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2017 still no improvements with housing or glamours

RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
This is just the perfect example of the MMO Industry that doesn't listen to feedback, and always gives an excuse of why they can't do something, honestly what is the point of a suggestions, or complaints if a game company or developers aren't going to fix the issue that is a plague to a game for over 2+ Years?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/314598-Please-fix-or-remove-housing%21/page3 

I am talking about Housing in FFXIV, Basically you buy virtual property with no way to sell it to another player, or trade it rather, or easily switch it within a FC, or remove the house from FC...

They could have put in (Instanced Housing) With only 1000-2000 plots maximum and over 5k players who would love to own housing rather than having only 1000-2000 limited plots but rather fix it so players can easily enter another persons house, or set to default which house they want to enter and so on making it easy for anyone to own their own property (But rather they don't do this and this is one major turn off from trying this game again even though its been recommended to me by some friends, and the reason why I might look into ESO again once housing comes out but not sure on ESO.)

2.) The second issue is why the heck does FFXIV have Glamour shards, you spend money for a costume in the so called (Optional Items) shop but instead you have to hit level 50, do quests just to unlock cosmetic items, rather than be able to just select from a list of items you have unlocked in game and from the cash shop and apply them, or have a different window for applying cosmetic costumes on which will be displayed on the character, but having to waste time crafting (Glamour Shards) do a quest to unlock this is rather disturbing considering almost every other MMO  such as Guild Wars 2, ESO, Rift, all have a cosmetics system which is easy to apply unlocked cosmetic items to an account, even equipping cash shop outfits without a problem at all or required use of glamours ( I haven't played FFXIV in years) but I asked this on reddit and I was told at level 1 if I wanted to buy optional items I couldn't use them...

This is just an example of a decent game created after Square Enix first failure at creating the original game, but now they create this FFXIV,and make awful mistakes at development, could be a great game, but developers who don't use their brains when they design something when they could do better, or make things better they just don't...

Any idea when they are going to wake up and fix these two issues which have been an issue for more than 2 years many complaints nothing done about it.
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Comments

  • KhebelnKhebeln Member UncommonPosts: 794
    edited January 2017
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    image
    (Retired)- Anarchy Online/Ultima Online/DAoC/Horizonsz/EQ2/SWG/AC1&2/L2/SoR/WoW/TMO/Requiem/Atlantica Online/Manibogi/Rift+(SL)/Lol/Hon/SWTOR/Wakfu/Champions Online/GW/Lotr/CO/TcoS/Tabula Rasa/Meridian 59/Vanguard/Shadowbane/Fury/SotW/Dreamlords/HGL/RoM/DDO/FFXI/Aoc/Eve/Warhammer Online/Gw2/TSW/Tera/Defiance/STO/AoW/DE/Firefall/Darkfall/Neverwinter/PS2/ESO/FF14/Archeage/Gw2

  • ScorchienScorchien Member LegendaryPosts: 8,914
    edited January 2017
    Khebeln said:
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    And ill add , as far as glamours go , when im running around in game it is hard to find 2 players that look alike (unless its intentional guild,alts , bots etc..) which is quite the accomplishment imo
  • KhebelnKhebeln Member UncommonPosts: 794

    image
    (Retired)- Anarchy Online/Ultima Online/DAoC/Horizonsz/EQ2/SWG/AC1&2/L2/SoR/WoW/TMO/Requiem/Atlantica Online/Manibogi/Rift+(SL)/Lol/Hon/SWTOR/Wakfu/Champions Online/GW/Lotr/CO/TcoS/Tabula Rasa/Meridian 59/Vanguard/Shadowbane/Fury/SotW/Dreamlords/HGL/RoM/DDO/FFXI/Aoc/Eve/Warhammer Online/Gw2/TSW/Tera/Defiance/STO/AoW/DE/Firefall/Darkfall/Neverwinter/PS2/ESO/FF14/Archeage/Gw2

  • KhebelnKhebeln Member UncommonPosts: 794
    Scorchien said:
    Khebeln said:
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    And ill add , as far as glamours go , when im running around in game it is hard to find 2 players that look alike (unless its intentional guild,alts , bots etc..) which is quite the accomplishment imo

    I wholly agree on that. FF14 Have one of the largest collection of gear combination of this quality in mmos.

