I'd love to have something like the nemesis system that allowed you to flip some mobs so they actually work for, or would help you. I'd also like to see vampire hunters like in Skyrim that were sworn to hunt you down and could appear nearly anytime, except cites or towns, to try and put an end to you.
In a few games you could flip mobs (Neverwinter comes to mind) but it's something in the past now due to the tilt of the balance. Even if you can only flip the lowest tier fodder of a mob group, that means you won't face X foes like all the other classes but X-1, with an additional help on your side.
Post-defeat (necros for example) is a different thing, they still need to kill foes against the same challenge and the raised minions after are just a form of damage boost tied to a mob's demise, which is fairly common with other classes too.
But even that was toned down over the years, to pull it closer to simple boosts of other classes, like Soul Puppet in Neverwinter or Frozen Hatred in AoC, where the additional mob deaths just extend the timer.
Kinda miss the old necromancer with a horde of minions at hand
For the second part, ill-fated TSW had bounty hunters, they could show up anywhere to take you down (the dimwits sometimes appeared in the middle of a raid, facing their target AND a whole raid group... they were killed right away). Interesting mechanic and really "kept you looking over the shoulder" as the thread title says.
There was a buff shortly before they attacked (you feel someone's watching you), so you could prepare somewhat, by closing the vendor tab, or bank or whatever you were doing at the time.
Sooo you want mobs that TRY to gank you, but not really ever do it so that you can continue to believe you are the hero and strong?
if not you’d just find a PvP game. Amiright?
That is not at all what I said.
You may not be aware, but your first paragraph,
“In many games, particularly older ones, there are mobs that prowl around that will end you quickly if you encounter them. Depending on the death mechanics of the game, that encounter may not be over with after just one death.”
describes open world pvp perfectly. Could you please elaborate on the difference? Why not just enter a open world pvp game?
I'll try and explain this.
On the face of it it looks odd that I can accept a mob having the coding to kill me on sight and chase me to the ends of the zone or until it actually kills me before leaving or in some cases its spawn point is close to where I died in which case it may well be corpse camping me (happens in Everquest).
It's all about malice aforethought. I think when an NPC decides to kill me it is coding and simply that. When a player does it they are doing it deliberately. They chase you around follow you everywhere just to kill you over and over again it isn't the same as an AI that is coded to kill you on sight. There is a thought process that makes it personal. They are making the choice to ruin your day and they are making it personal.
You can argue they are simply playing the game but I can also say that playing the game where you have the choice of not camping and constantly harassing and killing another player is a choice the coded monster that kills you on sight does not have. The player chooses the monster doesn't. That is the difference that makes it a fundamental change in perception and the reason I dislike being killed by another player. I don't mind being killed in BGs, Shooters, MOBAs and other PvP scenarios but if you're going to camp and constantly ruin my fun then I will have to say no to the game.
Sooo you want mobs that TRY to gank you, but not really ever do it so that you can continue to believe you are the hero and strong?
if not you’d just find a PvP game. Amiright?
That kind of argument is still as retarded as it ever was.
Mobs that "gank" you don't do things players do, like corpse/graveyard camping. They kill you and go back to their mob routine. Two completely different things.
Did you miss where OP described corpse camping (something that should not be possible imho)?
“In many games, particularly older ones, there are mobs that prowl around that will end you quickly if you encounter them. Depending on the death mechanics of the game, that encounter may not be over with after just one death.”
Most of the time, though, MMOs with that mechanic has the "offending monster" wandering off again by the time you get back to your corpse. Unlike too many PvP'ers that sit on your corpse or spawn point and kill you over and over again.
Many times in MMOs, you die on a corpse run to some monster completely different from the one that originally killed you. I guess the motivation isn't there to ruin your day?
The perceived motivation is the problem then.
Any mmorpg that allows a person to stand on your corpse and kill you over and over sucks.
Personally i dying in a pack of mobs then having to resurrect over and over is just as bad. I guess that’s ok for some people because of how they perceive intent.
What if those mobs or pat emoted over you, would that change how you feel?
Yes. It would. Fighting monsters that act like schoolkids would not be fun for me. Just like PvP games, I'd avoid a game like that, too.
It's NOT "perceived" motivation. Deny there are players that go out of their way to ruin other people's fun.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
Comments
On the face of it it looks odd that I can accept a mob having the coding to kill me on sight and chase me to the ends of the zone or until it actually kills me before leaving or in some cases its spawn point is close to where I died in which case it may well be corpse camping me (happens in Everquest).
It's all about malice aforethought. I think when an NPC decides to kill me it is coding and simply that. When a player does it they are doing it deliberately. They chase you around follow you everywhere just to kill you over and over again it isn't the same as an AI that is coded to kill you on sight. There is a thought process that makes it personal. They are making the choice to ruin your day and they are making it personal.
You can argue they are simply playing the game but I can also say that playing the game where you have the choice of not camping and constantly harassing and killing another player is a choice the coded monster that kills you on sight does not have. The player chooses the monster doesn't. That is the difference that makes it a fundamental change in perception and the reason I dislike being killed by another player. I don't mind being killed in BGs, Shooters, MOBAs and other PvP scenarios but if you're going to camp and constantly ruin my fun then I will have to say no to the game.
It's NOT "perceived" motivation. Deny there are players that go out of their way to ruin other people's fun.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR