Glad to see my post held true except that people just added a ton more useless drivel to try and make it seem like they knew what they were talking about
Cmon man you can't be that daft, even my kid got it lol
Why do you think cinematics are shown years before the games come out?
You're the daft one trying to act like your home video analogy made any sense. Yet again, you exaggerate to the point of uselessness in your crusade to refute any and all negative observations about your pet project.
Your post was nonsense.
Sorry but I couldn't make it any simpler even if I tried. The point flew right over you, again.
At least I tried I guess, that's more than what you contributed tbh.
You could try and answer the question for the sake of the discussion.
Why do you think cinematic traillers are showcased years before the games are released?
You remeber remeber the first Cyberpunk trailer?
Oh and to put The Witcher 3 production into account you have to understand that it's a culmination of years and years of iteration back from its early versions.
Check how long how long it took witcher 1, then witcher 2 and then 3. Why do you think the early ones took so much longert than the later one when they are clearly so inferior? Engine development, tools, manpower...
Dude, no one cares about what came first, the cinematic or the engine build. You tried to make a shitty analogy in your overzealous crusade to defend your precious, a campaign which has rendered your entire account here a laughable addition to the community that does nothing but bait and troll.
Stick to sharing videos and photos.
You ignore parts of everyone else's points you can't easily refute with bullshit trolling techniques. Period. And your shtick is old as hell.
You dont care and it shows lol, that's fine, it's not for everyone.
People that like game development like knowing and discussing about it to learn uppon their interests. It's only normal.
My analogy was spot on for anyone with a clue, infants included.
Making movies is way easyer and faster than games because you have less dynamic factors to take into account. Different Different mediums of entertainement.
You might be feisty or even angry that @babuinix keeps exposing ignorance and misconceptions about star citizen and game dev in general but you cant say I've ever been wrong
Deal with it as you like but dont ever try to shut me down like you own the place, specially when you dd nothing to the discussion, again.
You exposed no ignorance or misconceptions in our exchange except your own.
I can just about guarantee you it took that long because they shelved it so they could milk and monetize every penny out of GTA V. Why compete against yourself if you dont have to?
I don't need your garantee because I know and talk wth friend who been working in Rockstar for many years now xD
They are given the freedom to take their time until the release date is announced what comparing to the entire dev timeframe is shortly before release, the profit prospects of the IPs as GTA are colossus on their own so they don't feel the need to pressure the studios with tight budgets.
ahh the famous I"I know a guy who knows a guy' response.
I thought you had given up on this pig (no pun intended) and were now white knighting the latest failure...Atlas.
LOL noone knows how its getting made, even the people making it, thats why its only about 20% 'done'. And even what they have is stuff that has existed for 20 years. So much for being the genre changing generation defining game.
But I am getting caught up again no way in hell anything ever comes of it. We all know that now. you cant piss through 200 million+ with what they have and realistically expect it will ever release beyond what they have now. They MIGHT get some partially finished crap and slap an SQ 42 title on it, but it surtely wont be anything to be proud of thats for sure. but whatever they can put out to maybe make enough to pay back some of the 46 million they borrowed. But even then I am not sure that will ever happen. Like I said its one of those wink and a nod type deals.
But I can also not underestimate the stupidity of people still throwing money at this train wreck. But as we have seen no matter how much money gets thrown at it the results are laughably modest.
But I can also not underestimate the stupidity of people still throwing money at this train wreck. But as we have seen no matter how much money gets thrown at it the results are laughably modest.
If the only thing important to CIG is money, then it's a good thing they stopped giving refunds. Didn't that report say they blew through all but $14M? Refunds would put them out of business.
They are not even gaining new backers in a meaningful rate any more. Most backers already moved on.
Which means it's the same core group throwing money at this game. If I was in the tank for a ton of cash, I'd be rabid too.
The remaining backers need the game to succeed. It's the only way to justify spending so much money on a tech demo/art project.
But good for CIG for the money they get out of people. Seriously. If I could scatter my offices around the world and could afford New York lawyers, I'd do it too. lol, why not?
Cmon man you can't be that daft, even my kid got it lol
Why do you think cinematics are shown years before the games come out?
You're the daft one trying to act like your home video analogy made any sense. Yet again, you exaggerate to the point of uselessness in your crusade to refute any and all negative observations about your pet project.
Your post was nonsense.
Sorry but I couldn't make it any simpler even if I tried. The point flew right over you, again.
At least I tried I guess, that's more than what you contributed tbh.
You could try and answer the question for the sake of the discussion.
Why do you think cinematic traillers are showcased years before the games are released?
You remeber remeber the first Cyberpunk trailer?
Oh and to put The Witcher 3 production into account you have to understand that it's a culmination of years and years of iteration back from its early versions.
Check how long how long it took witcher 1, then witcher 2 and then 3. Why do you think the early ones took so much longert than the later one when they are clearly so inferior? Engine development, tools, manpower...
Dude, no one cares about what came first, the cinematic or the engine build. You tried to make a shitty analogy in your overzealous crusade to defend your precious, a campaign which has rendered your entire account here a laughable addition to the community that does nothing but bait and troll.
Stick to sharing videos and photos.
You ignore parts of everyone else's points you can't easily refute with bullshit trolling techniques. Period. And your shtick is old as hell.
You dont care and it shows lol, that's fine, it's not for everyone.
People that like game development like knowing and discussing about it to learn uppon their interests. It's only normal.
My analogy was spot on for anyone with a clue, infants included.
Making movies is way easyer and faster than games because you have less dynamic factors to take into account. Different Different mediums of entertainement.
You might be feisty or even angry that @babuinix keeps exposing ignorance and misconceptions about star citizen and game dev in general but you cant say I've ever been wrong
Deal with it as you like but dont ever try to shut me down like you own the place, specially when you dd nothing to the discussion, again.
I agree. An infant would believe that you can shoot Star Wars on your iPhone. Glad you found someone that will accept that crazy analogy.
Have fun!
I choose a basic comparison because I tought it would be easy to follow since it worked with infants but I guess I negleted the lvl of understanding people who dedicate their life forum posting can get lol
Guess when you struggle with simple quotation everything else might seem like climbing the everest.
Happy New Year Everyone, 2019 will surely bring more millions, amazing updates and new players !
Rinse & Repeat
IMHO it would take a child’s naivety to believe much of what you post. So I guess Touche....
Have Fun
Happy New Year!
See you in 2019
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Gotta love star citizen posts. Always the faithful "SEE ITS DOING FINE GUYS" followed by the "THERE IS NO GAME THO", and vice versa.
Game is already worth $60 in entertainment, thanks to the forums.
Yup.
This year was the best year for SC yet, both on the state of the game on updates released and also the most successful crowdfunding year to date.
The doomsayers have their work cut out for them as this further develops, as someone wise once said: "the dogs bark as the caravan passes by".
And so we go on into 2019 now don't we xD
And then 2020, and then 2021, and then 2022, and then 2023, and then 2024, etc. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe the game will fail to release, they haven't run out of money as the doomsayers predicted, nor has Chris Roberts exploded, I'm just skeptical of just how long their vision is going to take. Even the most loyal fan has their limits.
Totally agree. I really want to play SQ42...I could probably just watch the cut scenes and be happy, but some of the posters actually make part of me want to see the game fail...
Its a weird place that is kind of unique in gaming for me.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
And then 2020, and then 2021, and then 2022, and then 2023, and then 2024, etc. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe the game will fail to release, they haven't run out of money as the doomsayers predicted, nor has Chris Roberts exploded, I'm just skeptical of just how long their vision is going to take. Even the most loyal fan has their limits.
The vision will take long after the game itself has been released, as it's already admitted to, but either way, still a lot to release until a base game.
but some of the posters actually make part of me want to see the game fail...
lmao see that times we've saw some saying SC will be the best game ever created in history that will rule everyone else is just the same feeling mirrored version, it's all said and meant just to spite other random people on the internet (most times I see that anyway), reminds me of a sw scene lol
The biggest factor in how long something takes to make is - usually - how many people are working on the task. Not just at the end but throughout the life of a project.
In general though the biggest factor it how long is how many people; which often comes down to budget / money.
Not really...
Otherwise, RDR2 would be have done ASAP and not in 8 years.
The biggest factor in how long it takes is the development needs, if you go with a custom engine that will be most time and most expensive option, if you just build your game over one existing engine you can do it quickly enough.
This is how you can have one game like Assassin's Creed IP literally every year, but you don't get one GTA or one Read Dead Redemption every year because they tend to develop a custom engine with new core technology jump on each new title.
While more people do mean more resources, it all comes down to development needs that determine the time, and the budget with it.
No really.
Doesn't just apply to software projects either could just as easily be building an extension to your house.
Now the tools that are available - or not - can greatly speed up a project. With the right tools for the job things go quicker. Which is partly why you have to compare apples with apples and not oranges. Not always easy though.
As for RDR2 (and GTA):
RDR2 was not built on a custom engine but on an in-house engine called RAGE. Rockstar have used RAGE for all their games since 2006. Like EA's Frostbite engine and UbiSoft's Anvil & Snowdrop engines the RAGE engine has been built upon, added to over time and its name has been tweaked.
Rockstar announced RDR2 in 2016.
At that point all Rockstar's studios went to work on the title. All studios so nominally 2,000+ employees. (Working - primarily - on one game at a time bugs investors as well who have complained about the uneven revenue flow it creates for years).
So did RDR2 take just 2 years to develop?
I assume there will have been a small project team. They will have developed outlines, concepts and plans. Lots of plans: how many people needed; how long for; schedules; how much money would it tie up; what tasks should be done first; any RAGE updates needed and so on.
And they might have worked on plans for RDR2, then gone and worked on some GTA plans, then returned and updated the RDR2 plans. Iterative process. Until the go-ahead was given. So ... 2 years full steam ahead + some unknown low resource lead time.
And they won;t simply have gone from a small team to an all studio potential 2,000+ employees; they will have gone through the gears so to speak. In big picture terms though they threw the switch and the game happened.
Now if you try to compare the development of RAGE or Frostbite or Anvil / Snowdrop with what RSI is doing: tricky.
Here is an example though - for fun!
In 2004 EA bought the company whose game engine Rockstar has been using. Rockstar start work on a new engine. One comparison would be to fast forward 6 years to 2010 and compare what RSI have done with what Rockstar did: By 2010 Rockstar had developed a new engine (RAGE) and the games: Table Tennis, GTA IV, Midnight Club, two GTA IV follow ups, RDR and an RDR follow up. All these games on a new engine remember so in the case of GTA not simply a rehash of GTS 3.
Its a comparison. Is it fair?
Well whilst it covers the development of a new engine Rockstar in 2004 was an established, funded company - which RSI was not back in 2012. Good points, well argued I would agree. So maybe compare what RSI did from 2014? So 4 years:
By 2008 Rockstar had produced RAGE, Table Tennis, GTA IV and Midnight Club.
More than RSI achieved from 2014 to 2018? It did include - note - the creation of a new engine.
I would suggest the comparison looks somewhat skewed towards Rockstar because they had (and have) a much bigger team of people. Hence really.
Gotta love star citizen posts. Always the faithful "SEE ITS DOING FINE GUYS" followed by the "THERE IS NO GAME THO", and vice versa.
Game is already worth $60 in entertainment, thanks to the forums.
Yup.
This year was the best year for SC yet, both on the state of the game on updates released and also the most successful crowdfunding year to date.
The doomsayers have their work cut out for them as this further develops, as someone wise once said: "the dogs bark as the caravan passes by".
And so we go on into 2019 now won't we xD
LOL Like I said it isnt even speculation anymore, theyre out of money. I dont know how anyone who claims to have a single ounce of common sense could look at what they have and say 'yup thats totally worth 200 million and 6 years'. The fact the usual suspect in here dont have a single solitary cautionary word let alone critical one says it all.
Its ok to hope and dream. I would love to see Atlas (your latest crusade) become what they claim it was supposed to be. But I am a realist. I would also look at Atlas (which is MUCH MUCH MUCH further along than SC is and say its not worth 200 million and 6 years either.
Its not about hate or wanting something to fail its about accountability and some sort of responsibility. Bethesda and FO 76 I have been both critical and defensive on that project. But the biggest defense for them was they gave people 3 or 5 days of a free preview. Not everyone could play it but everyone could watch people play it and they could see that no matter WHO played it he game was the same buggy mess. Had Atlas done similar they MIGHT get some sort of concessions. but they didnt they had a small private server with a bunch of paid spokesmen run around with the very best stuff the game currently has. Similar to what they did last night.
These guys Roberts, Wildcard, and all the new kids trying to make a living off people with dreams ALL misrepresent what their finished products will be. Or in the case of WIldcard what the current state of their game theyre taking money for is in. And EA doesnt cut it anymore even with the double discount. I ALMOST bought it for the 25 bucks. But I know what its going to be shortly...empty. I suppose I could then play it as a solo game just to check out the features. But I have a library full of games I havent even opened that I bought simply because they were on sale.
Besides Atlas will be 19.99 or maybe even 14.99 long before it comes out and by then it will be better (simply because it has to be) and because the population will be low enough the engine will be able to handle it (except when it needs to the most).
SC will never come out. Not beyond whatever the PTU or Avocados have right now. Because they cant afford to put it out. They have to at this point be all in on SQ 42 and if they cant get a single player game to work on their engine in a workable state then no way they can get SC to work.
And while I say you cant underestimate stupidity or gullibility they have 3-5 more years before SQ 42 even sees the light of day. SO even with a skeleton crew ONLY working on that its still a 25 million a year project. Which as time goes by and no more tricks up their sleeve is going to be hard to pull off. Sure this year was supposedly a banner year (in terms of funding which is the ONLY thing these guys can do right and the biggest thing the fanbois focus on) but they didnt actually put anything anyone could actually play that was earth shattering.
Best year for SC, cant wait to play 3.5 and the new flight model. Really loving the game in its current state. SQ42 in a year or so will be dope too.
SQ42 in a year would be a miracle given how much they push back schedules. Think 2021 if you’re lucky, hope for sometime in 2022 for a game that will probably be mostly cutscenes and quick time events
I think i heard that tune before. 90 days ... TOPS !
Meanwhile ... Alpha 3.4 is out ;-)
>>> theyre out of money >>>
You have not read a single line from that article linked above by another poster, right ? Where the authors make an independent prediction about SC cash flow up to 2022.
Comments
I thought you had given up on this pig (no pun intended) and were now white knighting the latest failure...Atlas.
And I prefer to like the games I like instead of spending my time having a go at the ones I don't like!
It's not a shameful thing to admit.
Just dont pretend Star Citizen is the only in game development and everything will be alright
You wont be so many times wrong either
But I am getting caught up again no way in hell anything ever comes of it. We all know that now. you cant piss through 200 million+ with what they have and realistically expect it will ever release beyond what they have now. They MIGHT get some partially finished crap and slap an SQ 42 title on it, but it surtely wont be anything to be proud of thats for sure. but whatever they can put out to maybe make enough to pay back some of the 46 million they borrowed. But even then I am not sure that will ever happen. Like I said its one of those wink and a nod type deals.
But I can also not underestimate the stupidity of people still throwing money at this train wreck. But as we have seen no matter how much money gets thrown at it the results are laughably modest.
I already know what it is. But you will say "time will tell" and that's what we can agree with, for now.
Thank me later or say sorry doesnt realy matter.
They are not even gaining new backers in a meaningful rate any more. Most backers already moved on.
Which means it's the same core group throwing money at this game. If I was in the tank for a ton of cash, I'd be rabid too.
The remaining backers need the game to succeed. It's the only way to justify spending so much money on a tech demo/art project.
But good for CIG for the money they get out of people. Seriously. If I could scatter my offices around the world and could afford New York lawyers, I'd do it too. lol, why not?
Have Fun
Happy New Year!
See you in 2019
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Game is already worth $60 in entertainment, thanks to the forums.
This year was the best year for SC yet, both on the state of the game on updates released and also the most successful crowdfunding year to date.
The doomsayers have their work cut out for them as this further develops, as someone wise once said: "the dogs bark as the caravan passes by".
And so we go on into 2019 now won't we xD
Its a weird place that is kind of unique in gaming for me.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
lmao see that times we've saw some saying SC will be the best game ever created in history that will rule everyone else is just the same feeling mirrored version, it's all said and meant just to spite other random people on the internet (most times I see that anyway), reminds me of a sw scene lol
Doesn't just apply to software projects either could just as easily be building an extension to your house.
Now the tools that are available - or not - can greatly speed up a project. With the right tools for the job things go quicker. Which is partly why you have to compare apples with apples and not oranges. Not always easy though.
As for RDR2 (and GTA):
RDR2 was not built on a custom engine but on an in-house engine called RAGE. Rockstar have used RAGE for all their games since 2006. Like EA's Frostbite engine and UbiSoft's Anvil & Snowdrop engines the RAGE engine has been built upon, added to over time and its name has been tweaked.
Rockstar announced RDR2 in 2016.
At that point all Rockstar's studios went to work on the title. All studios so nominally 2,000+ employees. (Working - primarily - on one game at a time bugs investors as well who have complained about the uneven revenue flow it creates for years).
So did RDR2 take just 2 years to develop?
I assume there will have been a small project team. They will have developed outlines, concepts and plans. Lots of plans: how many people needed; how long for; schedules; how much money would it tie up; what tasks should be done first; any RAGE updates needed and so on.
And they might have worked on plans for RDR2, then gone and worked on some GTA plans, then returned and updated the RDR2 plans. Iterative process. Until the go-ahead was given. So ... 2 years full steam ahead + some unknown low resource lead time.
And they won;t simply have gone from a small team to an all studio potential 2,000+ employees; they will have gone through the gears so to speak. In big picture terms though they threw the switch and the game happened.
Now if you try to compare the development of RAGE or Frostbite or Anvil / Snowdrop with what RSI is doing: tricky.
Here is an example though - for fun!
In 2004 EA bought the company whose game engine Rockstar has been using. Rockstar start work on a new engine.
One comparison would be to fast forward 6 years to 2010 and compare what RSI have done with what Rockstar did:
By 2010 Rockstar had developed a new engine (RAGE) and the games: Table Tennis, GTA IV, Midnight Club, two GTA IV follow ups, RDR and an RDR follow up. All these games on a new engine remember so in the case of GTA not simply a rehash of GTS 3.
Its a comparison. Is it fair?
Well whilst it covers the development of a new engine Rockstar in 2004 was an established, funded company - which RSI was not back in 2012. Good points, well argued I would agree. So maybe compare what RSI did from 2014? So 4 years:
By 2008 Rockstar had produced RAGE, Table Tennis, GTA IV and Midnight Club.
More than RSI achieved from 2014 to 2018? It did include - note - the creation of a new engine.
I would suggest the comparison looks somewhat skewed towards Rockstar because they had (and have) a much bigger team of people. Hence really.
Its ok to hope and dream. I would love to see Atlas (your latest crusade) become what they claim it was supposed to be. But I am a realist. I would also look at Atlas (which is MUCH MUCH MUCH further along than SC is and say its not worth 200 million and 6 years either.
Its not about hate or wanting something to fail its about accountability and some sort of responsibility. Bethesda and FO 76 I have been both critical and defensive on that project. But the biggest defense for them was they gave people 3 or 5 days of a free preview. Not everyone could play it but everyone could watch people play it and they could see that no matter WHO played it he game was the same buggy mess. Had Atlas done similar they MIGHT get some sort of concessions. but they didnt they had a small private server with a bunch of paid spokesmen run around with the very best stuff the game currently has. Similar to what they did last night.
These guys Roberts, Wildcard, and all the new kids trying to make a living off people with dreams ALL misrepresent what their finished products will be. Or in the case of WIldcard what the current state of their game theyre taking money for is in. And EA doesnt cut it anymore even with the double discount. I ALMOST bought it for the 25 bucks. But I know what its going to be shortly...empty. I suppose I could then play it as a solo game just to check out the features. But I have a library full of games I havent even opened that I bought simply because they were on sale.
Besides Atlas will be 19.99 or maybe even 14.99 long before it comes out and by then it will be better (simply because it has to be) and because the population will be low enough the engine will be able to handle it (except when it needs to the most).
SC will never come out. Not beyond whatever the PTU or Avocados have right now. Because they cant afford to put it out. They have to at this point be all in on SQ 42 and if they cant get a single player game to work on their engine in a workable state then no way they can get SC to work.
And while I say you cant underestimate stupidity or gullibility they have 3-5 more years before SQ 42 even sees the light of day. SO even with a skeleton crew ONLY working on that its still a 25 million a year project. Which as time goes by and no more tricks up their sleeve is going to be hard to pull off. Sure this year was supposedly a banner year (in terms of funding which is the ONLY thing these guys can do right and the biggest thing the fanbois focus on) but they didnt actually put anything anyone could actually play that was earth shattering.