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Can Classic World of Warcraft Hold Up in Today's Market? - MMORPG.com

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  • Asch126Asch126 Member RarePosts: 542
    FFXIV's Eureka proved that these are just rose-tinted glasses. Eureka played and felt similarly to FFXI, something people kept saying they wanted over and over and people disliked it almost immediately.

    Give it a few weeks, maybe a few months and, once the rose-tinted glasses get forced off, Classic will begin to utterly fail, especially once people bother to realize that the game will pretty much be static [if Classic gets updates like the original game did, it won't be Classic anymore] permanently.
    Ungood
  • tawesstawess Member EpicPosts: 4,210
    well the basic math i guess suggest that with enough players there will always be a % that will go old school... and WoW does have the numbers to make that % viable.

    I still do not think it will last but i honestly does not have a dog in the fight to so speak. I do not own any stock in Blizzard
    Torval

    This have been a good conversation

  • blamo2000blamo2000 Member RarePosts: 1,123
    I'd love to know what type of player specifically the people who think classic will fail will attract that will hate it or lose interest quickly?

    1) Obviously, there is a lot of projection, so it goes without saying you guys are not interested, or will give it a try between watching videos of other people playing Fortnight and whatever other hot "game" that is fun to watch other people play.

    2) People into modern WoW and new games that the mainstream gamers and casuals love.  This is true since these people play (or more likely watch videos of other people play) modern WoW and all the popular mainstream casual games that are currently hot ticket items.  

    3) Most children under 25 - this shouldn't need an explanation.  


    I agree with these three groups ignoring, or trying and not lasting long in classic.  This argument would hold weight if this was the target market of classic.  It 100% isn't, so it is very poor and fallacious reasoning.  


    But, are you guys considering the market this game is actually for?  How many millions of players used to play WoW but stopped at certain points because WoW stopped being WoW to them?  Because what they actually liked about the game was patched or expansioned out?  Like talent trees, skills, complexity, things to do that are worth doing - you know, the game part of the game?  Disenfranchised prior mmorpg players that have absolutely nothing to play currently and nothing to look forward to since mmorpgs now aren't.  Kids or people that missed early WoW but want an actual mmorpg experience with some depth and complexity.  Etc.  Basically, everyone but the majority of the populations of the three groups named above.


    My biggest worry is classic will be too much of a hit and it will attract way too many people from the three named groups above because its a new hip thing and they'll feel pressure to play it, thus ruining the game for the actual target market of classic wow.  
    [Deleted User]
  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,105
    Torval said:
    nyxium said:
    The elephant in the room is the sub for Activision Blizzard. I can play nostalgic games that are free to play like Old School Runescape. I can play that on my mobile phone, I don't even need a computer these days. And it's F2P. I don't see how WoW Classic, which is an echo of the past, can get away with demanding a sub for "Classic" in this free to play modern day and age.
    My guess is they'll do a "unified" sub. Both Classic and Live will be under the same and you can access any server. It would be the wise approach because it helps hide specifics from the public. If Classic is crushing Live a unified sub will make it harder for critics to cite that. Likewise, if Classic flops after a bit a unified sub will help muddle that.

      There is no need to guess at  it , Blizz stated that , that will be the business model for Classic long ago at Blizzcon 2018
    Torval
  • Ecthelion27Ecthelion27 Member UncommonPosts: 3
    Well have any of you played BFA lately? Ghost towns, barely any1 in the world.

    Classic will do good. Sure a lot of people will quit because Classic is meant for the people that loved Vanilla.

    The demand came from those people, those people will play it. Thats the kind of players we need played Classic.

    It all depends of course if they manage to not piss the #NOCHANGES crowd too much. I for one, do not like the idea of shardding in Classic, i hope they do it for the first weeks alone, when a lot of people will play it.
  • BluelinerBlueliner Member UncommonPosts: 158


    After seeing the beta? No way.



    The other thing I don't get about these servers though is that there's no avoiding the inevitable progression/end of the ride. Eventually the game you're playing will become the retail version.....so why bother? And even if it never moved beyond X or Y point.....you're not going to get new content then......so why bother?



    oh I don't know, for fun? EVERY game ends eventually. so why bother right?
    Jean-Luc_Picardbcbully
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 491
    edited May 2019
    btdt said:
    It will do as well as the Rift Progression server did...

    The problem here is, if you played classic, you already know the game like the back of your hand.  It loses a lot of it's lustre because there is no wonder of the unknown.  Classic was about finding your way around, working your way around the bugs, figuring out different combinations of skills, and maximizing macros.

    By the end of classic, players had figured out everything there was to know about the game to the nth detail.  These players are going to be playing it again knowing all that information this time around.  Hell, anyone has access to that information with the way back machine... every macro, every build, every little detail there is to know.




    Regarding the the Rift comment... Ignoring the numerous examples of MMOs where classic/progression servers are successful, cherry-picking one that (presumably) isn't doing well, and asserting it as the model of how WoW's will perform is really dishonest. It's textbook confirmation bias.

    The rest of the quoted part, and rest of your post by extension is, in a word, projection.

    As I and others have stated, there is  and has been a notable demand for classic servers. The success of Nostalrius in particular proves this. That Blizzard decided to move forward with it, having been dismissive of it initially ("you think you do...") shows that they now see the potential in it as well. 

    Questioning if people will accept all the "issues" you list on a classic server is absurd. There's already proof that they would, because many of them already have been. You have to be willfully ignorant, or completely out of the loop to not realize this.

    This is why I say that it comes down not to whether or not a classic WoW server could succeed. It already has. The question to me is can Blizzard manage to not screw it up with their own.
    Galadourn
  • RoguewizRoguewiz Member UncommonPosts: 710
    While certainly not the same population level, EQ has been doing progression servers for years.

    WOW can certainly do well depending on how they actually implement it.

    Raquelis in various games
    Played: Everything
    Playing: World of Warcraft Classic, Stuff
    Wants: The World
    Anticipating: Everquest Next Crowfall, Pantheon

    Tank - Healer - Support: The REAL Trinity
  • WizbuizWizbuiz Member UncommonPosts: 215
    Bring full loot or wither and die
    Galadourn[Deleted User]
  • SeidrSeidr Member UncommonPosts: 17
    "Can Classic World of Warcraft Hold Up in Today's Market?
    No. Overly romanticized niche for couple thousand players, till they get bored. Half-life in this zeitgeist seems to be two months.
  • TheodwulfTheodwulf Member UncommonPosts: 307
    Older players will be okay, but bringing in new players may take some adjustment.
    Read more at https://www.mmorpg.com/world-of-warcraft/columns/can-classic-world-of-warcraft-hold-up-in-todays-market-1000013606#8hVXDaXzUW71yyzF.99


    I can't see it lasting for very long. Blizzard should be fixing retail and/or coming up with a sequel not re releasing a 15 year old product
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 4,391
    edited May 2019
    blamo2000 said:
    I really wish casual and mainstream gamers would stop projecting their views and ideas on what gamers like.  You know what you and your kind like.  And you have no idea what people like outside of casual and mainstream gaming.

    WoW original had actual meaty rpg systems geared towards adults - it had talents, skills, trying, and thinking.  No dual builds.  Most people could not afford to respect their talents all the time for different activities.  Most people didn't have the time build up huge sums of money, or play all day.  

    And the best thing is WoW classic will not appeal to the people who did since they are mostly unemployed mainstream players and are too busy playing Fortnight and other mainstream shit to play a game because it is actually a good game rather than the current it thing.  No achievements will drive off another large group of idiots and kids.   Etc.

    The people I dislike and do not want to play with will either not try this or move on quickly.  I truly hope this does not become some hip thing for all the mainstream and casual people, as that will be the only reason it deviates from being classic to having every loud mouth idiot and their brother screaming for it to become more and more modern wow.  

    We should make a peace - all you guys stick to your BRs, survival games, and modern wow - and we'll stick to classic wow and other real mmorpgs.  You stop playing our games and telling us what we like and want, and we'll continue to silently be confused by all of you and we watch you in horror watch videos of other people playing video games and play games that utter crap and barely deserve the title of game, and definitely don't warrant the label of rpg.
    Get of your high horse, you’re not making peace with anyone, you’re simply insulting the other group. Your bias and assumptions are a travesty and presenting your poorly disguised opinions as facts is laughable at best.

    The people you talk about are 95% of the players out there, THEY are the gamers, not you. You are the minority, a loud and rude one to boot. Classic will fail to be the saviour of anything because the small demopgraphic they are targetting finds themselves way too important to see its just a niche project.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    Post edited by lahnmir on
    blueturtle13RexKushman[Deleted User]blamo2000mbrodie
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • hikaru77hikaru77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,123

    jgDuffay said:





    What market?






