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Is Crowfall a MMOBA?

Big.Daddy.SamediBig.Daddy.Samedi Member UncommonPosts: 409
I was having a discussion with my guild about Crowfall, and the feature list contained therein.... And it dawned on me that it contains a great deal of MOBA elements. In fact, enough that I would classify it as a hybrid MMORPG/MOBA.


Set Campaign Times - Check
Fighting is done in arena (Campaigns) - Check
Each arena when started is a reset - Check

Gear is reset, and skills are only a number % change. So really when starting the campaign over everyone is starting from scratch for the most part. The skills that you develop and the EK are why I would say this is a hybrid. They key thing being that the world is NOT persistent and does reset.

Do you agree or Disagree, and why? I would like to see a good discussion on this.

GdemamiJamesGoblinBruceYeeIselinOctagon7711d_20
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Comments

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,947
    Typically MOBAs have very limited character development and it occurs in a matter of minutes. It also wipes (fully or mostly depending on game) at the end of each match.

    From what I understand, some of Crowfall's campaigns will be set to go for as many as 6 months, but also your character is persistent...


    It does have a lot of MOBA influence though... to me... I just want a fun game regardless of the acronym applied.

    JamesGoblinYashaX

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

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  • Big.Daddy.SamediBig.Daddy.Samedi Member UncommonPosts: 409
    Agreed, and for the most part from what I have seen so far, they are doing a good job. Even though the sessions are longer, nothing about MOBA and what it stands for indicates that it has to be short..... current game are, however that would be where some of the hybrid elements are.

    Really just trying to encourage discussion.
    JamesGoblin

  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 2,736
    edited September 2017
    I think a strong argument could be made that crowfall will be the first MMOBA. There is a match with a victory condition after which the game is done which is typical of a MOBA and highly untypical of an MMORPG.

    However the matches last months and contain massive quantities of players. Enough that it should still qualify as massively multiplayer. Something not seen in any existing MOBA.

    So yeah. Those those elements together seem to present a fairly reasonable argument for considering it the first Massively Multiplayer Online Battle Arena.

    I'd like to play it an see how it pans out before we classify it as anything though.
    JamesGoblin
  • CopperfieldCopperfield Member RarePosts: 654
    it will prolly be the same as a hub game
  • EldurianEldurian Member EpicPosts: 2,736
    it will prolly be the same as a hub game
    Define "hub game"
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 5,041
    edited September 2017
    Eldurian said:
    it will prolly be the same as a hub game
    Define "hub game"
    ? Crowfall has large scale warfare and the world you pick has no instances, just rulesets so you can pick the type of world you want. You do indeed have a private hub, a home if you want to call it that, but thats it, all the gameplay takes place on the world you picked.

    Edit. I would actually call it an MMOBARPG.
    It is also an rpg, with crafting etc. much more then any MOBA has.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    GdemamiJamesGoblin
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • FlyinDutchman87FlyinDutchman87 Member UncommonPosts: 336
    I'd say Moba fits pretty well. I love Moba's so it's not really an issue for me. Honestly I always thought making a  MMOBA would be a great idea, something like AV in wow back in vanilla or BC but with actual balance and thought. 

    I think crowfall will be a fun game, but it's definitely not a traditional MMO, not that being an Traditional MMO is a good thing. 
  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,030
    Not even close
    JamesGoblin
  • FrykkaFrykka Member UncommonPosts: 154
    It's not a MOBA really at all...   Gear is persistent but breaks over time for the economy (even if you cannot import much into the hard core ruleset campaigns.)  Skill training is persistent.  Your home EK hub is persistent and will allow player organized PvP and open markets for economic gains.  The Campaigns may go a full year in some cases with 4 seasons that make the survival game  element increase (food/hunger).   There are Races, Classes, and Disciplines that give the loadout powrers but are associated with the vessel you craft (meat ship).    It is a lot less structured than traditional "lane" MOBAs and the maps will be far larger than the biggest arena battleground.

    It is a Sandbox MMO...   with campaigns replacing traditional "servers".   You won't be stuck in a dead server for long nor left in a world completely dominated by one guild "for long".  Pigeonholing MMORPG as a genre into the (boring) WoW model of amusement themepark with MOBA instanced PvP is what got us to this sad state, that and gd loot boxes...

    Crowfall ressurrects the true sandbox open world PvP driven MMORPG of UO, DOAC, Shadowbane, and Warhammer Online.
    JamesGoblinlahnmir
  • natpicknatpick Member UncommonPosts: 271
    this game is no mmo,guys read up on it go to forums watch videos ,its going to be similar to destiny in the way you do stuff,lobby style.
    JamesGoblinYashaX
  • lahnmirlahnmir Member LegendaryPosts: 5,041
    edited January 2018
    natpick said:
    this game is no mmo,guys read up on it go to forums watch videos ,its going to be similar to destiny in the way you do stuff,lobby style.
    You couldn't be more wrong. And it has absolutely nothing in common with Destiny.

    /Cheers,
    Lahnmir
    JamesGoblinYashaX
    'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'

    Kyleran on yours sincerely 


    'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'

    Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...



    'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless. 

    It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.

    It is just huge resource waste....'

    Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer

  • JamesGoblinJamesGoblin Member RarePosts: 1,242
    I am afraid that labeling Crowfall as "MOBA"(!! - or even just connecting it with these) and "PvP only" / "no PvE", both of which are wrong to the bone, will hurt game's population a lot.

    Say, folks interested in MOBAs will inevitably compare CF's "slow" combat, low FPS, very low poly avatars etc. while not being aware of all the depth that lies beneath. I mean, we won't have chance for more than a quick first glance followed by typical "boring" or "looks like crap" (these are quotes).
     W...aaagh?
  • bcbullybcbully Member EpicPosts: 11,838
    Mmoba has a really nice ring to it.
    "We see fundamentals and we ape in"
  • DvoraDvora Member UncommonPosts: 499
    Frykka said:
    It's not a MOBA really at all...   Gear is persistent but breaks over time for the economy (even if you cannot import much into the hard core ruleset campaigns.)  Skill training is persistent.  Your home EK hub is persistent and will allow player organized PvP and open markets for economic gains.  The Campaigns may go a full year in some cases with 4 seasons that make the survival game  element increase (food/hunger).   There are Races, Classes, and Disciplines that give the loadout powrers but are associated with the vessel you craft (meat ship).    It is a lot less structured than traditional "lane" MOBAs and the maps will be far larger than the biggest arena battleground.

    It is a Sandbox MMO...   with campaigns replacing traditional "servers".   You won't be stuck in a dead server for long nor left in a world completely dominated by one guild "for long".  Pigeonholing MMORPG as a genre into the (boring) WoW model of amusement themepark with MOBA instanced PvP is what got us to this sad state, that and gd loot boxes...

    Crowfall ressurrects the true sandbox open world PvP driven MMORPG of UO, DOAC, Shadowbane, and Warhammer Online.
    I hope you are right, but to me it looks like a mmoba, and one dumbed down as if for future console port at that.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    edited January 2018
    I'd say Moba fits pretty well. I love Moba's so it's not really an issue for me. Honestly I always thought making a  MMOBA would be a great idea, something like AV in wow back in vanilla or BC but with actual balance and thought. 

    I think crowfall will be a fun game, but it's definitely not a traditional MMO, not that being an Traditional MMO is a good thing. 
    Why do you think FUN?

    To me it looks like a simple pvp game with restart campaign mode.Definitely trying to be a rpg but imo a very poor job at being a rpg.

    The worst thing i hate about fps games now is they try to add rpg stuff,i don't want mix and match games,they end up being worse.I guess in areality would cay this is just another version of PUBG but adding the kingdoms to support making more money.
    BruceYee

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • KajidourdenKajidourden Member EpicPosts: 3,030
    Dvora said:
    Frykka said:
    It's not a MOBA really at all...   Gear is persistent but breaks over time for the economy (even if you cannot import much into the hard core ruleset campaigns.)  Skill training is persistent.  Your home EK hub is persistent and will allow player organized PvP and open markets for economic gains.  The Campaigns may go a full year in some cases with 4 seasons that make the survival game  element increase (food/hunger).   There are Races, Classes, and Disciplines that give the loadout powrers but are associated with the vessel you craft (meat ship).    It is a lot less structured than traditional "lane" MOBAs and the maps will be far larger than the biggest arena battleground.

    It is a Sandbox MMO...   with campaigns replacing traditional "servers".   You won't be stuck in a dead server for long nor left in a world completely dominated by one guild "for long".  Pigeonholing MMORPG as a genre into the (boring) WoW model of amusement themepark with MOBA instanced PvP is what got us to this sad state, that and gd loot boxes...

    Crowfall ressurrects the true sandbox open world PvP driven MMORPG of UO, DOAC, Shadowbane, and Warhammer Online.
    I hope you are right, but to me it looks like a mmoba, and one dumbed down as if for future console port at that.
    That's because you can't read, apparently.
    JamesGoblin
  • k61977k61977 Member EpicPosts: 1,500
    Yes it has some MOBA elements to it but no it is not a MOBA.  It isn't some small area either like you would see in a MOBA it takes a little time to get from one side of the map to the other.  Overall you can't really title it at all right now because they are constantly making changes and streamlining the game as they should at this stage. 

    I see this as a campaign pvp game that reset every few months.  It isn't something were you log in play for 15 mins and it is over which is what I consider MOBA's go to thing, quick fast action and reset and do again. 

    It is also a 3 faction game not a 2 faction game.  You will always have that aspect of having the third party just waiting on the sideline to come in and wipe you after a major conflict so they can take what you just cleared. 

    It is a pvp first and foremost, don't listen to anyone that says anything else.  They have even reworked the crafting to where you must pvp or have people watching your back to craft as they have tiered it so that you must go into more pvp heavy areas to make the best items.

    So basically if you are looking for any type of pve game please move on as this game is not for you, at least not as the time I wrote this.
    YashaX
  • FrykkaFrykka Member UncommonPosts: 154
    k61977 said:

    It is also a 3 faction game not a 2 faction game.  You will always have that aspect of having the third party just waiting on the sideline to come in and wipe you after a major conflict so they can take what you just cleared. 
    3 faction is only one ruleset module for the campaigns; there will be 3 faction, 12 faction, GvG and FFA Campaigns...
    JamesGoblinYashaX
  • BruceYeeBruceYee Member EpicPosts: 2,556
    For me it's closer to a MOBA than MMORPG for the lack of persistence.
    JamesGoblinYashaX
  • UngoodUngood Member LegendaryPosts: 7,517
    Crowfall is RvR (Realms vs Realms).
    Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.

  • VrikaVrika Member LegendaryPosts: 7,882
    It's MMORPG.

    Crowfall is unique game so that it doesn't fit any game category perfectly, but it's much further away from MOBA gameplay than it's from MMO gameplay. It's a variation of MMO, not an variation of MOBA.
    JamesGoblin
     
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Yeah. Let's just totally disregard the tiny little detail that a MOBA match is typically 20 minutes to an hour and in Crowfall it can be as long as 6 months.

    On the plus side OP, I see a bright future for you writing MMO reviews of things like solitaire.
    YashaXJamesGoblin
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  • FlyByKnightFlyByKnight Member EpicPosts: 3,967
    It's so amazing how people take little nuggets of information and pervert it to giant falsities that fit their reality or ideology. It's scary almost.

    All Artcraft did was say they plan on making the environments finite. Meaning that a faction or guild will actually "win" after a certain time. Why? To solve a fundamental flaw of OWPVP MMORPGs which is stagnation due to infinite server dominance (for whatever reason). Now Crowfall is a MOBA?

    They call the server rings "campaigns". This magically makes them become "arenas" because MOBA MOBA MOBA MOBA.

    Why? Because this is MMORPG.com and MOBAs and First Person Shooters are bad AMIRITE?

    C'mon son.
    JamesGoblinThupli
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    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 3,098
    Yeah this is one of those mobas like DAOC and ESO.
    JamesGoblinKajidourden
    ....
  • TamanousTamanous Member RarePosts: 3,025
    edited January 2018
    It's an mmorpg trying to solve a historical mmorpg problem by trying something new. Only time will tell if it too radical for the genre due to impacting the concept of a persistent world so drastically.

    The rush to fresh realms was obvious even back in EQ and AC times and obvious during live vanilla Wow. After playing vanilla Wow emulators for a length of time I became convinced that a mmorpg CAN design with a true ending in mind. Vanilla Wow proves that an entire player base is willing to shift to new servers and do it repeatedly.

    I fear the cycle of 6 months is far too fast however as the shorter the turn around the more you diminish the scope of the game. 2-3 years worked well for Wow and truly epic story arcs can be told during that time followed by an epic conclusion highly impacted by the player base and perhaps even impact the following fresh start. A real conclusion and restart would also preserve the game for it's original audience ... an issue live Wow suffers terribly from. Staggered server time lines would always allow new players opportunity to join early in story arcs as the overall player base grows (even possible migrations, mergers, etc later can stagger story arcs even more ... a solution to another common mmorpg problem).

    Crowfall however, well, it's all pretty radical but it is also a pvp game and not pve. Games like EQ, AC, AO, Wow, perhaps even DAoC and the like and any future "old school" mmorpg could easily work toward 2-5 year cycles and "refresh" every server shard to their benefit to prolong their own game. Old school emulators prove it's a working concept. Fresh server migration is like a gold rush in mmorpgs so instead of trying to take it away, developers should embrace it in a dynamic way so they retain control over their own IP even into it's waning years.



    JamesGoblin

    You stay sassy!

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