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Star Citizen: Around the Verse - Depth of Character - MMORPG.com

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  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 9,525
    Hatefull said:

    LMAO he IS speaking for himself. Reading comprehension FTW.

    So far the game looks great. Glad to see a developer actually trying to finish a game prior to releasing it.
    I concur.

    It seems to have become such an exception to the rule that a development team actually wants to FINISH a game before they launch it (even if it takes time), that this causes bewilderment in some people.


    Have fun
    JoeBloberUm4dBruhXarktardBabuinixsquibbly
  • JoeBloberJoeBlober Member UncommonPosts: 190




    JoeBlober said:








    ..... seriously tho this game should of been out 5 years ago no amount of development can hold it back....



    )









    LOL.... Starting from scratch, 12 guys, no pipelines, 6 M$ end of Kickstarter Nov. 2012.. and should have finished it in 2013 two triple-A, hire +500 devs, make studios and pipelines.





    Another internet game "expert" :)







    Now im no "expert" but seriously some of the choices Cloud Imperium Games have taken baffle me (monetary decisions and game development). Just seems to me that things could of been done alot easier than the route they have taken



    Well all the project have been driven from start by Backers support through both pledges and pools. Scope change mid-2014, stretch goals, concept ships. All on backers request/support done by many seniors developers and managers who did already delivered memorable games in the past. CR and his brother Erin are both able to handle it... and this is precisely what they have done and keep doing with a roadmap giving beta in a year and from now.

    They could have delivered something close to original pitch, spending 100M$.. and leave with the remaining saying legally: "job done"... Not only they keep delivering quarter after quarter but this coming to fruition with features Publishers don't even care to add (FOIP, language sign, DNA face) despite having Billions$.

    This project is ours gamer project even if you don't realize it yet... and it cost a fraction (35/45$) of Triple-A sold at 50+DLC's we have seen a hundred times already.
    Quality is not easy. Easy is what Publishers are doing. personally I have waited decades for this project... and it is coming in few quarters in Beta (5 till Q2 2020).
    As a project leader in International project, not many guys around could have handle Cloud Imperium, from zero to a +460M valuation today... Factual evaluation from independent auditor... based on capacity from Cloud Imperium to deliver.

    mmolouUm4dBruhErillionXarktard
  • SabracSabrac Member UncommonPosts: 123
    Another SC news, another pointless fight between their haters and fans screaming at each other trying to prove the other side is wrong...

    Seems like you guys haven't learn the lesson that Vaas Montenegro gave us about insanity...


    On a side note: I don't hate this game or support it but if it releases, i will try it for sure :P
    JoeBloberTacticalZombehinfomatzMazikar
  • rodarinrodarin Member RarePosts: 2,411
    Hatefull said:

    Tiller said:


    Erillion said:

    >>>> completely over the top nonsense >>>

    For you it is nonsense. For us backers it is what we want and what we support.


    Have fun



    Speak for yourself, it's not for everyone. Some of us would possibly be interested in playing a completed non-buggy version of this game, if it ever launched properly. Based on their roadmap that will never happen, hence the saltiness over their micro-a la carte trickle-pee updates. Even when you think its close to the end, they create new goals to stretch it out and keep the game from launching fully while you folks get excited and pour more money into their wallets and tell everyone else it's not a game for you.  Well in the end, who is their potential playerbase? People who will give them infinite money for jpegs and videos of stuff they want to add someday?

    It's like if the Yellow brick road never ended and there where pictures all along the way showing you what the end looked like but you never reach it. I don't know about you but most normal people don't want to walk an infinite troll path to nowhere. Eventually you are gonna have to call bullshit.









    LMAO he IS speaking for himself. Reading comprehension FTW.

    So far the game looks great. Glad to see a developer actually trying to finish a game prior to releasing it.
    Actually he isnt he includes himself and all other backers.
    squibbly
  • LonzoLonzo Member UncommonPosts: 279
    This is soooo vaporware, it is not even funny.... ?
    gunklacker

    image
  • someforumguysomeforumguy Member RarePosts: 4,009
    edited March 8
    I mean, it is nice, all those details they work on. But, have they started working on a MMO yet? Not just assets, but actually the tech that makes this game a MMORPG? Massively Multiplayer Online RPG?
    Small scale multiplayer or a chat lobby is not in the same boat. Just upscaling, is not a realistic thing either.

    Does everyone also realise that the amount of detail that goes into assets, will also make it harder for your pc to have 100 players at the same time in your view? And for their servers?

    Or is the whole MMO thing scrapped and are they going for a more small scale multiplayer thing (think Ark, Conan etc) ?.

    Pretty assets and animations are the easy part. This just costs time, so money. And there is no lack of that. Plenty of talent out there to be hired to do this.

    MMO scale networking and server tech is not something you can look up guides for. I wish Games websites were more on the ball with this. Stop being blinded by their new shiny graphics.
  • JoeBloberJoeBlober Member UncommonPosts: 190


    I mean, it is nice, all those details they work on. But, have they started working on a MMO yet? Not just assets, but actually the tech that makes this game a MMORPG? Massively Multiplayer Online RPG?
    Small scale multiplayer or a chat lobby is not in the same boat. Just upscaling, is not a realistic thing either.

    Does everyone also realise that the amount of detail that goes into assets, will also make it harder for your pc to have 100 players at the same time in your view? And for their servers?

    Or is the whole MMO thing scrapped and are they going for a more small scale multiplayer thing (think Ark, Conan etc) ?.

    Pretty assets and animations are the easy part. This just costs time, so money. And there is no lack of that. Plenty of talent out there to be hired to do this.

    MMO scale networking and server tech is not something you can look up guides for. I wish Games websites were more on the ball with this. Stop being blinded by their new shiny graphics.



    Have a look to specific Star Citizen roadmap and you realize networking is on every quarter patch. They did already improved fps performance by a factor of 3 compared to 2017. Server meshing is the next big move and will happen after Squadron 42 (solo) Beta.
    Currently an average PC can handle the game at 1440p.

    They do hired economist expert years ago for the MMO part and even a senior guy from WOW. AS you said, pretty assets don't make an MMO... Guess that seniors developers with decades of experience know it as well :) Priority is to release Squadron 42 in 2020. Meanwhile, SC (MMO) keep improving with more performance, new flight model (3.5), new gameplay (3.6, 3.7) and locations.
    Xarktard
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 2,105
    Most crying about delays or "feature creep" are the same ones who cry about lack of innovation in mmorpgs, lack of immersion, lack of depth, lack of content etc etc.

    We get it, you're jaded, you're hurt and you're angry and frustrated because it's been too long without a mmorpg that you could call home, you really want to play a game like Star Citizen, you just can't handle the wait lol

    Complaining that dev's are showcasing their work, imagine complaining that a dev is putting extra effort in making their npc's more believable and interesting.... It's just angry gamers venting their frustration.

    Maybe instead of complaining you should showcase more appreciation that dev's are open enough to showcase their work weekly and that a company is putting time and money into details that often have to be neglected in the mmorpg genre because of scale - time - money restraints.











    You don't have to give your money to crowdfund games, nobody forces you to get in early. You can just wait (do absolutely nothing - oh so hard) and maybe learn something along the way instead of being in perpetual ignorant/hater/angry gamer mode.
    XarktardJoeBlober
  • sgelsgel Member RarePosts: 2,094
    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!
    BabuinixArglebarglemmolou

    ..Cake..

  • someforumguysomeforumguy Member RarePosts: 4,009
    JoeBlober said:


    I mean, it is nice, all those details they work on. But, have they started working on a MMO yet? Not just assets, but actually the tech that makes this game a MMORPG? Massively Multiplayer Online RPG?
    Small scale multiplayer or a chat lobby is not in the same boat. Just upscaling, is not a realistic thing either.

    Does everyone also realise that the amount of detail that goes into assets, will also make it harder for your pc to have 100 players at the same time in your view? And for their servers?

    Or is the whole MMO thing scrapped and are they going for a more small scale multiplayer thing (think Ark, Conan etc) ?.

    Pretty assets and animations are the easy part. This just costs time, so money. And there is no lack of that. Plenty of talent out there to be hired to do this.

    MMO scale networking and server tech is not something you can look up guides for. I wish Games websites were more on the ball with this. Stop being blinded by their new shiny graphics.



    Have a look to specific Star Citizen roadmap and you realize networking is on every quarter patch. They did already improved fps performance by a factor of 3 compared to 2017. Server meshing is the next big move and will happen after Squadron 42 (solo) Beta.
    Currently an average PC can handle the game at 1440p.

    They do hired economist expert years ago for the MMO part and even a senior guy from WOW. AS you said, pretty assets don't make an MMO... Guess that seniors developers with decades of experience know it as well :) Priority is to release Squadron 42 in 2020. Meanwhile, SC (MMO) keep improving with more performance, new flight model (3.5), new gameplay (3.6, 3.7) and locations.

    A random senior developer can't help you there. You don't seem to understand what I am saying. As long as they will not show they can handle MMO scale numbers, it is not sure if they are even able to do that.

    Another issue with this is that they are already ironing out asset details before they know how the framework will work and handle those assets. This can cause serious issues on the long run. It is like blindly picking some game engine and trying to create a MMO with that and then realising later on that it can't handle big numbers of players without serious lag (hello SWTOR). Big studios failed here. It is not something you simply hire random 'senior devs' for.

    I am very confused why this was not one of the first things they started with on the moment the money started to poor in. It is what will be the most difficult to get right.

    Your FPS performance increasing have to do with the graphics part, not networking. The networking on this small scale currently won't turn it into a MMO.

    Prediction : They will keep it small scale.
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 2,105
    sgel said:
    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!
    I guess it's because there's nothing else out there for them  :D
  • sgelsgel Member RarePosts: 2,094

    Babuinix said:


    sgel said:

    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!


    I guess it's because there's nothing else out there for them  :D



    Yeah.
    The only game worth playing is Star Citizen... everyone knows everything else is craaaaaaap.
    The PC Gaming saviour can't launch fast enough!
    Babuinix

    ..Cake..

  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 2,105
    edited March 9
    sgel said:

    Babuinix said:


    sgel said:

    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!


    I guess it's because there's nothing else out there for them  :D



    Yeah.
    The only game worth playing is Star Citizen... everyone knows everything else is craaaaaaap.
    The PC Gaming saviour can't launch fast enough!
    Yeah sometimes it seems that way for some folks. They cant stop being agry about this game lol. Kinda like obsessing with the high-school sweetheart who got away  :D
  • someforumguysomeforumguy Member RarePosts: 4,009
    sgel said:

    Babuinix said:


    sgel said:

    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!


    I guess it's because there's nothing else out there for them  :D



    Yeah.
    The only game worth playing is Star Citizen... everyone knows everything else is craaaaaaap.
    The PC Gaming saviour can't launch fast enough!
    Most probably like the idea of Star Citizen. But that does not mean all of them believe it will be executed properly (or at all).
    Just looking at MMORPG releases in the past, there is also enough reason to be very very sceptical about any huge MMO project in development. To just brush it off as being haters is unfair. The constant delays and focus on detail, does not help either. But I guess not everyone learns from past pre order mistakes and unfounded hype. Or some just don't care if they maybe feed money to a company as some kind of gamble.

    So far, SC has shown awesome looking art and ideas. But its nowhere near being a MMO and they still have nothing to show for that part. Not even if they are able to do it. Everything so far has been too small scale for that and mostly client side (the easy part). The whole development road so far seems to be upside down.

    The fact that they are planning dedicated servers also contradicts the MMO player number idea. Who is going to hire a server farm to run this? And if they are planning to make it scalable, then the required tech becomes even more complex. So my guess: SC will not be MMO scale in player numbers.

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 11,169
    Erillion said:
    Scot said:
    Any idea when it is going to launch? Will we just have another year of these videos? Which would be fine it was coming out in 2020 or even 2021.
    Did you look at the road-map ?  That information there answers your question.

    You do not only have to watch these developer videos. You can do a lot of things in game already, as  tenthousands (!) of player made videos (check YouTube) show. During free fly weekends you can check it out for yourself for free.


    Have fun
    I had a look at the roadmap, well the one I googled seemed official anyway. It just says what they are doing this year, no mention of launch. I am not looking for a date here, just a ballpark 'give or take half a year' estimate.

     25 Agrees

    You received 25 Agrees. You're posting some good content. Great!

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Now Doesn't That Make You Feel All Warm And Fuzzy Inside? :P

  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 2,105
    edited March 9
    You're talking about server meshing. 



    Yes it's in the works, no you don't need it to be finished before you start building assets or work on gameplay systems.

    Amazon is their partner and StarCitizen using it's engine Lumberyard will use their server network.


    JoeBlober
  • coretex666coretex666 Member EpicPosts: 3,605
    I was reading through the comments until I suddenly realized I no longer remembered what the original topic of the thread was. 

    Any SC related news just quickly derail into two sides fighting.

    Any thoughts on that NPC, guys? :D

    MaxBaconSabracScotinfomatz
  • BabuinixBabuinix Member EpicPosts: 2,105
    Any thoughts on that NPC, guys? :D
    Looking good. As far as performance-capture goes it seems on par with the other npc's that I posted above. Art style is very cool and no doubt will look awesome ingame, but the hair is the question mark. They've been working on hair tech for a while and it's due to improovements so it's nice to see them pushing for more complex hairstyles.
  • AwakenWarriorAwakenWarrior Member UncommonPosts: 48
    At least this character looks very interesting.
    JoeBlober
  • zerounuzerounu Member UncommonPosts: 1



    sgel said:



    Babuinix said:




    sgel said:


    Yeah!! You crying jaded, hurt, angry, frustrated peons... why aren't you grateful for Store Citizen?

    You tell em' Babs!




    I guess it's because there's nothing else out there for them  :D






    Yeah.

    The only game worth playing is Star Citizen... everyone knows everything else is craaaaaaap.

    The PC Gaming saviour can't launch fast enough!

    Most probably like the idea of Star Citizen. But that does not mean all of them believe it will be executed properly (or at all).
    Just looking at MMORPG releases in the past, there is also enough reason to be very very sceptical about any huge MMO project in development. To just brush it off as being haters is unfair. The constant delays and focus on detail, does not help either. But I guess not everyone learns from past pre order mistakes and unfounded hype. Or some just don't care if they maybe feed money to a company as some kind of gamble.

    So far, SC has shown awesome looking art and ideas. But its nowhere near being a MMO and they still have nothing to show for that part. Not even if they are able to do it. Everything so far has been too small scale for that and mostly client side (the easy part). The whole development road so far seems to be upside down.

    The fact that they are planning dedicated servers also contradicts the MMO player number idea. Who is going to hire a server farm to run this? And if they are planning to make it scalable, then the required tech becomes even more complex. So my guess: SC will not be MMO scale in player numbers.




    Actually SC look to me more like a bitcoin ... a better name should be starcoin : CR sold a dream, investors buy ships hoping to sell them to other players and after ... 7 years they still can't sell the original investment but they keep telling on forums that they are happy, pleased and everything works according to the plan.
    I played eve online for 3 years, i was part of big alliances wars, ganks, i made friends, tasted betrayal, quit for 1 year and i played for another year the quit again and started to play on another sandbox ... then when i read this mmorpg sc article, fans says that everything is ok and the game is developed according to the plan ...
    I have a feeling that most SC forum supporters here are business men, keeping "the dream real" - I don't believe that there is any gamer, with a healthy mind, that after 7 years of playing a demo can say is happy.
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 9,525
    edited March 11
    zerounu said:
    Actually SC look to me more like a bitcoin ... a better name should be starcoin : CR sold a dream, investors buy ships hoping to sell them to other players and after ... 7 years they still can't sell the original investment but they keep telling on forums that they are happy, pleased and everything works according to the plan.
    I played eve online for 3 years, i was part of big alliances wars, ganks, i made friends, tasted betrayal, quit for 1 year and i played for another year the quit again and started to play on another sandbox ... then when i read this mmorpg sc article, fans says that everything is ok and the game is developed according to the plan ...
    I have a feeling that most SC forum supporters here are business men, keeping "the dream real" - I don't believe that there is any gamer, with a healthy mind, that after 7 years of playing a demo can say is happy.
    I can only speak about myself - i have one account, one ship. I never sold a ship to anyone.

    Of all the dozens of people i know that play Star Citizen only one is selling ships or has been selling ships in the past. There are several players that have more ships than i have.

    There was (and to a smaller extend still is) a market for selling SC ships. In view of the hundredthousands of backers, i consider this a minuscule part of the community.

    What you call a "demo" i call an already living breathing Alpha version of a game with a dedicated, active community. As you can see in the many many fan made videos. You can believe whatever you want - that is your right. I for one AM happy with Star Citizen and look forward to play the full Star Citizen and Squadron 42.

    Coming back to the topic of this thread - you see in the quality of the characters in this game the constant improvements that are being made. It takes time. I personally am patiently waiting for the best possible quality. I have many other games to play until then. I plan to play SC for at least 10 years like I played Star Wars Galaxies - i personally can wait.


    Have fun

  • JoeBloberJoeBlober Member UncommonPosts: 190
    edited March 11





    ... ... 7 years they still can't sell the original investment but they keep telling on forums that they are happy, pleased and everything works according to the plan.

    I played eve online for 3 years, i was part of big alliances wars, ganks, i made friends, tasted betrayal, quit for 1 year and i played for another year the quit again and started to play on another sandbox ... then when i read this mmorpg sc article, fans says that everything is ok and the game is developed according to the plan ...

    I have a feeling that most SC forum supporters here are business men, keeping "the dream real" - I don't believe that there is any gamer, with a healthy mind, that after 7 years of playing a demo can say is happy.


    So first you don't understand how development of game is working. Publishers DON't release new game every 2 or 3 years because they are better than CIG... but because they have thousands of devs around the world, full up-to-date pipelines and engine, Billions $ of cash and no ambition beside re-skinning their past Triple-A.

    Second EVE is totally different of SC. It is free... and many don't play it because they do not like the gameplay. I am one of those many not playing a free MMO. You like it? good, just play it as much as you want no problem, meanwhile others space games are made: NMS, Hellion, SQ42+SC.

    Third your perception about people leaving comment about SC "I have a feeling that most SC forum supporters here are business men, keeping "the dream real" ".
    LOL. get back to point 1. The secret is hiding there.

    Backers do support this project because precisely they understand what is required to make two Triple-A starting from scratch.
    You still have the opportunity to get one of the many Publishers Triple-A around... already released and so much better than this project: Fallout 76... a disaster, Anthem... User score: 4.4 out of +3000. At the end the full Anthem experience will be available in few years after multiple DLC's... while SC cost 35/45$ and no subscription fees.

    +800.000 Backers decided they want to stop that crap. Result = SQ42 Beta in 5 quarters. By this time may be you will have 1 third of Anthem at x time the price of Star Citizen :)
    mmolou
  • KellerKeller Member UncommonPosts: 602
    Erillion said:
    Hatefull said:

    LMAO he IS speaking for himself. Reading comprehension FTW.

    So far the game looks great. Glad to see a developer actually trying to finish a game prior to releasing it.
    I concur.

    It seems to have become such an exception to the rule that a development team actually wants to FINISH a game before they launch it (even if it takes time), that this causes bewilderment in some people.


    Have fun
    wait what? Star Citizens is going to be finished at launch? That's not what Chris Roberts said when the kickstart campaign was launched.

    This is from an interview at The Mittani.com: (don't look at the given timeframe)

    Q: You have stated that you expect to have an Alpha up and going in about 12 months, with a beta roughly 10 months after that and then launch. For a game of this size and scope, do you think you can really be done in the next two years?

    CR: Really it is all about constant iteration from launch. The whole idea is to be constantly updating. It isn’t like the old days where you had to have everything and the kitchen sink in at launch because you weren’t going to come back to it for awhile. We’re already one year in - another two years puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale.


    So who do I need to believe CR who will give us a basic game at launch which will be expanded or @Erillion who tells us that we will get a finished game at launch?




  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 9,525
    Keller said:
    So who do I need to believe CR who will give us a basic game at launch which will be expanded or @Erillion who tells us that we will get a finished game at launch?


    Let me rephrase then that so its easier to understand for you. When i say "finish" i mean as bug free as possible, as technically mature as possible, with all major game systems implemented and working, with server meshing and network code working.

    Every multiplayer game is constantly evolving. Star Citizen will not be an exception. EVE Online is evolving (i play it since 2004). Star Wars Galaxies has evolved over 10 years (sometimes drastically). Elite Dangerous is evolving. Even World of Warcraft is still evolving. When i say "finished" i do NOT mean that no developer will ever touch the code anymore.

    Will there be all 100 star systems ready for play in the game at launch? Maybe not. Personally i guess they will launch with fewer open systems, to let the backers play sooner. But that is just additional locations in a universe that already has more planetary surface now than i could visit in my lifetime.

    You - and everyone else - can believe anyone they want to believe.

    Me - i just enjoy playing Star Citizen.


    Have fun


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