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No evidence video games cause mass shootings

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  • TiamatRoarTiamatRoar Member RarePosts: 1,534
    edited August 2019

    I don't think videogames have reached the level of realism for them to help "normalize" killing in a person's mind yet.  Pretty sure the way the military trains for such things is entirely different and involves lots of live exercises, etc.  If anything, pretty sure videogames do the opposite due to the uncanny valley effect where holding a real gun and shooting someone feels VERY different from how such things happen in games when done via a controller or light gun, etc.
  • GorweGorwe Member EpicPosts: 6,447
    I mean they could. But so could anything else. TV, News, Real Life etc.

    No reason to single it out except scapegoating.
  • GutlardGutlard Member RarePosts: 1,015
    Bellomo said:
    https://time.com/5647269/california-stabbing-rampage/


    We need common sense knife laws and knife registration

    This old gem of an argument.... Two psychos don't make a sane?

    Gut Out!
    TorvalAeander

    What, me worry?

  • TillerTiller Member EpicPosts: 8,474
    edited August 2019
    The last thread left a small number of people banned,  so remember..




    Keep in mind, crazy people are always looking for validation for their crazy from other humans, not games. It just takes one person saying the wrong thing to trigger some shit. We all know this, lets not pretend it isn't a thing. They strive to find people like them, and when they find them then it proves to them they must be normal. If it's someone of importance that makes it even more dangerous. At that point even supposed normal people start to act out of sorts, refer to history for that proof. Mental illness mixed with fringe thinking, toxic rhetoric, guns and drugs leads to very bad things happening.
    MisterZebubTorvalJeffSpicoli
    SWG Bloodfin vet
    Elder Jedi/Elder Bounty Hunter
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,061
    edited August 2019
    People aren't looking for evidence, they're looking for a convenient scapegoat.

    Harsh restrictions to guns so that getting a gun would be hard aren't convenient.

    A major reform of the political system that is currently causing US people to divide instead of managing to unify like it's supposed to do wouldn't be convenient.

    Finding a scapegoat so that you can act against something that doesn't matter to you and blame someone else is convenient.

    AxxarPhry
     
  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Member EpicPosts: 2,017
    edited August 2019
    Thane said:
    Bellomo said:
    https://time.com/5647269/california-stabbing-rampage/


    We need common sense knife laws and knife registration

    "killed four people and wounded two others" vs how many, 34 or even more with a gun?

    you sir, are dumb. and YOU sir, are what's wrong with the states.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/33-dead-130-injured-china-knife-wielding-spree-n41966

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/28/world/asia/japan-stabbing-schoolchildren.html

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mass_stabbings


    MMORPG.COM took away my swinging cheerleader butt .gif.

  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,061
    OG_Zorvan said:
    Thane said:
    Bellomo said:
    https://time.com/5647269/california-stabbing-rampage/


    We need common sense knife laws and knife registration

    "killed four people and wounded two others" vs how many, 34 or even more with a gun?

    you sir, are dumb. and YOU sir, are what's wrong with the states.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/33-dead-130-injured-china-knife-wielding-spree-n41966

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/28/world/asia/japan-stabbing-schoolchildren.html

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Mass_stabbings
    In stabbings you can usually count the dead with one hand as long as you've got only one person attacking.

    If you've got a more organized group adults then I think matters less whether they use weapons, knifes, home-made bombs, or something else. Humans are always able to kill each other, it's only a question of whether we give them weapons so that they can do it easier, or force them to figure out harder ways.
     
  • Mmochamp19Mmochamp19 Newbie CommonPosts: 12
    edited August 2019
    Kyleran said:
    Couldnt be due to racist hate speech,  easier to purchase firearms than alcohol, or broken moral fiber, has to be violent entertainment for sure, video games being the worst of course.

    Sometimes I think the Purge movies are ever closer to becoming a reality.


    You lose all credibility with this nonsense, its all due to mental illness.  We stopped using insane asylums in 1966 and mass shootings began

    GhostRider00Aeander
  • doomexdoomex Member UncommonPosts: 65
    Stupidity plus bad parenting cause shootings, not games. But what to expect of people that ban kinder surprise. America is a honk honk land.
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,061
    edited August 2019
    You lose all credibility with this nonsense, its all due to mental illness.  We stopped using insane asylums in 1966 and mass shootings began
    People can be forced to involuntary treatment for mental illness. The system just doesn't help because mass shooters aren't insane enough.

    A screening for smaller problems before giving people access to guns would likely help against mass shooters. A screening for large enough problems to send someone into involuntary treatment would help very little because most mass shooters would pass that test.
    cheeba
     
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 12,501
    edited August 2019
    Broadcasters and newspapers always need something or someone to take the blame for everything negative that happens in their country. It is never down to the individual/s who did it, it must always have wider implications with others to blame.

    Now for any given issue that can be true, maybe there are wider issues, maybe it is down to policies or other factors. The issue for journalism is that their immediate knee jerk reaction is to throw the blame net as widely as possible with or without  evidence to back up their claims.

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  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,061
    edited August 2019
    EDIT:

    Deleted after Scot edited his post
    Post edited by Vrika on
     
  • IncomparableIncomparable Member UncommonPosts: 1,116
    edited August 2019
    I beg to differ on the conclusion.

    The point is not wether games makes people want to become murders, is whether a game in unhealthy.

    They way the argument is being made is trying to draw direct parallels. Like there is a direct allergic reaction, or some kind of physical manifestation in the brain/body. Also it tries to deviate from the obvious, that negative online behavior is a problem, but focusing on single player games.

    However anything that is unhealthy adds to negative behavior which then from a statistical point of view will result in a more violent population.

    The problem with this generalization is that you could then argue that anything that makes people unhealthy will lead to negative consequences and therefore is a moot point.

    However, the point is valid since the level of impact is also a social dynamic, which can have more of an impact that other unhealthy things in someones life. 

    For example, if someone were to only interact with people online rather than in real life, they will see how easy it is to use crude and vulgar language without any real consequence other than what they choose to feel about it. So from there they learn something bad they would not necessarily do in real life. In real life people do not have to chance to act so negatively so easily. The problem here is that this negative behavior has a psychological affect, and is social dynamic of unhealthy.

    In such a negative social dynamic of treating people so badly, they learn people are not worth caring about, and become desensitized, which is a very normal affect by just watching the news. 

    However this is desensitization on how to perceive humans by interacting with them, which is different than watching a tragedy where even the journalist/reporter will show the proper emotions.

    Anyone that develops their personality around this kind of perception will not have a positive outlook on humanity and will be more depressed in their way of thiking.

    And in philosophy they like to argue for example, in general, what we think, despite reality, we might act out in irrationality. So that means a person who is 'brainwashed' by the online trolls, will have a negative idea of people, and in some bad moment in their life will act out in extreme irrationality.

    Now take this negative social dynamic, and negative perception and have a populaiton of billions, and to believe this wont increase negative behavior is just a flat out lie.

    I can agree however, single player games do not ahve the same affect, and that is what the pro game agurment is really talking about, but others are more likely talking about the online aspect of trolling and harassment which is part of 'gaming' (unfortunately) as well.

    “Write bad things that are done to you in sand, but write the good things that happen to you on a piece of marble”

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 12,501
    edited August 2019
    Vrika said:
    Scot said:
    Broadcasters and newspapers always needs something or someone to take the blame for everything negative that happens in their country. It is never down to the individual/s who did it, it must always have wider implications with others to blame.

    Blaming the individual doesn't fix the problem.
    You quoted me while I was still editing there, but I am trying to make people see beyond just this issue. Dramatic events do not put "bums on seats" next week for a news broadcast. The idea a problem is there is what keeps the story going, the drama, the alarm you must feel because this is so important 'you had better buy get our app' to keep up with it. This is the sort of broadcasting that has developed as a reaction to social media, where broadcasters feel they are being left behind.

    I am not talking about this specific incident, purely the media froth around it and the fact it is harder to determine what the truth is and what should be done when there is so much froth. Our media actual is often detrimental to us making calm, collected decisions. 

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  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 6,061
    Scot said:
    Vrika said:
    Scot said:
    Broadcasters and newspapers always needs something or someone to take the blame for everything negative that happens in their country. It is never down to the individual/s who did it, it must always have wider implications with others to blame.

    Blaming the individual doesn't fix the problem.
    You quoted me while I was still editing there
    Sorry. If I'd seen your edit I wouldn't have quoted you that way.
     
  • SpiiderSpiider Member RarePosts: 817
    Just a mirage to take the attention away from two main groups responsible for mass shootings:
    1. Pharma
    2. Politicians

    Games? Laughable.

    No fate but what we make, so make me a ham sandwich please.

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 12,501
    Vrika said:
    Scot said:
    Vrika said:
    Scot said:
    Broadcasters and newspapers always needs something or someone to take the blame for everything negative that happens in their country. It is never down to the individual/s who did it, it must always have wider implications with others to blame.

    Blaming the individual doesn't fix the problem.
    You quoted me while I was still editing there
    Sorry. If I'd seen your edit I wouldn't have quoted you that way.
    These things happen, thankfully this is not Twitter or we would have to be having a war of words by now. I would be posting screen shots of my original post and demanding the Twitter Council looks into your behaviour. That's how barmy social media is making people. :D

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  • GorweGorwe Member EpicPosts: 6,447
    Spiider said:
    Just a mirage to take the attention away from two main groups responsible for mass shootings:
    1. Pharma
    2. Politicians

    Games? Laughable.
    You forgot news.
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Scot said:
    Vrika said:
    Scot said:
    Broadcasters and newspapers always needs something or someone to take the blame for everything negative that happens in their country. It is never down to the individual/s who did it, it must always have wider implications with others to blame.

    Blaming the individual doesn't fix the problem.
    You quoted me while I was still editing there, but I am trying to make people see beyond just this issue. Dramatic events do not put "bums on seats" next week for a news broadcast. The idea a problem is there is what keeps the story going, the drama, the alarm you must feel because this is so important 'you had better buy get our app' to keep up with it. This is the sort of broadcasting that has developed as a reaction to social media, where broadcasters feel they are being left behind.

    I am not talking about this specific incident, purely the media froth around it and the fact it is harder to determine what the truth is and what should be done when there is so much froth. Our media actual is often detrimental to us making calm, collected decisions. 
    Part of the problem is that the MSM is outright lying, its got so bad that you literally cannot trust them as a news source, if anything there is an actual causational link between the MSM and mass killings, the lies and propoganda is too often, an incitement to violence.
    Banning weapons, whether its firearms or knives, does not prevent acts of violence, what it does, is make it harder for people to defend themselves, it leaves the most vulnerable without protection of any kind and that usually means women. :/
  • FinvegaFinvega Member UncommonPosts: 176
    If, like some, you believe someone like the President can incite a crazy person to violence, then you shouldn't be surprised that a genre of games might incite a crazy person to violence. Now, I don't hold that opinion, but some do.
    Aeanderragebulletkenguru23
  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 971
    Meanwhile in Europe, same games, no mass shooting.
    Could it be that the difference is that in Europe they don’t sell automatic guns at the mall?

    I don’t know what will it take for Americans to understand that automatic weapons, in particular rifles are made for wars, not for civilians consumption.

    Why do you need an M16 for personal defence?
    What kind of scenario requires the use of an automatic rifle in a civilian environment?
    I really don’t get it.
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 11,004
    Finvega said:
    If, like some, you believe someone like the President can incite a crazy person to violence, then you shouldn't be surprised that a genre of games might incite a crazy person to violence. Now, I don't hold that opinion, but some do.
    Some people are liars though.
  • mbrodiembrodie Member RarePosts: 1,481
    Democrats/republicans both always blame video games, the two party system is junk. Be better for a europe multi-party system (or australia is a bit similar too) with coalition possibilities where even a small party can win and have a say in the election. Not get screwed over by racist democrats (democrats are as racist as republicans) and racist republicans that both parties hate everyone.

    But I remember obama, bush and clinton all always blamed video games. 

    Except recently there was a stabbing spree in california, but no one is asking to ban knives. Or last year a whole bunch of people (100s) got ran over by a van in the UK and no one wants to ban vans. Or the acid that always gets thrown on people in the UK and that gets ignored.
    you should literally never wish for australias voting system / political climate... it's a damn shit show over here, disgusting to say the least.
  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,246
    Google says 32% of american dont' want striker gun law.  I don't know how true that is.  

    Trevor on Comedy center also says 98% of gun owner want tougher back ground check.  I'm not sure how accurate that poll is.

    I dont' know why so many Americans want guns.  
  • mbrodiembrodie Member RarePosts: 1,481
    edited August 2019
    TEKK3N said:
    Meanwhile in Europe, same games, no mass shooting.
    Could it be that the difference is that in Europe they don’t sell automatic guns at the mall?

    I don’t know what will it take for Americans to understand that automatic weapons, in particular rifles are made for wars, not for civilians consumption.

    Why do you need an M16 for personal defence?
    What kind of scenario requires the use of an automatic rifle in a civilian environment?
    I really don’t get it.
    There might be states where that's easy to come by....

    but almost none of these mass shootings are with automatic weapons by default, it's actually my understanding that you need specific licenses to get bigger caliber / automatic weapons.

    AR15 is not an automatic weapon by default, they can mod them to be automatic, i think there is actually videos on youtube of how to do this, or you can get like bump stock etc... but an off the shelf AR15 isn't automatic.

    i don't even think civillians can buy M16s just off the shelf in the USA, maybe in some states not 100% sure

    https://www.oldglorygunsandammo.com/nfa-class-iii-weapons/

    here we go class III weapons, need a special license that takes months and a lot of work to aquire if you get approved..

    it should also be noted that an M161A retails for over $20,000 so i'm pretty sure teenage school shooters aren't gonna be rocking these out


    Edit - However i do agree that there needs to be better laws in place about gun ownership and acquisition. state by state gun laws don't make any sense, it needs to be federal gun laws that govern the sale and licensing across all the states, with a tougher application process and better screening + mandatory courses and safe storage with penalty of license revocation if they aren't stored securely and children can access them.

    it's not even something that would fix in the next 5 years if measures were put into place, with 80% of the worlds weapons being manufactured in the USA and how many are already out on the streets or in peoples homes, it could take 10 / 15 / 20 years to really clean everything up and start seeing the benefits, but the longer you take to action the harder and longer it's gonna be to clean it all up.
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