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The Almost MMO and Me - Bill Murphy - MMORPG.com

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,126

imageThe Almost MMO and Me - Bill Murphy - MMORPG.com

I’ve noticed something of late - I haven’t logged into a real MMORPG, even my precious Elder Scrolls Online, in weeks. In ESO’s case, this is partly because I’m waiting for Elsweyr. But usually, between big content swells of ESO, I’m at least playing something else - GW2, WoW, FFXIV, Neverwinter, and so forth. But there’s a type of game that seems to be meeting my needs for persistence and online play. I’ve been trying to think of a name for them for ages, and I think Almost MMO just about covers it.

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Comments

  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,126
    I agree 100%. I don't have long hours to spend in traditional MMOs and these "almost MMOs" fit the bill perfectly. Even games like Assassin's Creed Odyssey manage to provide that same feeling without the time commitment that I simply can't give any more. I can get in, get something done and log out. I can play with friends and, well, for me that's enough. :) I'm not sure I'll ever commit fully to another MMO again.
    AeanderparrotpholkYashaXTimEisenklash2defjonp200BananableOctagon7711chojin2kTacticalZombehand 2 others.


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 2,865
    Honestly there hasn't been an interesting MMO to launch since....I wanna say Wildstar (which ultimately tanked).

    The mmo genre is totally stagnant, whereas a lot of these looter-shooters and "not-quite-mmo"s have been evolving quite a bit.
    SBFordTorvalgunklackerAlverant
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 4,841
    The only way I'm committing to another MMO ever again is if it offers:

    1) Phenomenal realm vs realm content unlike anything I can experience elsewhere.

    2) Deep buildcraft comparable to the original Guild Wars. 

    3) Or both.

    My gaming time is precious and a majority of MMOs don't deserve a piece of that. Much less the huge piece that they demand.
    YashaXjmcdermottuk
  • chrisapete123chrisapete123 Member UncommonPosts: 23
    Wow did change Mmorogs or revives Mmorogs.. Everqueat did those things and is the GOAT of MMORPG.. Wow will not ever get to 30 Expansion like EQ will.. EQ will out last Wow.. since Wow is the same and hasn’t changed it’s dying off fast.. lmao
    GdemamiOzmodanMaddog666
  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 4,841
    Wow did change Mmorogs or revives Mmorogs.. Everqueat did those things and is the GOAT of MMORPG.. Wow will not ever get to 30 Expansion like EQ will.. EQ will out last Wow.. since Wow is the same and hasn’t changed it’s dying off fast.. lmao
    Daybreak won't outlive WoW, let alone Everquest.
    SBFordblueturtle13OzmodanlaseritMaddog666seshses
  • parrotpholkparrotpholk Member EpicPosts: 4,602
    Summed up perfectly why the MMO genre is more or less dying.  Most new games coming out are nostalgia vehicles for those longing for the old days.  I had hoped the genre would move forward but we are heading in a direction of games that will draw small niche crowds.  You also have what I hope will end the crowd funding craze when those games either never see the light of day or never launch with anywhere close to the MMO nirvana they presented on paper.

    When you think about it most of the MMO with a population all launched 5+ years ago and nothing coming up will likely change that.  Where will the FFXIV fans hop to once that game begins to slow down or the ESO folks.  The options for quality MMO games is just no longer there and nothing coming down the pike is going to change it.
    SBFordYashaXKajidourdenMaddog666
  • laseritlaserit Member LegendaryPosts: 6,157
    edited March 19
    I say we change the Website to "almostmmo.com" ;)

    I still enjoy a good mmorpg, but just like my single player games I don't need to rush things. There are so many things out there to enjoy.

    Almost that time of year to smell them roses ;)

    Enjoy your kids Bill, time goes by and they grow up so fast.
    BillMurphyYashaXblueturtle13SBFordTimukasAethaeryncmacqBananableOctagon7711

    "Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee

  • NibsNibs Member UncommonPosts: 287
    edited March 19


    Summed up perfectly why the MMO genre is more or less dying.  Most new games coming out are nostalgia vehicles for those longing for the old days.  I had hoped the genre would move forward but we are heading in a direction of games that will draw small niche crowds.  You also have what I hope will end the crowd funding craze when those games either never see the light of day or never launch with anywhere close to the MMO nirvana they presented on paper.

    When you think about it most of the MMO with a population all launched 5+ years ago and nothing coming up will likely change that.  Where will the FFXIV fans hop to once that game begins to slow down or the ESO folks.  The options for quality MMO games is just no longer there and nothing coming down the pike is going to change it.

    I see the MMO genre development, and its apparent back slide like this: We were driving along and found a great place (EQ, AC, DAoC, whatever). When we were ready to move on we climbed back in our cars and hit the road again. We were fairly certain we heading towards an even better place. Now, however, we realised the road we're on is just leading us to more of the same. But there is a better place over ----> there. But we can't just drive from here to there. There's too much stuff in the way we'd have to jump over to get there. We need to go back on ourselves to find the right turn off to get where we want to be. A smoother road to our destination than cutting cross country with no rest stops available.

    We need to go back to a place in the development where taking a new direction is easier, rather than just trying to climb a mountain.
    SBFordScotHluillWallisHall
  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 2,415
    I'm glad to see you have reached the point where you can accept that these types of games are not mmos.

    I think "almost mmo" is a good way to describe them and "Ammos" rolls off the tongue nicely. That said, the "almost" qualifier makes them seem "less" than mmos, and while that may be true in some respects, a moniker with a more positive connotation would probably work better and might even catch on.
    SBFord
    ....
  • PhaserlightPhaserlight Member EpicPosts: 2,941
    It's simple for me; if I'm not enjoying it it's not worth my time. As such I take a very light-handed approach. If my toon on screen dies in the middle of a player to player transaction because my 5 year old son wants to show me his latest Lego creation, it's no loss.
    SBFord

    "The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
    Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 4 tracks in Distance

  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 2,011
    During 2004 - 2008 before WOTLK came out. I was able to raid MC, ZG, AQ20, and BWL during Vanilla, I cleared Kara, ZA, Mag, and Guurls lair. While I did not clear all the content in WOW I felt happy, I enjoyed my time in WOW. Also during this time I was working on 2 degrees that took me 10 years to complete. While I was working on my degrees I worked on average 60 hours a week while I was in the starting stages of my career. Anyone that knows if you want to be come good at your career and get to a very high level in their career they need to work hard and endless hours at times. Which is what I did and still even on weeks I would work 60 hours and do 20 to 30 hours of homework I still ended up find time to raid and progress my adventure in WOW. This is because I have Time Management skills and most importantly I am a player who takes a long view of a game.

    The problem I see with the author of this article @SBFord and every person that complains about how BUSY they are and how they have A JOB, AND KIDS, and A WIFE comes down to 2 core things. First being that today's MMORPGS are built for you to jump on their Treadmill and RUN as fast and as HARD as you can for 2 to 3 months where you need to put a ton of time into the game so you can keep up with the raiding curve. You do this because when the raiding curve has past there are few options left to raid without tools like LFD and easy raids. You have to run content daily like in FFXIV to get your Stones or other games do their dailies to get your gear for raiding. Plus you have to do multiple levels of raid content to get the best gear to take on the hardest content. YES this content gets old and why I no longer play current MMORPGS.

    The second problem with this group if you mindset. You look at games like Classic, Ashes, Pantheon, Camelot Unchained and you think. O my god HOW do I a person with a Casual Schedule get ANYWHERE in this games. Then you go on a rant on how you have a job and a life outside the game like there is no one else that has these things too play these games or will play these games. Is your mindset which is stuck in the I need to keep up with what ever curve there is. Instead of taking more of an acceptance approach. In my first paragraph I told you my life during the first 4 years of WOW. I got to see a lot of content I did not see it all, BUT I did do a good amount. Why? Because I took a long view of the game and of other games. You can do.

    For Example. I am working on building a guild for Classic WOW. I personally today have a schedule visitation schedule to see my kids. I work about 45 hours a week now, I also work on certifications mainly for Microsoft Azure. I also work out 3 days a week, I go fishing at least once every other weekend when I dont have my daughters and I try to fish in between. So I am a fairly busy almost 39 year old man here. I will be running a classic WOW guild, in my guild right now I have a guy going for his P.H.D who is about 6 months from completing it plus him and his Wife are trying to have a kid. I have another guy who is in his late 40s and has kids. Most everyone in our guild has kids and a life outside the game, and the one guy who does not have kids works 8 to 10 hours a day 6 days a week.

