I personally aren't anti police, but pro logic and facts. The video clearly shows they didnt even try to figure out anything and came to the home cocked and loaded to kill.
The information they had at the time, thanks to the SWATTER, was that someone was in the house who was a threat to them. They came prepared to defend themselves and prevent that person from harming others. They didn't have the 20/20 hind sight that we are privileged with now. If you've never been in their situation then you won't understand how tense of a situation that is.
Always some cop hating morons to second guess people who never know if they are coming home from work. There are half a million cops in the U.S., there are about 1000 people killed by cops every year. Do the math. If cops were a bunch of blood thirsty killers I think we would see more killed. Most cops go their whole career without ever having to fire their weapon. FACT.
Here's the math for you:
But I don't think it's the fault of USA police. People of USA have time and again elected that everyone must have access to guns, and the police must meet this force with even greater force. The people have decided that this is the way it's done in USA.
Not even close to a case. THey have one charge of false 911 call. After that charge he is cleared of anything the police did on their own. Any good attorney will defeat the charges.
The person in question has no ability to control the actions of anyone accept himself which he place the 911. This is why the are trying a invulatary charge becasuse they know the real crime was committed by the officers.
The key phrase that will get detroyed " which lead" , why did it lead ? What was the circumstances of the shooting ? this kid had absolutely no control of that situation , at all.
Understanding of the law = 0
They have charged with involuntary because due to his reckless act, a person is dead. Period. Had he not called, that person would be alive. Period. Its as black and white as that.
how are police action the responsibilty of caller ?
Because he started a chain of events that led to the death of a person. If no call was made, that man would be alive. It was a reckless act that led through an unbroken chain of events to the death of someone. The SWAT team member may also be charged if he is found to jave been in the wrong. It is not either/or.
You don't have to directly kill someone to be charged with murder. One example. If you are robbing a bank with another person and that other person shoots and kills someone during the commission of the crime, you can also be charged with murder.
I posted the police video, watch that then reread your own post.
Ok, that video changes nothing. Even if the SWAT member is found guilty of murder that doesn't absolve the SWATTER (although I think the shooting will be deemed justified). He still started the chain of events through an illegal action that directly led to that man's death. Without his knowingly false report the police would not have been at the house.
I don't agree with Swatting, but still he isn't the one who did the murder, he did a crime absolutely, but as we all know police who shoot innocent people get away with pretty much everything and are not held accountable simply because of the fact they are the LAW, and because of Training, even though it was clearly a hoax they could have prevented the shooting in the first place I mean Swat Team has AR-15's with scopes they could have known if they were armed for sure.
If you're being told by the police to keep your hands up don't put them down and reach for your waistband. The police are justified.
What if you're not an expert on being drawn down on by police? You should die? Cool.
So the police should have to wait until someone gets a gun out of their waste band and gets a few shots off before they can react? Cool. Come on down and I'll put you in the front of the stack on my next arrest.
United States street police are incompetently trained, trigger happy, and too scared to be responsible for high tension situations. They aren't legit first response anymore. Other countries deal with the similar situations better. It doesn't take a genius to see this. They need a massive retraining or there needs to be another branch of law enforcement created and the responsibility stripped away from PD. You can be obtuse all you want for whatever reason you please, we'll just disagree. I'm not hearing you.
I give all praise to Firefighters, Ambulance, and volunteers.
"As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*"
Up to 36 months in jail... and an innocent person remains dead without justice being served.
And that, my friends, is why crime in the US is as high and frequent as it is. Crime gets you a short vacation with roof over your head, food and shower every day, and whatever else they do in there.
The justice system in this country is a big fat turd.
Always some cop hating morons to second guess people who never know if they are coming home from work. There are half a million cops in the U.S., there are about 1000 people killed by cops every year. Do the math. If cops were a bunch of blood thirsty killers I think we would see more killed. Most cops go their whole career without ever having to fire their weapon. FACT.
Here's the math for you:
But I don't think it's the fault of USA police. People of USA have time and again elected that everyone must have access to guns, and the police must meet this force with even greater force. The people have decided that this is the way it's done in USA.
It's something I've thought many times when I see the stats. If I were a cop in a country where everyone's packing I'd be pretty damn quick to (over?)react too.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Not even close to a case. THey have one charge of false 911 call. After that charge he is cleared of anything the police did on their own. Any good attorney will defeat the charges.
The person in question has no ability to control the actions of anyone accept himself which he place the 911. This is why the are trying a invulatary charge becasuse they know the real crime was committed by the officers.
The key phrase that will get detroyed " which lead" , why did it lead ? What was the circumstances of the shooting ? this kid had absolutely no control of that situation , at all.
Understanding of the law = 0
They have charged with involuntary because due to his reckless act, a person is dead. Period. Had he not called, that person would be alive. Period. Its as black and white as that.
how are police action the responsibilty of caller ?
Because he started a chain of events that led to the death of a person. If no call was made, that man would be alive. It was a reckless act that led through an unbroken chain of events to the death of someone. The SWAT team member may also be charged if he is found to jave been in the wrong. It is not either/or.
You don't have to directly kill someone to be charged with murder. One example. If you are robbing a bank with another person and that other person shoots and kills someone during the commission of the crime, you can also be charged with murder.
I posted the police video, watch that then reread your own post.
Ok, that video changes nothing. Even if the SWAT member is found guilty of murder that doesn't absolve the SWATTER (although I think the shooting will be deemed justified). He still started the chain of events through an illegal action that directly led to that man's death. Without his knowingly false report the police would not have been at the house.
you are using emotion instead of logic. I will simple have to disagree with your opinion
Emotion? Where? You can disagree all you want. He'll be found guilty.
United States street police are incompetently trained, trigger happy, and too scared to be responsible for high tension situations. They aren't legit first response anymore. Other countries deal with the similar situations better. It doesn't take a genius to see this. They need a massive retraining or there needs to be another branch of law enforcement created and the responsibility stripped away from PD. You can be obtuse all you want for whatever reason you please, we'll just disagree. I'm not hearing you.
I give all praise to Firefighters, Ambulance, and volunteers.
Cops arw too scared? Looks like we've got a hero here. I especially liked all of the supporting facts you used in your argument. My comment was just your obtuse reasoning from a different view point. I'm not surprised you are "not hearing me". You might be able to present a better argument if you listened a bit.
Up to 36 months in jail... and an innocent person remains dead without justice being served.
And that, my friends, is why crime in the US is as high and frequent as it is. Crime gets you a short vacation with roof over your head, food and shower every day, and whatever else they do in there.
The justice system in this country is a big fat turd.
I can tell from my experience in prison, you are dead wrong. that kid is going to get raped if he goes to a state pen. You might think that is great, but the fact is, he didnt pull the trigger.
He knew his action could easily lead to wrongful death, and was charged in the past for a similar crime so he was aware of the danger. Going easy on crime is never a solution. Yes, the officer who pulled the trigger should be charged as well, but nobody would have died if this guy hadn't been an idiot.
He had his second chance and he blew it, and this time an innocent died.
I don't agree with Swatting, but still he isn't the one who did the murder, he did a crime absolutely, but as we all know police who shoot innocent people get away with pretty much everything and are not held accountable simply because of the fact they are the LAW, and because of Training, even though it was clearly a hoax they could have prevented the shooting in the first place I mean Swat Team has AR-15's with scopes they could have known if they were armed for sure.
If you're being told by the police to keep your hands up don't put them down and reach for your waistband. The police are justified.
What if you're not an expert on being drawn down on by police? You should die? Cool.
So the police should have to wait until someone gets a gun out of their waste band and gets a few shots off before they can react? Cool. Come on down and I'll put you in the front of the stack on my next arrest.
It's called being trained properly, and having proper protocols. If it's too difficult or dangerous to deal with civilians because of fear, there are other professions, straight like that. It's a tough ask and I feel those who are capable should be paid accordingly and held in the highest regard. Unfortunately that's not what's happening in the US.
I don't know what that last sentence was insinuating but, a hasty "mistake" on one of mine would more than likely result in something purposeful in return. That's what needs to be avoided at all costs.
"As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*"
Pretty sad he didn't get life in prison, but 3 years and a fine he will likely being paying off most of his life due to being unable to get a good job or a job outside the service industry ever again is still not a trivial thing. He may have his freedom, but his life is ruined. Good on that at least. Personally, I think people who SWAT should get tried for assault and sued by their respective state for wasting valuable tax payer dollars and police resources on bullshit.
They should have banned him from internet / computer use as well if you ask me.
Pretty sad he didn't get life in prison, but 3 years and a fine he will likely being paying off most of his life due to being unable to get a good job or a job outside the service industry ever again is still not a trivial thing. He may have his freedom, but his life is ruined. Good on that at least. Personally, I think people who SWAT should get tried for assault and sued by their respective state for wasting valuable tax payer dollars and police resources on bullshit.
They should have banned him from internet / computer use as well if you ask me.
I agree. This guy should get the book thrown in his face. They can be lenient later but his charges and sentencing should have sent a message. If a death occurs during the commission of a felony the charge is 1st degree murder. He weaponized the bumbling of law enforcement and an innocent party is dead and gone forever.
"As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*"
So he intentionally got someone killed and he gets that punishment ( yes intentionally, we know exactly how the police force is over there) and gets let off with that type of punishment.
Up to 3 years jail time?
Shocking.
As a law enforcement officer in the US, I have to ask. Exactly how am I? Please explain further since you appear to know me so well.
Ignore them, even law enforcement funds certain things disgusting. But we have laws in place, most of them made ages ago that need to be renewed.
free 7 day sub and unlocks for swtor new accounts and 90+ day inactive subs click here to get it!
I would just like to point out that the police are in no way responsible unless the investigation deems the officer in question was not reacting to the situation appropriately. The guy reached towards his waste band when he was told to freeze and leave his hands in the air. He got shot. End of story. Yeah, it is completely messed up but you have to think about it this way: What if he did have a gun?
Don't give me that crap about "ohh they need to be trained better!" you are talking about a job that takes a considerable amount of time to train and one where you are constantly risking your life to protect idiots like us. People who would never even consider doing something as hard as risking your life daily. I mean, you can't blame the person who answered the call either. Just listen to the call itself:
This guy is spooky real sounding, there is no funny tone in his voice, he sounds completely normal in tone. There is no way they could just be like "oh this is a prank". They had to go in prepared for a hostage situation with a dude who was threatening to burn his whole house down and kill his whole family.
Yes, this video is in response to the other video. Funny how if you take a thing out of context it looks way worse then it is. Had to make sure you guys who are claiming it was the officer's fault had your comeuppance.
Up to 36 months in jail... and an innocent person remains dead without justice being served.
And that, my friends, is why crime in the US is as high and frequent as it is. Crime gets you a short vacation with roof over your head, food and shower every day, and whatever else they do in there.
The justice system in this country is a big fat turd.
I can tell from my experience in prison, you are dead wrong. that kid is going to get raped if he goes to a state pen. You might think that is great, but the fact is, he didnt pull the trigger.
He knew his action could easily lead to wrongful death, and was charged in the past for a similar crime so he was aware of the danger. Going easy on crime is never a solution. Yes, the officer who pulled the trigger should be charged as well, but nobody would have died if this guy hadn't been an idiot.
He had his second chance and he blew it, and this time an innocent died.
apparently the person has done it before, and no one was killed in those instances.... So, no he didn't know...
Would a reasonable human being be able to determine that aiming an armed SWAT team at someone could result in death? I argue that they could.
I would just like to point out that the police are in no way responsible unless the investigation deems the officer in question was not reacting to the situation appropriately. The guy reached towards his waste band when he was told to freeze and leave his hands in the air. He got shot. End of story. Yeah, it is completely messed up but you have to think about it this way: What if he did have a gun?
Don't give me that crap about "ohh they need to be trained better!" you are talking about a job that takes a considerable amount of time to train and one where you are constantly risking your life to protect idiots like us. I mean, you can't blame the person who answered the call either. Just listen to the call itself:
This guy is spooky real sounding, there is no funny tone in his voice, he sounds completely normal in tone. There is no way they could just be like "oh this is a prank". They had to go in prepared for a hostage situation with a dude who was threatening to burn his whole house down and kill his whole family.
Apparently you live in a world where this only happens because of SWATing in video games.
It's all "what if he had a gun" "the guy reached" "don't give me that crap" until its YOU or one of yours.
A random idiot with a telephone can weaponize the police across state lines to potentially murder. Why is that, and what does that say to more nefarious parties in the world?
"As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*"
Not even close to a case. THey have one charge of false 911 call. After that charge he is cleared of anything the police did on their own. Any good attorney will defeat the charges.
The person in question has no ability to control the actions of anyone accept himself which he place the 911. This is why the are trying a invulatary charge becasuse they know the real crime was committed by the officers.
The key phrase that will get detroyed " which lead" , why did it lead ? What was the circumstances of the shooting ? this kid had absolutely no control of that situation , at all.
Understanding of the law = 0
They have charged with involuntary because due to his reckless act, a person is dead. Period. Had he not called, that person would be alive. Period. Its as black and white as that.
how are police action the responsibilty of caller ?
Because he started a chain of events that led to the death of a person. If no call was made, that man would be alive. It was a reckless act that led through an unbroken chain of events to the death of someone. The SWAT team member may also be charged if he is found to jave been in the wrong. It is not either/or.
You don't have to directly kill someone to be charged with murder. One example. If you are robbing a bank with another person and that other person shoots and kills someone during the commission of the crime, you can also be charged with murder.
I posted the police video, watch that then reread your own post.
Ok, that video changes nothing. Even if the SWAT member is found guilty of murder that doesn't absolve the SWATTER (although I think the shooting will be deemed justified). He still started the chain of events through an illegal action that directly led to that man's death. Without his knowingly false report the police would not have been at the house.
you are using emotion instead of logic. I will simple have to disagree with your opinion
Emotion? Where? You can disagree all you want. He'll be found guilty.
Did he tell the officer to kill the man ? Or did he make up an erronous statement. From what I've experienced, we are proven innocent until the day of court. Why is the man dead ? Why wasn;t he given the chance to declare innocence ? How can he declare innocence if he is dead ? Innocent until proven guilty, not " open the door and get blown the fuck away". Cop guaranteed manslaughter, all other get criminal misdemeanors
He's not being charged with telling the officer to kill the man. He's being charged with committing a crime that recklessly lead to the death of another person.
Up to 36 months in jail... and an innocent person remains dead without justice being served.
And that, my friends, is why crime in the US is as high and frequent as it is. Crime gets you a short vacation with roof over your head, food and shower every day, and whatever else they do in there.
The justice system in this country is a big fat turd.
I can tell from my experience in prison, you are dead wrong. that kid is going to get raped if he goes to a state pen. You might think that is great, but the fact is, he didnt pull the trigger.
He knew his action could easily lead to wrongful death, and was charged in the past for a similar crime so he was aware of the danger. Going easy on crime is never a solution. Yes, the officer who pulled the trigger should be charged as well, but nobody would have died if this guy hadn't been an idiot.
He had his second chance and he blew it, and this time an innocent died.
apparently the person has done it before, and no one was killed in those instances.... So, no he didn't know...
Would a reasonable human being be able to determine that aiming an armed SWAT team at someone could result in death? I argue that they could.
At the same time, isn;t reasonable that if someone opens their door they are given more then 4 seconds to comply with officer directions instead of getting blown away ?
If an officer thinks you are reaching for a weapon, is it reasonable to expect the officer to wait 4 seconds to find out? That could easily mean his or her death. Do you understand that we are talking about a human being in a ridiculously stressful, split-second, life or death situation? There is no pause, there is no respawn when you die.
I'm not sure what this video has to do with the swatting incident we're discussing, but since you posted it: It happens, and it's horrible. That's the result at times when you have imperfect human beings reacting to incredibly stressful situations. What are we supposed to do as a country, take guns away from the police when they are dealing on a daily basis with armed thugs? The only solution that I can think of is better training, but even that isn't going to remove the element of a fallible human being.
What about US cops who apparently can be used as unpaid - yet professional and well equipped - killers by anyone with an Internet access? Do they get real sentence or just an indulgence to kill more people (possibly from ISIS calling next time)?
What about US cops who apparently can be used as unpaid - yet professional and well equipped - killers by anyone with an Internet access? Do they get real sentence or just an indulgence to kill more people (possibly from ISIS calling next time)?
If they are grossly negligent or willfully violent where the situation doesn't call for it, of course they should be held accountable. But you can't find every cop that shoots someone guilty of a crime.
Comments
But I don't think it's the fault of USA police. People of USA have time and again elected that everyone must have access to guns, and the police must meet this force with even greater force. The people have decided that this is the way it's done in USA.
~~ postlarval ~~
I give all praise to Firefighters, Ambulance, and volunteers.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
And that, my friends, is why crime in the US is as high and frequent as it is. Crime gets you a short vacation with roof over your head, food and shower every day, and whatever else they do in there.
The justice system in this country is a big fat turd.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
He had his second chance and he blew it, and this time an innocent died.
I don't know what that last sentence was insinuating but, a hasty "mistake" on one of mine would more than likely result in something purposeful in return. That's what needs to be avoided at all costs.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ignore them, even law enforcement funds certain things disgusting. But we have laws in place, most of them made ages ago that need to be renewed.
free 7 day sub and unlocks for swtor new accounts and 90+ day inactive subs click here to get it!
Click here for trove referral, bonuses to both!
Don't give me that crap about "ohh they need to be trained better!" you are talking about a job that takes a considerable amount of time to train and one where you are constantly risking your life to protect idiots like us. People who would never even consider doing something as hard as risking your life daily. I mean, you can't blame the person who answered the call either. Just listen to the call itself:
This guy is spooky real sounding, there is no funny tone in his voice, he sounds completely normal in tone. There is no way they could just be like "oh this is a prank". They had to go in prepared for a hostage situation with a dude who was threatening to burn his whole house down and kill his whole family.
Yes, this video is in response to the other video. Funny how if you take a thing out of context it looks way worse then it is. Had to make sure you guys who are claiming it was the officer's fault had your comeuppance.
Would a reasonable human being be able to determine that aiming an armed SWAT team at someone could result in death? I argue that they could.
It's all "what if he had a gun" "the guy reached" "don't give me that crap" until its YOU or one of yours.
A random idiot with a telephone can weaponize the police across state lines to potentially murder. Why is that, and what does that say to more nefarious parties in the world?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
" Barriss is also wanted for his connection to another swatting incident in Calgary, Canada according to The Globe & Daily Mail
Read more at https://www.mmorpg.com/news/alleged-perpetrator-of-call-of-duty-wwii-swatting-death-indicted-for-involuntary-manslaughter-1000047036#KltEBk7CVC0UkIJX.99 "
Now that they have him He could also be deported to face Canadian Law. I hope at least they do it if it is possible.
If an officer thinks you are reaching for a weapon, is it reasonable to expect the officer to wait 4 seconds to find out? That could easily mean his or her death. Do you understand that we are talking about a human being in a ridiculously stressful, split-second, life or death situation? There is no pause, there is no respawn when you die.
"My bad, it's a stressful job. Better you than me. No respawns bruh"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm not sure what this video has to do with the swatting incident we're discussing, but since you posted it: It happens, and it's horrible. That's the result at times when you have imperfect human beings reacting to incredibly stressful situations. What are we supposed to do as a country, take guns away from the police when they are dealing on a daily basis with armed thugs? The only solution that I can think of is better training, but even that isn't going to remove the element of a fallible human being.
Thank you for your time!
If they are grossly negligent or willfully violent where the situation doesn't call for it, of course they should be held accountable. But you can't find every cop that shoots someone guilty of a crime.