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Fevir talks Pantheon Rise of the Fallen

MikehaMikeha Member EpicPosts: 9,196
Fevir gives his thoughts on the play session he was apart of playing Pantheon. Some interesting views of how people might feel towards old school mechanics in the modern mmo era. 


[Deleted User]AmathedeniterMendel
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Comments

  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 9,067
    I do agree with what he says. I also think the people interested will not be in the hundreds of thousands but I am one of them since I loved EQ and would play it again and have in P99.
    MendelThupli
    Chamber of Chains
  • deniterdeniter Member RarePosts: 1,429
    Modern MMO gamers never were Pantheon's target audience so i don't think anyone is interested how they feel towards this game's mechanics. They already have dozens of games to choose from.

    I'm so glad i have even one to look forward to.
    svannThupli
  • KnyttaKnytta Member UncommonPosts: 414
    Some very interesting thoughts, and yes will it attract enough long term players? 

    Chi puo dir com'egli arde é in picciol fuoco.

    He who can describe the flame does not burn.

    Petrarch


  • GutlardGutlard Member RarePosts: 1,019
    I would think there's enough room in our MMORPG pond for fish of all sizes to swim....

    Gut Out!
    Thupli

    What, me worry?

  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,609
    deniter said:
    Modern MMO gamers never were Pantheon's target audience so i don't think anyone is interested how they feel towards this game's mechanics. They already have dozens of games to choose from.

    I'm so glad i have even one to look forward to.
    The big problem is that the whereabouts of those 1999-2000 EQ1 players is a big mystery.  That easily defined group dispersed.  Some of them left gaming.  Some play modern games.  Until either WoW Classic or Pantheon or some of the other games-in-development relying on old-school players actually release, no one will really know how many people are in that market segment.

    I doubt anyone who posts on these forums is really *not* playing something.  They may be playing something they don't like while they wait on something to give them that feeling again.  That's good.  But for every one playing just to wait for something better, there are probably multiple others who loved the original EQ/AC/WoW/UO just as much, but have adapted to like newer games that have come along.  Pantheon is going to need to do something to attract those players or be satisfied with a fraction of EQ1s success.  Something tells me that a business is never satisfied with its revenues.

    Every time someone says 'they have dozens of games to choose from', I wonder why the person making this claim seems to want to exclude themselves from this 'they'.  A game such as Pantheon isn't going to be drawing in a hoard of disgruntled people who have left the market because the new games aren't to their liking.  VR is going to need to attract people who are currently playing those modern games that everyone disparages.

    VR is going to have to compete with current games for players, like it or not.  Because that's where the players are.  They aren't sitting around waiting for something old to resurrect itself.  They're playing games.  And some of those players are probably pretty happy where they are, game-wise, or at least, fiscally invested.

    It will be fascinating to see if WoW Classic or Pantheon or similar games will market themselves to the people who are customers of another company.  



    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • NeanderthalNeanderthal Member RarePosts: 1,861

    I do so long for something like the early days of EQ again.  It such a shame they are going down the retarded path of pleasing the hardcore raiders at the expense of everyone else.  I shouldn't even look at anything Pantheon related it depresses me so much.

    What could have been if Brad and Co. could just get over their "big raid" obsession.

    dcutbi001
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    Neanderthal said:

     It such a shame they are going down the retarded path of pleasing the hardcore raiders at the expense of everyone else.  
    They aren't doing that.
    Thuplidcutbi001

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • kosaboykosaboy Member UncommonPosts: 50
    Nostalgia sells for a while but will people stay or will they begin to remember the tediousness of things and bounce to the next new shiny game. Only time will tell.
  • VorpalChicken28VorpalChicken28 Member UncommonPosts: 348
    Still play EQ, been here 19 years and counting, if Pantheon proves to be a worthy successor I'll finally be bidding farewell to Norrath with a heavy heart, but it's about time someone brought out something thats more like how EQ was, but with some of the conveniences we've come to expect in modern MMO's, and is a challenge where levelling is part of the game, not just a means to reach max level to then do content, something that EQ used to have to some extent.
    Nightbringe1
    “Nevertheless, the human brain, which survives by hoping from one second to another, will always endeavor to put off the moment of truth. Moist” 
    ― Terry PratchettMaking Money
  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 7,081
    The guy is a good talker and represents the game well.  I like how he states. 
    - games like this had vanished. 
    - release will be around 2020 or 2021 

    But realistically he's just another Joe on the street corner, guessing who Pantheon will appeal to. realistically we all are, even VR. 

    But just remember games like this "had vanished", this is very very important.  They were gaining speed by the millions and simply stopped being produced !..... Big business did that !.... Not the players.... I don't think they will be gaining speed again I KNOW they will. 

    They better have a lot of servers on release because the game will crash form large population.

    As always sorry for being so blunt !
    MrMelGibson
  • KnyttaKnytta Member UncommonPosts: 414
    kosaboy said:
    Nostalgia sells for a while but will people stay or will they begin to remember the tediousness of things and bounce to the next new shiny game. Only time will tell.
    We still have not seen the crafting or itemization, and they are at least talking about more exploration and finding things that way. But I agree there has to be more things to do in game than just grind dungeons for it to be sustainable long time.

    Chi puo dir com'egli arde é in picciol fuoco.

    He who can describe the flame does not burn.

    Petrarch


  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 1,115
    kosaboy said:
    Nostalgia sells for a while but will people stay or will they begin to remember the tediousness of things and bounce to the next new shiny game. Only time will tell.
    The thousands of people who play old games on private servers beg to differ.
    Even though those servers don't have millions of players, the ones that actually play stay for long stints, not just few months, unlike modern games.

    The point of old school style games is not to attract millions of players, but rather keep the few that plays entertained for longer.
    Hence why a subscription makes more sense for this type of games.
    Old School is about longevity, that's actually what I love about them.
    Temp0
  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 1,115
    DMKano said:


    Lol - the game will crash from large population. 

    It wont.

    At launch it will.
    Mainly because VR estimated their player base at 50k (so at launch they will gear up for 70-80k capacity), but I am pretty sure that at launch at least 250K will try it, and it is a conservative estimate.
    Today the gaming community is so huge that even if 1% of them will try the game, just out of curiosity, it will cause huge problems for Pantheon Servers.

    Personally I think that this type of game, if they don' repeat the Vanguard launch, can attract 50 to 100k regular players.

  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 1,115
    DMKano said:
    TEKK3N said:


    I don't doubt that the launch rush will be much higher than playerbase 6 months post launch - this happens with every MMORPG - huge spike at launch with decline from that point on until the game settles with core players - which usually takes about a year or 2.

    I guess it comes down to what you consider as "large" populatoin - to me 250k players is certainly not large - heck EQ1 had over 400K at one point - and even that is not large.

    Large IMO is million+, I don't think that Pantheon will ever see that, which is why I said "it won't"

    Brad stated that the game will be profitable with 50k players, he is the realistic one, even though I think that's highly conservative.

    It's not him claiming the game will have millions of players.
    Personally I think that Pantheon will surprise many, and pull out much better numbers than the general consensus.

    People keep saying that the old EQ players now have a family and no time to play this type of game (true).
    What people forget is that there is a younger generation that might actually like this type of game.
    Who would have thought that Dark Souls would have been such huge success?
    What? Permanent death in a RPG? Madness, no one would like that.
    But it turned out rather differently, didn't it?

    The gamers are funny creatures, I don't think anyone can predict what the next big thing will be (not saying Pantheon will be the next big thing).
  • kitaradkitarad Member LegendaryPosts: 7,885
    edited August 2018
    I think Brad is practical although some of the supporters thinking in millions are delusional but at least the developers are more realistic.

    I love Everquest so I will play it but I'm not stupid enough to think there is a huge secret player base out there waiting to play numbering in the millions.
    MendelMrMelGibson

  • herculeshercules Member UncommonPosts: 4,924
    As been said this game will not have hundreds of thousands  paid accounts but it does not
    It is very niche .Even old EQ fans will have a hard time playing mechanics from  close to 2 decades ago due to time consuming.
    I see peopel post on the forums about millions which 1. it will never have anywhere bclose to that because of the above 2.it DOES NOT need it
    It needs to focus on a certain niche and develop according to the cost of this and keep those people happy
    There is a game for everyone .
    For me and my time it would be camelot unchained and it too will NEVER have millions but thats ok as long as the developers there focus on its niche .
  • Soki123Soki123 Member RarePosts: 2,558
    I think people are overestimating how many people have enough time to sink into a game like this. If you asked me and most of my old guild mates 10 or so years ago about a game like this we would all dive in. Now most of us just don t have the time.
  • AmatheAmathe Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
    I don't think at this time there can be a target number of subscribers by which to measure the financial success of the game. It will depend on how long it takes to make the game. It will depend on how much money they spend developing, marketing and publishing Pantheon. It will depend on their arrangement with investors. It will depend on whether the people currently working on it are going to receive deferred compensation, or a percentage of the profits, or something else. It will depend on the pricing model. There are many criteria. 

    You also can't compare Pantheon numbers to the numbers for some other game, such as Everquest, because the answers to those questions are all different.

    That said, I personally think the game can pull through without need of massive subscriptions. 
    Mendel

    EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests

  • UtinniUtinni Member EpicPosts: 2,209
    I think the main issue to keeping a population in pantheon will be figuring out how to handle people that are behind the curve. MMO requiring a group for content usually leave lower level folks with no one to group with which really kills interest. It's not 1999 anymore where people will solo 1 mob at a time then bind wound up for hours on end because they couldn't find a group. 

    The typical response to this is "play a main-stream solo themepark lolz noob" but this game will need new players to keep the economy flowing and content moving along. Without people having a way to readily get things done the game will quickly turn into the sadness that the majority of private servers are where the only content at end-game is drama between unemployed people.

    Don't need to make it a solo game, no need for group finder tools, but something will need to be done possibly a few months after launch. Perhaps mercenaries or similar so that 2+ people can still accomplish things. 
  • TEKK3NTEKK3N Member RarePosts: 1,115
    edited August 2018
    Soki123 said:
    I think people are overestimating how many people have enough time to sink into a game like this. If you asked me and most of my old guild mates 10 or so years ago about a game like this we would all dive in. Now most of us just don t have the time.
    I am convinced of the opposite.
    People are underestimating how many people have lots of time in their hands.
    Particularly on this forum where the age is 35+ (you are one, I guess), most don't know how the younger generations play games.

    If you look at the biggest blockbusters, most of those games require huge grind or time investment. Young people have lots of time to play games.
    Do you really think that people spend only 1 hour a day playing Fortnite?
    Try 4-6 hours a day on average.
    Not everyone is a grandad...
  • Soki123Soki123 Member RarePosts: 2,558
    TEKK3N said:
    Soki123 said:
    I think people are overestimating how many people have enough time to sink into a game like this. If you asked me and most of my old guild mates 10 or so years ago about a game like this we would all dive in. Now most of us just don t have the time.
    I am convinced of the opposite.
    People are underestimating how many people have lots of time in their hands.
    Particularly on this forum where the age is 35+ (you are one, I guess), most don't know how the younger generations play games.

    If you look at the biggest blockbusters, most of those games require huge grind or time investment. Young people have lots of time to play games.
    Do you really think that people spend only 1 hour a day playing Fortnite?
    Try 4-6 hours a day on average.
    Not everyone is a grandad...
    Fair enough but those types of games are a lot less involved. 
    MrMelGibson
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,030
    TEKK3N said:
    Soki123 said:
    I think people are overestimating how many people have enough time to sink into a game like this. If you asked me and most of my old guild mates 10 or so years ago about a game like this we would all dive in. Now most of us just don t have the time.
    I am convinced of the opposite.
    People are underestimating how many people have lots of time in their hands.
    Particularly on this forum where the age is 35+ (you are one, I guess), most don't know how the younger generations play games.

    If you look at the biggest blockbusters, most of those games require huge grind or time investment. Young people have lots of time to play games.
    Do you really think that people spend only 1 hour a day playing Fortnite?
    Try 4-6 hours a day on average.
    Not everyone is a grandad...
    Yeah, I'm sure sitting around for two hours shouting LFG because your class is on the bottom of the tier list will be TOTALLY fine with todays crowd.

    Get real.
    MendelMrMelGibson
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,739
    This game is the most interesting of all the ones coming down the road because of the forced grouping format. I really can't see it being much of a success with the 2018 gamer and imagine it only draws a small niche crowd.
    MendelMrMelGibson
  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    DMKano said:
    This game is the most interesting of all the ones coming down the road because of the forced grouping format. I really can't see it being much of a success with the 2018 gamer and imagine it only draws a small niche crowd.

    But it doesnt have forced grouping format - the forced part was something fans made up.

    Group oriented or group centric sure - but just like EQ1 it was soloable for some classes. Pantheon will be soloable for some classes as well, not all content but a lot of it will be for well geared players with the right class.


     Im seeing it also as Group /Solo as in Vanguard which was really well done , i enjoyed both alot and seeing VR heading in the same direction in this regard , i really i enjoyed the Overland Group content of Vanguard , so much fun sooo well done ...
  • asteldiancaliskanasteldiancaliskan Member UncommonPosts: 58
    Scorchien said:
    DMKano said:
    This game is the most interesting of all the ones coming down the road because of the forced grouping format. I really can't see it being much of a success with the 2018 gamer and imagine it only draws a small niche crowd.

    But it doesnt have forced grouping format - the forced part was something fans made up.

    Group oriented or group centric sure - but just like EQ1 it was soloable for some classes. Pantheon will be soloable for some classes as well, not all content but a lot of it will be for well geared players with the right class.


     Im seeing it also as Group /Solo as in Vanguard which was really well done , i enjoyed both alot and seeing VR heading in the same direction in this regard , i really i enjoyed the Overland Group content of Vanguard , so much fun sooo well done ...
    At the time i actually thought VG was too solo friendly, but looking back at it, there was 'just enough' to do solo without being a detriment to group play - likely because being grouped even doing the same thing you could do solo was more efficient and inevitably led to doing more difficult content (either due to questline or simply because you now could).
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