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Blizzard killed off it's competitors by lucky coincidence.

24

Comments

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,737
    WoW basically took EQ and improved upon it....They removed many of the time synchs that EQ had, made several options for solo, group, and raid gameplay, had quests organized in a linear pattern for ease, and made the game with graphics that you could play on even the worst systems.
    Octagon7711Mendel
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077

    By lucky coincidence, Blizzard was able to make unfortunate mistakes, cause it's competitors to follow, yet they them selfs were able to recover..... Blizzard is actually that strong ! 


    Your account is unable to post or reply until Dec 31, 2999 7:00 pm. (why not to 3000 AD???)

    Scroll down to the last 20 or so posts. Grab popcorn. WoW is ever about how Blizzard screws players and players flip it back dramas (and I ran out of thumbs up anyway!)...

    That aside, a lot of people still like WoW itself. It's one of the Western MMOs that's not tacky as the FTP and lootbox clown suit wearing/ham cleaver junk seen in Eastern gaming stuff. It's some Disney/Saturday morning cartoon game a lot grew up with. Complete with Acme holes!

    But Blizzard's actions (or ActiBlizzard as it should be called now) is where the players have problems with. That's where "The Game of Thrones" dramas of a studio and it's population, is as entertaining itself. >:)

    Sad thing is, THAT'S more entertaining than playing WoW these days. They should market that on Twitch or MLG, it'll get more views!

    Perfect RPGness theme to go with that popcorn, too...


  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    Well since i have seen for FACT that some gamer's play ONLY Blizzard games says there are some really easy sell targets that use NO criteria for choosing games and simply make Blizzard richer because they don't think about their choices.

    My assumption all along was VERY simple,Blizzard was the big advertising developer when DSL became a cheap household item.It is EXACTLY like cell phones,people get a PC or a cell phone they immediately start buying ANYTHING to play on it.Two things come into play,popularity,like friends telling friends to come join them and all of them influenced by marketing.
    I was around the PC circles long before most and there were only a handful of hangouts,so if something was talked about i knew it and heard it.

    The icing on the cake,the closing of the analysis was obvious to me when i was standing in line at Electronic Boutique.A few young kids had to be accompanied by a parent to buy Wow and when the first young child went to the counter with what looked like his grandmother the clerk asked "Oh so another Wow gamer,do you like the game?".The child and his 2 friends behind him all chimed in,YEAH yeah all our friends at school are getting it.This is known as the SNOWBALL effect,then from there is snowballs into more popularioty and everyone new to PC gaming wants in on this popularity game.


    We need to remember that NOBODY had yet stepped foot into the game to have ANY clue what they were buying and at least 65% never even played a MMO before so even if they did know they would have NOTHING to compare their choice to.Point being there was NO criteria used in making the decision,this would definitely reaffirm LUCK.Then of course even after a few months of playing,if they got bored they would be thinking as i also seen a LOT of ,players afraid to let all their hard work disappear so they keep playing in spite.Then of course many would make friends within the game of which also does a really good job of keeping them there.


    Octagon7711Coorslite

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    There is yet one more aspect that helps Blizzard keep a large player base well two more.
    1 Being popular means it is a great option for streamers looking to make money and Esports of which is VERY popular.This was reaffirmed by a once popular streamer that became a scammer "ATHENE" who said he ONLY plays Blizzard games because it gives him the most viewers.

    2 For years many of these Wow players never tried another mmo,so there is a VERY good chance they go try another they find it cumbersome,not like Wow so they immediately feel awkward in the game.If they don't make new friends they start thinking about,man i know how to play Wow,i know the world,i know the mechanics,i have lots of loot there,i should just go back and play Wow.

    I know when we had some Wow players come over to FFXi they were extremely confused to the point of giving up.They didn't understand the UI or macros or how to function as a GROUP within a group because in Wow it  is more like playing solo within a group.SATA wtf is that ,no thanks i'll just do my WS on my own,not realizing the SATA was needed to keep hate on the tank.

    My point is that even after the LUCK phase,there is likely LOTS of reasons why they kept their player base or players returned every time a new expansion came out.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    Wizardry said:
    Well since i have seen for FACT that some gamer's play ONLY Blizzard games says there are some really easy sell targets that use NO criteria for choosing games and simply make Blizzard richer because they don't think about their choices.

    My assumption all along was VERY simple,Blizzard was the big advertising developer when DSL became a cheap household item.It is EXACTLY like cell phones,people get a PC or a cell phone they immediately start buying ANYTHING to play on it.


