Can't bother much, SC hate became so low-effort is just uninteresting. Anyway, I responded on the topic itself (such as being shortsighted on its point and its impact) and that it. Now if you just want to have a go and call morons and dipshits then good luck with that, I'm more up for actual arguments that aren't countered with cheap baits/insults/hyperbole.
So are you one of the supporters that disagrees with everything the Forbes article brought up?
No, an article was nitpicking with some clear target message, one in character assassination ("the wife is crazy" for eg) and the other regurgitating years old drama building up the story of who knows of what relevance to the present reality, they (cig) themselves had given years ago that interview where they admitted to mistakes that cost immense dev time and refactoring that led to the company being restructured, so I saw little there for all the hype some were givin it.
Years old drama... the amount of fans repeating this party line makes me laugh.
If mismanagement is something that was known about years ago, it begs the question of why they haven't got their house in order in the subsequent years. Fledgling companies can be expected to go through some mismangement, but to not learn from that and still be micromanaging and mismanaging years later does not somehow make it ok.
People pointing fingers at forum users when it was Robert's who pitched the idea for this game and was to be finished a long time ago. I already spelled out WHY he is not even trying to finish ..>>SOMETHING,a version,perhaps even twice what he originally was selling and NO excuse is going to make it about forum users,this is all about Robert's,HIS ideas,HIS plans,HIS claims and his fails.
Amazing how fanbois become so blind to what goes on right in front of their face.Perhaps this is yet another reason these crowd funders shoule not exist,once people toss money into it they defend it no matter how crooked or scummy the developer is. Let's remove forum users out of the equation..AGAIN,let's put a value on a AAA video game,a FINISHED AAA game and we can go much higher,let's say double.
So 90 bucks?Let's double that...$180 bucks,,...pffftt lets TENx that,let's say this game is worth $1800.Now add up all the cash shop costs and tell me this Robert's guy is a fair legit businessman.Let's say the entire cash shop can be bought for 2000 dollars,is ANY game on this planet worth $2000 NO,a huge emphatic NO.So what % of the ENTIRE game does the cash shop curtail...3%....5%...let's go real high 50% !!.We know it is not even close to 50% but i'll give it the best value it can muster,so you can buy 50% of the games assets..err i mean LICENSE the use of for $2000 dollars,,LMAO seems legit to ,and we know it is actually MUCH worse than that,at least 10x worse than that.
Defend those economics fanbois,tell us how Robert's treats his loyal fans so fair and just.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Give this Robert's thief some free money and he will take you to the cleaners.Oh wait..NOBODY says you have to buy all the cash shop,of course not,why would anyone expect to have an entire game at their disposal after spending 100's...500...1500,oh no we would not dare expect to own all those assets,after all they were not made for the game we play and support,they were made for umm....oh yeah why exactly were those ships and assets made?Oh yeah they were made for the game,go figure a gamer expecting to have access to all the assets,oh no we shouldn't expect that.
Ok now all game owners ,please lobby those developers to take back 90% of their game assets and charge us to buy it all back.Seems fair to me,Robert's is doing it,it must be legit.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Yet Red Dead Redemption 2 took 8 fucking years to release.
Cyberpunk 2077 started in 2012, where are the people bitching that game is not out.
FF 15 took how long again.
Please tell us where Beyond Good and Evil 2 is at in it's production time line.
Not crowdfunded with release dates changing after that. . did those even have release dates. . nope. . not until within 2 years. . or 1 year maybe. I think Red Dead 2 hit that. Even a one year delay is acceptable. . but their game their money. . their timeline.
These aren't comparable . . games can take a long time for sure. I don't care how long they take. I care about what they were advertised as when I gave up my money and when it was said to be released at that time.
You can't seriously compare then as being the same. I wanted Red Dead 2 to be released ASAP but I didn't expect it other than when they said it would be released.
So, you fucking morons have forgotten how basic economics work eh. ALL games are crowdfunded by consumers paying for ANY games that studios put out, thus earning the money to make more games to repeat the process. Cloud Imperium form of crowdfunding was to establish the development studio along with the games that got funded. So, if any of ANY studios first games DO NOT SELL well enough more games may not be an option. Movie industry works the same way(unless it is a multi movie deal from the start) only when the box office is greatly over their studios expectation will a sequel be made.
Stop digging this hole.
You're either arguing in bad faith, or you're truly too busy chugging the Koolaid to think about this rationally. Either way, you contribute little of substance.
As I said in another (non-SC) thread you can make the best game ever but if no on knows about it then so what. Good development has to go hand in hand with good *marketing. Studios have to do both. Not suggesting SC is - or isn't! - the best game ever btw. This goes for all games.
As far as this con goes I am pretty sure there won't be 500 developers (or whatever) attending. They will be going about their job working on the game.
Edit: *marketing!
Rimworld had zero marketing and is an amazing game and has sold millions of copies.
So, you fucking morons have forgotten how basic economics work eh. ALL games are crowdfunded by consumers paying for ANY games that studios put out, thus earning the money to make more games to repeat the process. Cloud Imperium form of crowdfunding was to establish the development studio along with the games that got funded. So, if any of ANY studios first games DO NOT SELL well enough more games may not be an option. Movie industry works the same way(unless it is a multi movie deal from the start) only when the box office is greatly over their studios expectation will a sequel be made.
Years old drama... the amount of fans repeating this party line makes me laugh.
If mismanagement is something that was known about years ago, it begs the question of why they haven't got their house in order in the subsequent years. Fledgling companies can be expected to go through some mismangement, but to not learn from that and still be micromanaging and mismanaging years later does not somehow make it ok.
Says who they didn't? The article hits more at sources from the past than anything else, including people from Wing Commander over 23 years ago, or that worked on SC as a contractor in 2013/2014. So that does not prove anything being the present reality of the project, in 2016 when those interviews about the problems popped as said, the company restructured itself, including dropping a ton of outsourcing contractors and moving all dev in-door and so forth. And those improvements are visible in past years, when compared to for eg. how visibly stuck the project was in stuff as engineering debt years ago.
CR for me micromanages the visual aspect, it has to be how he wants to be, especially characters when they don't get approved and it shows that is where the complaint is from all different comments over the years I'd bet most of all that talk comes from Artists or Designers, what is not much consequential to the game dev itself where gameplay is considered, aside of that general design and balance he insists on (immersion/realism all things), going from longer travel times to wanting players to "walk more" or micromanage more in the FM.
End of the day this changes nothing, it's more of the same tired for years dead horses that just made this forum the most uninteresting thing for me, who wants to be angry/negative/positive will continue being so, as it's been ongoing for years.
Except CDPR didn't have stalls or
development breaks. Seriously man go and read up on the development
timeline for Cyberpunk 2077. There is a rather large difference between announcing their next project and actively starting development on it.
Cyberpunk 2077 entered pre-production as soon as developer CDPR had finished TW3 Blood & Wine (May 2016) with 50 staff bveing involved and then a much larger team getting involved after TW3 and its expansions were finished.
The hypocrisy is from fanboys of SC saying that development didn't start until 2016 because CIG changed the scope, how many times have they tried to wish away the first 4 years of development and yet they try to claim other games have been in longer development despite that often not being the case...
And lololol at it being crowdfunded because people bought the previous games, what an utter complete load of nonsense.
They are damned if they do and they are damned if they don't.
If they announced they were cancelling Citizen Con in order to fully focus on development they would be accused of everything from running out of money to hiding that they having no development progress to show.
If you accept peoples money, you have to accept the criticism that goes along with it.
They are damned if they do and they are damned if they don't.
If they announced they were cancelling Citizen Con in order to fully focus on development they would be accused of everything from running out of money to hiding that they having no development progress to show.
If you accept peoples money, you have to accept the criticism that goes along with it.
And this is true, I was being consciously unfair to SC because they are in fact in this exact position.
Post edited by Vaross on
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
You know you lost the argument when when you have to resort to name
calling and swearing to try and make people believe you're right.
I see where this is going already...my prediction, I'm sure eventually he will
be triggered to the point where he gets himself banned or posts removed,
so just sit back and watch.
They are damned if they do and they are damned if they don't.
If they announced they were cancelling Citizen Con in order to fully focus on development they would be accused of everything from running out of money to hiding that they having no development progress to show.
If you accept peoples money, you have to accept the criticism that goes along with it.
That's a good point. Plus the longer the development cycle the greater the criticism.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Mind enlightening me on where I said I was intelligent. Now fucking enlighten me on how consumerism is not crowdfunding if you have a counter or shut the fuck up. By the fucking way I could fucking care less about Star Citizen, it just so happens to be THE game this time around that has all the ire of the loudmouthed squad, because gamers are like fucking crack addicts looking for that next hit, just like the impatient, impulsive, irresponsible spending CROWDFUNDING CONSUMERIST THEY HAVE ALWAYS EXISTED AS.
Yet Red Dead Redemption 2 took 8 fucking years to release.
Cyberpunk 2077 started in 2012, where are the people bitching that game is not out.
FF 15 took how long again.
Please tell us where Beyond Good and Evil 2 is at in it's production time line.
If you knew anything about CyberPunk 2077's development you would know that it didn't start properly until after TW3's expansions were finished up in mid 2016.
On top of that no-one paid money to fund either game after being told it would release 2 years later.
Every game is funded by a consumer one way or another bro lol.
Mind enlightening me on where I said I was intelligent. Now fucking enlighten me on how consumerism is not crowdfunding if you have a counter or shut the fuck up. By the fucking way I could fucking care less about Star Citizen, it just so happens to be THE game this time around that has all the ire of the loudmouthed squad, because gamers are like fucking crack addicts looking for that next hit, just like the impatient, impulsive, irresponsible spending CROWDFUNDING CONSUMERIST THEY HAVE ALWAYS EXISTED AS.
Ok, you are correct, you are not intelligent at all.
In a non-crowdfunded scenario, let's say the automotive industry, the Seller, presents a product they designed and manufactured and put up for sale in the hopes of not only paying for the material and labor cost to produce the vehicle, but they also want to enjoy a profit.
In crowdfunding, you have an idea, or usually, a prototype (feel free to use google for all these big words) and you ask people to donate money to your cause.
See the automobile was produced solely by capital put up by the manufacturer.
The Crowdfunding asks the crowd to put up the capitol so the idea can be realized.
I hope this is simple enough for you to wrap your head around.
As to the rest of your points, you have yet to make a valid point, you are the ONLY loudmouth in this thread, and furthermore, I have no idea why you even bother to talk, it seems like you are out for nothing but a little troll. Trust me little fella that is not what you want to do here. Get to a valid point or get out of the thread.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Never has the shortening of conference to con been more appropriate.
For sale with or without watermark:
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Comments
that's like kids complaining why the food is taking so long.
because it's cooking. get over it.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
I already spelled out WHY he is not even trying to finish ..>>SOMETHING,a version,perhaps even twice what he originally was selling and NO excuse is going to make it about forum users,this is all about Robert's,HIS ideas,HIS plans,HIS claims and his fails.
Amazing how fanbois become so blind to what goes on right in front of their face.Perhaps this is yet another reason these crowd funders shoule not exist,once people toss money into it they defend it no matter how crooked or scummy the developer is.
Let's remove forum users out of the equation..AGAIN,let's put a value on a AAA video game,a FINISHED AAA game and we can go much higher,let's say double.
So 90 bucks?Let's double that...$180 bucks,,...pffftt lets TENx that,let's say this game is worth $1800.Now add up all the cash shop costs and tell me this Robert's guy is a fair legit businessman.Let's say the entire cash shop can be bought for 2000 dollars,is ANY game on this planet worth $2000 NO,a huge emphatic NO.So what % of the ENTIRE game does the cash shop curtail...3%....5%...let's go real high 50% !!.We know it is not even close to 50% but i'll give it the best value it can muster,so you can buy 50% of the games assets..err i mean LICENSE the use of for $2000 dollars,,LMAO seems legit to ,and we know it is actually MUCH worse than that,at least 10x worse than that.
Defend those economics fanbois,tell us how Robert's treats his loyal fans so fair and just.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Ok now all game owners ,please lobby those developers to take back 90% of their game assets and charge us to buy it all back.Seems fair to me,Robert's is doing it,it must be legit.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
These aren't comparable . . games can take a long time for sure. I don't care how long they take. I care about what they were advertised as when I gave up my money and when it was said to be released at that time.
You can't seriously compare then as being the same. I wanted Red Dead 2 to be released ASAP but I didn't expect it other than when they said it would be released.
Seriously. You are trolling?
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
You're either arguing in bad faith, or you're truly too busy chugging the Koolaid to think about this rationally. Either way, you contribute little of substance.
MurderHerd
Chicken / egg. Now I know you are kidding.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
CR for me micromanages the visual aspect, it has to be how he wants to be, especially characters when they don't get approved and it shows that is where the complaint is from all different comments over the years I'd bet most of all that talk comes from Artists or Designers, what is not much consequential to the game dev itself where gameplay is considered, aside of that general design and balance he insists on (immersion/realism all things), going from longer travel times to wanting players to "walk more" or micromanage more in the FM.
End of the day this changes nothing, it's more of the same tired for years dead horses that just made this forum the most uninteresting thing for me, who wants to be angry/negative/positive will continue being so, as it's been ongoing for years.
They are damned if they do and they are damned if they don't.
If they announced they were cancelling Citizen Con in order to fully focus on development they would be accused of everything from running out of money to hiding that they having no development progress to show.
If you accept peoples money, you have to accept the criticism that goes along with it.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Only real post thus far:
And this is true, I was being consciously unfair to SC because they are in fact in this exact position.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
MAGA
In a non-crowdfunded scenario, let's say the automotive industry, the Seller, presents a product they designed and manufactured and put up for sale in the hopes of not only paying for the material and labor cost to produce the vehicle, but they also want to enjoy a profit.
In crowdfunding, you have an idea, or usually, a prototype (feel free to use google for all these big words) and you ask people to donate money to your cause.
See the automobile was produced solely by capital put up by the manufacturer.
The Crowdfunding asks the crowd to put up the capitol so the idea can be realized.
I hope this is simple enough for you to wrap your head around.
As to the rest of your points, you have yet to make a valid point, you are the ONLY loudmouth in this thread, and furthermore, I have no idea why you even bother to talk, it seems like you are out for nothing but a little troll. Trust me little fella that is not what you want to do here. Get to a valid point or get out of the thread.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
For sale with or without watermark:
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED