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If you were to design your own MMO, what would you leave out?

2

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  • cameltosiscameltosis Member EpicPosts: 2,123
    Vertical Progression - this is a hangover from single player RPGs. It shouldn't exist in MMOs. Vertical progression only serves to segregate the community and provide a false sense of progression. It unbalances content and PvP. An MMO should be looking to bring people together, not split them apart!


    XP / Progression tied to Stories - whenever you tie the primary form of progression to quests/story, you end up creating a very linear game and, again, segregating the community based on who has or hasn't completed a quest. I don't mind having stories in my games (even though they're usually poor), but disconnect the story from progression. 


    Enrage Timers - Whenever I see a boss with an enrage timer, I am reminded that the game has been poorly designed. An enrage timer just means they couldn't design a challenging boss and so are instead implementing challenge via statistics. Try harder. 


    Shallow Combat - I'm fed up of shallow combat. Action combat is the main reason why combat has become so shallow, but it is possible to have action combat and have a deep combat system (I've never seen it personally, but it is theoretically possible). If a game has shallow combat, I'll be bored very quickly and quit. Design something deeper and it'll keep me engaged for months, increasing retention and therefore revenue. 


    Dungeon / Raid Finder - I think MMOs should retain some way for an average person to indicate that they are looking for a group, but I think the act of putting together a group and launching a dungeon or raid should remain manual. This is an essential part of community building, but whenever it gets automated you remove responsibility and leadership. Whilst a dungeon finder may result in more group content being run, it does nothing to improve the community and so I consider it a negative impact on the game and genre. 


    Content Scaling (other than group size) - I hate content scaling. With a passion. I've never seen it done right. Whenever content is scaled to the player, it invariably makes it too easy. It removes all sense of progression and usually a sense of danger too. The only time I'm happy for content to be scaled is when it is scaled by group size, but even then I think that needs to be limited in scope and perhaps restricted only to instanced content. 


    Loot-based Gear - I prefer a game where all gear is crafted and nothing is bound. You can still tie some of the best ingredients to hard content as a way to motivate people, but crafters should supply virtually all gear in the game. This creates a much better community, but more importantly it opens up options to the players. No longer will you have to grind a raid for weeks on end as the only method of progressing gear. Now, you can either craft it yourself, or buy it. Doesn't sound like much of an increase in options, but when buying gear you have tons of options for how to earn the money. Perhaps you'll farm rare mats to sell. Perhaps you'll craft low level items to sell. Perhaps you'll grind missions for gold. Perhaps you'll just trade on the auction house. Options keep people happy. 
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 7,507
    The setting would be medieval, so:

    - No classes.
    - No dungeon/raid finder.
    - No teleportation type of travel except for people with the appropriate magic skills.
    - No flying mounts.
    - No instancing or zoning. Seamless world.
    - No phasing.
    - No binding of items.
    - No silly drops by mobs (e.g. a rat dropping a broadsword).
    - No silly outfits or items.
    blueturtle134507anemo
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  • sunandshadowsunandshadow Member RarePosts: 1,869
    I'd remove loot. 

    There is no loot. Because in my MMO, you would be the mob using your claws and teeth to kill. You don't need stupid human or humanoid items. You are mindlessly evil and just want to kill and charge head long into everyone. I mean you're so dumb, you wait till the humanoid is within a certain radius before you attack even if you see them from miles away. You don't need loot cuz you're so dumb, you see a few humanoids coming who are slaughtering your brethren without breaking a sweat and you can't even run away if you want. 

    :grin:  You know, I've played games where you are a monster.  But they always have loot, whether it's health kits, mana pots, evolution points, evolution patterns, or skill-ups.  Why would you play as a monster if you can't build your monster up?
    I want to help design and develop a PvE-focused, solo-friendly, sandpark MMO which combines crafting, monster hunting, and story.  So PM me if you are starting one.
  • SteelhelmSteelhelm Member UncommonPosts: 282
    Classes and levels.
    Talking about games where thousands of players exist simultaneously in a single instance and mechanics related to such games.
  • DrunkWolfDrunkWolf Member UncommonPosts: 1,396
    edited February 15
    The setting would be medieval, so:

    - No classes.
    - No dungeon/raid finder.
    - No teleportation type of travel except for people with the appropriate magic skills.
    - No flying mounts.
    - No instancing or zoning. Seamless world.
    - No phasing.
    - No binding of items.
    - No silly drops by mobs (e.g. a rat dropping a broadsword).
    - No silly outfits or items.
    im just going to add to your list because i agree with all of this. i would also like to say

    - No global chat for people who think the entire player base wants to read their nonsense.
    Post edited by DrunkWolf on
    4507Jean-Luc_Picard
  • ArChWindArChWind Member UncommonPosts: 1,312
    DrunkWolf said:
    The setting would be medieval, so:

    - No classes.
    - No dungeon/raid finder.
    - No teleportation type of travel except for people with the appropriate magic skills.
    - No flying mounts.
    - No instancing or zoning. Seamless world.
    - No phasing.
    - No binding of items.
    - No silly drops by mobs (e.g. a rat dropping a broadsword).
    - No silly outfits or items.
    im just going to add to your list because i agree with all of this. i would also like to say

    - No global chat for people who think the entire player base wants to read their nonsense.
    I will add no global market otherwise this list looks great.
  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member RarePosts: 27,767
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 
  • CryomatrixCryomatrix Member RarePosts: 1,746
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 

    So Neverwinter is your go to game?
  • AkulasAkulas Member UncommonPosts: 2,257
    No big numbers.
    anemo

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • UngoodUngood Member RarePosts: 1,365
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 

    So Neverwinter is your go to game?
    Neverwinter is not the only D&D based game that does this. Just FYI.
    There is no Truth, only the Illusions we wish to Cling to. Knowing this, why do we all cling to such shitty illusions?
  • growillgrowill Member UncommonPosts: 28
    bartoni33 said:
    Easy:

    No forced PvP.
    Funny I'd say no forced PvE for me
    (ofc pvp would have to be meaningful)
    4507
  • sunandshadowsunandshadow Member RarePosts: 1,869
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 

    So Neverwinter is your go to game?
    I was thinking Vindictus.
    I want to help design and develop a PvE-focused, solo-friendly, sandpark MMO which combines crafting, monster hunting, and story.  So PM me if you are starting one.
  • HatefullHatefull Member RarePosts: 1,587
    Cash Shop
    Loot boxes
    Paid content - Subscription price would pay for future content patches.
    Pointless/meaningless quests
    In game Auction house. I would go with an SWG system, where you craft your vendor/storefront but nothing centralized.

    In game mail - nope. Public mail rooms (built by players) where players can charge a fee to x-fer items safely and securely between players.

    Stealth of any type. If you want to hide, you would need to be good at using terrain.

    For starters.

    If you want a new idea, go read an old book.

  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,044
    edited February 18
    I'd make a sandbox, with high quality PvE content

    And leave out the PvP

    That would truly be a genre innovation after the countless PvP sandbox deathmatch clones that are out there!
    Post edited by TheScavenger on
    anemoTheocritusHatefull

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  • ZamuroZamuro Member UncommonPosts: 100
    after reading few comments im happy none of u is a game designer... "remove pvp, lvls, items, quests, story, dungeons" wtf?! just remove the whole game
  • growillgrowill Member UncommonPosts: 28
    Zamuro said:
    after reading few comments im happy none of u is a game designer... "remove pvp, lvls, items, quests, story, dungeons" wtf?! just remove the whole game
    lol you have a point xD
  • LawlmonsterLawlmonster Member UncommonPosts: 1,064
    Honestly, I don't know anymore. I'm not as interested in the genre as I used to be. The only systems I find exceptionally repulsive these days are cash shops and loot crates, and often enough I don't have to partake. I'm not a huge fan of instancing, but I guess it depends on the game that's being developed. Sometimes it works.

    "This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  • jazz.bejazz.be Member UncommonPosts: 841
    These things will not be in my ideal mmo for sure:
    Boundaries in the world and landscapes you cannot reach.
    Action combat
    AOE combat being the norm (fighting multiple (3+) mobs at once)
    Cinematic experiences where you perform one task after the other
    Quest helping mechanisms (map helpers etc)

    That's all I can come up with for now but that's the direction the mmo's have taken and they're all wrong imo.
  • anemoanemo Member UncommonPosts: 1,427
    Zamuro said:
    after reading few comments im happy none of u is a game designer... "remove pvp, lvls, items, quests, story, dungeons" wtf?! just remove the whole game
    If you look at the sister thread of what people want to add, it's still dire but not as dire as you'd think  :p

    ______________________

    There really are a lot of things that can be tossed aside and you still have a great MMO.  One of my favorites from last year Screeps (AI programming RTS is 500-1000 player servers running 24/7):  literally uses leveling as a way to stop unlimited growth (and soften killing blows),  has no story, no instancing, and no official "guilding" mechanics (but alliances that players make are pretty amazing leading to massive world wars).   

    Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member RarePosts: 27,767
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 

    So Neverwinter is your go to game?

    nah .. it is silly to have one "go to game". But in terms of lobby-based dungeon gameplay, Diablo, PoE, Warframe, Torchlight 2 ... there are tons of good ones. 
  • thunderCthunderC Member EpicPosts: 1,621
    Tokens, tokens and &^^^% TOKENS!!! I Despise a loot system the rewards tokens on dungeon/raid runs. The magic of WOW in early days was always the "unknown" of whats going to drop. I hate everything about a system that has you planning out exactly what will be getting and when you will be getting it.

      
  • BluefishBluefish Member UncommonPosts: 85
    Raids

    Cash shops

    Quests to very a large extent

    Mobs porting back to their respawn points on full heath after moving a pathetically short distance (my pet hate)

    Sparkly combat graphics

    I'd prefer a PvE game, there aren't enough around any more, so for my game, no PvP, or at least stick it somewhere I can avoid it without limiting my play-style


    4507
  • WizardryWizardry Member EpicPosts: 14,459
    I would leave out 99% of any producer or developer that has a hand in 99% of the mmorpg's i see today,most don't have a clue how to design a mmorpg.I would hire 99% new faces,new people with SMART,intelligent ideas,people that can think a bit and understand the phrase"makes sense".A lot of what i see in games today do not make any sense at all,so i would leave out anything and anyone that has had anything to do with dumb ideas.

    CUTE,there is a fine line to having cutesy in your game,over sized weapons,over sized breasts,pfft i'd like to think people play my game on merit and not on goofy ideas.I do not need any 20 digit numbers on my screen,i might even put some thought into removing number damage altogether as in reality it only mildly makes sense.I mean in real life if you hurt yourself or experience pain someone might say "on a scale of 1-10" how much does it hurt,but your re NEVER going to say ,oh man that looked like 24,756 damage.
    So yeah mostly eliminate all the nonsense i see in games,it would be geared towards the mature.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • BcudaBcuda Member UncommonPosts: 120
    What would i leave out? The persistent virtual world, and the associated long walks. 

    Just focus on fun instanced combat gameplay and a convenient lobby. Don't make me walk 5 min before something fun happens. 
    You dont want an mmo you want pubg
    SovrathJean-Luc_PicardSteelhelm
  • kjempffkjempff Member RarePosts: 1,451
    edited February 20
    -Story (as in story driven content)
    -Shop (as in all connection between shop and ingame items or services)
    -Voice chat (also externally, by trying to design the game to need it as little as possible)
    -Endgame (defined by gear building and raiding as the only endgame.. I want "infinite" character progression system like skill system and more)
    -Short fights, swarm combat (combat should mean something and have tactical components, not just mindless slaughter or twitchy key spamming)
    -ALL references to pop culture, real life holidays/events, religion/politic/racial and other immersion breaking stuff (sorry no christams trees or valentine day and no Chuck Morris npc either)
    -Balancing for pvp and between class/builds (adjustments should primary be focused on improving co-op play and fun factor)


    Post edited by kjempff on
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