Its not a real choice if all the zones are the same. Different stuff should drop in different camps, and some camps should be good loot and some camps good xp.
Just dont make that so extreme that there is only one camp worth doing. Im thinking of Najena where there was a line 20 long for a camp for journeyman boots. Dont do that.
You could also get journey boots camp in Desert Of Ro, Oasis Of Mar. If you were smart you wouldn't have 20 long for camp.
Plus isn't that the point of not having everything handed to you, I would log on at funny hours and plan my camps.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
If anyone was not around for Original/Kunark/Velious then they have no real knowledge of how good EQ was at that point in history. EQ was about control and patience... control in pulling, control in healing, control in dealing with adds... DPS was only a factor in raid fights as a damage-to-healing time factor.
Things like procs, resists, buffs were all very important... much more so over DPS in EQs prime.
Its not a real choice if all the zones are the same. Different stuff should drop in different camps, and some camps should be good loot and some camps good xp.
Just dont make that so extreme that there is only one camp worth doing. Im thinking of Najena where there was a line 20 long for a camp for journeyman boots. Dont do that.
You could also get journey boots camp in Desert Of Ro, Oasis Of Mar.
Not at first you couldnt. They added that because the Najena camp was such a cluster-xxxx.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
In EQ kill stealing was against the rules and repeated offenses was a valid reason to contact a GM/Guilde.
Repeated offenses could get you banned.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
HIghest roll of the diece won in my guild.
DKP in my guild, but what he was talking about was in-game mechanics for more than one group killing the same mob.
i.e. kill stealing
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
Its not a real choice if all the zones are the same. Different stuff should drop in different camps, and some camps should be good loot and some camps good xp.
Just dont make that so extreme that there is only one camp worth doing. Im thinking of Najena where there was a line 20 long for a camp for journeyman boots. Dont do that.
You could also get journey boots camp in Desert Of Ro, Oasis Of Mar. If you were smart you wouldn't have 20 long for camp.
Plus isn't that the point of not having everything handed to you, I would log on at funny hours and plan my camps.
More fun imo.
I remember setting my alarm for odd hours in the morning to check some camps. As much as a pain that was, it was actually fun too.
As far as "smart", I think that the internet has dumbed it down and allowed so many people to just look up something and go there immediately as opposed to truly having to learn what was where.
I am going to do my best to not do any online research (besides the Lore stuff on RotF's website) and just experience the game as if I was really in the world. That was how EQ was to me and to many other games were trivialized with spoilers, or hell, even the "?" over quest givers heads.
Make it hard but also don't make it totally random.
DAoC had one of the best design philosophies in regards to dishing out XP to players. Farm a certain area enough, mobs give less XP. Find an area that's rarely touched and you actually get bonus XP or as DAoC referred to as camp bonus. Eventually, that camp bonus XP would dissipate as well.
In all honesty, I think DAoC PvE design was spot on to promote healthy group content as well as content for people to solo. Let's be honest folks, the only content that should be group focused is dungeon raids. As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I disagree about the solo content. For a lot of us, particularly the old EQers, we have families and other commitments now. My best memories come from EQ guilds and groups. In the last 10 years of MMO's that made soloing so easy, I ended up soloing because it was easier and a lot less hassle trying to organize my friends to get online at the same time, or stay close in level, similar quest lines, etc.
There def should be solo content and some grinding spots, maybe even dungeons designed for solo players, but I really hope they stick to their guns and make groups way more mandatory than anything I've played in the last 5 years.
It will help build the community.
Anyone else thing the LFG systems are too shallow and only help the player but don't help build much of the server community?
I am going to start organizing some of my old guildies and if that fails, I will be looking for a small to medium size guild with similar time issues but the same desire to bring back the good ole days.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
In EQ kill stealing was against the rules and repeated offenses was a valid reason to contact a GM/Guilde.
Repeated offenses could get you banned.
