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Why we can't have nice things.

delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
in The Pub at MMORPG.COM
Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

Go private: 
Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
Ashes of Creation 
Saga of Lucimia 

Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

Here watch this, 

  
TaneonOctagon7711[Deleted User]
«13

Comments

  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,990
    While indie MMOs may certainly be a solution to getting the genre out of the rut marketing has put it in, don't pin your hopes on anything coming out until it has launched.
    delete5230AlBQuirkyOctagon7711Kyleran
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    edited November 2018
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    I'll agree to that DMK, 
    But what your asking is to give up ? 
    The three games listed MAY NOT be what you or he/she wants but private is the only struggle we have left.... We have no choice but to "fight the man".
    RexKushman
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다












  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    edited November 2018
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    I'll agree to that DMK, 
    But what your asking is to give up ? 
    The three games listed MAY NOT be what you or he/she wants but private is the only struggle we have left.... We have no choice but to "fight the man".
    There is no 'man' just money 
    mmorpgs are a dying genre. 
    There may be a resurgence in time as many things are cyclical but the genre as we once knew it is dead. 
    Again, give up ? 
    Lets say all three listed are not liked by any... But with the man in charge were done for? 

    I say let something else rise up, its the only way to get different B)   


    Their is the man, BIG MONEY is the man, Jack will explain it better, watch the video.
    Gdemami
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다












  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    blueturtle13 said:
    delete5230 said:
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    I'll agree to that DMK, 
    But what your asking is to give up ? 
    The three games listed MAY NOT be what you or he/she wants but private is the only struggle we have left.... We have no choice but to "fight the man".
    There is no 'man' just money 
    mmorpgs are a dying genre. 
    There may be a resurgence in time as many things are cyclical but the genre as we once knew it is dead. 
    Again, give up ? 
    Lets say all three listed are not liked by any... But with the man in charge were done for? 

    I say let something else rise up, its the only way to get different B)   
    Give up on what?
    I have zero interest in playing any of those games listed. Nor do I feel they will be a hit. The old classic whack a mole stand around for hours downtime games are dead. I say let them remain buried. 
    If I had an attitude like this, I would quit my job and go on food stamps. 

    What's the point of it all...… No, I would rather go down fighting, even if all by myself.
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,149
    delete5230 said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      
    I am not sure if you meant "gist" or used jest as a very clever play on words. . .at first I thought it was a mistake etc. . then. . then. . .brilliance.
    delete5230

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • jonp200jonp200 Member UncommonPosts: 457
    I hear you.  I have been playing mostly single-player games for the past couple years.  There has been a nice pick up with 4x games and Baldur's Gate-esq titles.  Here's hoping the MMO genre gets a shot in the arm.

    One thing to do is to stop supporting junk with our dollars.  I  am pretty much done crowdfunding and pre-ordering anything.  I realize to an extent, I may be missing something by not helping in development but frankly, most of what I have funded hasn't worked out so well.

    The current wave of Battle Royale titles doesn't do it for me either.  I'm fine with PvP but would rather have some story behind it.

    Maybe the new model with shift to more like what Fallout 76 is looking to accomplish.  With some tweaks maybe that works?  We'll see.
    AlBQuirky

    Seaspite
    Playing ESO on my X-Box


  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    Aethaeryn said:
    delete5230 said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      
    I am not sure if you meant "gist" or used jest as a very clever play on words. . .at first I thought it was a mistake etc. . then. . then. . .brilliance.
    You keep up on grammar and I'll explain "why we cant have nice things". 

    You can be my spell checker person, but I would like to at least keep it "jest" if that's OK ?
  • iixviiiixiixviiiix Member RarePosts: 2,256
    If you have nice thing , then how will they get money from you ?
  • ScotScot Member LegendaryPosts: 22,990
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.

    That is defeatism, where's the hope? You may be right but something else may come along that shakes up the MMOROG genre. I doubt any of those games will be game changers, but before the indie MMOs started developing what had we to look forward to? AAA has abandoned MMOs, another WoW clone with some tweaks and something supposedly "different" were about it.

    So far Albion and SotA have not done well, but this is as much about what future indie may do as it is about what's being released now. But we do need a success, preferably a few successes in their own terms as regards playerbase.

    You only have to look at Fortnite to realise it is possible for something to come out of left field and redefine genres, Fortnite was not AAA either.

    You actually mentioned a solution to these issues, the one sure fire way of insuring yourself against being in a game that does not live up to your expectations, make sure you are in a good guild.
    delete5230
  • ConstantineMerusConstantineMerus Member EpicPosts: 3,338
    Scot said:
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.

    That is defeatism, where's the hope? You may be right but something else may come along that shakes up the MMOROG genre. I doubt any of those games will be game changers, but before the indie MMOs started developing what had we to look forward to? AAA has abandoned MMOs, another WoW clone with some tweaks and something supposedly "different" were about it.

    So far Albion and SotA have not done well, but this is as much about what future indie may do as it is about what's being released now. But we do need a success, preferably a few successes in their own terms as regards playerbase.

    You only have to look at Fortnite to realise it is possible for something to come out of left field and redefine genres, Fortnite was not AAA either.

    You actually mentioned a solution to these issues, the one sure fire way of insuring yourself against being in a game that does not live up to your expectations, make sure you are in a good guild.
    Hope is a valuable currency. I don't spend it on video games or the stuff that I have no role in their outcome. 

    I was there at the beginning. People keep focusing on their nice memories, which is good. But they tend to forget the flaws. The genre is dead (or on life support) for good reasons. Those are facts, we can't replace them with hope. 

    Second (or third) coming of the genre's path doesn't go through the past, but the future. And for now I don't see anything hinting to that. 
    Constantine, The Console Poster

    • "One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
  • ThaneThane Member EpicPosts: 3,534
    because "nice" is relative, and you obviously like niche games :expressionless:

    [Deleted User]

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    Because that's how economics in America works, right? Major companies arbitrarily decide what we can have or not, and they don't care about what we want to spend our money on? Just take this game you hate and tough noogies?

    Do you have any idea how much hard work and money goes into trying to identify market demands and what sections of the market to attempt to service based on their needs?

    You may not like what is being offered, but that is another issue entirely. 
    AlBQuirky[Deleted User]

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,432
    delete5230 said:
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    I'll agree to that DMK, 
    But what your asking is to give up ? 
    The three games listed MAY NOT be what you or he/she wants but private is the only struggle we have left.... We have no choice but to "fight the man".
    As an old dinosaur, myself, I've given up. I don't expect any MMORPG to make it to daylight in my lifetime.

    @DMKano, I hear your "not enough players" argument and wonder either how accurate it is, or what is considered "enough." I don't believe that millions of players want old time experiences anymore, but I wonder just how many do, and if it's feasible to a company.

    It will be interesting to see how some of the kickstarter throwbacks turn out and watch their numbers. I don't expect any record breaking numbers, but my curiosity may be quenched ;)
    Scot[Deleted User]

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,855
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    No, it's not. It's more like, going to the store and the only thing you can buy to eat is dog food, or starve.

    It has nothing to do with minorities and majorities, and every thing to do with force-feeding shit down the masses throats because they know you can't get anything better anywhere else.
    delete5230
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Member EpicPosts: 6,601
    I hate to tell you this but no one's forcing anything. Anytime a new game comes on the market people make a choice play it or don't play it. Games are made in response to these choices.
    [Deleted User]Phry[Deleted User]
    Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,855
    VengeSunsoar said:
    I hate to tell you this but no one's forcing anything. Anytime a new game comes on the market people make a choice play it or don't play it. Games are made in response to these choices.
    Buy or don't buy isn't exactly a choice when the only thing on the market is shit.
    "Gee, what to buy this time?" "Dogshit or horseshit?" "Wait! Hey! Look over there, looks like a new shipment of Bullshit just arrived."

    So no, no one is forcing you to buy any of it, but if you gotta buy something, it's going to be shit.
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    GeezerGamer said:
    VengeSunsoar said:
    I hate to tell you this but no one's forcing anything. Anytime a new game comes on the market people make a choice play it or don't play it. Games are made in response to these choices.
    Buy or don't buy isn't exactly a choice when the only thing on the market is shit.
    "Gee, what to buy this time?" "Dogshit or horseshit?" "Wait! Hey! Look over there, looks like a new shipment of Bullshit just arrived."

    So no, no one is forcing you to buy any of it, but if you gotta buy something, it's going to be shit.
    Powerful stuff here :D
    ConstantineMerus
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Member EpicPosts: 6,601
    GeezerGamer said:
    VengeSunsoar said:
    I hate to tell you this but no one's forcing anything. Anytime a new game comes on the market people make a choice play it or don't play it. Games are made in response to these choices.
    Buy or don't buy isn't exactly a choice when the only thing on the market is shit.
    "Gee, what to buy this time?" "Dogshit or horseshit?" "Wait! Hey! Look over there, looks like a new shipment of Bullshit just arrived."

    So no, no one is forcing you to buy any of it, but if you gotta buy something, it's going to be shit.
    It is absolutely a choice. Developers are following the tends of what people are buying. If more people choose not to buy eventually something will change.

    So make a choice or continue to complain 
    [Deleted User]
    Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 5,041
    edited November 2018
    Interesting. Because for the first time in quite a while I am cautiously optimistic. When survival games hit the scene I predicted they would become the new MMOs: sandboxy, PVP, meaningful crafting, building, surviving. Dark and Light showed me the fantasy setting works like a charm. All these games need to do is grow in size (increasing land mass and player count) and in complexity of their systems ( no more bush whacking but farming for example). And now New World is taking the steps to show growth in size. All the signs are there, we are getting there. And when we do I’ll be first in line and give everyone a nice big ‘I told you so.’

    Maybe I am just optimistic.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    ScotVermillion_Raventhal[Deleted User]
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    DMKano said:
    Just like the NFL owns football, challenge them and they'll squash you. 
    The Oil companies own all other types of vehicle energy. 
    And go ahead and try to make that wonderful song you wrote a hit on the charts then see what happens to ya.  

    THE MAN is in control, and you better like it...….. that's the jest of it. 

    Go private: 
    Pantheon Rise of the Fallen 
    Ashes of Creation 
    Saga of Lucimia 

    Jack Black in School of Rock got it right :)  

    Here watch this, 

      


    All 3 games you mentioned are like 3 grains of sand on the beach. 

    Masses will be blissfully unaware regardless of what happens to those games - success, failure or mediocrity.

    The issue here is simple - one finds himself being in the minority - and realizes that the reason you can't have nice things is - not enough people want what you want, and the masses have a found "new nice things".

    I do hope that Pantheon at least makes it for a year - as I don't see my guild playing it longer than that.




    I'll agree to that DMK, 
    But what your asking is to give up ? 
    The three games listed MAY NOT be what you or he/she wants but private is the only struggle we have left.... We have no choice but to "fight the man".
    Can't fight the man as you become what you hate.  Look at Lucas who's whole thing was to stick it to the man.  He became the man then sold out everything.  At least Stan Lee never sold out everything and maintained the right to have final say over what was done with Marvel.  

    Just go out and do your own thing to the best of your ability.  Don't get lost along the way.  Things will work out.

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    edited November 2018
    I hate to tell you this but no one's forcing anything. Anytime a new game comes on the market people make a choice play it or don't play it. Games are made in response to these choices.
    Buy or don't buy isn't exactly a choice when the only thing on the market is shit.
    "Gee, what to buy this time?" "Dogshit or horseshit?" "Wait! Hey! Look over there, looks like a new shipment of Bullshit just arrived."

    So no, no one is forcing you to buy any of it, but if you gotta buy something, it's going to be shit.
    Your opinion that something is "shit" doesn't mean it's really shit. it's just your opinion.
    You should make a club of people who think their opinions are facts. You already have two members.

    Both you and I disagree heavily on all matters, its to the point we really don't like each other.  
    But putting this aside, I would like to say this into defense of both of you: 
    @GeezerGamer is saying we are controlled with controlled options, and by the analogy of several styles of shit, but shit none the less. 
    @Jean-Luc_Picard is saying that's only his opinion. 

    So this is saying you BOTH have opinions.  


    With that out of the way, please consider this:  
    @GeezerGamer "doesn't like" the controlled options NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.
    @Jean-Luc_Picard "likes" the controlled options NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.  


    I happen to be on the side of Geezer where Jean-Luc is not, two different opinions.  Both are ok and justifiable. 

    But can I ask Jean-Luc this ?.... Could you admit we have controlled mmorpg's by heavy bigger money by advertisement, as opposed to mmorpgs for the other side that can't afford it, their for kicked to the side ? 

    Could you at least appreciate where both sides are coming from.  I have to admit I don't and I should. 
    iamspamicus
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    Jean-Luc_Picard said:
    I don't admit that "one side" insults the other because they have different gaming tastes. I don't admit that just because some people like game "A" and other game "B", people of game "A" say that people of game "B" can only be mindless idiots.

    And that's exactly what some people, usually always the same, are doing here. And I indeed don't like people like that.
    I don't mean this as an insult, please don't take it as such...Again it's only my opinion. But you are as un-open minded as me.  

    Were both on opposite sides the only difference is 
    -I'm "very insulting" 
    -Your "grammar tactful" 

    However were both doing the EXACT SAME THING. 
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    Jean-Luc_Picard said:
    When you say "I don't like those games", it's an opinion.
    When you say "I think all people playing those games are mindless idiots who buy crap", then it's an insult. And that is what you and your new friend are doing.

    I don't think you have the slightest idea about what open minded means, but I'll give you a hint, that's certainly not you with that attitude.

    And I'm definitely nothing even remotely like you. Thankfully.
    Well, we stay at war then 

    Reason: 
    You "think" your open minded.  Your completely far from it.  
    Your doing EXACTLY THE SAME AS ME, you have been all along.  


    I can at least admit I'm not open minded.... At times, I feel guilty.  Were both rude, that's a fact,  THATS A GIVEN  but I guess your proud of it.  


    Your right, and I'm not remotely like you either.... I'm so happy for that.  In real life, if I argue with an opposing person, I usually find middle ground, it may take a day or two but I do except others rights.  I'll bet you never come to terms.  
    craftseeker
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