Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

I hope this game appeals to casual players

2

Comments

  • danwest58danwest58 Member RarePosts: 1,981
    Quizzical said:
    No one is arguing that the worst players need to fare just as well as the best.  But players who are substantially below average (whether in time spent, player skill, or whatever) need to be able to accomplish things and have fun.  Otherwise, they will get sick of the game and leave.  And then the players who used to be average then be below average among those who are left, and then they'll get sick of the game and leave, too.  And so on as this works its way upward until the game is dead.

    If substantially below average players aren't able to do anything other than die a lot, that's not fun.  If they're able to accomplish things, have fun, and be on the winning side in some sense a substantial fraction of the time in spite of dying twice as often as they kill someone else, that's fine.
    Yea but all too often the casuals that cry in these games are of the I play 15 minutes a week and dont have any other time to put into the game so it needs to cater to me type.  Which is why WOW is in the shape its in because they catered to the players who didnt want to put more than a very small amount of effort in.   The effort put in should equal the reward getting out of the game and yes if you only play 15 minutes a week you should be fodder for everyone else.  If you put effort into learning your role and work to get better you should achieve rewards based on that level of play.
  • LedrirLedrir Member UncommonPosts: 69
    I agree with the players that want fights to be won by skill, knowledge and teamwork not from toys gained from hardcore raiding and playing long hours. 

    As others pointed out, pve games can give over powered gear and abilities for many hours grinding but pvp is ruined if the fight is won by the gear or special powers instead of player ability.

    I do hope that there will be many options for a player to choose from to help the realm.  Some players will roam just looking for pvp fights without a care for strategic objectives. 

    However for the casual player they may not want to take a pug against a hardcore gank group.  I am hoping that CU creates multiple options for casual players to contribute to the realms success.
    tweedledumb99
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 5,864
    I doubt it will. For its sake though I hope the business model works out and MJ doesn't have to invoke his nuclear option of closing the game.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 20,599
    danwest58 said:
    Quizzical said:
    No one is arguing that the worst players need to fare just as well as the best.  But players who are substantially below average (whether in time spent, player skill, or whatever) need to be able to accomplish things and have fun.  Otherwise, they will get sick of the game and leave.  And then the players who used to be average then be below average among those who are left, and then they'll get sick of the game and leave, too.  And so on as this works its way upward until the game is dead.

    If substantially below average players aren't able to do anything other than die a lot, that's not fun.  If they're able to accomplish things, have fun, and be on the winning side in some sense a substantial fraction of the time in spite of dying twice as often as they kill someone else, that's fine.
    Yea but all too often the casuals that cry in these games are of the I play 15 minutes a week and dont have any other time to put into the game so it needs to cater to me type.  Which is why WOW is in the shape its in because they catered to the players who didnt want to put more than a very small amount of effort in.   The effort put in should equal the reward getting out of the game and yes if you only play 15 minutes a week you should be fodder for everyone else.  If you put effort into learning your role and work to get better you should achieve rewards based on that level of play.
    A lot is a matter of degree.  If the person who plays 15 minutes per week can't do much because he can't compete with the people who play an hour per week, oh well.  If the person who plays 20 hours per week has no hope of doing anything in that time other than getting slaughtered by the people who play 40 hours per week, the game is going to be dead on arrival.
    tweedledumb99MendelOctagon7711
  • UngoodUngood Member EpicPosts: 2,492
    ya know.. this is one of the things I love about Eternal Crusade, it have a leveling system, so as you play, to get incrementally better gear.. but you still have a loadout point limit, so you can't become a god, and everyone has the same point limit, so a new player with some skill can beat a veteran. 

    It allows those that put in the time and money to have "good" stuff.. but not overly powering tho. Until it comes to eldar, they are OPed AF, just all around.

    I kinda hope that CU and CF go in this direction.. we shall see.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 15,910
    Scot said:
    If casual players can be as successful as those who put time in, what's the point of putting time in?
    I don't think he means hardcore as in time,i think he means forcing large raids otherwise your left to doing almost nothing in game.Basically when i hear casual ,it means solo friendly.

    I have already stated 3 things over and over,raids are NEVER needed in a game,you can do BOTH grouping AND soloing because FFXI proved it.So unless devs are stunned ,not paying attention,still living on their OLD games then they SHOULD be able to figure it out.

    Time imo should always be a factor,it is a real life idea because anyone doing something a LOT and even repetitively will obviously get better at it.If you handed someone a hockey stick and said here go shoot the puck 3x and another guy practiced shooting for a month,i guarantee the second guy will be a hundred times better at it.

    Now an area developer's have missed out on are "trainers",you know just like in real life,someone teaches you how to do something properly.I do NOT want to see how trainers were used in old school games that was just retarded,spend points get a new level.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • BrunlinBrunlin Member UncommonPosts: 75
    edited December 2018
    There will always be solo gankers trying to wreck havoc on the masses, but that being said.....This is a team base pvp game.Where sucess will be in cooperative play with your team. So get yourself in a good guild, make friends and group up. You will be successful if you are social in these kind of games regarless how much time you put in every day. A hard core solo ganker will never have a chance agaisnt people running in a pack. Outside of that the game should be about who can communicate well with their team mates and can coordinate strategic maneuvers. Even if you are just doing pve content , you should be running in groups for protection. If you are a casual but social and in a good guild that often runs in groups than i think you will be fine. If you are a solo casusal than your not going to do well, (unless you dont mind just crafting or helping the team in some other way.) Eso would be more to your speed.....just saying..... I do agree though that gear should give an edge but shoudnt have a huge gap to someone that doesnt have gear on 1 v 1 or 3v3 or even 5v5 like in BDO

    If at first you don’t succeed, call it version 1.0

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,496
    Quizzical said:
    JDis25 said:
    My thought is that time invested is important, but their needs to be a ceiling. Maybe 9 months for a hardcore player and 1.5-2 years for a casual player. After that you are capped on gear, and no new gear is introduced.
    If it's going to take several months around dying a lot and being miserable before you can be competitive, then why bother paying the game at all?
    The original DAOC got around this somewhat by providing tiered battlegrounds but as I understand things none such will be provided in CU as there really won't be traditional levels.

    Long ago I read their might be some area for very new players to cut their teeth on but then they would move into the main RVR world with everyone else.

    Alledgedly CU was still to have some form of progression, but nothing like the gaps DAOC had.

    Proof is in the execution which I've not heard of much these days.

    Ever since going into beta news on it has been surprisingly quiet.  I still get the newsletters but as always they are full of "busy, busy, busy" without saying much of anything of import.


    YashaXtweedledumb99

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • ThaneThane Member RarePosts: 3,266
    edited December 2018
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    badermaljmcdermottuk

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,496
    Someone once said Ansel Adams could take a better photo with a pinhole camera than most people could with a modern SLR.

    At the end of the day it's all about maintaining the illusion so the average player believes they have a chance to be competitive. 

    The reality is the best players will always rise to the top if they spend more time practicing, min / maxing their builds, understanding its strengths and weaknesses against others and possessing far greater natural talent regardless of actual game design.

    Other players fool themselves into thinking they are competitive but even if the tools are completely even they'd still get crushed more often than they'd like, so devs have to make sure the players never truly realize it,  or at least not have it rubbed in their face publically.




    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • tweedledumb99tweedledumb99 Member UncommonPosts: 211
    CSE has committed, multiple times, to make the game fun for people who aren't hardcore min-maxers who no-life the game.

    They've committed to making it fun for people to lose, and committed to giving progression to people who consistently lose.

    If you don't like this, cause it's not hardcore enough for you, find a different game or go get f**ked.
    meddyck
  • DMKanoDMKano Member LegendaryPosts: 20,182
    edited December 2018
    At this point - I hope this game appeals to anyone.

    The development fatigue is real.
    Kylerantweedledumb99meddyckYashaXTrolldefender99
  • UngoodUngood Member EpicPosts: 2,492
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    Kylerantweedledumb99
  • ArteriusArterius Member RarePosts: 737
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    I would still argue that Fortnite is not casual. You hear stories all the time about how addicting the game is for not just teenagers but adults too. I have a guy in my apartment who plays fortnite from the moment he gets up to the moment he goes to bed. Sure he has a physical disability so can't work but there are other games that he could play. I think with the amount of hours an average player probally spends playing Fortnite you would find that the game is not casual.

    I can't back this up with cold hard facts. So I am not going to pretend this is the truth or anything. Just how I look at things.
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 10,581
    Arterius said:
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    I would still argue that Fortnite is not casual. You hear stories all the time about how addicting the game is for not just teenagers but adults too. I have a guy in my apartment who plays fortnite from the moment he gets up to the moment he goes to bed. Sure he has a physical disability so can't work but there are other games that he could play. I think with the amount of hours an average player probally spends playing Fortnite you would find that the game is not casual.

    I can't back this up with cold hard facts. So I am not going to pretend this is the truth or anything. Just how I look at things.
    125 million Fortnite players...  pretty sure the vast majority of those are causal players.  That doesn’t mean there are no hardcore players as their obviously are, but the sheer numbers mean there are far more casual players.
    gervaise1immodium

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

    Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017. 

    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

    "Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018

    My ignore list finally has one occupant after 12 years. I am the strongest supporter of free speech on here, but free speech does not mean forced listening. Have fun my friend. Hope you find a new stalking target.

  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 2,605
    "PvP is not casual" is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read on these forums. 
    Ungoodtweedledumb99
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
    • Song of the Week: Salvation by The Prophecy from Salvation (2013)
    • Currently Playing: Devil May Cry (HD Collection)
    • Favorite Drink: Bruichladdich Black Art 5th 1992
    • Gaming Timeline: Arcade, Commodore 64, Amiga 500, SEGA, IBM, PS, PC, PS2, More PCs, PS3, Giant PC, PS4, No More PCs, PS4 Pro.
    • Adopted @Kyleran as my virtual father - I put him in my signature since he worries about me all the time and this way he can keep track of me when I talk to strangers here!
  • AkulasAkulas Member RarePosts: 2,411
    If it's a PvE game then time invested should result in being stronger. Taking months and getting the levels is the reward.

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • cheyanecheyane Member EpicPosts: 6,138
    Games like this you have to join early and get into a good guild even before the game launches.
    image
  • DMKanoDMKano Member LegendaryPosts: 20,182
    Akulas said:
    If it's a PvE game then time invested should result in being stronger. Taking months and getting the levels is the reward.

    But Camelot Unchained is not s PvE game - so while your point is valid it doesnt apply in this case.


    YashaXTrolldefender99
  • DMKanoDMKano Member LegendaryPosts: 20,182
    Arterius said:
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    I would still argue that Fortnite is not casual. You hear stories all the time about how addicting the game is for not just teenagers but adults too. I have a guy in my apartment who plays fortnite from the moment he gets up to the moment he goes to bed. Sure he has a physical disability so can't work but there are other games that he could play. I think with the amount of hours an average player probally spends playing Fortnite you would find that the game is not casual.

    I can't back this up with cold hard facts. So I am not going to pretend this is the truth or anything. Just how I look at things.
    125 million Fortnite players...  pretty sure the vast majority of those are causal players.  That doesn’t mean there are no hardcore players as their obviously are, but the sheer numbers mean there are far more casual players.

    Fortnite has short session gameplay built in - so its casual friendly.

    Of course majority of the players are re casuals.

    CU is siege based - unless they have a button that you can click to join siege on progress - it just wont have that short session gameplay built it. 

    This alone will greatly limit casual appeal
    YashaXTrolldefender99
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,496
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    Or at least let you kick their ass all over the place because the believe they actually have a chance,  despite most evidence to the contrary. 
    Ungood

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 10,470
    Kyleran said:
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    Or at least let you kick their ass all over the place because the believe they actually have a chance,  despite most evidence to the contrary. 
    True enough, its a bit like CS:GO, technically its a level playing field, but practice, experience and teamwork will usually win the match. ;)
    YashaX
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 2,633
    Scot said:
    If casual players can be as successful as those who put time in, what's the point of putting time in?
    Skill, suck less.
    tweedledumb99
  • UngoodUngood Member EpicPosts: 2,492
    Kyleran said:
    Ungood said:
    Thane said:
    sorry, but NO. just no.
    this game isn't meant for casual gamers.

    and we are allll happy about it.

    you want a casual game, there are enough out there.
    this one is for pvp players, and quite frankly, pvp IS NOT CASUAL.
    Sure PvP is for casual players, just look at Fortnight, 80% of the population is casual players. 

    Just level the playing field, and make it a game of skill not grind, and casuals will be more then happy to kick your ass all over the place..
    Or at least let you kick their ass all over the place because the believe they actually have a chance,  despite most evidence to the contrary. 
    Not to get into some fight about Casuals vs Hardcore players, when it comes to games. As too often people pick their side and get overly emotionally invested. Such is the way with gamers.

    But when people talk to me about the skills and abilities of "hardcore" players, .. well.. I just keep in mind, that all Hack and Cheat, and other 3rd party software is designed to target Hardcore players, because they can't be competitive on their skills alone while playing the game as intended.

    I mean, I'd love to respect "Hardcore" players, but lets get real, this is the demographic of players that will pay a subscription fee to use a hack program for a Free 2 Play game.. 


    tweedledumb99
  • AmatheAmathe Member EpicPosts: 4,900
    Scot said:
    If casual players can be as successful as those who put time in, what's the point of putting time in?
    It's important how "success" is measured. Not everyone measures it the same.

    And it matters whether "success" is tied to time played. Many times it isn't. 

    For example, most guilds who pride themselves on how successful they are don't measure their success in time played. Quite the opposite. They want to get in, kill the top boss, get the best gear in as little time as possible.

    So really I think you have it backwards. 
    Kylerantweedledumb99YashaX

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

Sign In or Register to comment.