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So I was playing ESO - captured this screenshot.

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  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,409
    Gorwe said:
    I should give ESO another go. Sure, it's much too loose for me(I prefer guided approach of SWTOR), but I haven't got anything better to play as is. Should I?
    The story line is quite "guided" if you follow it. You'll get new quests regularly for it.
    YashaXGorwe
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.
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  • WedlenWedlen Member UncommonPosts: 142
    I hate the combat system in this game. It doesn't feel right I can't explain it. 
    BellaHSovrathsumdumguy1
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 433
    Phry said:
    Golelorn said:
    Viper482 said:
    Honestly wish I could get into this game. I love TES, love MMO's....but this game just doesn't grab me at all.
    ... character customization is just so horribly bland.
    Can't be serious. There's more character development variations possible in this game than in most if not all other class based theme parks.
    While there is a certain amount of truth in that, the reality to me seems to be that choice of weapons to use and race has more impact/meaning than the 'class' chosen as its likely that only one or two abilities will really be all that useful, so you end up choosing between swords, 1handed or 2 handed, bows, or magical staff combat, the rest is pretty much akin to traits, they allow for a certain amount of 'variation' but i wouldn't say they were all that significant compared to weapon choices which is where the real 'class' determination seems to be made. :/
    That's so not true.

    Your character build depends on so many factors - weapons used, stat point distribution, skills used, mundus stone chosen, which gear combination(s) used (mixing light/med/heavy, set-bonuses), what traits applied... and so on.

    There are so many ways you can play any given Class, it's overwhelming. Take Sorcerer.. You can play a Stamina-based Sorc or a Magic-based sorc. Within either of those two approaches, there are numerous builds to try, based on different applications of the above-mentioned options available. It's not a case where, like in many (most?) other MMOs, options are pointless 'cause there's only one or two "viable builds". A number of builds can be viable in ESO.

    For example, here's just two examples of how you could build a Stamina-based Sorcerer... from the same person.
    Windwalker
    Deathstroke

    That's just two options out of many for one approach (stamina) to one class. There's plenty more options out there as well.

    In ESO, your class choice is where your character's options *begin*... unlike other titles where it's the end-definition of what it will become.

    There's simply no way a person can say with a straight-face that character build/customization is "bland", unless they're either really good at dead-pan humor, or they have no idea how ESO actually is and are talking out their rears. Though, I'm finding a lot of the criticism leveled at ESO is either people being blatantly dishonest, clinging to "how the game was at launch" as though it's still the same now, or just going on what they've heard others say.


    YashaXJean-Luc_Picard
  • GaxusnGaxusn Member UncommonPosts: 77
    edited October 2017
    I've just bought Morrowind for PS4, being delivered tomorrow. Not played in a long time, which was on PC, so hoping for a better experience this time around.

    I enjoyed it previously, but never got 'hooked'... here's hoping. 

    I do agree the game gets a lot of negativity and I don't understand why. Maybe because it's a step away from the normal WoW/EQ2/SWTOR/Rift etc... who knows.

    Definitely not a bad game by any means.

    @ OP: I like the screenshot, looks cool :smile:

    Playing: Nothing
    Played: EQ1, EQ2, VG:SoH, WoW, AoC, LoTRO, Aion, L2, DF, WAR.
    Favourites: EQ1, VG:SoH, Original WoW.
    Waiting: Pantheon: ROTF

  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    edited October 2017
    Phry said:
    Golelorn said:
    Viper482 said:
    Honestly wish I could get into this game. I love TES, love MMO's....but this game just doesn't grab me at all.
    ... character customization is just so horribly bland.
    Can't be serious. There's more character development variations possible in this game than in most if not all other class based theme parks.
    While there is a certain amount of truth in that, the reality to me seems to be that choice of weapons to use and race has more impact/meaning than the 'class' chosen as its likely that only one or two abilities will really be all that useful, so you end up choosing between swords, 1handed or 2 handed, bows, or magical staff combat, the rest is pretty much akin to traits, they allow for a certain amount of 'variation' but i wouldn't say they were all that significant compared to weapon choices which is where the real 'class' determination seems to be made. :/
    That's so not true.

    Your character build depends on so many factors - weapons used, stat point distribution, skills used, mundus stone chosen, which gear combination(s) used (mixing light/med/heavy, set-bonuses), what traits applied... and so on.

    There are so many ways you can play any given Class, it's overwhelming. Take Sorcerer.. You can play a Stamina-based Sorc or a Magic-based sorc. Within either of those two approaches, there are numerous builds to try, based on different applications of the above-mentioned options available. It's not a case where, like in many (most?) other MMOs, options are pointless 'cause there's only one or two "viable builds". A number of builds can be viable in ESO.

    For example, here's just two examples of how you could build a Stamina-based Sorcerer... from the same person.
    Windwalker
    Deathstroke

    That's just two options out of many for one approach (stamina) to one class. There's plenty more options out there as well.

    In ESO, your class choice is where your character's options *begin*... unlike other titles where it's the end-definition of what it will become.

    There's simply no way a person can say with a straight-face that character build/customization is "bland", unless they're either really good at dead-pan humor, or they have no idea how ESO actually is and are talking out their rears. Though, I'm finding a lot of the criticism leveled at ESO is either people being blatantly dishonest, clinging to "how the game was at launch" as though it's still the same now, or just going on what they've heard others say.


    Hahahahaha, let me list the ways you are incorrect.

    Stamina DPS= Dual Wield/Bow
    Tank= Sword and board
    Healing= Resto staff
    Magicka DPS= Destro staff and/or Dual Wield depending on how zenimax is messing with passives.

    Anything else is gimp.

    They let you think you have choices, but their meta is so much of a runaway train that running anything else is just plain stupid.

    I LOVE every single other aspect of ESO, but the customization is laughable because of a lack of viable alternatives.
    Post edited by Kajidourden on
  • TaishiFoxTaishiFox Member RarePosts: 980
    Please stop bumping this thread, its months old ._.
    PhryTheScavenger

    imageimage
    image

  • sumdumguy1sumdumguy1 Member RarePosts: 1,357
    Gorwe said:
    Gorwe said:
    I should give ESO another go. Sure, it's much too loose for me(I prefer guided approach of SWTOR), but I haven't got anything better to play as is. Should I?
    The story line is quite "guided" if you follow it. You'll get new quests regularly for it.

    Thank you. After I secure my SWTOR characters, I'll give it a shot. Truly this time. I mean, there isn't any other MMO I even could think of playing, so why not?
    Wedlen said:
    I hate the combat system in this game. It doesn't feel right I can't explain it. 

    Yeah, I experienced the inverse version of this with Dark Souls III. I like it so much, but I'm not certain why. Something with colors and aesthetics etc. Quite irrational.

    I went back a few months ago.  I couldn't make it past a week and a few days.  The combat is not good and the story felt convoluted to me.   This game just doesn't work for me like the others I play. 
  • MyrradahMyrradah Member UncommonPosts: 98
    I quit ESO. I did animation canceling and learned how to do it and got very good with it. But its not a feature it is broke and Zenimax took the easy way out and said it was a feature. Lame..fix it.
    YashaX
  • shassellshassell Member UncommonPosts: 105
    Quit also. Played for a long time from release but due to work commitments I gave it a break for awhile. When I returned I found that it had changed completely to level scaling. On the plus side it gives a player a challenge anywhere but for me it killed the game. Mat drops for crafting now all level based, no point in travelling anymore. Mobs all the same bland level scaled borefest... no point in travelling or exploring. As all the mobs scale to your level, there is no point in levelling except to get to endgame content, which is now the entire focus of the game. Gear grind pointless boring generic pap. 
  • drivendawndrivendawn Member RarePosts: 2,144
    edited October 2017
    Yeah, it reminds me of the book covers from forgotten realms and raven loft that I have read over the decades.  :)
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 433
    TaishiFox said:
    Please stop bumping this thread, its months old ._.
    You do realize what you just did there, right?

    You do also realize what you could have done instead, right?

    I hope the answer to both questions is 'yes'.






    Phry
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 14,681
    Hahahahaha, let me list the ways you are incorrect.

    Stamina DPS= Dual Wield/Bow
    Tank= Sword and board
    Healing= Resto staff
    Magicka DPS= Destro staff and/or Dual Wield depending on how zenimax is messing with passives.

    Anything else is gimp.

    Well that's what min-maxers will do in every game they play lol. For them I think it's better to not give them the ability to build their own. Classes with strict separations probably seem like more variety for them.... go figure.
    QuarterStackGdemami
    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

    "... the "influencers" which is the tech name we call sell outs now..."
    __ Wizardry, 2020
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 433
    edited October 2017


    Hahahahaha, let me list the ways you are incorrect.

    Stamina DPS= Dual Wield/Bow
    Tank= Sword and board
    Healing= Resto staff
    Magicka DPS= Destro staff and/or Dual Wield depending on how zenimax is messing with passives.

    Anything else is gimp.

    They let you think you have choices, but their meta is so much of a runaway train that running anything else is just plain stupid.

    I LOVE every single other aspect of ESO, but the customization is laughable because of a lack of viable alternatives.
    So, here's my dilemma after reading that.

    I can't decide if you're being disingenuous, are short-sighted, not very knowledgable about ESO, or just trolling. Each part of your post leaves a different impression, so maybe it's a little of each.

    At the very least, I would hope you realize that a build in ESO is significantly more than "what weapon am I using?". Right?

    Suffice it to say, your list there is amusingly over-simplified, in a number of ways.


    YashaXGdemamipostlarval
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 433
    Iselin said:
    Hahahahaha, let me list the ways you are incorrect.

    Stamina DPS= Dual Wield/Bow
    Tank= Sword and board
    Healing= Resto staff
    Magicka DPS= Destro staff and/or Dual Wield depending on how zenimax is messing with passives.

    Anything else is gimp.

    Well that's what min-maxers will do in every game they play lol. For them I think it's better to not give them the ability to build their own. Classes with strict separations probably seem like more variety for them.... go figure.
    Good point, that, as well!

    One thing many Min-Maxers have in common, is they can't comprehend that not everyone obsesses over numbers the way they do as the "be-all end-all" of MMO gaming. Had a friend in RL who was like that with FFXI. He never could understand how I could possibly enjoy the game if I wasn't playing it "optimally",  keeping up with the latest "ultimate build guide du-jour".
    SovrathGdemami
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    edited October 2017
    Iselin said:
    Hahahahaha, let me list the ways you are incorrect.

    Stamina DPS= Dual Wield/Bow
    Tank= Sword and board
    Healing= Resto staff
    Magicka DPS= Destro staff and/or Dual Wield depending on how zenimax is messing with passives.

    Anything else is gimp.

    Well that's what min-maxers will do in every game they play lol. For them I think it's better to not give them the ability to build their own. Classes with strict separations probably seem like more variety for them.... go figure.

    Except in most games it's a 10-15% increase, not a 200fucking% increase in performance.

    50k+ DPS vs 20 at best with a sub-optimal build.  Sorry but that's not "min-max" that's stupid vs performing well.

    There is an OUTRAGOEUS disparity between meta and non-meta builds in ESO, you cannot deny that unless you just have blinders on.
  • AlomarAlomar Member RarePosts: 1,260
    Just spent my last hour of ESO out of 2,867 hours in July. The game's got real potential for any ES fan, casual pve'ers, and rp'ers to be your mmo home. Yet, for any hardcore player the game's content and direction isn't aimed at you, so you'll need long breaks. After years of being an ESO hardcore pvper I've finally called it a quits after seeing 90%+ of the NA PC pvp community leave before me. WTB Elder Scrolls 6.
    Kajidourden
    Haxus Council Member
    21  year MMO veteran 
    PvP Raid Leader 
    Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 2,744
    Gorwe said:
    What kind of character would work for main story? I figured, sorry for Dark Souls spiel, some kind of Hexes + weapons. Nightblade? Melee Sorc? How'd you even end in Coldharbor? Be as it may, my favorite has to be Dunmer 2H Sword DK. But I don't really think it fits main story. Maybe for Morrowind.
    I think any character with decent aoe and survivability works well. 2H DK would be perfect, but basically anything except a stealthy single target focused NB would probably be OK.
    GdemamiGorwe
    ....
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,026
    YashaX said:
    Gorwe said:
    What kind of character would work for main story? I figured, sorry for Dark Souls spiel, some kind of Hexes + weapons. Nightblade? Melee Sorc? How'd you even end in Coldharbor? Be as it may, my favorite has to be Dunmer 2H Sword DK. But I don't really think it fits main story. Maybe for Morrowind.
    I think any character with decent aoe and survivability works well. 2H DK would be perfect, but basically anything except a stealthy single target focused NB would probably be OK.
    What Yasha said, just about anything will work for overworld content.  In instanced content (non-vet) you will be carried easily enough, in vet content you will be unable to complete objectives/survive, PARTICULARLY the newest DLC dungeons on vet which are always the hardest.
    Gdemami
  • cheyanecheyane Member LegendaryPosts: 7,422
    edited October 2017
    I should play this game again now that my video card has been upgraded (touch wood). I don't want it to read this  shhh...shhh it might decide to act up.

    I am however playing Everquest again on Project 1999 and as you all know you need to spend an inordinate amount of time to progress in Everquest so other games are off the table for now.
    Chamber of Chains
  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Member UncommonPosts: 1,940
  • HeraseHerase Member RarePosts: 993
    It's it a stunning game, the voice acting it amazing too. 

    I might be wrong, but feel they've added more, noticed NPCs seem to be having much more realistic interactions and dialog. Like Yesterday, heard a woman yell and saw this dog run off and she told another NPC that the dog bit her when she went to pet it and they had a little back and forth.

    I just found that really cool
    SlyLoKHariken
  • OhhPaigeyOhhPaigey Member RarePosts: 1,517
    The game is quite fun, I'm still trying to get my cousin to purchase the latest expansion so we can play through it, the Warden looks really cool, especially considering I mained a Druid in WoW for many years up until I quit recently.

    I had a couple concerns with the game though it seems to be more so the genre moving in a more casual direction.

    The end game rotations are (were, haven't played since the latest expansion) super easy. You have maybe a buff or two, a DoT or two to maintain, and then it's just regular attacks. I do wish there was more to the rotations, but maybe that's just me reminiscing.

    The other problem we ran into, is how awful the majority of the players were. The content itself was easier than finding good players, a lot of times we had to try and figure out how to run a dungeon just the two of us, because people wouldn't listen to boss mechanics, die and leave and nobody else would join. I was playing a dual dagger / bow Khajiit Sorc which was surprisingly really fun, but I had to switch it up to a templar with destruction/resto staff so I could heal parts with big incoming damage.

    Especially that stupid boss that chains a player down and makes you kill an add, it seemed like a pretty basic concept after our second try, but a lot of people couldn't grasp the concept.

    Anyway, had quite a bit of fun with the game, hoping to try the expansion soon. Heard they changed a lot of stuff (mostly regarding end game, specifically my build and a few others around) hopefully there's still a fun build or two around.
    When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,293
    YashaX said:
    Gorwe said:
    What kind of character would work for main story? I figured, sorry for Dark Souls spiel, some kind of Hexes + weapons. Nightblade? Melee Sorc? How'd you even end in Coldharbor? Be as it may, my favorite has to be Dunmer 2H Sword DK. But I don't really think it fits main story. Maybe for Morrowind.
    I think any character with decent aoe and survivability works well. 2H DK would be perfect, but basically anything except a stealthy single target focused NB would probably be OK.
    What Yasha said, just about anything will work for overworld content.  In instanced content (non-vet) you will be carried easily enough, in vet content you will be unable to complete objectives/survive, PARTICULARLY the newest DLC dungeons on vet which are always the hardest.

    Single player games work in a similar manner too. I'm playing through Pillars of Eternity with a friend (we're playing separate games at the same time) and it works just like ESO. If I play the game on the easiest setting I can enjoy it. As I raise the difficulty my character and party build options narrow until there are only a few viable ways to play on the hardest modes.

    The challenge levels are mostly illusion. Does a game get much more challenging if you play with the most powerful tools or does it just appear that way for the majority that don't have or use those tools?

    A music analogy. Great guitarists and musicians can sound amazing on a $150 Yamaha guitar. A crappy guitarist can sound great through an expensive sound system with an engineer tweaking the board. Is he really great or did he just have a bunch of tools that allowed him to play at that level.
    Iselin
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • skullquakerskullquaker Member UncommonPosts: 311
    only just got back in to ESO, the game dose feel a lot better from the first days of launch loving  the dark brotherhood  assassin skills  
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 14,681
    Torval said:
    YashaX said:
    Gorwe said:
    What kind of character would work for main story? I figured, sorry for Dark Souls spiel, some kind of Hexes + weapons. Nightblade? Melee Sorc? How'd you even end in Coldharbor? Be as it may, my favorite has to be Dunmer 2H Sword DK. But I don't really think it fits main story. Maybe for Morrowind.
    I think any character with decent aoe and survivability works well. 2H DK would be perfect, but basically anything except a stealthy single target focused NB would probably be OK.
    What Yasha said, just about anything will work for overworld content.  In instanced content (non-vet) you will be carried easily enough, in vet content you will be unable to complete objectives/survive, PARTICULARLY the newest DLC dungeons on vet which are always the hardest.

    Single player games work in a similar manner too. I'm playing through Pillars of Eternity with a friend (we're playing separate games at the same time) and it works just like ESO. If I play the game on the easiest setting I can enjoy it. As I raise the difficulty my character and party build options narrow until there are only a few viable ways to play on the hardest modes.

    The challenge levels are mostly illusion. Does a game get much more challenging if you play with the most powerful tools or does it just appear that way for the majority that don't have or use those tools?

    A music analogy. Great guitarists and musicians can sound amazing on a $150 Yamaha guitar. A crappy guitarist can sound great through an expensive sound system with an engineer tweaking the board. Is he really great or did he just have a bunch of tools that allowed him to play at that level.
    Agreed. That was exactly what I was getting at when I said min-maxers do this in every game. And that's every MMO that has end-game difficult content as well as single player RPGs in hard mode.

    I'm not aware of any MMO where the most difficult trials don't exclude classes, specs and builds from their approved list. This may change slightly from one balancing iteration to the next but it exists in all of them.

    Trials are time consuming challenges and people who are into clearing them and especially being the first, don't want to waste time having players in them with iffy specs. Word gets out what is and isn't allowed in those and this gives rise to the meta builds.

    It's been happening for so long in so many games and it has persisted through so many balancing iterations by so many different developer teams that I honestly do not believe that it's a problem that can be solved. It's just the PVE version of the equally elusive PVP balance.

    And just like the highest end PVP, Its also something the vast majority players really do not give much of a shit about. Game play at those "best of the best" levels synthesizes game play down to numbers and the player is just an operator of some impersonal sequence of keystrokes.

    Leaving trials aside, ESO 4-man dungeons are all about sometimes tricky mechanics that, once learned, become very easy and almost trivial. They are NOT about running the optimal trials-derived meta spec except to the very bored elitist speed runner who wants to always run them in record time as if they were some painful chore they need to get through as quickly as humanly possible.

    I've run all the veteran dungeons in ESO multiple times with a huge variety of different specs as DPS, healer and tank. The main reason those DLC ones - especially the newer ones - seem more challenging is because the developer team is always looking for new tricks and mechanics to throw at us - mechanics that often have zero to do with your build. What the elite DPS builds do in them is they allow players to kill things fast enough that they can cheese through avoiding a lot of the mechanics.

    So when I hear someone talking about how ESO has meta builds that must be played or else be "carried" through vet dungeons, what I hear is "speed runner cheesing through content."


    Jean-Luc_PicardQuarterStackTorvalunfilteredJW
    “Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” 
    ― CD PROJEKT RED

    "... the "influencers" which is the tech name we call sell outs now..."
    __ Wizardry, 2020
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