    When WoW started and upto MoP (when people could download the game and no longer needed to buy it at a store -- or get it stolen in the mail), people couldn't MISS the WoW boxes at Wal-Mart. A whole shelf SCREAMED at them to BUY it.

    I ignored it until EQ2 was going into an another expansion and I wanted to play a pally healer. No problem, just walk into Wal-Mart and buy the game.

    These days it's not like that, and Blizzard even prefers digital downloads (that maybe what's really hurting them, shelf space for PC games is crowded out with console games now. Parents find a console is also cheaper to buy than a PC, too).

    But who plays Wow these days, they've been in the game for years and invested a lot of time in it. Not new players. The kids are into MOBAs and the arena games (Overwatch is an example of it).

    WoW also is a closed garden. Activision sells it's stuff on Steam, Blizzard doesn't. You have to want to play it and find it, even at Wal-Mart now. It's now kids of parents who played the game that's playing.
    ScotCoorslite
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    Despite a few preferring group forced MMOs (I come from Asheron's Call where grouping was encouraged not forced)...the truth is, the vast majority of gamers don't want to be FORCED. But if they are encouraged to do something, they'll do it.

    Blizzard found that encouraging grouping instead of forcing it, let those who want to do their own thing in an MMO to those who prefer grouping while leveling (dungeons/pvp) found true success

    WoW even in vanilla also focused on a smooth, mostly (compared to competitors) bug free gameplay. I remember I went through so many MMOs because how broken and buggy they were. WoW just had style,such a smooth experience...even animations for its time were spot on. Barely any if any at all had that kinda gameplay

    Nothing in WoW is really forced, its all optional or encouraged. Want the best items possible? Yeah gotta group for it, but there is a ton of other things to do besides getting top item level. Nothing is really forced upon anyone

    And just like real life, companies realized forcing players to do something is a road to failure because no one LIKES to be forced to do something.

    And that is one major reason WoW saw great success, a bigger reason than it just being "warcraft". That and equally so how smooth and relatively bugfree the game was, with such a good quality experience compared to any competitors. There is a reason EQ2 failed when it was competiting for launch date with WoW. Today looks butt ugly while running extremely poorly and it always ran poorly and looked ugly compared to WoW.

    But its more than the IP definitely. There is plenty of IPs that MMOs have been based that have failed that were popular IPs.
    Good read,
    This is what made World of Warcraft #1.  To make a long story short, WoW had everything a player could possibly want. It was flawless with the only exception of not being a players style. 

    This made World of Warcraft King 5x over.

    With this power they changed direction in many ways and LOST A LOT OF PLAYERS. Key word "changed direction".

    Up coming competition followed along with the changed direction. Bad for them !  
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    And WoW had PvP, now it tries again, just fails. Albion is full with WoW players :)

    WoW HAS PvP and it HAS PvP since 2004. Your game you love now wasn't even an apple in it's creator's eye then.

    WoW players are leaving because simply: WoW is old and Blizzard refuses to make WoW2. Most are bored with the design the devs have used for almost 20 years, and THEY refuse to adapt to changing player needs.

    Do you like watching the same series for almost 20 years, hours a day?

    You'd go crazy playing one game ONLY and nothing else!

    WoW has become a game players leave for months to years and come back to play for a month or so, then move on again. It's that familar game that's always there to return to when other games are down/messed up.

    Furthermore, while all games share the same type of game theory designs and overall abilities and such, LoL and WoW aren't the same, though. MOBAs are a different genre than RPGs. It's not about RP. You know a character story? MOBAs are like FPS games with faceless cutout characters. It's designed for ACTION and strategy. Not making a hero with their story playing in a larger story (while still keeping their own identity). WHY they're different genres. There's no roles in the RP sense, either.

    You don't go into LoL making a RP character. You pick premaade characters with the dev's descriptions. RPGs you customize your own character. EQ universe and some others allowed you to add in your profile your backstory, too (why I call WoW a ARPG, because it's devoid of that RPness, and it's basically Diablo for the masses, a loot grinder).

    Now do you understand the differences?
    Coorslite
  • btdtbtdt Member RarePosts: 523
    100% PROOF THAT THE OP HAS NO LIFE.

    You know the guy... you had one in every class... here he is... 20 years older and none the wiser...

    Life really does revolve around MMOs for him... it really does.
  • MightyUncleanMightyUnclean Member EpicPosts: 3,531
    What the fuck did I just read?  I'm gonna learn one of these days.
  • AAAMEOWAAAMEOW Member RarePosts: 1,600
    I think blizzard is just giving people what they want.  At least what people say on the wow forum.  

    It's like people on this forum mocking GW2 for being too easy.  While on GW2 forum people complain that the content(first expansion) is too hard.

    I also heard opposite on many topic like fast travel on this forum.  While on the actually game forum people argue the other way.

    Obviously different game have different target audience.  So reaction may differ.


  • CryomatrixCryomatrix Member EpicPosts: 3,223
    When I approach Delete's OP, I have one simple method.  

    1) I read it until my eyes glaze over. 

    This OP it took me the first sentence, sometimes, I make it to the end and others I do not. Once, I glaze over it, I stop reading it and then scroll down looking for entertaining posts. 

    If I do happen to make it to the end, and I understand his point, I may chime in, but usually my eyes glaze over too quickly to reach the end. 

    So if I chime in, it means I was able to follow the thought process, if not, then I usually enjoy the show by posting nothing and putting in "LOL" when I there are mirthful responses. 
    [Deleted User]
    Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix
    You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations. 
  • MalviousMalvious Member UncommonPosts: 218
    Nice bait.

    Fine, we'll compromise. I'll get my way & you'll find a way to be okay with that.

  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 7,591
    edited April 2019
    If someone succeeds with something you approve, it's skill, talent, etc...
    If someone succeeds with something you dislike, it can only be luck.

    In the meantime, Blizzard are laughing all the way to the bank for the last 25 years ;)
    I agree but Morhaime and company are no longer in the picture. It will be interesting to see how Blizzard progresses from here.

    I'll judge them by the quality of their game, not by the amount of dollars the game brings in. 
    Coorslite

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • esc-joconnoresc-joconnor Member RarePosts: 1,097
    PsYcHoGBR said:
    Wow is no longer "King of the hill". ESO and FF14 have taken that crown.
    Someone doesn't know how king of the hill works.
    Kyleran
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    AAAMEOW said:
    I think blizzard is just giving people what they want.  At least what people say on the wow forum.
    If that was so, Blizzard would put the portals back into the world; and revert their water strider change.

    Both changes no one asked for even.

    Blizz just dumped it on us instead, with a take it or leave it attitude.
  • Kevyne-ShandrisKevyne-Shandris Member UncommonPosts: 2,077
    When I approach Delete's OP, I have one simple method.  

    1) I read it until my eyes glaze over. 

    This OP it took me the first sentence, sometimes, I make it to the end and others I do not. Once, I glaze over it, I stop reading it and then scroll down looking for entertaining posts. 

    If I do happen to make it to the end, and I understand his point, I may chime in, but usually my eyes glaze over too quickly to reach the end. 

    So if I chime in, it means I was able to follow the thought process, if not, then I usually enjoy the show by posting nothing and putting in "LOL" when I there are mirthful responses. 
    Naw. Just ignore the obvious and talk about the game instead. :D
  • MMOExposedMMOExposed Member RarePosts: 7,384
    No. Most MMOs are copies of Everquest. EQ2 came out before WoW and did all those same things as well. WoW was just more polished and had a bigger IP. WoW didnt do anything new. It was just a new skin and easier to get into.  Vanilla WoW was grindy like every other game, had hardcore endgame that less than 5% of players ever played.
    [Deleted User]Coorslite

    Philosophy of MMO Game Design

  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 1,115
    I think you are all too harsh with Delete.
    He actually makes good points, if you can get through his awful way to express himself.
    Most times I do find it difficult to understand what his point is, but eventually I do get it, and most times I have to say, I agree with him.

    When he says that MMORPGs at their core are pretty dull games, and what makes them stand out from other games is the social aspect, he is not saying anything outrageous.

    Blizzard made MMORPGs less dull by adding aspects from Single Player games, but at the same time they killed what made MMORPGs so different from other games, the Social aspect.
    Basically Blizzard killed MMORPGs selling point, if you take out the Social element, MMORPGs are pretty average games at best.

    Unfortunately everyone else followed Blizzard mistake thinking they were on a winning, but it wasn't the right path to follow.
    WoW survived because Blizzard, fans gave them always the benefit of the doubt thinking the next Expansion would put things right, but that never really happened, and now finally even the fanboys are turning their back on WOW.
    Cryomatrix[Deleted User]Vermillion_RaventhalBruceYee
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    edited April 2019
    15 years after WoW released, OP reports that it had a transformative effect on the mmorpg landscape. Good eye.
    Hatefulljimmywolf

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • HashbrickHashbrick Member RarePosts: 1,851
    Did you forget your meds again?
    Hatefull
    [[ DEAD ]] - Funny - I deleted my account on the site using the cancel account button.  Forum user is separate and still exists with no way of deleting it. Delete it admins. Do it, this ends now.
  • HatefullHatefull Member EpicPosts: 2,502
    edited April 2019
    H0urg1ass said:
    Blizzard didn't invent anything new, but what they did do was come along and refine everyone else's ideas into their most appealing aspect.

    They didn't invent the MMO, but they made it far more accessible to the average player.

    It wasn't luck at all.  They looked at each genre and said "How do we take this style of game and make it so that everyone in the house will want to play it."

    They did it exceptionally well.  I know 60 year old people who play WoW, I know 12 year old people who play WoW.  I know 60 year old people who play Diablo, I know 12 year old people who play Diablo.  I even know 60 year old people who play Overwatch, using support classes, and I know 12 year old people who play Overwatch.

    They worked diligently towards universal appeal and mostly succeeded in almost every genre they tried.

    The community developed organically after the game showed appeal.
    Thanks, you saved me some typing.

    Blizzard saw what was working in other games, took those ideas, polished them a little bit, wrapped it all in a nice shiny very colorful package, and made billions. This isn't my idea, nor is it made up, it is exactly what Blizzard said in a post-release interview. Every other studio just wanted a slice of that cake.

    It's pretty simple and has been discussed to death. Nothing new here at all.


    DMKano said:
    Viper482 said:
    Just going off the subject title.....and this shows how competition is healthy. Because Blizzard destroyed the MMO....imo.


    Blizzard is given far too much credit for the entire MMO genre which existed 5 years before WoW.

    MMORPGs petered out all by themselves by staying the same old core gameplay for the last 20 years. 

    Deliver X, collect Y, kill 50 Z... all done back in 1999 and still the same in 2019.

    Players just moved on from the same old crap... this isnt Blizzards fault - it's the entire industry failing to keep the genre new and fresh.


    WoW may not have been what started it all, but it is most definitely what brought the genre into the living room and made it popular with people from 8 to 80...ish.
    jimmywolf

    If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

    In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.

  • HashbrickHashbrick Member RarePosts: 1,851
    H0urg1ass said:
    Blizzard didn't invent anything new, but what they did do was come along and refine everyone else's ideas into their most appealing aspect.

    They didn't invent the MMO, but they made it far more accessible to the average player.

    It wasn't luck at all.  They looked at each genre and said "How do we take this style of game and make it so that everyone in the house will want to play it."

    They did it exceptionally well.  I know 60 year old people who play WoW, I know 12 year old people who play WoW.  I know 60 year old people who play Diablo, I know 12 year old people who play Diablo.  I even know 60 year old people who play Overwatch, using support classes, and I know 12 year old people who play Overwatch.

    They worked diligently towards universal appeal and mostly succeeded in almost every genre they tried.

    The community developed organically after the game showed appeal.
    So your Grandpa/Grandma and cousin play.  Guess Blizzard really missed out on the 13-59yr old demographic there.
    [[ DEAD ]] - Funny - I deleted my account on the site using the cancel account button.  Forum user is separate and still exists with no way of deleting it. Delete it admins. Do it, this ends now.
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,737
    No. Most MMOs are copies of Everquest. EQ2 came out before WoW and did all those same things as well. WoW was just more polished and had a bigger IP. WoW didnt do anything new. It was just a new skin and easier to get into.  Vanilla WoW was grindy like every other game, had hardcore endgame that less than 5% of players ever played.
    You obviously didn't play EQ2 at release....It was a hardcore game...They completely revamped it after WoW came out and crushed it....In a panic move, they basically Wowified EQ2 to try and compete.
    [Deleted User]mmolouKyleranHatefulllahnmirMendelCoorslite
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    edited April 2019
    AAAMEOW said:

    I believe someone mention there are list of 600 mmorpg now. 
    That is because everything these days is considered by some to be a mmorpg.

    If I order a pizza it's Pepperoni RPG Online.
    Post edited by Amathe on
    KyleranHatefullCoorslite

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

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