    The only thing I would like to see is a glamour collection system similar to what WoW Legion offered to us in latest expansion. This would allow a more freedom with creating your own character look while adding a more of a collection vibe.

    There is so little space atm for collections right now. You really have to be selective what you keep and throw out for your glamours esp if you have multiple jobs.

    image
    (Retired)- Anarchy Online/Ultima Online/DAoC/Horizonsz/EQ2/SWG/AC1&2/L2/SoR/WoW/TMO/Requiem/Atlantica Online/Manibogi/Rift+(SL)/Lol/Hon/SWTOR/Wakfu/Champions Online/GW/Lotr/CO/TcoS/Tabula Rasa/Meridian 59/Vanguard/Shadowbane/Fury/SotW/Dreamlords/HGL/RoM/DDO/FFXI/Aoc/Eve/Warhammer Online/Gw2/TSW/Tera/Defiance/STO/AoW/DE/Firefall/Darkfall/Neverwinter/PS2/ESO/FF14/Archeage/Gw2

  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    edited January 2017
    Khebeln said:
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    I am not talking about apartments but rather actual land / plots open <3 like in ESO where I Can go buy as many houses as I want, edit the full layout of a house and property not a small space like in FFXI MOG houses, but rather actual property where I can fully customize.

    Land Space is still very limited, and that is the problem people are still complaining about.

    And Glamours are still a problem...

    Both poorly designed into the game that needs fixing its been years no fixes for either of them.

    Also what do you mean by (Monthly Fee to keep it), Is there land tax now for owning one I hear there was none everywhere I read online, except for the active subscription.

    As for the glamours (Yes I understand getting to level 50 is easy) I have a  almost level 50 before I quit, but that isn't the point, the point is the poorly designed cosmetics system in FFXIV that needs to be fixed. I should be able to use (Optional Items) and other unlocked in game cosmetics from level 1 no restrictions.

    Two features that keep me from even looking at this game again.

    Also there is no reason why why Whole homes or land can't be instanced so more people can buy them, not everyone wants an apartment you can't fully interact with (Grow Flower Beds) the whole scenery is not the same, while some people don't care about this the time spent developing apartments should have been put into offering more individual instanced homes in the game that can be purchased rather than the current way it is.

    Also not having enough disk space to store the data that is a complete lie for this to be truly the design of such a system has to be awful.
    Post edited by Renoaku on
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 544
    edited January 2017
    Renoaku said:
    This is just the perfect example of the MMO Industry that doesn't listen to feedback, and always gives an excuse of why they can't do something, honestly what is the point of a suggestions, or complaints if a game company or developers aren't going to fix the issue that is a plague to a game for over 2+ Years?

    http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/314598-Please-fix-or-remove-housing%21/page3 

    I am talking about Housing in FFXIV, Basically you buy virtual property with no way to sell it to another player, or trade it rather, or easily switch it within a FC, or remove the house from FC...

    They could have put in (Instanced Housing) With only 1000-2000 plots maximum and over 5k players who would love to own housing rather than having only 1000-2000 limited plots but rather fix it so players can easily enter another persons house, or set to default which house they want to enter and so on making it easy for anyone to own their own property (But rather they don't do this and this is one major turn off from trying this game again even though its been recommended to me by some friends, and the reason why I might look into ESO again once housing comes out but not sure on ESO.)

    Yoshida is stubborn, is convinced he knows best, and only "listens" to the playerbase now when it's already in line with something he wants to do, or can somehow be added to the Mog Station for more $$$.

    I've been with FFXIV since the very beginning of 1.0, and I've seen the transformation from when Yoshida took over up through to now.

    When he took over 1.x, and during the development of ARR, he was so much more open and receptive to the players, on just about everything. He was critical about how the game had been run previously, the arrogance displayed by SE and seemed determined to bring a change to how they approached the game and its playerbase. He swore he was going to change that, and did so until it became clear that ARR was not only doing well, but much better than they'd anticipated. From that point on, he began to recede from that openness and receptiveness.

    He began to say "no" far more often to players requests, no matter how popular the request might be. His reasoning would be somewhere along the lines of "it's too difficult to do in FFXIV", "it can't be done in FFXIV" or "that isn't how I want people playing FFXIV". He began to embody the very arrogance he'd once so strongly criticized.

    He's the only MMORPG Director/Producer I've ever known of to *remove* options from a game, giving players fewer choices in how they played or developed their character. Most developers build their titles in a very "additive" manner. Yoshida's approach is a decidedly "subtractive" one. It's not a matter of "less is more". It's just less.

    All that is bad enough. But then, if you were one of the relatively few people who looked at the game objectively and critically, you were - and still are - immediately trounced upon by the many who feel it's their sworn duty to apologetically and uncritically defend Yoshida's every word or action, no matter how poorly it was received by the player base at large. However egregious the screw-up, the excuses and denials just flow like Niagara Falls. I expect I'll get just such responses to this post.

    Housing is a wonderful example. It's been a train-wreck since day 1.

    Yoshida's tried to explain away the constant limitations with housing by claiming it's not possible to expand easily due to hardware restrictions and all this. The fact is, the limitation wasn't the hardware/resources, but his awful, short-sighted implementation of it.

    Meanwhile, he's ignored the suggestions by players who've said "Just make it instanced". He's ignored the requests of people who've asked to have housing be account-wide (not sure if that's changing for 4.0 or not; I've not seen any mention of it). His short-sightedness, obstinance, and arrogance prevent him from admitting he botched it. Instead, he's doubled-down on his design every step of the way, causing this on-going shortage.

    His short-sighted decisions in the Housing system have put him in a position where all housing, even apartments, have to have a fairly steep price tag on them, purely to mitigate how many would want to buy one. I suspect he had that same idea with the original implementation, and under-estimated just how many would actually want and have the means to buy one. Underestimating his own player-base is something he seems to do consistently, in a variety of ways.

    The housing system in FFXIV has been a mess since its inception, and he's done nothing to actually *fix* the problems. Because of his stubbornness and refusal to admit he screwed up, all he's done is push the broken goalpost a bit further by applying band-aids.

    Meanwhile, there's ESO, whose housing system goes live in about a week or so, and right from launch will be better designed, better implemented and infinitely more accessible than XIV's even after all its updates and "fixes". This is despite also being a cross-platform MMO, and having the same limitations to deal with.

    At release, ESO's housing will:
    - Be instanced "per house", greatly eliminating the restrictions XIV's housing has suffered from day 1. Players have suggested this in FFXIV. Yoshida has refused to do it.
    - Allow players to buy one of each of the 40-odd houses available if they wish. You're lucky if you can successfully acquire *a* house in FFXIV, nevermind more than one, or the one that you actually want.
    - Be Account-wide - all your characters will have access to your house. Players have also requested this in XIV, and Yoshida has refused to implement it.
    - Every player gets a *free* apartment for completing a fairly short quest. The best Yoshida can do in XIV, because of his poor planning, is to sell apartments for what, 500k gil?
    - Decorations in ESO's housing is far more wide-open and flexible than XIVs. As a "silly" but demonstrative example.. On the PTS (because ESO also has one of those), I was able to place my horse, in my house, upside down on the ceiling. 
    - Will be expanded on further over time in terms of functionality, not only adding more plots.

    ESO's existence, frankly, is a mockery of Yoshida's claims of what's "not possible" or "too difficult" to do in FFXIV. Put bluntly, there's a list of things in ESO that make Yoshida look either incompetent, out-of-touch with the rest of the genre, or plain dishonest. Housing is just one of those things.

    Another great example of how ESO makes him look ridiculous. RMT Spam. RMT Spam in FFXIV is awful. On some servers, you can be spammed several times in a minute. The only fix is a third-party add-on, which somehow accomplishes what Yoshida's team can't; and even that is limited in its efficacy. What's the excuse? "Well, RMT is unavoidable. It's everywhere. It's very very difficult to combat". Years into its service, and SE's best efforts have been temporary at best, and utterly insufficient overall.

    Meanwhile, you log into ESO - which is packed these days, anyone claiming otherwise is lying  or clueless - and there is *zero* RMT spam. Literally zero. Once again, ESO makes Yoshida look ridiculous by accomplishing something he claims is "very difficult", and tons of his apologists insist "can't be stopped". Well, log into ESO for a week, then come back here and tell me how "unpreventable" it is.

    I don't know how he has the gall to make some of the claims he does when there's another MMO out there that proves him wrong, time and again.
    Post edited by QuarterStack on
  • ForgrimmForgrimm Member EpicPosts: 3,053
    Renoaku said:
    Khebeln said:
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    I am not talking about apartments but rather actual land / plots open <3 like in ESO where I Can go buy as many houses as I want
    Didnt ESO just got housing?.....
    The patch with housing isn't even live yet, comes out on 2/6.
  • MaquiameMaquiame Member UncommonPosts: 1,073
    edited January 2017


    Yoshida is stubborn, is convinced he knows best, and only "listens" to the playerbase now when it's already in line with something he wants to do, or can somehow be added to the Mog Station for more $$$.

    I've been with FFXIV since the very beginning of 1.0, and I've seen the transformation from when Yoshida took over up through to now.

    When he took over 1.x, and during the development of ARR, he was so much more open and receptive to the players, on just about everything. He was critical about how the game had been run previously, the arrogance displayed by SE and seemed determined to bring a change to how they approached the game and its playerbase. He swore he was going to change that, and did so until it became clear that ARR was not only doing well, but much better than they'd anticipated. From that point on, he began to recede from that openness and receptiveness.

    He began to say "no" far more often to players requests, no matter how popular the request might be. His reasoning would be somewhere along the lines of "it's too difficult to do in FFXIV", "it can't be done in FFXIV" or "that isn't how I want people playing FFXIV". He began to embody the very arrogance he'd once so strongly criticized.

    He's the only MMORPG Director/Producer I've ever known of to *remove* options from a game, giving players fewer choices in how they played or developed their character. Most developers build their titles in a very "additive" manner. Yoshida's approach is a decidedly "subtractive" one. It's not a matter of "less is more". It's just less.

    All that is bad enough. But then, if you were one of the relatively few people who looked at the game objectively and critically, you were - and still are - immediately trounced upon by the many who feel it's their sworn duty to apologetically and uncritically defend Yoshida's every word or action, no matter how poorly it was received by the player base at large. However egregious the screw-up, the excuses and denials just flow like Niagara Falls. I expect I'll get just such responses to this post.

    Housing is a wonderful example. It's been a train-wreck since day 1.

    Yoshida's tried to explain away the constant limitations with housing by claiming it's not possible to expand easily due to hardware restrictions and all this. The fact is, the limitation wasn't the hardware/resources, but his awful, short-sighted implementation of it.

    Meanwhile, he's ignored the suggestions by players who've said "Just make it instanced". He's ignored the requests of people who've asked to have housing be account-wide (not sure if that's changing for 4.0 or not; I've not seen any mention of it). His short-sightedness, obstinance, and arrogance prevent him from admitting he botched it. Instead, he's doubled-down on his design every step of the way, causing this on-going shortage.

    His short-sighted decisions in the Housing system have put him in a position where all housing, even apartments, have to have a fairly steep price tag on them, purely to mitigate how many would want to buy one. I suspect he had that same idea with the original implementation, and under-estimated just how many would actually want and have the means to buy one. Underestimating his own player-base is something he seems to do consistently, in a variety of ways.

    The housing system in FFXIV has been a mess since its inception, and he's done nothing to actually *fix* the problems. Because of his stubbornness and refusal to admit he screwed up, all he's done is push the broken goalpost a bit further by applying band-aids.

    Meanwhile, there's ESO, whose housing system goes live in about a week or so, and right from launch will be better designed, better implemented and infinitely more accessible than XIV's even after all its updates and "fixes". This is despite also being a cross-platform MMO, and having the same limitations to deal with.

    At release, ESO's housing will:
    - Be instanced "per house", greatly eliminating the restrictions XIV's housing has suffered from day 1. Players have suggested this in FFXIV. Yoshida has refused to do it.
    - Allow players to buy one of each of the 40-odd houses available if they wish. You're lucky if you can successfully acquire *a* house in FFXIV, nevermind more than one, or the one that you actually want.
    - Be Account-wide - all your characters will have access to your house. Players have also requested this in XIV, and Yoshida has refused to implement it.
    - