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Interesting read: Is EverQuest II in a downward spiral?

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  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,293
    Albatroes said:
    DMKano said:
    gervaise1 said:
    Grimula said:

    still Thousand's of people playing EQ 2 (Regardless of what you people think)

    <snip>

    Whatever the number is it is enough for DBG (CN) to keep the game going.


    It is - also there's the notion of maintaining EQ brand and not shuttering EQ2 due to negative PR.

    Sometimes companies will keep an under-performing product running because of brand alone.


    Could kind of explain why FFXI didn't shut down and is still being "updated" even though the "updates" just consist of stuff being shifted around to make it seem "new." But its something I suppose. Some of the stuff they are doing to XI are pretty scummy to say the least though and desperate. Hate seeing that happen
    Final Fantasy absolutely is a brand with value. Not just the games of course. And FFXI is probably still making money now that they have stopped doing "updates". It still has a sub.

    As @DMKano says it is possible that DBG could keep EQ2 going if it wasn't making money but if they wanted to simply "maintain" the brand they would only need to keep EQ1 or EQ2 going not both. So I am inclined to lean towards "both are making ends meet" currently.

    As to whether DBG would, come the crunch, keep one of the games going if they were both losing money - certainly possible but I don't think they would. Would be a CN call though not a DBG one.
    craftseeker
  • laxielaxie Member RarePosts: 1,044
    When I left EQ2 in 2014, the population on AB (one of the more populated servers) was in the hundreds - and that's being generous. I would be surprised if this was very different today. Some people may have returned to play on the "vanilla" servers, but their population is not booming either.

    I agree with others that guild halls and endgame don't help. They always made the population feel less than what it was. But that doesn't change the painful fact that the total online population is close to nothing overall.

    I think the only reason why EQ2 is still running is the DBG transition. They are now owned by an investment group, and the most valuable asset they bought is the EQ brand. The investors couldn't have bought SOE hoping to make long term profits on current products. They probably don't feel comfortable making further investments to create new products (hence the EQNext cancellation). So the goal likely is to keep the brand going and then sell it off to an interested buyer?

    How do these investment meetings even work? Do the people investing know the space? I wondered this in relation to things like the SOE buyout, but also in ESports. Are the tech people pitching crazy projections? They can't be buying based on current numbers, right?

    "We have 3 million registered users across all our products! Imagine the exposure and reach you could have!"
    "Well, let's have a look at the financials Bob, how much in sales did you make last quarter?"
    "If we launch EQ Next, we are looking at 1 million sold copies, plus micro transactions Q1 next year. And that's a cautious guess! Did you know gaming is a billion dollar industry, with females playing as many games as males these days? It's an untapped gold mine!"
    "That's interesting, so you're telling me your products reach a diverse audience. And you have access to 3 million registered users who follow your products?"
    "And we will have more! Did you know 90% of our active player base buys our expansions?!"
  • skadadskadad Member UncommonPosts: 377
    Grimula said:

    still Thousand's of people playing EQ 2 (Regardless of what you people think)

    the Marketplace sells cosmetic items , Nothing you need to buy

    I have over 300  USA dollars worth of marketplace cash from the Years of Free cash every month

    and I have never wanted to spend 1 cent of it in the Shop

    just waiting for 1 day something catches my eye.

    And exp potions and stuff. Also the spellupgrades nowadays, so just cosmetic is kind of bs :dizzy:

  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member RarePosts: 807
    Both games announced upcoming expansions fairly recently.

    The last expansion for EQ claimed to have added seven expansion zones, eight raids, new quests and missions, and a new feature for familiars.

    The last expansion for EQII claimed to have added new dungeons (some for raids), four new ascension classes (whatever that is), a mercenary equipment system, and other stuff.

    That seems a lot of work for games on their last legs.
    Kyleran
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 33,937
    Both games announced upcoming expansions fairly recently.

    The last expansion for EQ claimed to have added seven expansion zones, eight raids, new quests and missions, and a new feature for familiars.

    The last expansion for EQII claimed to have added new dungeons (some for raids), four new ascension classes (whatever that is), a mercenary equipment system, and other stuff.

    That seems a lot of work for games on their last legs.
    The original article was focused on the lack of visibility at recent gaming events and a slowdown in communication.

    That expansion you mentioned was set in motion a year or two previously and may not reflect current plans.

    There have been MMOs previously which scaled back or closed shortly after the launch of an expansion, so no guarantees just from seeing one.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing POE at the moment.

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  • KnightFalzKnightFalz Member RarePosts: 807
    Kyleran said:
    Both games announced upcoming expansions fairly recently.

    The last expansion for EQ claimed to have added seven expansion zones, eight raids, new quests and missions, and a new feature for familiars.

    The last expansion for EQII claimed to have added new dungeons (some for raids), four new ascension classes (whatever that is), a mercenary equipment system, and other stuff.

    That seems a lot of work for games on their last legs.
    The original article was focused on the lack of visibility at recent gaming events and a slowdown in communication.

    That expansion you mentioned was set in motion a year or two previously and may not reflect current plans.

    There have been MMOs previously which scaled back or closed shortly after the launch of an expansion, so no guarantees just from seeing one.
    Yeah.... The upcoming expansions were just announced in the second half of last month. That would be current. The ones I detailed have been out for some time.

    Any game can be closed at any time, so pretty much... that point is pointless.
  • tixylixtixylix Member UncommonPosts: 1,288
    Scorchien said:
    ummm  EQ 2 has been in a downward spiral since 2009 .............. this is not news ..

    launch more like
  • Mackaveli44Mackaveli44 Member RarePosts: 580
    edited December 2017
    Both games announced upcoming expansions fairly recently.

    The last expansion for EQ claimed to have added seven expansion zones, eight raids, new quests and missions, and a new feature for familiars.

    The last expansion for EQII claimed to have added new dungeons (some for raids), four new ascension classes (whatever that is), a mercenary equipment system, and other stuff.

    That seems a lot of work for games on their last legs.
    EQ2 expansions haven't been "expansions" since the Kunark expansion was released.  Everything post Kunark has been complete shit in terms of feeling like they're expansions.  You pay a fee for something that's the size of a game patch now from Daybreak.  Its fuckin horrible what Daybreak has turned into.  Its a shame too cause I've been a die hard EQ franchise fan since EQ1 launched. 

    Hopefully Pantheon will be decent... well, I take that back, I know Pantheon will be better than anything Daybreak is putting out.  Daybreaks all about $$$$$ now and little to no passion. 
    Luiden
  • Cybersig211Cybersig211 Member UncommonPosts: 128
    Elephant in the room:  How many companies do you think bid or attempted to buy the remanence of SOE?

    Think about all the chinese gaming companies who are desperate to get western gamers into their publishing pools.  These companies have money.  How did some unknown investment company end up the winner of the SOE catalogue? 

    I think most companies knew mmorpgs are on their deathbed and buying a catalogue of games including several on their last leg, and a buggy mess of a pvp sandbox probably yielded little to no offers.   the SOE group of games seem to me to be more money pits than investment.  Im betting other than H1Z1 all their games are just barely break even, and H1Z1 probably yields some profits but not much considering what they have to spend on development.

    What im getting at here is that Daybreak isnt some trailblazer investment company gone gaming.  Its an investment company that probably bid low and won because few bothered to bid.  

    So they cut all but the vital workers, killed anything that wasn't making even a slight profit, and put into their games as little as they can to eek by a profit.  

    I wouldn't expect anything more than keeping the games alive until the profits equal zero.

    Reading up on the parent investment firm of columbus nova, they have about 200-300m investments TOTAL across all their investments. this is a small firm that seems to scoop up investments of opportunity.

    For them to kill their potential money maker EQ:NEXT is all you need to know about this company.  They want the quick easy money off the H1Z1 and will allow other projects to run until unprofitable then they will kill it without question.  They are not about growing the brands, other than maybe H1Z1 which they failed spectacularly to grow.

    Best thing they could do for the IP is sell it off to an indy company with some funding who is passionate.  They can keep H1Z1 and milk that for what its worth.  Do the IP justice, allow the sale of all EQ IP including the unfinished next game.  The only passionate people are the leftover developers working directly on the game, there is no passion from the parent company.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 16,452
    I have my own hunch and it is not about gaming.I don't really want to get into the whole shebam but imo DBG is there as a front,sort of like money laundering.
    Everything is sketchy from the owner claiming to not be a part of the Ogliarch's realm but he most certainly is.
    There is always obvious signs,the same  as i knew likely as most did that Trump is big time a crooked President that should have never been voted in.Just look back at the takeover,claims of things wil be the same,we plan on doing this and that but laid off half the employees lol.It was even funnier when they made a statement something to the effect of they were all about the community but of course laid off the community employees ,again lol.

    Point being,it SHOULD shut down but it won't,they want that office there for OTHER reasons.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 407
    edited January 15
    Oh, how unprecedented! People on a forum saying a MMORPG is dying. I've never read/heard that anywhere before. Certainly not in pretty much every MMORPG's forums I've ever read. Nope. Not at all.

    Folks, I'm sure your "concern" about EQ2's status is duly noted, but it's doing fine. EQ has been going since 1999. EQ2 has been going since 2004. Both are still receiving updates, expansions, and support. Both still have active player-bases. Whether the population is small or large or whatever is a moot point. The population is large and active enough to keep it going; that's all that matters.

    I've picked EQ2 up again recently. Fallen Gate, the progression server, is quite active. All the usual active spots are as busy as I remember them. I've mostly been playing on my Antonia Bayle characters and that server, too, is active and doing fine. My guild has been very active with stuff happening all the time. General chat is active with people chatting about whatever they chat about there.

    Is EQ2 "in a downward spiral"? Sure. In the same way any 10+ year old MMORPG is in a "downward spiral". Will it someday go offline? Sure. In the same way all MMORPGs will someday go offline. Kind of "no shit, Sherlock" to point that out, isn't it? I don't think any eye-opening "Truth Bombs" are landing on anyone's heads here.

    Anyways...
    For those who enjoy EQ2, or are interested in playing, don't let the would-be ambulance chasers dissuade you. It's a massive game, with still tons to do and a community large and active enough that you could surely find a home in a guild, whose members will likely be more than happy to help you out. You won't be running out of content any time soon.
    SavageHorizonkitarad
  • LuidenLuiden Member UncommonPosts: 261
    Both games announced upcoming expansions fairly recently.

    The last expansion for EQ claimed to have added seven expansion zones, eight raids, new quests and missions, and a new feature for familiars.

    The last expansion for EQII claimed to have added new dungeons (some for raids), four new ascension classes (whatever that is), a mercenary equipment system, and other stuff.

    That seems a lot of work for games on their last legs.
    EQ2 expansions haven't been "expansions" since the Kunark expansion was released.  Everything post Kunark has been complete shit in terms of feeling like they're expansions.  You pay a fee for something that's the size of a game patch now from Daybreak.  Its fuckin horrible what Daybreak has turned into.  Its a shame too cause I've been a die hard EQ franchise fan since EQ1 launched. 

    Hopefully Pantheon will be decent... well, I take that back, I know Pantheon will be better than anything Daybreak is putting out.  Daybreaks all about $$$$$ now and little to no passion. 
    This, although I might go 1 expansion after Kunark.. think it was called TSO.  After that these aren't expansions, rather just adding some cookie cutter zones/dungeons with little value and no innovation.  And to be clear, this was way before Daybreak.  Something happened after TSO and EQ2 started to go downhill fast.  The only people sticking around to play this game are those that just can't break away from a MMORPG, it's like they just keep taking the punishment until they are ground into a nub.

    That time though around Kunark & TSO this was the best MMORPG to play hands down.  It made WoW look like a child's toy even though WoW had many more subscribers.. but damn did they mess it up.


  • GruntyGrunty Member EpicPosts: 8,657
    What's with all the Johhny Depp spam?  Can't find any other way to try to piss people off?
    "I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone.  It's not.  The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone."  Robin Williams
  • AkulasAkulas Member RarePosts: 2,517
    It must be dieing because I see that AB is getting merged

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • BeansnBreadBeansnBread Member EpicPosts: 6,896
    Hmm.. 15 years old? I'm going to check this out again. I loved it for a few years when I was younger. I honestly can't wait to find out if they kept the EQ vibe.
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