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Updated; Something's brewing at Gamigo (trion) archeage without p2w elements and subscription :O?

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Comments

  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,157
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    Many of us have been asking for the AA sub only for years here , Would be great to finally see it ..

       Ill jump into that for sure..

     Good to see AA and Rift in competent hands now ..


    Competent hands????

    Rift has 2 devs left.

    Lol 

    There's nobody left to work on the games anymore. Gamigo took a sinking company and ran it into the ground hard instead of saving it.

    This AA sub relaunch was planned over a year ago way before Gamigo even came into the picture- this was a work of XL and Trion - gamigo didnt do shit to make this happen.

    The work was well underway as I said a long time ago
    And yet the community was asking for it for 5 years and Trion could not manage it .. Gamigo in under 6 moths will deliver lol..

     And it will crush al the other p2w server easily

    Dude you have no idea what you are talking about.

    It took Trion 5 years to finally get XL to agree to subscription servers.

    XL started coding all the changes to rip out the cash shop over a year ago.... 

    Gamigo swoops and gets credit for something they had  nothing to do with.

    Please- this is like when a new president comes in and gets credit (or blame) for 4 years of work that the previous president did - and people say - look it took the new president only 6 months .


    Please stop embarrassing yourself with things you have no insight into.
    After all the whales spent hundreds / thousands of dollars, and even they broke the game so bad all the whales jumped ship...

    Now suddenly they want to add subscriptions and expect people to trust such companies with "Ashes OF Creation" just around the corner + many other games ?
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Dragnelus said:
    Tbh if its p2p without heavy p2w. I will play it till I dont like it anymore and move on, like every other mmorpg.
    It is good to be optimistic, and maybe there will be some improvements, but its Gamigo so i really would not hold my breath on that one. :/
  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    Can somebody give a history lesson here. How did AA become P2W? Who was at fault on this, Trion or the Easter Developers? 

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • alkarionlogalkarionlog Member EpicPosts: 3,584
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:


    If they put up a sub only server for Archeage with cosmetic cash shop attached they will crush all other AA servers , Ive been saying thios for 5 years here ,( you can look if you like ) but i think you know better ..

      A sub only AA server would be an instant money maker for them , and i could see them getting some help for Rift ...

      So yes the Ips are in better hands today .. time will tell , but this a bigger step in the right direction than trion managed in 5 years

    Which part of me repeating that this deal (ArcheAge subscription servers) was done by Trion more than half a year before Gamigo acquisition do you not understand?

    Which part of Trion wanting to do sub only server and XL not wanting to hear it until about a year ago are you not understanding?

    Do you think that XL wanted to spend 1000s of dev hours recoding and rebalancing the game without the cash shop - and that this work only took months to do since Gamigo took over? Remember that cash shop is deeply imbedded to the entire gameplay and balance of ArchAge today. 

    You can't just rip it out and say - there add subscription and done - the entire game is coded around using the cash shop.

    and yet - you are still saying that Gamigo are the ones that should be applauded when they literally did none of the negotiations to make this happen.


    So again - please at least understand that trion before gamigo made the subscription AA servers a reality - the work started year+ ago.


    trying and failing means nothing, giving a participation trophy don't make things better, they failed, it was not only trion fault, but they still are part of it.

    also everything we are saying here is more like guessing work, we won't be sure of anything till its writen and even so it could be so damaged it was not worth doing this anymore.

    and lets get real here, the time frame for this is too late now, I sure as hell won't go back, and pretty sure most also prefer to see it burn, the ones who already play the game I ahrdly belive tehy would abandon they high pay and invested geared char to be like the rest of the people




    FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.
  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,387
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    Many of us have been asking for the AA sub only for years here , Would be great to finally see it ..

       Ill jump into that for sure..

     Good to see AA and Rift in competent hands now ..


    Competent hands????

    Rift has 2 devs left.

    Lol 

    There's nobody left to work on the games anymore. Gamigo took a sinking company and ran it into the ground hard instead of saving it.

    This AA sub relaunch was planned over a year ago way before Gamigo even came into the picture- this was a work of XL and Trion - gamigo didnt do shit to make this happen.

    The work was well underway as I said a long time ago
    And yet the community was asking for it for 5 years and Trion could not manage it .. Gamigo in under 6 moths will deliver lol..

     And it will crush al the other p2w server easily

    Dude you have no idea what you are talking about.

    It took Trion 5 years to finally get XL to agree to subscription servers.

    XL started coding all the changes to rip out the cash shop over a year ago.... 

    Gamigo swoops and gets credit for something they had  nothing to do with.

    Please- this is like when a new president comes in and gets credit (or blame) for 4 years of work that the previous president did - and people say - look it took the new president only 6 months .


    Please stop embarrassing yourself with things you have no insight into.
    Just curious, because I quit Rift when GW2 came out. What did these new owners of Trion do to run it into the dirt for Rift? Can you give me a brief history of what happened? 

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • Viper482Viper482 Member LegendaryPosts: 4,071
    DMKano said:
    Torval said:
    Whatever your beef with Trion, Gamigo aren't heroes. They're not your friend. They're a blight that makes EA seem like yer bud. Their entire library is built on predatory monetization tactics.
    So much this. Good to see sanity in this thread

    If you were not such a Trion fanboy for so long maybe people would actually give you the time of day on this topic. Must be frustrating to have so much information yet lack so much credibility.
    Make MMORPG's Great Again!
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    edited August 2019

    Just curious, because I quit Rift when GW2 came out. What did these new owners of Trion do to run it into the dirt for Rift? Can you give me a brief history of what happened? 
    His point is that the work had already started. Trion went under and were - basically - bought out of bankruptcy by Gamigo. To keep things afloat they cut - well everything pretty much including most of the people who worked at Trion. Bankruptcy sucks.

    And "this" is (probably) finishing off work that was already underway - so Gamigo must believe that "it" has the potential to make money otherwise "it" would have been cut  as well.

    And I assume that @DMKano is right in what this is but if it turns out to be some optional sub service and the cash shop is still there <shrug>.
    Post edited by gervaise1 on
  • DragnelusDragnelus Member EpicPosts: 3,503
    edited August 2019










    Looks like a new AA experience to me?

  • DragnelusDragnelus Member EpicPosts: 3,503

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916
    edited August 2019
    My bet is that Gamigo will find ways to squeeze even MORE money out of AA players, lol, while trying their best to disguise it as an "awesome deal" ! :smiley:

    Companies like Gamigo do not buy games with the expectation of making LESS money than the previous owner...
    [Deleted User][Deleted User]
  • Panther2103Panther2103 Member EpicPosts: 5,773
    As long as it's not a sub server that gets a cash shop at a later time than I'll gladly try it. If they sneak a cash shop in later on that's going to basically put the nail in the coffin for this game for me. If that's what this announcement ends up being I mean. 
  • vegetableoilvegetableoil Member RarePosts: 768
    A guy died and get to choose whether he gets to heaven or hell, he previewed heaven and thought it was a boring place with nothing to do. then he previewed hell and he saw party all day all night. After some thought he said I'm going to hell, When he arrived at hell then he is immediately tortured and begin to complain to the devil, "Where are the parties? This is not what I sign up for." The devil replied "Oh you mean that? It's just the screen saver" 
    [Deleted User]FlyByKnight
  • CaffynatedCaffynated Member RarePosts: 753
    edited August 2019
    The only way I would go back is if they opened a sub only server with cosmetic only cash shop and let me use my old account. If I can't use all of the APEX I already have on my account they can sit and spin. 
  • alkarionlogalkarionlog Member EpicPosts: 3,584
    Renoaku said:
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    Many of us have been asking for the AA sub only for years here , Would be great to finally see it ..

       Ill jump into that for sure..

     Good to see AA and Rift in competent hands now ..


    Competent hands????

    Rift has 2 devs left.

    Lol 

    There's nobody left to work on the games anymore. Gamigo took a sinking company and ran it into the ground hard instead of saving it.

    This AA sub relaunch was planned over a year ago way before Gamigo even came into the picture- this was a work of XL and Trion - gamigo didnt do shit to make this happen.

    The work was well underway as I said a long time ago
    And yet the community was asking for it for 5 years and Trion could not manage it .. Gamigo in under 6 moths will deliver lol..

     And it will crush al the other p2w server easily

    Dude you have no idea what you are talking about.

    It took Trion 5 years to finally get XL to agree to subscription servers.

    XL started coding all the changes to rip out the cash shop over a year ago.... 

    Gamigo swoops and gets credit for something they had  nothing to do with.

    Please- this is like when a new president comes in and gets credit (or blame) for 4 years of work that the previous president did - and people say - look it took the new president only 6 months .


    Please stop embarrassing yourself with things you have no insight into.
    After all the whales spent hundreds / thousands of dollars, and even they broke the game so bad all the whales jumped ship...

    Now suddenly they want to add subscriptions and expect people to trust such companies with "Ashes OF Creation" just around the corner + many other games ?
    you say it like the new game will be any better, we know how devs work, anything good, is at most wishfull thinking.


    but even wishing for a P2P game on AA would be nice, I serious don't belive after everything XL plus trion, plus what gamigo is will even be a good thing, getting profits for a job well done is all well nice, and deserved, but we know already it will not happen, and anything who would appear as nice is just a prelude of they breaking it in the future to force more money to be taken.

    after the well is poisoned you don't drink again from it too, risk

    FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.
  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,610
    Unless they promise no cash shop...  No one knows how they going to alter the cash shop in the future...
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    edited August 2019
    My bet is that Gamigo will find ways to squeeze even MORE money out of AA players, lol, while trying their best to disguise it as an "awesome deal" ! :smiley:

    Companies like Gamigo do not buy games with the expectation of making LESS money than the previous owner...
    The one doesn't automatically lead to the other.

    Yes Gamigo will have bought Trion with a view to making more than they paid + return on investment etc.

    Squeezing more money out of customers doesn't automatically follow however. I would go further and suggest they wouldn't want to do that as it could upset the cash slow projections.

    Remember they bought Trion "out of bankruptcy" - so small upfront investment to recover.
    Secondly they laid off the vast majority of the staff.   So if revenue simply remains flat they will have much higher cash flow than Trion.
    Thirdly they may have some notion of cross-game promotion.

    If they just recover their initial outlay and then cover costs anything above that is a bonus. Beyond that - well having axed most staff revenues may subsequently decline. Its what they do however having decided that developing their own games was high risk.
  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    DMKano said:
    gervaise1 said:
    My bet is that Gamigo will find ways to squeeze even MORE money out of AA players, lol, while trying their best to disguise it as an "awesome deal" ! :smiley:

    Companies like Gamigo do not buy games with the expectation of making LESS money than the previous owner...
    The one doesn't automatically lead to the other.

    Yes Gamigo will have bought Trion with a view to making more than they paid + return on investment etc.

    Squeezing more money out of customers doesn't automatically follow however. I would go further and suggest they wouldn't want to do that as it could upset the cash slow projections.

    Remember they bought Trion "out of bankruptcy" - so small upfront investment to recover.
    Secondly they laid off the vast majority of the staff.   So if revenue simply remains flat they will have much higher cash flow than Trion.
    Thirdly they may have some notion of cross-game promotion.

    If they just recover their initial outlay and then cover costs anything above that is a bonus. Beyond that - well having axed most staff revenues may subsequently decline. Its what they do however having decided that developing their own games was high risk.

    There's a huge amount of debt that Gamigo didn't buy which is why Trion wasn't 100% bought by Gamigo as they only bought the bare essentials to keep the games going  - but the MAIN prize of the whole deal was the rights to ArcheAge.

    Trion got transferred to Trion ABC - and then the company was dissolved (with a lot of debt never being paid) - Gamigo only bought a portion of Trion.

    ""The board of directors, officers, general counsel and employees resigned effective october 22, 2018 and TWI is to formally dissolve as a corporate within the next 60 days

    All assets and property were assigned to Trion Worlds (ABC) LLC, and they proceeded to sell the assets and intellectual property to others, particularly Gamigo, a Germany-based game publisher. All of the employees of Trion have been terminated effective October 22, 2018, i.e. immediately upon the announcement, and its directors and officers are gone and the company will be dissolved."

    On Oct 22 - all Trion employees were terminated - and 40ish of them were re-hired immediately as Gamigo employees. They did this for legal reasons so that all the debtors couldn't go after anyone at Trion as none of that existed anymore.

    Gamigo literally doesn't care at all for Rift/Trove/Defiance which is why all of them have been in maint mode - there is no intention to do anything with those games except just let populations dwindle down to the point where the servers are not worth the cost to run anymore.

    Also from what I've been told there's less than 20 ex-trion folks left at this point - and more leaving as there is no future at Gamigo for any of them.
    And yet Mobi was hired just 14 days ago , a previous Trion(3 year)  employee that was with Defiance and Atlas ..

          Strange they are hiring ..  sorta flys right in the face of your last comment
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    gervaise1 said:
    <snip>

          Strange they are hiring ..  sorta flys right in the face of your last comment
    Nah. Hiring one person doesn't alter the fact that Trion - as was - is no more. Maybe they found something that "needs doing" and he is the best available. 
    [Deleted User]
  • DhahranGirlDhahranGirl Newbie CommonPosts: 22
    Can't wait.  It is worth the wait!
  • DragnelusDragnelus Member EpicPosts: 3,503

  • alkarionlogalkarionlog Member EpicPosts: 3,584
    DMKano said:
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    gervaise1 said:
    My bet is that Gamigo will find ways to squeeze even MORE money out of AA players, lol, while trying their best to disguise it as an "awesome deal" ! :smiley:

    Companies like Gamigo do not buy games with the expectation of making LESS money than the previous owner...
    The one doesn't automatically lead to the other.

    Yes Gamigo will have bought Trion with a view to making more than they paid + return on investment etc.

    Squeezing more money out of customers doesn't automatically follow however. I would go further and suggest they wouldn't want to do that as it could upset the cash slow projections.

    Remember they bought Trion "out of bankruptcy" - so small upfront investment to recover.
    Secondly they laid off the vast majority of the staff.   So if revenue simply remains flat they will have much higher cash flow than Trion.
    Thirdly they may have some notion of cross-game promotion.

    If they just recover their initial outlay and then cover costs anything above that is a bonus. Beyond that - well having axed most staff revenues may subsequently decline. Its what they do however having decided that developing their own games was high risk.

    There's a huge amount of debt that Gamigo didn't buy which is why Trion wasn't 100% bought by Gamigo as they only bought the bare essentials to keep the games going  - but the MAIN prize of the whole deal was the rights to ArcheAge.

    Trion got transferred to Trion ABC - and then the company was dissolved (with a lot of debt never being paid) - Gamigo only bought a portion of Trion.

    ""The board of directors, officers, general counsel and employees resigned effective october 22, 2018 and TWI is to formally dissolve as a corporate within the next 60 days

    All assets and property were assigned to Trion Worlds (ABC) LLC, and they proceeded to sell the assets and intellectual property to others, particularly Gamigo, a Germany-based game publisher. All of the employees of Trion have been terminated effective October 22, 2018, i.e. immediately upon the announcement, and its directors and officers are gone and the company will be dissolved."

    On Oct 22 - all Trion employees were terminated - and 40ish of them were re-hired immediately as Gamigo employees. They did this for legal reasons so that all the debtors couldn't go after anyone at Trion as none of that existed anymore.

    Gamigo literally doesn't care at all for Rift/Trove/Defiance which is why all of them have been in maint mode - there is no intention to do anything with those games except just let populations dwindle down to the point where the servers are not worth the cost to run anymore.

    Also from what I've been told there's less than 20 ex-trion folks left at this point - and more leaving as there is no future at Gamigo for any of them.
    And yet Mobi was hired just 14 days ago , a previous Trion(3 year)  employee that was with Defiance and Atlas ..

          Strange they are hiring ..  sorta flys right in the face of your last comment

    They are rehiring positions that nobody can cover due to people who have left and continue to leave. Also Mobi is not a dev - and is a low salary community manager employee which doesnt pay crap.

    Why haven't they rehired a ton of devs?

    Hmm.... 

    Because they are expansive and they dont need them.


    One low paying job - community manager behind hired doesnt invalidate anything I am saying - but do your own research and find out the truth. 

    Rift, Defiance, Trove are all operating on 2 devs per game or less... 

    what's flying int he face of my argument? 
    or they are bad? serious if you really are in the market you know very well the good ones hardly stay unemployed too long, and most are hired by desperation on teh hirer part or they are that good talker, and then they are keep because who hired him wouldn't never let anyone know they did a mistake
    FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.
  • DragnelusDragnelus Member EpicPosts: 3,503

  • fcweddfcwedd Member UncommonPosts: 196
    If it is ArcheAge Unleashed, Unchained, or whatever, I'm hoping for a completely new sub-based server.
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