And if the game is group based and soloing really will be tougher, that kill stealing jerk will become a pariah or will never become a KSer because word will spread. Insta-groups and easy soloing just allow for more of that.
That being said, I would prefer that KSing be possible, along with trains (TRAIN!!!) and let the community help police the jerks.
I am not a KSer and never will be, but it does add some spice to the game when you set a vendetta against some jackass. I remember keeping a handwritten list of names of people I owed some payback too.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
They said there will be solo content. IMO there should be a fair bit of solo content but I also think the exp should be much slower, give lesser rewards and make you want to team to get the bigger exp and rewards. I hate doing nothing when I am LFG.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
HIghest roll of the diece won in my guild.
DKP in my guild, but what he was talking about was in-game mechanics for more than one group killing the same mob.
i.e. kill stealing
Not always killstealing. If 2 groups get to the mob at the same time the way the server displays information it may appear to each of them that they got there first. You dont always know.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
In EQ kill stealing was against the rules and repeated offenses was a valid reason to contact a GM/Guilde.
Repeated offenses could get you banned.
And if the game is group based and soloing really will be tougher, that kill stealing jerk will become a pariah or will never become a KSer because word will spread. Insta-groups and easy soloing just allow for more of that.
First, I want to clarify that Im not the ks'er. I know you never said that but I just want to be clear.
2nd, you talk about a group game and that "that kill stealing jerk" will have a hard time soloing. But the fact is that groups are usually the guilty party when it comes to ks'ing. Almost 100%.
The EQ series failed in that respect because it was simplified to be nothing more than best dps wins ,so everyone wants the exact same weapons.You need to create reasons for choice,different types of mobs,i noticed peeps want water zones,so be it then have aquatic and need for Thunder/Lightning type effects/weapons and water resistant armor. This is the time i mention another term i always use >>DEPTH in systems.If you simply aim for DPS,then say goodbye to a good game and say hello to same old boring crap.
Choice is an illusion, and EQ did not fail in that respect. Pre-WOW, EQ was never best dps wins.
I think your memory is faulty. In EQ best dps (technically it was most damage done) always won the loot rights, and still does. In WOW first tag wins loot rights. Both systems have problems tbh.
In EQ kill stealing was against the rules and repeated offenses was a valid reason to contact a GM/Guilde.
Repeated offenses could get you banned.
And if the game is group based and soloing really will be tougher, that kill stealing jerk will become a pariah or will never become a KSer because word will spread. Insta-groups and easy soloing just allow for more of that.
First, I want to clarify that Im not the ks'er. I know you never said that but I just want to be clear.
2nd, you talk about a group game and that "that kill stealing jerk" will have a hard time soloing. But the fact is that groups are usually the guilty party when it comes to ks'ing. Almost 100%.
Good point about bands of jerks. I do remember single KSer's being a bigger problem when I was below level 30. Of course it was pretty crazy back then when your corpse wasnt locked down too.
Either way, I'd rather the game mechanics not be the sole factor in stopping or dealing with these types of players. Sorta like real life...don't tread on me, LOL.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
They said there will be solo content. IMO there should be a fair bit of solo content but I also think the exp should be much slower, give lesser rewards and make you want to team to get the bigger exp and rewards. I hate doing nothing when I am LFG.
You seem to be confusing "solo content" in Pantheon, with content designed for solo players.
All they've said is that Pantheon is designed for groups, but they are not making an effort to prevent or discourage soloing.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
Even in the early days soloing was possible in EQ.
It was seldom as efficient as grouping, but it was possible.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
It's so interesting that this game is drumming up so much discussion on both sides of the "old school" fence in every topic about it. It will be nice to have a definitive example to point to in a few years finally in regards to the "how an old school game would fare today" argument that is constantly brought up. As a backer I'm excited to get in there and give it a go, but as an mmo gamer I know that my tastes/desires have changed quite a bit from my EQ/FFXI days.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
Even in the early days soloing was possible in EQ.
It was seldom as efficient as grouping, but it was possible.
Bards who swarm kited were more efficient than any group.
My Necro could solo with ease in PoP. The AI in Pantheon will make it harder to kite. VR devs have said some mobs would kite, others would run away and get help when their HP hit a set %, others would kite you by snaring you and doting, maybe nuking you. Soloing will take more thought then EQ1.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
Even in the early days soloing was possible in EQ.
It was seldom as efficient as grouping, but it was possible.
Bards who swarm kited were more efficient than any group.
Yeap and it was boring as heck also. I grouped 99+% of of the time with my bard as it was certainly not hard to find a good group in those days. Good grouping was very efficient apparently as I made 50 ( which was max level in EQ at the time) over a month before any other bard on my server.
One of the biggest things I recall from the early days of EQ1 involved the philosophy of designing zones. For those that don't remember, zones were roughly divided into those with good loot (including gear) and those with good experience. This pulled players in an extra couple of directions. Do we go here for a chance at loot, or do we go there and try to gain a level or two? The 'loot heavy' zones were nothing special, maybe a special weapon like the Runed Totem Staff, and 7g instead of 1g per mob. That took an awful long time for players to make any money in an evening.
The 'experience-heavy' zones were far more generous, and always crowded. High Pass Keep was home to the orcs in the tunnels, and indoors was all about the small goblin camp. Both were exceptional experience. It wouldn't have been unusual for characters to gain 2-5 levels in an evening, depending on how much competition was in-zone at the time. Some spots for high experience are still in game, like the undead gnoll reavers hill in East Karana, and are still superior experience for the level 13-18 crowd.
Another issue was the existence of camps where both the experience and loot were superior. Bandit sashes in West Karana was an excellent source of experience -- there were lots of bandits and they gave good experience. They also dropped the Bandit sashes which could be turned in for bronze weapons, which sold for 1-3 platinum apiece (a fortune when similar mobs were dropping a few silver pieces). These hot spots were popular camps, and tended to draw a disproportionate portion of the population.
A balanced design philosophy eventually took over and experience and loot were balanced. The paltry loot was bumped considerably, where it is now possible to easily earn 10-20 platinum in any of the starting zones while on the ride from 1st to 5th level.
This is one aspect of the early games that not many people remember, and I hope doesn't reappear in Pantheon. This design philosophy was left on the side of the road when the game evolved.
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you. The best loot AND XP was always in dungeons. Always. Dungeons had zonewide XP bonuses whereas outdoor zones did not.
Now, obviously the risk was much much higher, so if you died a lot and lost a lot of XP then your net gain might have been higher in an outdoor zone. That being said if you were a good group and capable of doing the dungeon area, the rewards were there in both XP and loot.
Also, the two examples you give, things like bandit camps and crushbone belts, etc. Were really only for low levels and new players, there was nothing like that to my knowledge post level 20 ish, at least up to kunark.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
I don't want dungeons unless they make sense and not just to house some Boss at the end of a tunnel. I also don't want BEST of gear or best of anything,i want a diverse game that allows players choice in how they gear their player and NOT just best dps wins. While on the topic of loot,i don't want to see a repeat of several full loot bags every 2 hours needing an hour to clear out all the trash. Give us some useful reason to have trash items and not just to cash in to some vendor.In other words,make everything valuable,i hate trash items in games.
At least we have a guy who is actually a lot better suited to game design than Smedley,whom could sink the Titanic before it was built,at least Brad waits until it hits the ocean lol. Joking aside i feel Brad will build the best game he can,problem is manpower and budget will not allow the best possible game let's hope it is good enough to keep us for 3+ years and not another fly by night like the rest. Dam i make good midnight sandwiches lol...mmmm
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I don't want dungeons unless they make sense and not just to house some Boss at the end of a tunnel. I also don't want BEST of gear or best of anything,i want a diverse game that allows players choice in how they gear their player and NOT just best dps wins. While on the topic of loot,i don't want to see a repeat of several full loot bags every 2 hours needing an hour to clear out all the trash. Give us some useful reason to have trash items and not just to cash in to some vendor.In other words,make everything valuable,i hate trash items in games.
At least we have a guy who is actually a lot better suited to game design than Smedley,whom could sink the Titanic before it was built,at least Brad waits until it hits the ocean lol. Joking aside i feel Brad will build the best game he can,problem is manpower and budget will not allow the best possible game let's hope it is good enough to keep us for 3+ years and not another fly by night like the rest. Dam i make good midnight sandwiches lol...mmmm
You talk some rubbish lol, EQ the fly by night is still going now and even Vanguard lasted 7 years.
This game will be more like those two games than you realise, after all who wants Ffxi copy lol, oh wait you do.
There will always be a boss at the end of the tunnel but also bosses on the way to the end of the tunnel, stop playing mmo's if you can't handle that. Some of the best dungeons in any mmo to date have come from Brad's games I doubt the wiz can school him on how to make interesting dungeons.
As much as I hate solo artists in MMO's, it doesn't hurt the game to allow people to level up by themselves.
I strongly disagree, and when I say disagree, I mean that statement is factually incorrect based on all available evidence.
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
Even in the early days soloing was possible in EQ.
It was seldom as efficient as grouping, but it was possible.
The fact that only caster classes could do it effectively, and even for most of them it was less efficient, is why EQ was such a social mmorpg, and undoubtedly contributed largely to it's longevity as a game. The example of EQ only puts more weight behind my assertion.
EQ was never designed for soloing. Content, especially after level 10, was intended to be entirely a group endeavor. The fact that there were ways to achieve some things solo was happenstance, and the byproduct of a good, open-ended design that did not entirely constrain the players.
EQ was never designed for soloing. Content, especially after level 10, was intended to be entirely a group endeavor. The fact that there were ways to achieve some things solo was happenstance, and the byproduct of a good, open-ended design that did not entirely constrain the players.
A game design I can only hope to see repeated. Good open-ended design that allows players to play the game in their own fashion.
I don't ask that much content be specifically designated as solo. I do ask for players to be able to use alternate abilities and tactics to take on what would normally be group content.
Yes, in EQ you could root rot, kite, or even pet tank, but it was seldom as efficient as killing the same mobs in a group. What it typically did do is allow a skilled player to progress alone when groups were not an option.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. Benjamin Franklin
Comments
You could also get journey boots camp in Desert Of Ro, Oasis Of Mar. If you were smart you wouldn't have 20 long for camp.
Plus isn't that the point of not having everything handed to you, I would log on at funny hours and plan my camps.
More fun imo.
If anyone was not around for Original/Kunark/Velious then they have no real knowledge of how good EQ was at that point in history. EQ was about control and patience... control in pulling, control in healing, control in dealing with adds... DPS was only a factor in raid fights as a damage-to-healing time factor.
Things like procs, resists, buffs were all very important... much more so over DPS in EQs prime.
HIghest roll of the diece won in my guild.
In EQ kill stealing was against the rules and repeated offenses was a valid reason to contact a GM/Guilde.
Repeated offenses could get you banned.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
DKP in my guild, but what he was talking about was in-game mechanics for more than one group killing the same mob.
i.e. kill stealing
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
As far as "smart", I think that the internet has dumbed it down and allowed so many people to just look up something and go there immediately as opposed to truly having to learn what was where.
I am going to do my best to not do any online research (besides the Lore stuff on RotF's website) and just experience the game as if I was really in the world. That was how EQ was to me and to many other games were trivialized with spoilers, or hell, even the "?" over quest givers heads.
Make it hard but also don't make it totally random.
Caseyx
There def should be solo content and some grinding spots, maybe even dungeons designed for solo players, but I really hope they stick to their guns and make groups way more mandatory than anything I've played in the last 5 years.
It will help build the community.
Anyone else thing the LFG systems are too shallow and only help the player but don't help build much of the server community?
I am going to start organizing some of my old guildies and if that fails, I will be looking for a small to medium size guild with similar time issues but the same desire to bring back the good ole days.
Caseyx
That being said, I would prefer that KSing be possible, along with trains (TRAIN!!!) and let the community help police the jerks.
I am not a KSer and never will be, but it does add some spice to the game when you set a vendetta against some jackass. I remember keeping a handwritten list of names of people I owed some payback too.
A little chaos is fun.
Caseyx
The problem with people being able to level up entirely by themselves is that it detracts from the social challenge in the game, making everything easier. In the end, it's largely responsible for people being able to rush through quickly, and never becoming attached to the world itself or it's inhabitants (other players). Without that bond with the world when the player truly appreciates the challenge and the people required to overcome it, players simply jump to the next game as soon as it becomes available.
2nd, you talk about a group game and that "that kill stealing jerk" will have a hard time soloing. But the fact is that groups are usually the guilty party when it comes to ks'ing. Almost 100%.
Either way, I'd rather the game mechanics not be the sole factor in stopping or dealing with these types of players. Sorta like real life...don't tread on me, LOL.
Caseyx
All they've said is that Pantheon is designed for groups, but they are not making an effort to prevent or discourage soloing.
There's a difference, and it's huge.
Even in the early days soloing was possible in EQ.
It was seldom as efficient as grouping, but it was possible.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
It will be nice to have a definitive example to point to in a few years finally in regards to the "how an old school game would fare today" argument that is constantly brought up.
As a backer I'm excited to get in there and give it a go, but as an mmo gamer I know that my tastes/desires have changed quite a bit from my EQ/FFXI days.
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you. The best loot AND XP was always in dungeons. Always. Dungeons had zonewide XP bonuses whereas outdoor zones did not.
Now, obviously the risk was much much higher, so if you died a lot and lost a lot of XP then your net gain might have been higher in an outdoor zone. That being said if you were a good group and capable of doing the dungeon area, the rewards were there in both XP and loot.
Also, the two examples you give, things like bandit camps and crushbone belts, etc. Were really only for low levels and new players, there was nothing like that to my knowledge post level 20 ish, at least up to kunark.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
I also don't want BEST of gear or best of anything,i want a diverse game that allows players choice in how they gear their player and NOT just best dps wins.
While on the topic of loot,i don't want to see a repeat of several full loot bags every 2 hours needing an hour to clear out all the trash.
Give us some useful reason to have trash items and not just to cash in to some vendor.In other words,make everything valuable,i hate trash items in games.
At least we have a guy who is actually a lot better suited to game design than Smedley,whom could sink the Titanic before it was built,at least Brad waits until it hits the ocean lol.
Joking aside i feel Brad will build the best game he can,problem is manpower and budget will not allow the best possible game let's hope it is good enough to keep us for 3+ years and not another fly by night like the rest.
Dam i make good midnight sandwiches lol...mmmm
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
You talk some rubbish lol, EQ the fly by night is still going now and even Vanguard lasted 7 years.
This game will be more like those two games than you realise, after all who wants Ffxi copy lol, oh wait you do.
There will always be a boss at the end of the tunnel but also bosses on the way to the end of the tunnel, stop playing mmo's if you can't handle that. Some of the best dungeons in any mmo to date have come from Brad's games I doubt the wiz can school him on how to make interesting dungeons.
EQ was never designed for soloing. Content, especially after level 10, was intended to be entirely a group endeavor. The fact that there were ways to achieve some things solo was happenstance, and the byproduct of a good, open-ended design that did not entirely constrain the players.
A game design I can only hope to see repeated. Good open-ended design that allows players to play the game in their own fashion.
I don't ask that much content be specifically designated as solo. I do ask for players to be able to use alternate abilities and tactics to take on what would normally be group content.
Yes, in EQ you could root rot, kite, or even pet tank, but it was seldom as efficient as killing the same mobs in a group. What it typically did do is allow a skilled player to progress alone when groups were not an option.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin