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Ashes 101 - Is it true Ashes is a BR Game now?

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  • jahlonjahlon Member UncommonPosts: 383
    Tiamat64 said:
    Kyleran said:
    I always thought it was you were supposed to be innocent until proven guilty .heaven forbid i ever end up in court with a jury from this site 
    In a court of law, perhaps, but in the court of public opinion,  not so much.
    Yea, the overly trusting mentality that leads people to think "innocent until proven guilty" applies outside of courts is a big part of how these kickstarter crowdfunded MMOs suckered so many people in the first place.

    I sort of agree with you on that.

    I think that any game that goes to Kickstarter needs to be able to provide at the very least a playable demo.   

    Between the Stars did it right (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1393754749/between-the-stars) .   They had a playable demo before they ever went to kickstarter.

    Other games I'm following are doing the same.

    I think there is something wrong with people who keep jumping on kickstarters.   That shifts the risk from the company to the public.   

    If a company thinks they can put together a good game, let them do a demo, and then ask for money to make it better. 



    KyleranMadFrenchie
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    CoE had a combat demo.  Turns out it was utter crap that had nothing to do with the game.  So I’m not sure a demo solves any problems.  
    Kylerantweedledumb99

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • VutarVutar Member UncommonPosts: 920
    As a side note, I wonder why it is that PvP is dominating so many of these new "MMORPGs" when it has been clear for years that most want PvE. I think Pantheon is going to win the battle of kickstarter MMORPGs if for no other reason than they seem to be the only game targeting the group that is "starving" for an MMORPG. 
  • jahlonjahlon Member UncommonPosts: 383
    Vutar said:
    As a side note, I wonder why it is that PvP is dominating so many of these new "MMORPGs" when it has been clear for years that most want PvE. I think Pantheon is going to win the battle of kickstarter MMORPGs if for no other reason than they seem to be the only game targeting the group that is "starving" for an MMORPG. 

    I wouldn't say most want PvE

    And Pantheon cannot win the battle of kickstarted MMORPGs.   

    Pantheon's Kickstarter failed https://www.polygon.com/2014/2/22/5437134/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen-fails-to-meet-kickstarter-goal



    ArteriusKumapon
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    jahlon said:
    Vutar said:
    As a side note, I wonder why it is that PvP is dominating so many of these new "MMORPGs" when it has been clear for years that most want PvE. I think Pantheon is going to win the battle of kickstarter MMORPGs if for no other reason than they seem to be the only game targeting the group that is "starving" for an MMORPG. 

    I wouldn't say most want PvE

    And Pantheon cannot win the battle of kickstarted MMORPGs.   

    Pantheon's Kickstarter failed https://www.polygon.com/2014/2/22/5437134/pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen-fails-to-meet-kickstarter-goal



    Ouch

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • jahlonjahlon Member UncommonPosts: 383




    Pantheon kickstarter failed because of Brad and what happened with VG.  Nothing to do with the want or not for PVE.

    At least you know what you get with Brad whereas Steven is a used car salesman

    I'm all all down for the Bill of Rights, totally cool with Civil Liberties, and I 100% support the Freedom of Speech.

    The problem is, I'm really against ignorance, and when people make statements like "Steven is a used care salesman" I get offended.  Not, because you are making fun of the guy, make fun of him all the hell you want.

    But, if you are calling him a Used Car Salesman, I really hope you are rolling with more than $30,000,000 in your bank account and living in more than a $10,000,000 home because otherwise it comes off as petty jealousy that you can't live that life.


    Make fun of him if you feel the need to because his company runs like a clown car at present.
    Trash him because they fucked up their database migration and can't get it fixed in a timely manner.
    Laugh that their first game the BR is a total dumpster fire

    But FFS, if you want to throw shade on someone make it relevant and you know, actually insulting.

    Calling someone a used car salesman isn't even an insult anymore, i mean "oh no, someone has a job selling stuff to stupid people"  

    Might as well call them a Cell Phone Salesman, or a Internet Service Provider salesperson, or pretty much a sales person cause they all are shady as fuck.  
    tweedledumb99
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    Ehh.

    I think Used Car Salesman got the point across just fine.  The amount of money someone has in the bank is irrelevant.  It just means they were successful.  There are successful used car salesmen.  Owners of used car companies make millions each year.

    But I knew what the poster meant when he used the term so I guess it served its purpose.
    KyleranGdemami

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    Should respect for one be solely judged on one's success?  Regardless of the means used to achieve that end?

    Americans, at least ideologically, generally tend to think it should not.

    image
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,493
    edited February 2019
    jahlon said:




    Pantheon kickstarter failed because of Brad and what happened with VG.  Nothing to do with the want or not for PVE.

    At least you know what you get with Brad whereas Steven is a used car salesman



    But, if you are calling him a Used Car Salesman, I really hope you are rolling with more than $30,000,000 in your bank account and living in more than a $10,000,000 home because otherwise it comes off as petty jealousy that you can't live that life.  
    I know you keep up on this game more than most, do you happen to have links to any source which definitively confirms the first figure? ($30M)

    It is often repeated but what I've read previously were statements by Steven stating he had "access" to that level of funding, not that it was personally his or even "in the bank."

    Their recent actions to release a BR and some other things have lead me to doubt he really has this money.


    mmolou

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    Right on these MMORPG forums a few days ago I asked Steven to confirm that $30M budget was funded.  Surprise... he disappeared again.

    Kylerantweedledumb99[Deleted User]

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • tweedledumb99tweedledumb99 Member UncommonPosts: 290
    Right on these MMORPG forums a few days ago I asked Steven to confirm that $30M budget was funded.  Surprise... he disappeared again.

    I mean, it seemed like he just dropped by to say a quick thing, it's not like he was answering other people's questions and skipped yours, did he?
  • tweedledumb99tweedledumb99 Member UncommonPosts: 290
    jahlon said:




    Pantheon kickstarter failed because of Brad and what happened with VG.  Nothing to do with the want or not for PVE.

    At least you know what you get with Brad whereas Steven is a used car salesman

    I'm all all down for the Bill of Rights, totally cool with Civil Liberties, and I 100% support the Freedom of Speech.

    The problem is, I'm really against ignorance, and when people make statements like "Steven is a used care salesman" I get offended.  Not, because you are making fun of the guy, make fun of him all the hell you want.

    But, if you are calling him a Used Car Salesman, I really hope you are rolling with more than $30,000,000 in your bank account and living in more than a $10,000,000 home because otherwise it comes off as petty jealousy that you can't live that life.


    Make fun of him if you feel the need to because his company runs like a clown car at present.
    Trash him because they fucked up their database migration and can't get it fixed in a timely manner.
    Laugh that their first game the BR is a total dumpster fire

    But FFS, if you want to throw shade on someone make it relevant and you know, actually insulting.

    Calling someone a used car salesman isn't even an insult anymore, i mean "oh no, someone has a job selling stuff to stupid people"  

    Might as well call them a Cell Phone Salesman, or a Internet Service Provider salesperson, or pretty much a sales person cause they all are shady as fuck.  
    I know you like to sniff his ass and all but not jealous.  He is a guy who is full of shit.  Is that a clearer response for you?

    And you get offended over that seriously?  I did not know he had a house that size wow I respect him so much more now.  And I guess you have access to his bank account so I am sure you can pin down that number with facts.  Can you provide some pictures of the kitchen and bathroom from the house as well since you have been?  Those sell houses after all.
    Nah gonna agree with Jahlon here - Jahlon pointed out lots to criticize Steven over, but pointed out that it's silly to criticize him for his past role, and Jahlon's right about that.
  • psiicpsiic Member RarePosts: 1,635
    Rofl made a BR for pvp testing my ass, a BR game is a significant investment of time and money and you do not make one to test pvp, you make one to market and shovel the dough into your pockets. 
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,493
    edited February 2019
    psiic said:
    Rofl made a BR for pvp testing my ass, a BR game is a significant investment of time and money and you do not make one to test pvp, you make one to market and shovel the dough into your pockets. 
    Though I can't find it, I recall reading a transcript by Steven where he admitted the decision to release a BR as it's own game was to cover cost overruns which resulted from unplanned "player requested" test cycles back in 2018.

    Was to test combat performance or something like that.

    With access to $30M plus to build the core game its surprising they are concerned about minor schedule overruns, but perhaps they are just being forward thinking and striking while BRs are so hot.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • jahlonjahlon Member UncommonPosts: 383
    Kyleran said:
    psiic said:
    Rofl made a BR for pvp testing my ass, a BR game is a significant investment of time and money and you do not make one to test pvp, you make one to market and shovel the dough into your pockets. 
    Though I can't find it, I recall reading a transcript by Steven where he admitted the decision to release a BR as it's own game was to cover cost overruns which resulted from unplanned "player requested" test cycles back in 2018.

    Was to test combat performance or something like that.

    With access to $30M plus to build the core game its surprising they are concerned about minor schedule overruns, but perhaps they are just being forward thinking and striking while BRs are so hot.
    Its that $30,000,000 figure vs the overmonetizing thing that is hard to balance.

    As far as the BR as its own game, I got something in an interview, that their decision to make it open to everyone was the reason they decided to monetize it.  ( https://www.paradoxgaming.net/the-steven-answer )

    But, after that they took the BR back down, then it was testing "each" weekend, then it was testing "some" weekends, now we just don't have testing.

    Never saw a statement that it was due to cost overruns.  That is interesting.  



  • AngreeegamerAngreeegamer Member UncommonPosts: 51
    edited March 2019
    jahlon said:
    They took the BR back down, then it was testing "each" weekend, then it was testing "some" weekends, now we just don't have testing.

    Intrepid gives us BR - people shit on Intrepid and demand they cancel the BR. Intrepid takes away BR - people shit on intrepid for not letting them test the BR.

    Personally I hope Intrepid spites every single whinging entitled asshole with too much time on there hands in this upcoming letter. I hope they announce that they are denying access to the BR, the Siege mode, the Horde mode, and the MMO Alpha and Beta's until launch day. Just refund all the Pre-Order packs and lock you all out in the cold for good until you learn some perspective, manners and patience.

    God I would get such a kick out of watching you all collectively lose your shit.
    Slapshot1188IselinMadFrenchie
  • ArteriusArterius Member EpicPosts: 2,847
    jahlon said:
    They took the BR back down, then it was testing "each" weekend, then it was testing "some" weekends, now we just don't have testing.

    Intrepid gives us BR - people shit on Intrepid and demand they cancel the BR. Intrepid takes away BR - people shit on intrepid for not letting them test the BR.

    Personally I hope Intrepid spites every single whinging entitled asshole with too much time on there hands in this upcoming letter. I hope they announce that they are denying access to the BR, the Siege mode, the Horde mode, and the MMO Alpha and Beta's until launch day. Just refund all the Pre-Order packs and lock you all out in the cold for good until you learn some perspective, manners and patience.

    God I would get such a kick out of watching you all collectively lose your shit.
    Honestly I think most people this site would respect them more if they did that. Its not like you said for them to cancel the alpha and beta without giving people back there money. After the BR mode was announced I did a cashback and got my money back. I at least would respect them way more if they said we are going dark until the game is released, sorry, here is your money back and see you at launch.
    Gdemami
    Currently playing: Outer Worlds (Xbox One X)

    Currently Reading: Skaven Slayer (Gotrek and Felix Book 2)

    Currently Writing: Champions of Legend Book 1 (3rd Draft)

    Currently Watching: Oz (Season 4), Soprano's (Season 1)


  • AngreeegamerAngreeegamer Member UncommonPosts: 51
    That's pretty sad that people respect games that are close to silent and just put out one over-hyped gameplay trailer a week before launch (games like *cough* Atlas) over a game they get to have full transparent access to. Nothing beats getting instant player feedback when devs can still drastically change things viewed as massive flaws. Like imagine if Intrepid was close development, never showed us their combat before launch, and then as a result they launched with ultra polished PAX demo combat - aka a polished turd? Too late, oh well.
    Slapshot1188
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,528
    edited March 2019
    jahlon said:
    They took the BR back down, then it was testing "each" weekend, then it was testing "some" weekends, now we just don't have testing.

    Intrepid gives us BR - people shit on Intrepid and demand they cancel the BR. Intrepid takes away BR - people shit on intrepid for not letting them test the BR.

    Personally I hope Intrepid spites every single whinging entitled asshole with too much time on there hands in this upcoming letter. I hope they announce that they are denying access to the BR, the Siege mode, the Horde mode, and the MMO Alpha and Beta's until launch day. Just refund all the Pre-Order packs and lock you all out in the cold for good until you learn some perspective, manners and patience.

    God I would get such a kick out of watching you all collectively lose your shit.
    I could only speak for myself where I think the anger in people is coming from.

    From my perspective:
    I'm starving for a new mmorpg.  I'm mainly a PvE player "I think most of us are".  But PvP games have been dominating lately, Battle Royal have been too.  

    I understand Ashes of Creation is both a PvP and PvE game.  I don't think Intrepid intentionally tried to trick or fool us but their first few videos were PvE content.... The PvE players got excited !!!!..... Then BR was introduces and reality set in.  The PvE players being the majority feel let down.  Battle Royal games are popular, BUT were looking for an mmorpg.

    This may sound stupid, but I think it was an "unintentional trick of the mind" on people. 

    I for one assumed with Everquest developers, it would be PvE.  I built in my mind PvE, I didn't read the fine print.


    Angreeegamer 
    PvP type are asking...What's the problem ?... But the PvE player feels let down by the unintentional shift of what they were expecting. 
    Post edited by delete5230 on
  • ArteriusArterius Member EpicPosts: 2,847
    That's pretty sad that people respect games that are close to silent and just put out one over-hyped gameplay trailer a week before launch (games like *cough* Atlas) over a game they get to have full transparent access to. Nothing beats getting instant player feedback when devs can still drastically change things viewed as massive flaws. Like imagine if Intrepid was close development, never showed us their combat before launch, and then as a result they launched with ultra polished PAX demo combat - aka a polished turd? Too late, oh well.
    I don't know what world your living in but only Kickstarted MMO's and games are made this way or indie studios who need to go into Early Access to stay afloat. There is nothing different from Ashes. Also who says they have to listen to feedback. For instance you can say that "X" is terrible and they can say they are changing "X." However, they play there own games. They might have been already going to change that certain thing and now you and the rest of the backers feel like they listened to you.

    I think this way for all games that allow early access. Even games that I have personally backed and look forward to. I am sure they will listen to our feedback somewhat but if you think they are really going to listen and change a core concept of there game if it is not working then I have a nice seaside house i would like to sell you. It comes with three bedrooms.
    Currently playing: Outer Worlds (Xbox One X)

    Currently Reading: Skaven Slayer (Gotrek and Felix Book 2)

    Currently Writing: Champions of Legend Book 1 (3rd Draft)

    Currently Watching: Oz (Season 4), Soprano's (Season 1)


  • AngreeegamerAngreeegamer Member UncommonPosts: 51
    I could only speak for myself where I think the anger in people is coming from.

    From my perspective:
    I'm starving for a new mmorpg.  I'm mainly a PvE player "I think most of us are".  But PvP games have been dominating lately, Battle Royal have been too.  

    I understand Ashes of Creation is both a PvP and PvE game.  I don't think Intrepid intentionally tried to trick or fool us but their first few videos were PvE content.... The PvE players got excited !!!!..... Then BR was introduces and reality set in.  The PvE players being the majority feel let down.  Battle Royal games are popular, BUT were looking for an mmorpg.

    This may sound stupid, but I think it was an "unintentional trick of the mind" on people. 

    I for one assumed with Everquest developers, it would be PvE.  I built in my mind PvE, I didn't read the fine print.


    Angreeegamer 
    PvP type are asking...What's the problem ?... But the PvE player feels let down by the unintentional shift of what they were expecting. 

    That's an interesting perspective. I guess I view this whole situation as Intrepid has a checklist of content they need to make to please everyone and meet all their advertised design choices that have been public since 2017. We've already seen them dedicate pretty much a year to nothing but PvE mechanic foundations with placeholder tab target combat. Now we're seeing them shift to PvP and action combat which is also on that list. Both tab and action, PvP and PvE are still going to be apart of the end product so why would the order they are tested in cause you to feel tricked?

    I mean the world is meant to be dynamic and constantly changing which means it needs to be driven by PvP and conflict to spawn new PvE content that doesn't feel predictable and stale.

     @Arterius

    I mean despite your feelings for other games and the pre-bias its caused, Intrepid are clearly listening to feedback within reason. They're not asking players to be designers with insane scope creep features. They're asking players to work with what they give them - what they laid out for us since the very beginning - and tell them how to improve it and change it while still delivering that specific feature.

    You can just look at this recent mess to see how this played out. Intrepid brought an early demo to PAX and let players see and test it. Intrepid got feedback on how to change and improve an aspect of that demo that players seem to be focused on (combat) and they did just that. They've severely deviated from their original testing schedule to put certain aspects in the front since there was such major player feedback and demand to do so.

    Despite people taking the piss out of the game mode, since the combat update and server architecture tests we've seen far less complaints and concerns surrounding those two aspects of the game. Shockingly now people seem to want to see more of what Intrepid was doing in the first place. Only now the community went from chill to a horde of Veruca Salt's screaming "I WANT IT NOW or it doesn't exist!"
    delete5230
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,493
    edited March 2019
    I could only speak for myself where I think the anger in people is coming from.

    From my perspective:
    I'm starving for a new mmorpg.  I'm mainly a PvE player "I think most of us are".  But PvP games have been dominating lately, Battle Royal have been too.  

    I understand Ashes of Creation is both a PvP and PvE game.  I don't think Intrepid intentionally tried to trick or fool us but their first few videos were PvE content.... The PvE players got excited !!!!..... Then BR was introduces and reality set in.  The PvE players being the majority feel let down.  Battle Royal games are popular, BUT were looking for an mmorpg.

    This may sound stupid, but I think it was an "unintentional trick of the mind" on people. 

    I for one assumed with Everquest developers, it would be PvE.  I built in my mind PvE, I didn't read the fine print.


    Angreeegamer 
    PvP type are asking...What's the problem ?... But the PvE player feels let down by the unintentional shift of what they were expecting. 

    That's an interesting perspective. I guess I view this whole situation as Intrepid has a checklist of content they need to make to please everyone and meet all their advertised design choices that have been public since 2017. We've already seen them dedicate pretty much a year to nothing but PvE mechanic foundations with placeholder tab target combat. Now we're seeing them shift to PvP and action combat which is also on that list. Both tab and action, PvP and PvE are still going to be apart of the end product so why would the order they are tested in cause you to feel tricked?

    I mean the world is meant to be dynamic and constantly changing which means it needs to be driven by PvP and conflict to spawn new PvE content that doesn't feel predictable and stale.

     @Arterius

    I mean despite your feelings for other games and the pre-bias its caused, Intrepid are clearly listening to feedback within reason. They're not asking players to be designers with insane scope creep features. They're asking players to work with what they give them - what they laid out for us since the very beginning - and tell them how to improve it and change it while still delivering that specific feature.

    You can just look at this recent mess to see how this played out. Intrepid brought an early demo to PAX and let players see and test it. Intrepid got feedback on how to change and improve an aspect of that demo that players seem to be focused on (combat) and they did just that. They've severely deviated from their original testing schedule to put certain aspects in the front since there was such major player feedback and demand to do so.

    Despite people taking the piss out of the game mode, since the combat update and server architecture tests we've seen far less complaints and concerns surrounding those two aspects of the game. Shockingly now people seem to want to see more of what Intrepid was doing in the first place. Only now the community went from chill to a horde of Veruca Salt's screaming "I WANT IT NOW or it doesn't exist!"
    They made their own bed from the moment they announced this "testing only" BR mode and their mishandling of it to date has lead to the current player angst.

    Remember, "launch" of Ashes the MMORPG (AtM) is due by years end and I doubt anyone believes that's possible.

    Ashes Battle Royal (ABR) was supposed to go live in February right?  Today is March 1st, and I'm not sure they published a single update last month on it besides, oh, we f'd up and have to rework a bunch of stuff, including our forums.
    Post edited by Kyleran on
    Gdemami

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    Kyleran said:
    I could only speak for myself where I think the anger in people is coming from.

    From my perspective:
    I'm starving for a new mmorpg.  I'm mainly a PvE player "I think most of us are".  But PvP games have been dominating lately, Battle Royal have been too.  

    I understand Ashes of Creation is both a PvP and PvE game.  I don't think Intrepid intentionally tried to trick or fool us but their first few videos were PvE content.... The PvE players got excited !!!!..... Then BR was introduces and reality set in.  The PvE players being the majority feel let down.  Battle Royal games are popular, BUT were looking for an mmorpg.

    This may sound stupid, but I think it was an "unintentional trick of the mind" on people. 

    I for one assumed with Everquest developers, it would be PvE.  I built in my mind PvE, I didn't read the fine print.


    Angreeegamer 
    PvP type are asking...What's the problem ?... But the PvE player feels let down by the unintentional shift of what they were expecting. 

    That's an interesting perspective. I guess I view this whole situation as Intrepid has a checklist of content they need to make to please everyone and meet all their advertised design choices that have been public since 2017. We've already seen them dedicate pretty much a year to nothing but PvE mechanic foundations with placeholder tab target combat. Now we're seeing them shift to PvP and action combat which is also on that list. Both tab and action, PvP and PvE are still going to be apart of the end product so why would the order they are tested in cause you to feel tricked?

    I mean the world is meant to be dynamic and constantly changing which means it needs to be driven by PvP and conflict to spawn new PvE content that doesn't feel predictable and stale.

     @Arterius

    I mean despite your feelings for other games and the pre-bias its caused, Intrepid are clearly listening to feedback within reason. They're not asking players to be designers with insane scope creep features. They're asking players to work with what they give them - what they laid out for us since the very beginning - and tell them how to improve it and change it while still delivering that specific feature.

    You can just look at this recent mess to see how this played out. Intrepid brought an early demo to PAX and let players see and test it. Intrepid got feedback on how to change and improve an aspect of that demo that players seem to be focused on (combat) and they did just that. They've severely deviated from their original testing schedule to put certain aspects in the front since there was such major player feedback and demand to do so.

    Despite people taking the piss out of the game mode, since the combat update and server architecture tests we've seen far less complaints and concerns surrounding those two aspects of the game. Shockingly now people seem to want to see more of what Intrepid was doing in the first place. Only now the community went from chill to a horde of Veruca Salt's screaming "I WANT IT NOW or it doesn't exist!"
    They made their own bed from the moment they announced this "testing only" BR mode and their mishandling of it to date has lead to the current player angst.

    Remember, "launch" of Ashes the MMORPG (AoM) is due by years end and I doubt anyone believes that's possible.

    Ashes Battle Royal (ABR) was supposed to go live in February right?  Today is March 1st, and I'm not sure they published a single update last month on it besides, oh, we f'd up and have to rework a bunch of stuff, including our forums.
    Love love how all these Crowdfunded games claim they are doing stupid shit because it was demanded by the players.   Yeah... I’d love to see the groundswell of backers who demanded that they create a stand alone BattleRoyale game with its own cash shop.
    [Deleted User]Gdemami

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

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  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,493
    edited March 2019




    They've severely deviated from their original testing schedule to put certain aspects in the front since there was such major player feedback and demand to do so.


    I wanted to focus on this point, glad to see I'm not the only person who remembered the comments about testing schedule delays.

    I'm sure I read a write up at years end where Steven said a big driver behind the decision to market and monetize the BR was to help cover the unplanned cost this off cycle testing added to to the project. 

    Wish I could find that conversation, but it might have been in one of their Q & A sessions locked behind their downed forums.

    I bring this up as I never believed their claims that little or none of the AtM funding was used to stand up and ready Apocalypse, and I know they are trying to spin all of the new rework as being a benefit to AtM. 

    As I see things, they not only aren't getting any revenue benefit from ABR, they continue to divert resources from AtM to it, delaying the MMORPG version further.
    Gdemami

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    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

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  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 12,296
    Kyleran said:




    a

    They've severely deviated from their original testing schedule to put certain aspects in the front since there was such major player feedback and demand to do so.


    I wanted to focus on this point, glad to see I'm not the only person who remembered the comments about testing schedule delays.

    I'm sure I read a write up at years end where Steven said a big driver behind the decision to market and monetize the BR was to help cover the unplanned cost this off cycle testing added to to the project. 

    Wish I could find that conversation, but it might have been in one of their Q & A sessions locked behind their downed forums.
    He did say that.

    It didn't make any sense then and it doesn't make any sense now.  Unless of course, you question whether or not he actually has the $30M in funding secured...

    Anytime someone tells you they are going to make a different "stand alone" game to support the other game they are working on... it should make your Spidey-Senses tingle.

    KyleranGdemami

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

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