th video, you also see a dude going down the stairs with some janky box sledding.
And none of that remains to absolve that the gif ends up otherwise being from this year (within the last five months), given player access to female avatars with 3.5. Unless you're trying to say that gif was shared by the developers themselves derping about, which then leads into wondering how everyone wouldn't have known about that gif already.
Or in short, this was nothing more than yet another red herring from you to try and obfuscate an otherwise obvious error on your part.
In some people's opinion, SC can do nothing right.
In my opinion, SC is far too expensive for an incomplete game.
So, in my opinion, money put into SC at this time is a sunken cost. I didn't buy a car with the intention of driving it in 5 years, nor have I bought a ticket to Mars. Money for future consumer goods is a sunken cost to me. Please don't try to insist that these cases are similar to the futures/options market, they aren't -- money put into SC (and other crowd-funded games) isn't protected by laws and SEC regulations (in the US).
Hello Mendel,
were you or are you Star Citizen backer?
Do you participate in any game crowdfunding?
Have fun
I did not give money to Star Citizen, and have never participated in any game crowdfunding.
Thank you.
Have fun
Now I'm curious. Why ask if I contributed to SC or other crowdfunded games?
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
In some people's opinion, SC can do nothing right.
In my opinion, SC is far too expensive for an incomplete game.
So, in my opinion, money put into SC at this time is a sunken cost. I didn't buy a car with the intention of driving it in 5 years, nor have I bought a ticket to Mars. Money for future consumer goods is a sunken cost to me. Please don't try to insist that these cases are similar to the futures/options market, they aren't -- money put into SC (and other crowd-funded games) isn't protected by laws and SEC regulations (in the US).
Hello Mendel,
were you or are you Star Citizen backer?
Do you participate in any game crowdfunding?
Have fun
I did not give money to Star Citizen, and have never participated in any game crowdfunding.
Thank you.
Have fun
Now I'm curious. Why ask if I contributed to SC or other crowdfunded games?
The original request by the OP was: „Describe the moment you realized that supporting Star Citizen was a "Sunk Cost Fallacy".“
And I wanted to know if you DID support Star Citizen. And then if at some time during the crowdfunding you realized something. But you did not support SC, did not participate in the crowdfunding.
You mentioned a car and 5 years of waiting for driving as an example. Waiting several years in a crowdfunding project is nothing unusual and not unexpected. I wanted to know if you participate in any crowdfunding projects, if you are personally familiar with the typical waiting time in crowdfunding campaigns.
I realized in 2016 for sure. "Answer the call 2016!" page was still up with a pledge button through like August-November when everyone at CIG Knew there was no way they were going to hit their 2016 deadline. This was just a very unethical way to garner funds from people IMO.
After that, watching the way they lied about things over and over again was disturbing. Watching the sale of land, a system that may never even exist in game was strange.
I remember that DKlond guy was defending them back then too. He was saying he was predicting a mid-2017 release of SQ42. Laughable now as always. We've been through so many embarrassing things for the project and its staunch supporters that it's impossble not to see how badly this is going. It wouldn't bother me so much if they just didn't knowingly lie about release dates and other various things. Companies miss deadlines all the time. This company knows they are going to miss them before hand and collects donations based on false information.
I realized in 2016 for sure. "Answer the call 2016!" page was still up with a pledge button through like August-November when everyone at CIG Knew there was no way they were going to hit their 2016 deadline. This was just a very unethical way to garner funds from people IMO.
After that, watching the way they lied about things over and over again was disturbing. Watching the sale of land, a system that may never even exist in game was strange.
I remember that DKlond guy was defending them back then too. He was saying he was predicting a mid-2017 release of SQ42. Laughable now as always. We've been through so many embarrassing things for the project and its staunch supporters that it's impossble not to see how badly this is going. It wouldn't bother me so much if they just didn't knowingly lie about release dates and other various things. Companies miss deadlines all the time. This company knows they are going to miss them before hand and collects donations based on false information.
Most of the ardent fans when asked when the game will release generally answer with current year + 1 or 2. Go back far enough in this forum and the usual suspects will be seen doing it. If you draw attention to it you will get the excuse of scope increase.
But many (not necessarily on this forum) will continue to pour money onto the garbage fire thinking that if they stop now the game could fail without their support. Also explains why some attack the critics cause any threat to the funding model is seen as a direct threat to the game being completed
Comments
Which you tried to do, as you said exactly this;
"Playtesters do not "kick" things into lower priority. And we are pretty good at finding out if something was really fixed or not."
Which is an observably false statement because you tried to claim what "playtesters" do (not) do, and tried to make a claim with the collective "we" (which remains false any ways since, clearly, you missed the above bug).
That's kind of how living in a fantasy works.
Have fun
And still won't acknowledge that the whole point either of those got mentioned was your erroneous claim you haven't owned up to.
But as I said - if you know this information feel free to share and it can be used to write a bug report.
Have fun
What they do in the Forum i see in the Forum.
What they NOT do in the forum, I cannot know. I would have to be an Eldar Runesmith for that.
And - as already mentioned - I never claimed to represent all of them. These are you your words, nothing that I said.
Have fun
Your words. Disowning your own comments is quite the act of desperation.
The video published in 2019, titled "Star Citizen Experience in 2019"
A 15 minute long video, yet you talk about "only a few seconds".
One with many such scenes, but you say only one "focused" one.
Where the player's avatar is also female, which should be a hint.
While dude is constantly talking, yet you claim there's no dialogue.
And the creator notes that he was approached and filmed this experience only a few days prior to posting the video.
But all you can do is claim that a specific scene is only "a few seconds long"?
You aren't even trying to pose a valid argument any more.
Have fun
"Playtesters will kick things wherever they want. Most won't even playtest, so why would you ever think of claiming they wouldn't drop priority or discussion of one bug in favor of some newer or more serious bug?"
Read more at https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/483287/sunk-cost-fallacy/p9#6Lj1kh0yU6SSk6Qm.99
Not going to take the claims of someone who can't find some bug in four years, while others post examples of it, in regards to playtesting.
were you or are you Star Citizen backer?
Do you participate in any game crowdfunding?
Have fun
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Have fun
Ahhh, NOW I understand what you talk about. We are talking about two different videos. YOU talk about the 15:20 video of TheYamiiks. The „long neck“ bug does not appear in that video. Ever.
I talk about the 15 second clip in another post, with the „long neck“ bug on a female avatar (with no dialogue and no additional information).
In the video of TheYamiks he basically goes through the list of known and reproducable bugs that are already earmarked for being patched out (he likes elevator and stair bugs ;-) ). And claims that this is the state of SC in 2019. And as commentators already mention in his thread „I got to experience all the worst bugs that I heard about, but never seen first hand.“
Have fun
You, the person that claimed "And we are pretty good at finding out if something was really fixed or not.", couldn't find a bug in four years that clearly still exists as of this year.
By all means, keep digging that hole.
Female characters are in SC as early as spring 2017 (e.g. watch the YouTube video of „BoredGamer“ from 27th March 2017 from Alpha 3.0. With no elongated neck bug in his video.
Feel free to share if you have more information on the SC version relevant for this gif
Have fun
It's clearly been a habit of yours. Trying to make some remark, then backpedaling into a softer version that gives you wiggle room for the moment when someone catches you trying to fool them. What, are you going to backpedal into saying "Well the assets were in the game..."?
A still image of an asset in the game for a render demo means next to nothing. It won't even tell you the state of the rig because it's more than likely just been hand-posed for the screengrabs.
Worth also noting in the March 25th video, you also see a dude going down the stairs with some janky box sledding.
And none of that remains to absolve that the gif ends up otherwise being from this year (within the last five months), given player access to female avatars with 3.5. Unless you're trying to say that gif was shared by the developers themselves derping about, which then leads into wondering how everyone wouldn't have known about that gif already.
Or in short, this was nothing more than yet another red herring from you to try and obfuscate an otherwise obvious error on your part.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
„Describe the moment you realized that supporting Star Citizen was a "Sunk Cost Fallacy".“
And I wanted to know if you DID support Star Citizen. And then if at some time during the crowdfunding you realized something. But you did not support SC, did not participate in the crowdfunding.
You mentioned a car and 5 years of waiting for driving as an example. Waiting several years in a crowdfunding project is nothing unusual and not unexpected. I wanted to know if you participate in any crowdfunding projects, if you are personally familiar with the typical waiting time in crowdfunding campaigns.
Have fun
What did I say that you consider a lie?
Have fun
After that, watching the way they lied about things over and over again was disturbing. Watching the sale of land, a system that may never even exist in game was strange.
I remember that DKlond guy was defending them back then too. He was saying he was predicting a mid-2017 release of SQ42. Laughable now as always. We've been through so many embarrassing things for the project and its staunch supporters that it's impossble not to see how badly this is going. It wouldn't bother me so much if they just didn't knowingly lie about release dates and other various things. Companies miss deadlines all the time. This company knows they are going to miss them before hand and collects donations based on false information.
But many (not necessarily on this forum) will continue to pour money onto the garbage fire thinking that if they stop now the game could fail without their support. Also explains why some attack the critics cause any threat to the funding model is seen as a direct threat to the game being completed
The premonitions of the "end is near", 90 days top, total collapse since 2015 are now a beautifull meme....
The impossible seamless transition from space to planet fake demoed turned out to be real...
The vehicles inside vehicles too....
The female characthers too...
Atmospheric planets with crysis level detail too...
Cityplanets too...
Capital ships too....
Making dreams come true