    There are approximately 2.2 billion gamers in the world. Out of the estimated 7.6 billion people living on earth, as of July 2018, that means almost a third of people on this planet are gamers. Out of those 2.2 billion gamers, 1.2 billion of those who play games are playing games on a PC.



    None of them will play a 2004 game, again. WoW classic is just for a niche of wow veterans, that probably will get bored after a few months or weeks.
  • BluelinerBlueliner Member UncommonPosts: 158
    lahnmir said:
    blamo2000 said:
    I really wish casual and mainstream gamers would stop projecting their views and ideas on what gamers like.  You know what you and your kind like.  And you have no idea what people like outside of casual and mainstream gaming.

    WoW original had actual meaty rpg systems geared towards adults - it had talents, skills, trying, and thinking.  No dual builds.  Most people could not afford to respect their talents all the time for different activities.  Most people didn't have the time build up huge sums of money, or play all day.  

    And the best thing is WoW classic will not appeal to the people who did since they are mostly unemployed mainstream players and are too busy playing Fortnight and other mainstream shit to play a game because it is actually a good game rather than the current it thing.  No achievements will drive off another large group of idiots and kids.   Etc.

    The people I dislike and do not want to play with will either not try this or move on quickly.  I truly hope this does not become some hip thing for all the mainstream and casual people, as that will be the only reason it deviates from being classic to having every loud mouth idiot and their brother screaming for it to become more and more modern wow.  

    We should make a peace - all you guys stick to your BRs, survival games, and modern wow - and we'll stick to classic wow and other real mmorpgs.  You stop playing our games and telling us what we like and want, and we'll continue to silently be confused by all of you and we watch you in horror watch videos of other people playing video games and play games that utter crap and barely deserve the title of game, and definitely don't warrant the label of rpg.
    Get of your high horse, you’re not making peace with anyone, you’re simply insulting the other group. Your bias and assumptions are a travesty and presenting your poorly disguised opinions as facts is laughable at best.

    The people you talk about are 95% of the players out there, THEY are the gamers, not you. You are the minority, a loud and rude one to boot. Classic will fail to be the saviour of anything because the small demopgraphic they are targetting finds themselves way too important to see its just a niche project.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    He's 100% right. Nowhere did he claim we were a majority. We know the Fortnite mentality players are a majority. What he is saying is there is a large group of us that will play WoW classic and you low mentality BR players should just stay away, those servers aren't for you, we don't want you there, much like you don't want us playing your BR games.
    blamo2000
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 4,391
    edited May 2019
    Blueliner said:
    lahnmir said:
    blamo2000 said:
    I really wish casual and mainstream gamers would stop projecting their views and ideas on what gamers like.  You know what you and your kind like.  And you have no idea what people like outside of casual and mainstream gaming.

    WoW original had actual meaty rpg systems geared towards adults - it had talents, skills, trying, and thinking.  No dual builds.  Most people could not afford to respect their talents all the time for different activities.  Most people didn't have the time build up huge sums of money, or play all day.  

    And the best thing is WoW classic will not appeal to the people who did since they are mostly unemployed mainstream players and are too busy playing Fortnight and other mainstream shit to play a game because it is actually a good game rather than the current it thing.  No achievements will drive off another large group of idiots and kids.   Etc.

    The people I dislike and do not want to play with will either not try this or move on quickly.  I truly hope this does not become some hip thing for all the mainstream and casual people, as that will be the only reason it deviates from being classic to having every loud mouth idiot and their brother screaming for it to become more and more modern wow.  

    We should make a peace - all you guys stick to your BRs, survival games, and modern wow - and we'll stick to classic wow and other real mmorpgs.  You stop playing our games and telling us what we like and want, and we'll continue to silently be confused by all of you and we watch you in horror watch videos of other people playing video games and play games that utter crap and barely deserve the title of game, and definitely don't warrant the label of rpg.
    Get of your high horse, you’re not making peace with anyone, you’re simply insulting the other group. Your bias and assumptions are a travesty and presenting your poorly disguised opinions as facts is laughable at best.

    The people you talk about are 95% of the players out there, THEY are the gamers, not you. You are the minority, a loud and rude one to boot. Classic will fail to be the saviour of anything because the small demopgraphic they are targetting finds themselves way too important to see its just a niche project.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    He's 100% right. Nowhere did he claim we were a majority. We know the Fortnite mentality players are a majority. What he is saying is there is a large group of us that will play WoW classic and you low mentality BR players should just stay away, those servers aren't for you, we don't want you there, much like you don't want us playing your BR games.
    No, he is 100% wrong. He has this crazy assumption that casuals and mainstream gamers aren’t real gamers when in fact they are 95% of the audience and therefor are the actual real gamers. His dillusional snobism en eilitarian verbal vomit doesn’t help him building his case either and you suffer from that same disabity talking about ‘you’ this and ‘you’ that as if you are above any of that, especially that cute dig with ‘low mentality blablabla.’ Different folks, different strokes, but you are by no means better then others and that condecending attitude might actually prove the opposite. Get of the high horse.

    I btw also love the BR assumption in your need to differentiate yourself, I hate BR games. I did however raid 3 nights a week in vanilla for 2 years straight and will actually be playing Classic with an ot tank shammy. Assumptions, silly things they are.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    blamo2000Torvalmbrodie
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • GaladournGaladourn Member RarePosts: 1,811
    Simply looking at the number of comments this thread has, is indicative of the interest Classic WoW still sparks to the gaming community...
  • SandmanjwSandmanjw Member RarePosts: 430
    Galadourn said:
    Simply looking at the number of comments this thread has, is indicative of the interest Classic WoW still sparks to the gaming community...
    Got to remember...WOW was a generations first foray into MMORPG's. Lot of both angst, and joy, rapped up in that game. A game that defines the genre to many...even those that do not like it.
  • btdtbtdt Member RarePosts: 523
    btdt said:
    It will do as well as the Rift Progression server did...

    The problem here is, if you played classic, you already know the game like the back of your hand.  It loses a lot of it's lustre because there is no wonder of the unknown.  Classic was about finding your way around, working your way around the bugs, figuring out different combinations of skills, and maximizing macros.

    By the end of classic, players had figured out everything there was to know about the game to the nth detail.  These players are going to be playing it again knowing all that information this time around.  Hell, anyone has access to that information with the way back machine... every macro, every build, every little detail there is to know.




    Regarding the the Rift comment... Ignoring the numerous examples of MMOs where classic/progression servers are successful, cherry-picking one that (presumably) isn't doing well, and asserting it as the model of how WoW's will perform is really dishonest. It's textbook confirmation bias.

    The rest of the quoted part, and rest of your post by extension is, in a word, projection.

    As I and others have stated, there is  and has been a notable demand for classic servers. The success of Nostalrius in particular proves this. That Blizzard decided to move forward with it, having been dismissive of it initially ("you think you do...") shows that they now see the potential in it as well. 

    Questioning if people will accept all the "issues" you list on a classic server is absurd. There's already proof that they would, because many of them already have been. You have to be willfully ignorant, or completely out of the loop to not realize this.

    This is why I say that it comes down not to whether or not a classic WoW server could succeed. It already has. The question to me is can Blizzard manage to not screw it up with their own.
    I mentioned Rift as it was the latest attempt at reviving the past.  And exactly what did I say about the server in particular?  Nothing other than it didn't last all that long.  The one projecting here is you.

    The 100% fact, truth, reality of it is, WoW from 2004 can never be recreated.  No more than your birth can be recreated.  It happens only once.

    You can hope all you want to hope but even Blizzard knows it's not going to be a long term thing... just another stop gap to try and keep players paying a sub until their next expansion comes out.

    Trust me... what made WoW great back in the day had zero to do with the game itself... it had everything to do with the players.  The Aussies that you chatted with at 2AM while dancing naked in Iron Forge... the notion that you could even talk in realtime with people from around the world in a video game was utterly new to most of us.  The game was just a vessel.  The people that came to play the game MADE THE GAME.  Those people are long gone.  No one on this planet has been under a rock for the past 12 years to be oblivious to the gazillion forms of social interaction available to them.  They don't see talking to an Aussie at 2AM as the best thing since sex.  

    No one gives a rats ass who downs who first in a game anymore or who has the best of this or that gear on.  Those days are long over... but back in the day... it was everything to some... so much so as to become national news about gamer addiction.  It was unheard of addiction.  It was a different time and a different mindset.

    So go ahead and believe relaunching a 12 year old game will bring all that back in 2019.  The delusional one is you.
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    edited May 2019
    Galadourn said:
    Simply looking at the number of comments this thread has, is indicative of the interest Classic WoW still sparks to the gaming community...
    I can remember DAoC Trials of Atlantis generating over a 100 pages of comments on the VN boards in its first day - more comments per page as well. And there were multiple other threads and hundreds of more pages of comments in the days that followed. Clearly - by your yardstick - ToA must have been really, really, really popular.
  • alyndalealyndale Member UncommonPosts: 936
    edited May 2019
    I tend to agree with blueturtle. What we need to remember is that mmo's aren't the popular form of game found on pc's. jgDuffay claims that through his research, he's found 1.2 billion gamers on pc. They aren't playing WoW or any other mmo at this time. While it is true some of that number may have played WoW "back-in-the-day", but they just aren't into that type of gaming entertainment at this time.

    Thus it is possible, but in MY opinion NOT probable that "Classic WoW" will either save or kill commercial wow. For me, just another legacy game we reminisce about.

    All I want is the truth
    Just gimme some truth
    John Lennon

  • alyndalealyndale Member UncommonPosts: 936
    edited May 2019
    You guys and gals out just take a bit to think back to the beginning before Christmas, 2004. Enjoy this link, I did  ;)  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMVjToYOjbM

    Yeah, you'll notice. if you indeed did go to the music video, there are four singers, with one missing-uh huh they are four-manning and in remembrance to a legend. 
    blueturtle13

    All I want is the truth
    Just gimme some truth
    John Lennon

  • blamo2000blamo2000 Member RarePosts: 1,123
    lahnmir said:

    Get of your high horse, you’re not making peace with anyone, you’re simply insulting the other group. Your bias and assumptions are a travesty and presenting your poorly disguised opinions as facts is laughable at best.

    The people you talk about are 95% of the players out there, THEY are the gamers, not you. You are the minority, a loud and rude one to boot. Classic will fail to be the saviour of anything because the small demopgraphic they are targetting finds themselves way too important to see its just a niche project.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    95% huh?  I highly, highly disagree with that.  And why would I want to make peace with people whose poor taste has ruined mmorpgs for me?  Maybe you're a mosaicist that loves people who poop all over your party, but I personally think that's really weird.  

    Anyway, I think you are way too emotional and need lots of medication and anger management before you consider playing a real mmorpg.  

    Also, I never said classic will be the savior of anything.  It will just give a new home to all the millions of disenfranchised mmorpg refugees.  Not all at once, and not consistently.  But it will be something we know we enjoy when we all need an mmorpg to scratch that itch.  I, personally, plan on at least trying all real mmorpgs aimed at an mmorpg audience with decent chardev that come out in the future.  This isn't my dream game - its just a game I know I will enjoy playing and putting time into.  

    Only time will tell who is right and wrong about this.  But what is clear is some people are thinking of the big picture and this game's actual target market/potential market and others are projecting and egotistically assuming their tastes and wants are everyone's tastes and wants.  And since all new, modern hip games include them in their target market the fact that a noteworthy big name game isn't can't register with them. 

    I'm not saying I am immune from an egotistical perspective.  I have it all the time.  When I saw the trailer for Momma Mia I immediately thought that it would be a huge flop because no one sane wants to see that shit.  My mind cannot understand how or why anyone would watch it of their own volition.  But, my wife and sizable amounts of other people love shit movies like that.  I just don't understand it because I'm clearly not who the movie is made for.  I'm neither their target market or included in their potential market.  Me and my kind are not considered.  Because me and my kind have tastes and preferences that ensure we are not included, because if we were the final product would end up being nothing like Momma Mia.  It would be far closer to the Avengers or Shazam.  

    So, in order to make product X interesting to audience A, it needs Y features and not have Z features.  Audience B may be excluded because of Y features or not, or may only be included with Z features or not.  Either way you most likely won't have a product that will be really interesting to both audience A and B as an extremely simplified explanation.   The more you try the more you alienate people from one audience or another.  

    My opinion on Momma Mia is not valid because I like movies and have mainstream, casual taste in movies and like all the modern blockbusters.  

    You can call me a snob and an elitist all day but that doesn't change market realities.  Am I snob or elitist because I enjoy casual, mainstream blockbusters like the DC and Marvel movies?  Is my wife a snob or elitist because she likes shit movies like Momma Mia and singing movies in general and thinks all the movies I like are shit?  Of course not.  We like what we like.  We dislike what we dislike.  Now, if you think me being annoyed that people who have pretty much all modern games made for them telling us we will realize we actually don't like what we like and will realize it when we play something they don't like makes me an elitist and a snob, all I can say is you should have your medicine adjusted.  
    [Deleted User]deniter
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 4,391
    blamo2000 said:
    lahnmir said:

    Get of your high horse, you’re not making peace with anyone, you’re simply insulting the other group. Your bias and assumptions are a travesty and presenting your poorly disguised opinions as facts is laughable at best.

    The people you talk about are 95% of the players out there, THEY are the gamers, not you. You are the minority, a loud and rude one to boot. Classic will fail to be the saviour of anything because the small demopgraphic they are targetting finds themselves way too important to see its just a niche project.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    95% huh?  I highly, highly disagree with that.  And why would I want to make peace with people whose poor taste has ruined mmorpgs for me?  Maybe you're a mosaicist that loves people who poop all over your party, but I personally think that's really weird.  

    Anyway, I think you are way too emotional and need lots of medication and anger management before you consider playing a real mmorpg.  

    Also, I never said classic will be the savior of anything.  It will just give a new home to all the millions of disenfranchised mmorpg refugees.  Not all at once, and not consistently.  But it will be something we know we enjoy when we all need an mmorpg to scratch that itch.  I, personally, plan on at least trying all real mmorpgs aimed at an mmorpg audience with decent chardev that come out in the future.  This isn't my dream game - its just a game I know I will enjoy playing and putting time into.  

    Only time will tell who is right and wrong about this.  But what is clear is some people are thinking of the big picture and this game's actual target market/potential market and others are projecting and egotistically assuming their tastes and wants are everyone's tastes and wants.  And since all new, modern hip games include them in their target market the fact that a noteworthy big name game isn't can't register with them. 

    I'm not saying I am immune from an egotistical perspective.  I have it all the time.  When I saw the trailer for Momma Mia I immediately thought that it would be a huge flop because no one sane wants to see that shit.  My mind cannot understand how or why anyone would watch it of their own volition.  But, my wife and sizable amounts of other people love shit movies like that.  I just don't understand it because I'm clearly not who the movie is made for.  I'm neither their target market or included in their potential market.  Me and my kind are not considered.  Because me and my kind have tastes and preferences that ensure we are not included, because if we were the final product would end up being nothing like Momma Mia.  It would be far closer to the Avengers or Shazam.  

    So, in order to make product X interesting to audience A, it needs Y features and not have Z features.  Audience B may be excluded because of Y features or not, or may only be included with Z features or not.  Either way you most likely won't have a product that will be really interesting to both audience A and B as an extremely simplified explanation.   The more you try the more you alienate people from one audience or another.  

    My opinion on Momma Mia is not valid because I like movies and have mainstream, casual taste in movies and like all the modern blockbusters.  

    You can call me a snob and an elitist all day but that doesn't change market realities.  Am I snob or elitist because I enjoy casual, mainstream blockbusters like the DC and Marvel movies?  Is my wife a snob or elitist because she likes shit movies like Momma Mia and singing movies in general and thinks all the movies I like are shit?  Of course not.  We like what we like.  We dislike what we dislike.  Now, if you think me being annoyed that people who have pretty much all modern games made for them telling us we will realize we actually don't like what we like and will realize it when we play something they don't like makes me an elitist and a snob, all I can say is you should have your medicine adjusted.  
    Its not about finding other peoples taste shit, it is about the desperate need to actually tell other people that and then distancing yourself from that because " your" fun is being ruined.

    You talk about poor taste, the likes of you, loud mouth idiots, the people I dislike etc. etc. etc. You couldn't be more condecending if you tried, THAT makes you an elitist. Enjoy Classic, I know I will, but when you want people to leave your fun alone, don't start pissing all over theirs like you have been doing up till now.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    Jean-Luc_PicardTorvalblamo2000
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • DinastyDinasty Member UncommonPosts: 205
    Nope, this will not do well for long.

    Once those rose colored glasses are slapped off, crushed by reality and the population dwindles. I'll tell ya I told ya so.
  • baphametbaphamet Member RarePosts: 3,311
    Dinasty said:
    Nope, this will not do well for long.

    Once those rose colored glasses are slapped off, crushed by reality and the population dwindles. I'll tell ya I told ya so.
    so where are you thinking those people end up? retail? there are a lot of people that don't like retail and would much rather play on a "classic" server. its either that or don't play wow at all for a lot of people.

    my reality is i can't stand wow retail, so the buck stops here if i ever want to play wow again., unless i go to a private server. i'm guessing i'm not alone, not by a long shot.


    blamo2000
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