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Amd almost had me lol.

24

Comments

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Cleffy said:
    Find a link to an available X370 board not by biostar. They are all in back-order or out of stock. The CPUs are in stock, but not the motherboards. It's not the situation you want as a company since you need both to make a computer. The shortage and other motherboard issues are obviously hampering sales.
    Considering there is only 4 boards that aren't out of stock and you cannot currently get any of the cpu's.  What are you trying to say?
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • CleffyCleffy Member RarePosts: 5,810
    "And you can purchase motherboards all day long without waiting"
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    Well, I am going with the i7 1070, i think it is the better deal for gaming. 
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member EpicPosts: 18,925
    Well, I am going with the i7 1070, i think it is the better deal for gaming. 
    Have fun playing games on your CPU that doesn't exist.
  • CleffyCleffy Member RarePosts: 5,810
    If you are just gaming, the better deal would be the Core i5 7600.
  • GladDogGladDog Member RarePosts: 881
    edited March 2017
    GladDog said:
    I read an extensive (OMGWTFBBQ too damn long!) review of the Ryzen at Tom's Hardware, and what they said is that It is a good chip that is extremely competitive with Intel at the workstation market, which is the largest market for desktops, by far.  The 16 thread Ryzen runs rings around the 8 or 10 thread Broadwell in many tests related to programming and rendering.  So Ryzen is a win for AMD business-wise.  However, the game tests were not as strong as the business ones.

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-am4-ryzen-chipsets,33806.html

    The performance in games suffers for two reasons;

    1 - lack of games optimized for more than 4 threads.
    2 - The Ryzen was rushed to market too soon.  The CPU itself has a lot of potential, but it is suffering from lack of polish.  The CPU will probably get a firmware update or two over the next year or so (scary!) that should make it very competitive with Intel's current offerings by the end of the year.

    The game performance isn't bad by any stretch of the imagination; it is just lower than Intel's performance.   When AMD releases the 6/12, 4/8 and 4/4 parts, which will have the time invested in optimization to make these parts more gamer-competitive with what Intel is offering, and at a much lower price, we can make a better judgment. 
     In one case ryzen is slightly faster than a 6 core 6 thread intel cpu lol. Not the 8 thread 8 core which gets almost 20k on the passmark, where their fastest gets 15000, and has 8 more threads lol. Your saying in a year the amd ryzen will be as fast as intels now. Well in a year intel will have a new cpu, and that ends that. So once again amd failed. Ryzens would be worth it if they were priced at like 250 bucks. 500 is way to high. The hype train is strong though, and a lot of suckers bought one, so i guess they priced it better if your goal is to be greedy. 

    It is no different than I phone selling their obselete garbage phones for 4x the amount of a android phone. The i phone 7 isnt even as good as a lg g3, which sells for 150 bucks. You get that hype train a going, and you can sell garbage for gold. More proof would be no mans sky, which has got to be the worst game in existence, there is no game on steam that equal it in bad feed back. Yet No man sky has some of the highest feed back numbers. So again some one used the power of hype to sell garbage at non garbage prices.

    In reality though, there is no reason any average person would want a ryzen, and the people who would want a workstation cpu, would buy a xeon, or i7 6950x. So yeah the only people buying a ryzen got hyped up on the train, bought garbage, and so they dont feel bad will defend it forever. 

    I wish i had a i5 7600k and a 1080, so i could go into games, and laugh at the ryzen fps. 
    I linked the incorrect article in my earlier post, I corrected it with an edit.  This review runs many tests and the Ryzen held it's own against the Broadwell-E, at half the cost.  Some the Broadwell-E was faster, some Ryzen was king, and others the Kaby Lake smeared them both.  For business and scientific endeavors, the Ryzen did well and would be a top contender for new contracts, especially if the potential buyer is on a limited budget.

    I'm not trying to laud AMD to the heavens, nor am I slamming Intel.  I have actually never bought an AMD CPU in my life.  But AMD closed a lot of ground with Ryzen, and once they get the polish on their new CPU line I expect them to continue to dog Intel's ankles and force innovation to occur, and prices to be competitive.

    Here is the correct link to the Tom's Hardware review of Ryzen 7.
    http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-7-1800x-cpu,4951.html
    Post edited by GladDog on


    The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!


  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    edited March 2017
    Cleffy said:
    If you are just gaming, the better deal would be the Core i5 7600.
    Your right, thank you, I did go with the i5 7600k and the 1080 gtx instead of the i7 7600k and the 1070, good thing i used amazon so i could cancel quit and get the right one. Now if i can refrain from over clocking it and blowing it up im good haha. 
    Post edited by hatefulpeace on
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    Quizzical said:
    Well, I am going with the i7 1070, i think it is the better deal for gaming. 
    Have fun playing games on your CPU that doesn't exist.
    I guess you didnt read any of the posts lol. If you did, i linked a bunch of cpu and gpu builds. So one of those was a 1070 gtx and a i7 7700k, which is the same price as a i5 7600k and a 1080, which i went with the i5 1080, i mean 1070 should automatically equal graphics card to you. Its like saying lol = nothing. 
  • Bdog128Bdog128 Member UncommonPosts: 4
    edited March 2017
    I feel alot of people are not understanding some things about the ryzen cpus. First off intels yearly new cpu releases are nothing like ryzen. Intel has a backbone they have refining for years now with every iteration. They have been building on top of and adding to a cpu architecture for years now. Why? because it was a good damn architecture from the start however it had some issue at first too. like games having issues with the hypertreading turned on and stuff. whats my point? Ryzen is a brand new everything. architecture, memory control, ect. Its 100% from the ground up new. What does this mean? well for starters its going to have some early growing pains. all these things do. no matter how much time they spent on it it would still have growing pains at first. your talking about a cpu architecture here. Now what is the 1800x aimed at? its not really a gaming cpu though it can do it very nicely, its supposed to be aimed at the 6900. which it is competing with nicely in workstation based applications at half the cost. making it a cost to performance workstation beast. For the most part we have to give it time. and what we are seeing is not signs of amd dropping the ball again. what we are seeing are people getting over hyped and expecting it to be something its not and it to be a flawless launch on a brandnew cpu architecture which almost never happens. what amd has shown it is they have a really good backbone now. One which can compete with intels like the fx series never could and to top it off they are trying to push the idea of more cpus at a consumer friendly price which trust me is a very good thing, with dx12 and vulkan helping games utilize multiple cores and thread way better we need the marked to push past this idea of "well 4s good enough right now.". the industry said 32bit was good enough too and franckly the fact games are really just now starting to go strickly 64bit is fucking sad. amd ryzen is not an intel killer. its an intel wake up bitch slap. Its needs some fine tuning. but im sure by the end of the year we are going to see alot of the bugs worked out and the cpu and chips set performing better. now does that mean go out and buy one right now? not unless you want to be a early adopters. Really unless your willing to put up with early on problems you should never buy anything brand new. but ryzen is not a failure. not yet atleast. now if amd cant follow through then it will be a failure.

    Post edited by Bdog128 on
  • CrusadecrusherCrusadecrusher Member UncommonPosts: 283
    Why do some people need to try so hard to push a product.  Listen op nobody is going to change their mind and you aren't fooling anyone with your made up "I believed the hype until I read one article" garbage.  
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    edited March 2017
    Why do some people need to try so hard to push a product.  Listen op nobody is going to change their mind and you aren't fooling anyone with your made up "I believed the hype until I read one article" garbage.  
    Haha, did you lose it? I never said I read a article. I said I thought with all the stuff i read before it came out, that it was going be equal to intel if not better. I didnt read any article after, i compared them on passmark, and according to passmark ryzen is garbage for anything but one thing, multitasking. 

    And what is your problem anyways. Calling me a lier, you bastard. I 100 percent this morning and for the last month planing on buying ryzen. I was waiting for passmark numbers, and since it got barely 100 points above a 8350 oc to 5gz, i bought a i5 7600k and a 1080, when i was gonna buy a ryzen and a 1070. 

    This is a 8350 oced to 5ghz
    10297

    Single Thread Rating: 1731

    This is a ryzen 1800x
    15518

    Single Thread Rating: 1960

    That is not worth a 400 dollar price increase from a 8350 oced to 5ghz. For gaming. 

    THis is the 1700x
    14472

    Single Thread Rating: 1856

    This is a i5 at 3.8 7600k 

    9262

    Single Thread Rating: 2395

    This is a gaming website. Last time I checked. I dont recall reading, mmorpgservers any where. Yeah if I was building a server computer, I would 100 percent buy a ryzen.

    And maybe when amd comes out with the 150 dollar version of ryzen that is 4 cores, I would of considered it, I doubt it though. Because it is going to get worse single core performance than intel, and its only like 30-50 dollars cheaper.

    If Amd came out with their gaming versions of the ryzen the same time, I dono which I would do. But either way as it stands right now, i5 7600k and a 1080, is a better gaming machine, than a 1700x  and a 1070. 

    So yeah in 5 months when vega is out for 600 bucks, and the 4 core ryzen is 150, the better deal would be a vega and a ryzen. I am not waiting 5 more months. I still dont know about that though. Look at that single thread rating of a 1700x, it is almost as bad as a 8350 over clocked. So who knows what the 1400x will get. My guess is no where near 2500. 

    That is also assuming radeon fixed their lines through the screen at 4k and 1440 144hz. I had to go to a 970 because the 480 had lines through the screen and i tried 2 of them. 

    As for pushing. I wasn't pushing any one. Any one can do what ever they want to do. I was giving the reason why I decided to buy a i5, although when I started this I wasn't gonna buy one. That didn't happen till later, when I was playing empyrion and wanted to get more than 20 fps at 4k. 
    Post edited by hatefulpeace on
  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter Member UncommonPosts: 3,065
    Why do some people need to try so hard to push a product.  Listen op nobody is going to change their mind and you aren't fooling anyone with your made up "I believed the hype until I read one article" garbage.  
    Haha, did you lose it? I never said I read a article. I said I thought with all the stuff i read before it came out, that it was going be equal to intel if not better. I didnt read any article after, i compared them on passmark, and according to passmark ryzen is garbage for anything but one thing, multitasking. 

    And what is your problem anyways. Calling me a lier, you bastard. I 100 percent this morning and for the last month planing on buying ryzen. I was waiting for passmark numbers, and since it got barely 100 points about a 8350 oc to 5gz, i bought a i5 7600k and a 1080, when i was gonna buy a ryzen and a 1070. 

    This is a 8350 oced to 5ghz
    10297

    Single Thread Rating: 1731

    This is a ryzen 
    15518

    Single Thread Rating: 1960

    That is not worth a 400 dollar price increase from a 8350 oced to 5ghz. 

    This is a i5 at 3.8 7600k 

    9262

    Single Thread Rating: 2395
    If you play passmark all day long, sure go with Intel.
    If you on the other hand do other things like video encoding, streaming, virtual machines, Ryzen is quite competitive and it is also quite competitive in power consumption.

    A 1070 that can compete with a 6800K and 6900K in multithreaded workloads while being a decent gamer (10-20% slower 7700K in average in non max settings 1080p, less in minimums FPS) in market that for the last 15 years has completely been optimized for Intel CPUs for $330 and cheaper motherboard his a decent product for most people.

    Not for passmark players though...

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • pantaropantaro Member UncommonPosts: 476
    i wouldnt spend over 300+ on a cpu for gaming anyway lol
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member EpicPosts: 18,925
    If you play passmark all day long, sure go with Intel.
    You win the thread.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Where exactly are the cpu's in stock?
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • CrusadecrusherCrusadecrusher Member UncommonPosts: 283
    Why do some people need to try so hard to push a product.  Listen op nobody is going to change their mind and you aren't fooling anyone with your made up "I believed the hype until I read one article" garbage.  
    Haha, did you lose it? I never said I read a article. I said I thought with all the stuff i read before it came out, that it was going be equal to intel if not better. I didnt read any article after, i compared them on passmark, and according to passmark ryzen is garbage for anything but one thing, multitasking. 

    And what is your problem anyways. Calling me a lier, you bastard. I 100 percent this morning and for the last month planing on buying ryzen. I was waiting for passmark numbers, and since it got barely 100 points above a 8350 oc to 5gz, i bought a i5 7600k and a 1080, when i was gonna buy a ryzen and a 1070. 

    This is a 8350 oced to 5ghz
    10297

    Single Thread Rating: 1731

    This is a ryzen 1800x
    15518

    Single Thread Rating: 1960

    That is not worth a 400 dollar price increase from a 8350 oced to 5ghz. For gaming. 

    THis is the 1700x
    14472

    Single Thread Rating: 1856

    This is a i5 at 3.8 7600k 

    9262

    Single Thread Rating: 2395

    This is a gaming website. Last time I checked. I dont recall reading, mmorpgservers any where. Yeah if I was building a server computer, I would 100 percent buy a ryzen.

    And maybe when amd comes out with the 150 dollar version of ryzen that is 4 cores, I would of considered it, I doubt it though. Because it is going to get worse single core performance than intel, and its only like 30-50 dollars cheaper.

    If Amd came out with their gaming versions of the ryzen the same time, I dono which I would do. But either way as it stands right now, i5 7600k and a 1080, is a better gaming machine, than a 1700x  and a 1070. 

    So yeah in 5 months when vega is out for 600 bucks, and the 4 core ryzen is 150, the better deal would be a vega and a ryzen. I am not waiting 5 more months. I still dont know about that though. Look at that single thread rating of a 1700x, it is almost as bad as a 8350 over clocked. So who knows what the 1400x will get. My guess is no where near 2500. 

    That is also assuming radeon fixed their lines through the screen at 4k and 1440 144hz. I had to go to a 970 because the 480 had lines through the screen and i tried 2 of them. 

    As for pushing. I wasn't pushing any one. Any one can do what ever they want to do. I was giving the reason why I decided to buy a i5, although when I started this I wasn't gonna buy one. That didn't happen till later, when I was playing empyrion and wanted to get more than 20 fps at 4k. 
    Haha and this is what TRIGGERED looks like class...
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member EpicPosts: 18,925
    filmoret said:
    Where exactly are the cpu's in stock?
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113428
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113429
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113430

    New Egg only has four Socket AM4 motherboards in stock, though, and "limit 1 per customer" doesn't exactly imply high volume stockpiles.  The chipsets are surely on an older process node with tons of capacity, so it's just a question of how quickly motherboard manufacturers can assemble the boards and get them to the United States.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    edited March 2017
    Quizzical said:
    filmoret said:
    Where exactly are the cpu's in stock?
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113428
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113429
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113430

    New Egg only has four Socket AM4 motherboards in stock, though, and "limit 1 per customer" doesn't exactly imply high volume stockpiles.  The chipsets are surely on an older process node with tons of capacity, so it's just a question of how quickly motherboard manufacturers can assemble the boards and get them to the United States.
    Those are confusing.  It looks like they are sold out on front page then you  click on link and you can purchase.
    Post edited by filmoret on
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    Actually the better deal was that ebay still had 1080tis for sale for 699 so i went that way. I am sure a i5 7600k, and a 1080ti, will beat a 1800x and a 1080. Since the ti gets 30-40 more fps than a 1080
  • MrMelGibsonMrMelGibson Member EpicPosts: 2,677
    Bdog128 said:
    I feel alot of people are not understanding some things about the ryzen cpus. First off intels yearly new cpu releases are nothing like ryzen. Intel has a backbone they have refining for years now with every iteration. They have been building on top of and adding to a cpu architecture for years now. Why? because it was a good damn architecture from the start however it had some issue at first too. like games having issues with the hypertreading turned on and stuff. whats my point? Ryzen is a brand new everything. architecture, memory control, ect. Its 100% from the ground up new. What does this mean? well for starters its going to have some early growing pains. all these things do. no matter how much time they spent on it it would still have growing pains at first. your talking about a cpu architecture here. Now what is the 1800x aimed at? its not really a gaming cpu though it can do it very nicely, its supposed to be aimed at the 6900. which it is competing with nicely in workstation based applications at half the cost. making it a cost to performance workstation beast. For the most part we have to give it time. and what we are seeing is not signs of amd dropping the ball again. what we are seeing are people getting over hyped and expecting it to be something its not and it to be a flawless launch on a brandnew cpu architecture which almost never happens. what amd has shown it is they have a really good backbone now. One which can compete with intels like the fx series never could and to top it off they are trying to push the idea of more cpus at a consumer friendly price which trust me is a very good thing, with dx12 and vulkan helping games utilize multiple cores and thread way better we need the marked to push past this idea of "well 4s good enough right now.". the industry said 32bit was good enough too and franckly the fact games are really just now starting to go strickly 64bit is fucking sad. amd ryzen is not an intel killer. its an intel wake up bitch slap. Its needs some fine tuning. but im sure by the end of the year we are going to see alot of the bugs worked out and the cpu and chips set performing better. now does that mean go out and buy one right now? not unless you want to be a early adopters. Really unless your willing to put up with early on problems you should never buy anything brand new. but ryzen is not a failure. not yet atleast. now if amd cant follow through then it will be a failure.

    If you want me or anyone else to read that.  Use some paragraphs ffs.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 6,349
    Better than the tread in Hardware by far.
  • Thomas2006Thomas2006 Member RarePosts: 1,091
    edited March 2017
    Gdemami said:
    Thomas2006 said:
    That is just a discusion by some people. Its not an official windows post or anything. Also the video I linked above proves that, that post is entirely WRONG.
    The video/article is some huge leap assumptions and in neither way implies Windows scheduler fix cannot help the problem, especially when fiddling with affinity and HT does provide performance gains.

    And yeah, bad link posted when on phone..

    http://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-performance-negatively-affected-windows-10-scheduler-bug/

    Regardless, it is pretty much everywhere...

    Ok then from AMD themselfs
    http://www.pcworld.com/article/3180525/components-processors/amd-busts-ryzen-performance-myths-clearing-windows-10-and-others-from-blame.html

    Windows 10 Scheduler is NOT the issue.

    “We have investigated reports alleging incorrect thread scheduling on the AMD Ryzen processor,” AMD’s Robert Hallock wrote in the blog post. “Based on our findings, AMD believes that the Windows 10 thread scheduler is operating properly for ‘Zen,’ and we do not presently believe there is an issue with the scheduler adversely utilizing the logical and physical configurations of the architecture.”

    Link to AMDs blog post on it.
    https://community.amd.com/community/gaming/blog/2017/03/13/amd-ryzen-community-update?sf62107357=1
    Post edited by Thomas2006 on
  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 11,004
    Ok then from AMD themselfs
    http://www.pcworld.com/article/3180525/components-processors/amd-busts-ryzen-performance-myths-clearing-windows-10-and-others-from-blame.html

    Windows 10 Scheduler is NOT the issue.

    “We have investigated reports alleging incorrect thread scheduling on the AMD Ryzen processor,” AMD’s Robert Hallock wrote in the blog post. “Based on our findings, AMD believes that the Windows 10 thread scheduler is operating properly for ‘Zen,’ and we do not presently believe there is an issue with the scheduler adversely utilizing the logical and physical configurations of the architecture.”

    Link to AMDs blog post on it.
    https://community.amd.com/community/gaming/blog/2017/03/13/amd-ryzen-community-update?sf62107357=1
    Well, if AMD does not believe MS can help Ryzen peformance, it is a bummer.

    So afterall, it does seem it will be indeed FX all over again....
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    Actually lol, the blizzard i just had, made it so I had more time to think about this. I have come to the conclusion that the ryzen 1700 if they arent lying about it being able to hit 4.0 on the stock cooler it comes with, is the better deal by far. I didnt understand that 1700 was overclockable, i figured it was like intel where you cant overclock unless you buy the k version, which i figured was what x meant on the cpus. So from what I saw it looks like the only difference between the 1700 to the 1800x are the clock speeds. In which case, that changes things alot. 

    That means I dont have to buy a 100 dollar cooler. So in effect saving 100 bucks, getting some lower fps in some games, but not by a huge amount, like the differnce between a 1080 and a 1080 ti. So I think I am gonna go with the ryzen lol.

    Damnit I wish i could just buy the i7 6700k, i7 7700k, i5 7600k and the ryzen 1700 and see which one i wanted haha. 
  • mbrodiembrodie Member UncommonPosts: 1,318
    also in terms of gaming performance the 7700k is only marginally  better than 1800x

    it's like 5 - 8% or something in most titles and even then we're talking about 100+ fps and ryzen still runs said games smooth as butter.

    where the 1800x shines is in comparison to the extreme intel chips where it is half the price and outperforms the $1500 chip by a large margin in non gaming activities than it loses to the 7700k in games.

    so overall the 1800x is a chip and a windows fix is incoming for the single core performance issues which will make it better again and probably put it over the 7700k in gaming.
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