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What is Hardcore to You?

[Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
in The Pub at MMORPG.COM
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  • Vermillion_RaventhalVermillion_Raventhal Member EpicPosts: 4,198
    Usually tedium of some sort making the game harder. 
    RueTheWhirlOctagon7711Scot
  • immodiumimmodium Member RarePosts: 2,610
    edited September 2018

    So saying all that what makes a game 'Hardcore' to you?

    What IS hardcore?
    Permadeath. You die, you go back to square one.

    No save functionality either. You have to complete the game in one sitting.
    seraphis79Theocritus[Deleted User][Deleted User]

    image
  • RueTheWhirlRueTheWhirl Member UncommonPosts: 33
    I like this idea but for now can only post something fun and slightly sarcastic as I'm low on time. My buddies and I had soo much fun on AoC from release because of how 'raw' it felt. It was very playable (for me) but its issues were there. For me, in a sarcastic way, this was hardcore on our patience after a couple of years. Haha.
    TheScavenger
  • JeffSpicoliJeffSpicoli Member EpicPosts: 2,849
    If a game ( of any genre ) requires more than 1 hour of my time to make ANY SIGNIFICANT progress than by my own definition said game is hardcore. Also any game that has PVP full loot (You drop all your shit when killed) upon death is hardcore.

       
    seraphis79Octagon7711[Deleted User]

    • Aloha Mr Hand ! 

  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    A hardcore game to me is one in which player desired goals are difficult to attain, take a meaningful amount of time, have a substantial chance of failure, and penalize failure significantly. 

    But this question cannot be fairly answered without narrowing the field to something more specific than mmorpgs. because:

    PvPers are not going to see any PvE game as hardcore.

    Twitch combat players are not going to see tab target games as hardcore.

    Players of games with tough death penalties are not going to see games without that as hardcore.

    And so on.
    RueTheWhirl

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • RueTheWhirlRueTheWhirl Member UncommonPosts: 33
    Amathe said:
    A hardcore game to me is one in which player desired goals are difficult to attain, take a meaningful amount of time, have a substantial chance of failure, and penalize failure significantly. 

    But this question cannot be fairly answered without narrowing the field to something more specific than mmorpgs. because:

    PvPers are not going to see any PvE game as hardcore.

    Twitch combat players are not going to see tab target games as hardcore.

    Players of games with tough death penalties are not going to see games without that as hardcore.

    And so on.
    Great points! For example, hardcore for me is a game that gives many options for a pvp/pve build. GW1 comes to mind for me personally. My idea of hardcore may be a little different from others because it's wasn't the difficulty of coming up with a build (which took awhile sometimes) or the difficulty of said pve. It was the constant meta change and unique build choices that existed within the pvp environment. I loved it.
    TheScavenger
  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    edited September 2018
    Well , thew way i see it , it falls into 2 categories ime..

      There are Hardcore Gamers ... for ex in Wow.. the less than  1% that complete all Mythics

      And there are Hardcore games ex.. Ultima Online , in which the PvP and PvE are unforgiving ..
    [Deleted User]Lokero
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
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  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    edited September 2018
    Yup .... gonna log in , in abit trying to GM Cooking ..   :)

     And just got my 21 year gifts ... woot!

       Also there Halloween event has started , which you can get some very cool deco from ..
    [Deleted User][Deleted User]
  • WarEnsembleWarEnsemble Member UncommonPosts: 252
    Hardcore in a game means when you die, its perma-death.
    [Deleted User]
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    Can I get a list of these "hardcore" games that feature permadeath? By that I mean uninsurable, unrecoverable, irreplaceable, permadeath? Not where there is some avoidance mechanism.

    Games someone can log in and play right now, not cancelled ones or ones that are conceptual or being made. 

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • immodiumimmodium Member RarePosts: 2,610
    Amathe said:
    Can I get a list of these "hardcore" games that feature permadeath? By that I mean uninsurable, unrecoverable, irreplaceable, permadeath? Not where there is some avoidance mechanism.

    Games someone can log in and play right now, not cancelled ones or ones that are conceptual or being made. 
    Plenty of roguelikes with permadeath.

    As far as MMORPG's, none that I'm aware of.

    image
  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,609
    I don't think Hardcore is a function of any game or its mechanics.  Hardcore is more about how an individual approaches the game.  I personally consider a Hardcore gamer to be one that spends at least 20 hours out of every 7 days in a specific game.  It is possible for a Hardcore player to not be involved in raids, but in my experience, these types of players raid at least once a week.

    I've been both a Hardcore player and a Casual.  These days, I'm totally casual.



    [Deleted User]

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

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  • pratt12200pratt12200 Member UncommonPosts: 36
    Hardcore is something, to me, that people feel they need to say to justify how much they obsess over a game.  It's like the fat guy on jurassic park.  See no one cares.

  • AlBQuirkyAlBQuirky Member EpicPosts: 7,432
    edited September 2018
    For me, hardcore used to describe a game means "chance to fail." No automatic successes in the game. Not even close to 100% success rate in everything one does. RNG is present.
    [Deleted User]

    - Al

    Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
    - FARGIN_WAR


  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    edited September 2018
    immodium said:

    So saying all that what makes a game 'Hardcore' to you?

    What IS hardcore?
    Permadeath. You die, you go back to square one.

    No save functionality either. You have to complete the game in one sitting.
    In essence, this.  Most notably, through the finality of actions taken by the player.  Permadeath, permanent build or expensive/limited means of respeccing, etc..

    It means not giving the player an out every time the player makes a less than ideal decision.

    Not that I want these things.  It's just what I think of when I think of hardcore games.
    [Deleted User]immodium

    image
  • MrTugglesMrTuggles Member UncommonPosts: 188
    Salem Online.

    That is all.
    immodium
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    Nyctelios said:
    Amathe said:
    Can I get a list of these "hardcore" games that feature permadeath? By that I mean uninsurable, unrecoverable, irreplaceable, permadeath? Not where there is some avoidance mechanism.

    Games someone can log in and play right now, not cancelled ones or ones that are conceptual or being made. 
    Path of Exile has a hardcore character "league". If you die you get booted from the league, going to standard ("easy") version.

    Also the HC leagues has a variant on it's difficult settings forcing defense-over-offense mindset (or else).
    While that sounds like a serious death penalty, you still have your character, so I would not call that permadeath.
    [Deleted User]

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
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  • MrTugglesMrTuggles Member UncommonPosts: 188
    blueturtle13 said:
    MrTuggles said:
    Salem Online.

    That is all.
    Good mention. Salem is a real 'hardcore' mmo in the vain of Wizardry Online as well. (RIP)
    imo of course
    Salem is still ticking. Pretty decent game overall.
    [Deleted User]
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 12,263
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  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    Anything that can be called extreme within a game.  Completing every achievement that's offered.  Being first on the leader boards and staying first.  Taking time off from work on launch day and planning on not doing anything else until max level is hit.  Losing ones job or spouse because gaming comes first.  Being in the guild that prides itself on being the first to complete extremely difficult content.  Any activity that takes one away from the middle path of living a full life. 
    [Deleted User]

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • anemoanemo Member RarePosts: 1,903
    The point at which a game starts to affect reality (skipping real social events, eating worse, scheduling work around the game, and similar).  So normally a personal choice, though occasionally games can be designed to encourage the playstyle (grind especially when in competition with other players is good for this).

    Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.

    "At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."

  • LokeroLokero Member RarePosts: 1,514
    Hardcore is a term without any real static definition, much like 'MMO' these days.  It's a very general term used in multiple ways.

    Many people called Dark Souls hardcore.  ARPGs have 'Hardcore' modes with permadeath. 

    People here call older MMOs 'hardcore' usually for one of two reasons:
    1) They were very time intensive
    2) They were considered higher difficulty

    Same for 'hardcore' players:
    1) They spend lots and lots of time in the game
    2) They are into the 'end game' scene(ex. people who do raids regularly, or are competing in pvp leagues/ladders, etc.)

    I'm sure there's some usages I didn't mention, also.
    So, basically, I view the word 'hardcore' based on the context it's currently being used in.

    AlBQuirky
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