    Yet we all are working on a guild that will see a lot of the Classic WOW content. How are we doing it? We are all taking a very long view of the game. We do not feel we need to clear Naxx in under 24 months. We will take 4 to 6 months just for leveling and getting ready to raid. We will only raid 2 to 2.5 hours 2 days a week. We are ok with taking months of gearing up and enjoying the content and having a WOW family again. None of us enjoy jumping on the Treadmill running as hard and as fast as we can until we burn out then quitting the game. Its our Mindsets that will allow us to do this in an old school game. You can to if you want to.

    Lets say you want to play Ashes of creation and become a very good blacksmith. Well Maybe you dont have 20 hours a week it takes to become the best blacksmith on the server and make all of the best gear. What about specializing in maybe just making weapons or maybe armor? Narrow your focus and accept that you will not be able to do everything and be the best at everything. Only less than 1% of the MMORPG population should be that good. When I was playing SWG I was the best at making Rocket Launchers on my weaponssmith and YES I had hundreds of Millions of credits in the game. Some others had more than I did however I still made a killing to do everything I wanted to do in game. I had a Narrow focus and was the best at that. I enjoyed my time playing MMORPGS that required a lot of effort. Most of that time I didnt play endless hours and had no life. I always had a life outside the game.
    ScotManWithNoTanHluillMaddog666AgeniMonkattaPhry
  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,126
    @danwest58 While I agree with the article in general, I didn't write it. @BillMurphy did ;)


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 27,320
    Well, for me, my time is "my time" so I can play or do what I want.

    However, I'm ok with playing an mmorpg and not making huge leaps of progress. Spent 2 hours lat night in Lord of the Rings Online and didn't make a level. Which is fine. I did enjoy myself immensely.

    Since I'm more interested in "worlds to explore" than obtaining the next big shiny (as a goal) it doesn't matter if I have only 30 minutes or 4 hours or "whatever."

    As I mentioned in another thread, once the current large AAA mmo's have done their time we probably won't see anything but indy mmo's unless technology get to the point where a true living world can be done.

    And then would a large amount of people really want to play them?

    That's the thing, games that require large amounts of money will appeal to the largest denominator of people who don't want to spend more than 30 minutes playing them. So as others have said, they are going to require 30 minutes of content that people can enjoy.


    ScotPanther2103PhaserlightExistentialist



  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 2,011

    SBFord said:

    @danwest58 While I agree with the article in general, I didn't write it. @BillMurphy did ;)



    I am saying everyone like Bill, and yourself as well as others who say. I just cant play MMORPGS like I use to because Life. Then they take a look at up and coming MMORPGS and Classic and dont see how these games can work. I am saying its your mindset on these games that hold you back, like my mindset holds me back from today's MMORPGS. I talk about how you can as a person with a life can play these games you just have to change your mindset. Look at what I am trying to do with the guild I am going to run for classic. Its a long view of the game vs running your ass off today on the treadmill that MMORPGS have become. Besides if I want to get on a treadmill I will walk to the other end of the building here and get on the treadmill there.
  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 2,011

    Sovrath said:

    Well, for me, my time is "my time" so I can play or do what I want.

    However, I'm ok with playing an mmorpg and not making huge leaps of progress. Spent 2 hours lat night in Lord of the Rings Online and didn't make a level. Which is fine. I did enjoy myself immensely.

    Since I'm more interested in "worlds to explore" than obtaining the next big shiny (as a goal) it doesn't matter if I have only 30 minutes or 4 hours or "whatever."

    As I mentioned in another thread, once the current large AAA mmo's have done their time we probably won't see anything but indy mmo's unless technology get to the point where a true living world can be done.

    And then would a large amount of people really want to play them?

    That's the thing, games that require large amounts of money will appeal to the largest denominator of people who don't want to spend more than 30 minutes playing them. So as others have said, they are going to require 30 minutes of content that people can enjoy.





    This is exactly what I am saying. Players who play MMORPGS that take a lot of effort and dont have the endless amounts of time can still enjoy the content when they have an accepting mindset.
  • PalebanePalebane Member RarePosts: 3,714
    edited March 19
    I assume most people who are willing to sacrifice parts of their lives for video games are mostly playing a different genre these days. Many MMOs are more streamlined and dumbed down than the single player counterparts. Time spent there is literally wasted when you could be playing better rpgs by yourself, or better multiplayer in different genres. Just my opinion.
    AeanderYashaXHluill

    Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.

  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 5,990
    "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us." - Gandalf

    PhaserlightSBFordExistentialistHluill

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 21,122
    So you're saying that you want a Modestly Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game? Or perhaps "Moderately" or "Mildly".
    YashaXlaseritTacticalZombehAlmostLancelot
  • HarikenHariken Member RarePosts: 2,384
    Lately i have only been logging in to ESO because of the daily login rewards and logging out. Been mostly playing single player RPG's. Grim Dawn and Kingdom of Alumar Reckoning a lot lately.
  • BizkitNLBizkitNL Member RarePosts: 2,507
    Hear, hear!
    10
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 12,083
    I think "Not MMOs At All And Me" would be a more apt title. There is nothing wrong with playing a range of games and finding real MMOs are not for you right now, currently in that boat myself.

    But what I do not do is decide because my playstyle is changing that what games are called must change as well. Indeed in his article Bill seems to recognise this, they only have MMO like elements, that's hardly 'almost a MMO'.

    When I was a lot younger I moved from mainly playing shooters and RPG's to MMOs, I did not decide that games like Asherons Call and DAOC were "Almost Shooters". :D

    This revaluating of reality to suite oneself is hardly restricted to gaming we often seem to decide that "what I want now is normal because it is what I want". But I think you can be in the same boat as Bill and realise that pretending something like Division 2 are now MMOs is just irrational.

    I think many of us will face the problems he talks about with any upcoming MMOs, but with a good enough guild we can do it.
    HluillNilden

     25 Agrees

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  • EponyxDamorEponyxDamor Member RarePosts: 726
    Bill, even the MMOs you listed in your article (FFXIV, WoW, etc) are less MMOs these days and more lobby-style dungeon runners with an over-world zone used for little else other than leveling. I think this is partly because these games really shrink the game world down when dungeon queues are introduced.

    Essentially, MMOs have become a watered-down version of their past selves; leaving many of the endearing features at the wayside to better accommodate modern gamers. Granted, I appreciate this and don't fault them for it -- after all, I don't want to spend hours just getting a group together and running to the entrance of the dungeon I want to run. But, at the end of the day, MMOs are trying to be something they're not and really become little more than co-op experiences. In order to enjoy all of the content offered by those MMOs (especially the most difficult/rewarding content, ie. raids), you'd have to take time to schedule a certain number of hours in the week with 6-10 other individuals in order to complete it (raids, etc). So, there's a real disconnect between the two "difficulties" that leave "casual gamers" (read: those without ample amounts of time to play) who crave challenging content to the wayside.

    The other games you mentioned (Anthem, Div2, D2, etc) are made more for that lobby-style, co-op game play and don't pretend to be something they're not. They really shine in comparison to MMOs for that quick, bite-sized piece of content and entertainment because they are made from the ground up for it. For those of us, like you, who have a busy personal or professional life, these games offer more on-the-fly enjoyment due to the content being created for just that kind of consumption. Want more challenging content? Just increase the difficulty level and queue up. Chances are, all of the content in these games are easily accessible, even at the hardest difficulty, to the majority of players -- better, they don't require precise planning and scheduling to achieve progression.

    TL;DR I don't find MMOs challenging enough anymore from the perspective of someone with limited playtime. Co-op games offer more challenge and better feeling of progression for those times I have to drop-in and play.
    ScotHluill
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 12,083
    A bit puzzled did Bill or Aaron Couture write this? Both names are up there.
    TimEisen

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  • TimEisenTimEisen ColumnistMember EpicPosts: 3,293

    Scot said:

    A bit puzzled did Bill or Aaron Couture write this? Both names are up there.



    I assume it was Tim Ford or Suzie Eisen using a thirds pseudo.
    TorvalTacticalZombeh
    I used to role-play a Warrior Priest now I role-play a writer.
  • TimEisenTimEisen ColumnistMember EpicPosts: 3,293
    "Well crap, how can I even think I’ll be able to play those?". The good old Murican 40plus be ganking our MMO time. If WOW launched today would it even find success? It seems like more and more multiplayer games are made for ultra quick fixes due to both lack of people's time, the competition (including social media, netflix etc), and our ever shortening smart phone dopamine attention spans.
    HluillTacticalZombeh
    I used to role-play a Warrior Priest now I role-play a writer.
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