Is that how you start off in Pantheon? I had no idea I thought you might start off as a generic adventurer.
You start off as a generic adventurer among a society from a foreign world, displaced on Terminus. Apparently something occurred during this process that stripped these societies of their former glory and power. Hence the name rise of the fallen.
Is that how you start off in Pantheon? I had no idea I thought you might start off as a generic adventurer.
You start off as a generic adventurer among a society from a foreign world, displaced on Terminus. Apparently something occurred during this process that stripped these societies of their former glory and power. Hence the name rise of the fallen.
Well that's much better then if a whole nation, or "society" is trying to pick it self back up and establish/conquer its power again... I also hate the everyone is a hero theme.
Give me my wooden sword and my potato sack armor and let me earn my status from the bottom!
To be honest, I made fun of Rift's story, they made it sound as if you were like the only hero or something, and the story made it easy to cut the game down to 2 starting points (one each for the opposite factions).
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
To be honest, I made fun of Rift's story, they made it sound as if you were like the only hero or something, and the story made it easy to cut the game down to 2 starting points (one each for the opposite factions).
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
A lot of games make it sound like you're the one true hero. I remember Elder Scrolls Online was particularly bad about that. Look in front of you there's another person doing the same hero quest, and someone behind you someone doing the same.
It's really a joke to apply that single player rpg storyline to the mmorpg. That is not what Pantheon has done, though it almost sounds like it at first glance.
To be honest, I made fun of Rift's story, they made it sound as if you were like the only hero or something, and the story made it easy to cut the game down to 2 starting points (one each for the opposite factions).
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
A lot of games make it sound like you're the one true hero. I remember Elder Scrolls Online was particularly bad about that. Look in front of you there's another person doing the same hero quest, and someone behind you someone doing the same.
It's really a joke to apply that single player rpg storyline to the mmorpg. That is not what Pantheon has done, though it almost sounds like it at first glance.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
To be honest, I made fun of Rift's story, they made it sound as if you were like the only hero or something, and the story made it easy to cut the game down to 2 starting points (one each for the opposite factions).
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
A lot of games make it sound like you're the one true hero. I remember Elder Scrolls Online was particularly bad about that. Look in front of you there's another person doing the same hero quest, and someone behind you someone doing the same.
It's really a joke to apply that single player rpg storyline to the mmorpg. That is not what Pantheon has done, though it almost sounds like it at first glance.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
Actually we have seen an npc in one of the streams. It was an example of the perception system.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
You're talking about something different. I have no expectation that every quest will be (or even should be) for groups or personalized, just that the main story being told not cast the player as the singular hero or savior upon which the entire narrative is driven.
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
To be honest, I made fun of Rift's story, they made it sound as if you were like the only hero or something, and the story made it easy to cut the game down to 2 starting points (one each for the opposite factions).
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
A lot of games make it sound like you're the one true hero. I remember Elder Scrolls Online was particularly bad about that. Look in front of you there's another person doing the same hero quest, and someone behind you someone doing the same.
It's really a joke to apply that single player rpg storyline to the mmorpg. That is not what Pantheon has done, though it almost sounds like it at first glance.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
Actually we have seen an npc in one of the streams. It was an example of the perception system.
I certainly couldn't read the quest text from that particular NPC gave. If you could, then I envy your eyesight.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
You're talking about something different. I have no expectation that every quest will be (or even should be) for groups or personalized, just that the main story being told not cast the player as the singular hero or savior upon which the entire narrative is driven.
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
Haven't seen an sample of the writing, can't judge it. You are free to expect anything, but that's nothing more than an opinion.
Maybe a group quest is something different than what we've seen in prior games. Maybe a group quest is only active (and the reward viable) while the members of the group are constant and unchanging in the same session. A group quest could be a timed quest that isn't put into a quest journal to be accomplished later. Do it now, or fail. Group falls apart, the quest fails. Form the group, get the quest and accomplish the task. It could be as straight forward as an LDoN mission (from EQ1) or a small-scale raid event. Such a group quest could conceivably take 20 minutes or 3 hours.
Could be, but I doubt very much that Brad and his team are going to step outside the same conventions used in prior games. To me, that's the pity, not exploring the possibilities of doing things differently.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
You're talking about something different. I have no expectation that every quest will be (or even should be) for groups or personalized, just that the main story being told not cast the player as the singular hero or savior upon which the entire narrative is driven.
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
Haven't seen an sample of the writing, can't judge it. You are free to expect anything, but that's nothing more than an opinion.
Maybe a group quest is something different than what we've seen in prior games. Maybe a group quest is only active (and the reward viable) while the members of the group are constant and unchanging in the same session. A group quest could be a timed quest that isn't put into a quest journal to be accomplished later. Do it now, or fail. Group falls apart, the quest fails. Form the group, get the quest and accomplish the task. It could be as straight forward as an LDoN mission (from EQ1) or a small-scale raid event. Such a group quest could conceivably take 20 minutes or 3 hours.
Could be, but I doubt very much that Brad and his team are going to step outside the same conventions used in prior games. To me, that's the pity, not exploring the possibilities of doing things differently.
Honestly, much more important things to focus on. If you the devs were shooting for that kind of level of detail/storytelling/writing it may as well be an adventure game ala Grim Fandango.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
You're talking about something different. I have no expectation that every quest will be (or even should be) for groups or personalized, just that the main story being told not cast the player as the singular hero or savior upon which the entire narrative is driven.
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
Haven't seen an sample of the writing, can't judge it. You are free to expect anything, but that's nothing more than an opinion.
Maybe a group quest is something different than what we've seen in prior games. Maybe a group quest is only active (and the reward viable) while the members of the group are constant and unchanging in the same session. A group quest could be a timed quest that isn't put into a quest journal to be accomplished later. Do it now, or fail. Group falls apart, the quest fails. Form the group, get the quest and accomplish the task. It could be as straight forward as an LDoN mission (from EQ1) or a small-scale raid event. Such a group quest could conceivably take 20 minutes or 3 hours.
Could be, but I doubt very much that Brad and his team are going to step outside the same conventions used in prior games. To me, that's the pity, not exploring the possibilities of doing things differently.
Honestly, much more important things to focus on. If you the devs were shooting for that kind of level of detail/storytelling/writing it may as well be an adventure game ala Grim Fandango.
In a thread about how a game might perpetuate the one hero concept, I think questioning how the developers think about creating quests and other content for the game is totally in play. I'd even suggest that there is no more important thing to discuss, and that this may be the ideal time (or possibly a little late) to bring these types of concepts to light, while there is time to incorporate new ideas.
@Dullahan and I definitely have different opinions. Each is entitled to their own opinions, and each are allowed to express those opinions.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Group quests wouldn't be hard programmatically, but would really be reskinning the same cat while introducing new potential problems. We know they've talked a bit about their triggered event system for questing, which would be something that could make the world feel more dynamic.
This seems like more of the same. What made mmos sticky was long-term progression and the prominence of interaction between players in an immersive fantasy environment. I'm more interested in them focusing on nailing that aspect, not collective quests or other refurbished minutia.
"The player is a legendary hero, stripped of his or her powerful relics"
It's not a big thing but it does rub me the wrong way. How many of you have said in the past that you are annoyed by games that tell you you're a great hero or the chosen one or some crap like that when you know very well that the game is telling everyone else the same thing?
I'm sure this will have very little (if any) impact on day to day gameplay. However, it seems like the wrong tone to take for a game of the type they are making. I think it would be better if they didn't say anything at all about player characters. I have a bigger issue with the game than this, it's just a little thing that seems out of whack to me.
I don't care if some background lore blurb says that I am a legendary hero, I have a problem with the pre set character story that usually accompanies the concept in game. I hate character story in a MMORPG. I love lore, but hate a story. It's rarely, if ever, done well and other genres do it better.
So, yeah, if I am a 'legendary hero' as a device for accumulating super human abilities and explaining away respawning, fine. That was never the problem anyhow.
We will see. If a 'quest' is individualized to a specific person, then it will be approaching that the same way as all previous games. When the NPC says "Will you help me?" and the meaning is "Will you (a singular individual) help me?" and not "Will you (a group) help me?", we're back to the developers viewing the content as a single player RPG story within a multiple-player persistent game. Designing the content that way will ensure that a vast majority of the players will see and treat the game as a shared single-player experience.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
You're talking about something different. I have no expectation that every quest will be (or even should be) for groups or personalized, just that the main story being told not cast the player as the singular hero or savior upon which the entire narrative is driven.
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
Haven't seen an sample of the writing, can't judge it. You are free to expect anything, but that's nothing more than an opinion.
Maybe a group quest is something different than what we've seen in prior games. Maybe a group quest is only active (and the reward viable) while the members of the group are constant and unchanging in the same session. A group quest could be a timed quest that isn't put into a quest journal to be accomplished later. Do it now, or fail. Group falls apart, the quest fails. Form the group, get the quest and accomplish the task. It could be as straight forward as an LDoN mission (from EQ1) or a small-scale raid event. Such a group quest could conceivably take 20 minutes or 3 hours.
Could be, but I doubt very much that Brad and his team are going to step outside the same conventions used in prior games. To me, that's the pity, not exploring the possibilities of doing things differently.
Honestly, much more important things to focus on. If you the devs were shooting for that kind of level of detail/storytelling/writing it may as well be an adventure game ala Grim Fandango.
In a thread about how a game might perpetuate the one hero concept, I think questioning how the developers think about creating quests and other content for the game is totally in play. I'd even suggest that there is no more important thing to discuss, and that this may be the ideal time (or possibly a little late) to bring these types of concepts to light, while there is time to incorporate new ideas.
@Dullahan and I definitely have different opinions. Each is entitled to their own opinions, and each are allowed to express those opinions.
It would have to be a AAA dev or a crowdfunded project that made WAY more money than pantheon did. Otherwise you're talking about sacrificing other things for it.
I always saw this lore/story as that each player was a hero from somewhere else, but here, you're just a nobody and it is up to you to make a name for yourself. Not that every person is automatically a hero or savior, just has the potential to become a hero.
It all depends how the story is laid out in game, but I wouldn't be surprised to see NPCs saying "Hey stranger, make yourself useful, go save that cat stuck in a tree".
I always saw this lore/story as that each player was a hero from somewhere else, but here, you're just a nobody and it is up to you to make a name for yourself. Not that every person is automatically a hero or savior, just has the potential to become a hero.
It all depends how the story is laid out in game, but I wouldn't be surprised to see NPCs saying "Hey stranger, make yourself useful, go save that cat stuck in a tree".
It's a clear case of big fish in a small pond migrates to the sea and now is small fry in a huge ocean, with the potential to swim by Fukashima Diiachi reactor for an instant character boost. Making them a bigger fish among many other large fish.
What bothers me is when people use generic, click-bait type titles for a forum topic.
Topic titles should be specific and have at lease some meaning with no other information. A question such as "Doesn't it bother you?" makes absolutely no sense without the rest of the question.
What bothers me is tyrannical rules for posting are what kills the soul of many forums. Questions should be freely asked. Don't like freedom?
IMO they are just setting the focus of the game......we all start from nothing and strive to be a hero. They aren't gonna check to see if we make it . If it's troublesome, just ignore it maybe
Now I am not going to say it's perfect, or great story telling, but it explains why I am off trying to save the world as opposed to opening a fabric store and selling my wife's special marmalade, its got whisky in it, which makes it special.
So, the ideas is that I am -A- previously legendary hero.
In modern Terms, it would be akin to being a Medal of Honor recipient, or being a war hero. Sure there are others out there, and all of us are special.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I think FFXIV did it well. I prefer the Elder Scrolls(single player) way of doing it. Or Metroid...like I had all this stuff n was awesome but now I gotta got get it.
IMO they are just setting the focus of the game......we all start from nothing and strive to be a hero. They aren't gonna check to see if we make it . If it's troublesome, just ignore it maybe
If it was just starting lore then I could ignore. But this sounds more like something you build off of when designing future lore.
Personally i hate the "your the chosen one" stories in MMOs. FFXIV does it imo in the worst way and pushes it heavy in the story that you and you alone are the hero of heroes...but so arent the other thousands standing next to you. Those stories are fine in a solo RPGs, but not MMOs. It forces a story onto your character when its your own made up avatar. It bugged me when my character is supposed to be this storys magical hero but does things i would not have done (or lack in action when they should have).
Oddly enough i think FFXI did it well enough were you are an adventurer helping out the heroes in their stories, you are a part of that story but not showed as the main character. Being one of many in a world of many other players just fits better.
It bother's me, but not enough to care. Unfortunately it's become so much the norm that I just expect it to be the case and ignore.
Generally speaking I don't play MMO's for the story (that's what single player games and books are for). That being said one of the things I loved about EQ was that they didn't pull that shit. Just like most of my favorite fantasy novels are the ones where the main character starts out as a schmuck, or a stable hand, or some such thing and turns themselves into a badass.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
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Give me my wooden sword and my potato sack armor and let me earn my status from the bottom!
It isn't going to stop me from enjoying the game, just have to see how big this is part of the game.
It's really a joke to apply that single player rpg storyline to the mmorpg. That is not what Pantheon has done, though it almost sounds like it at first glance.
You may believe that Pantheon is doing things differently, but until we see the quest writing in near-finalized form, there won't be any evidence either way. I'd love for you to be right, but I've not seen it. So far, the videos have been careful to avoid any NPC that couldn't be pounded upon. No quest givers; no quest text; nothing to evaluate.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Even writing dialogue for a group is problematic because players seldom have the exact same people throughout an entire quest.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Maybe a group quest is something different than what we've seen in prior games. Maybe a group quest is only active (and the reward viable) while the members of the group are constant and unchanging in the same session. A group quest could be a timed quest that isn't put into a quest journal to be accomplished later. Do it now, or fail. Group falls apart, the quest fails. Form the group, get the quest and accomplish the task. It could be as straight forward as an LDoN mission (from EQ1) or a small-scale raid event. Such a group quest could conceivably take 20 minutes or 3 hours.
Could be, but I doubt very much that Brad and his team are going to step outside the same conventions used in prior games. To me, that's the pity, not exploring the possibilities of doing things differently.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Honestly, much more important things to focus on. If you the devs were shooting for that kind of level of detail/storytelling/writing it may as well be an adventure game ala Grim Fandango.
@Dullahan and I definitely have different opinions. Each is entitled to their own opinions, and each are allowed to express those opinions.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
This seems like more of the same. What made mmos sticky was long-term progression and the prominence of interaction between players in an immersive fantasy environment. I'm more interested in them focusing on nailing that aspect, not collective quests or other refurbished minutia.
I don't care if some background lore blurb says that I am a legendary hero, I have a problem with the pre set character story that usually accompanies the concept in game. I hate character story in a MMORPG. I love lore, but hate a story. It's rarely, if ever, done well and other genres do it better.
So, yeah, if I am a 'legendary hero' as a device for accumulating super human abilities and explaining away respawning, fine. That was never the problem anyhow.
It would have to be a AAA dev or a crowdfunded project that made WAY more money than pantheon did. Otherwise you're talking about sacrificing other things for it.
It all depends how the story is laid out in game, but I wouldn't be surprised to see NPCs saying "Hey stranger, make yourself useful, go save that cat stuck in a tree".
Now I am not going to say it's perfect, or great story telling, but it explains why I am off trying to save the world as opposed to opening a fabric store and selling my wife's special marmalade, its got whisky in it, which makes it special.
So, the ideas is that I am -A- previously legendary hero.
In modern Terms, it would be akin to being a Medal of Honor recipient, or being a war hero. Sure there are others out there, and all of us are special.
Oddly enough i think FFXI did it well enough were you are an adventurer helping out the heroes in their stories, you are a part of that story but not showed as the main character. Being one of many in a world of many other players just fits better.
It bother's me, but not enough to care. Unfortunately it's become so much the norm that I just expect it to be the case and ignore.
Generally speaking I don't play MMO's for the story (that's what single player games and books are for). That being said one of the things I loved about EQ was that they didn't pull that shit. Just like most of my favorite fantasy novels are the ones where the main character starts out as a schmuck, or a stable hand, or some such thing and turns themselves into a badass.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche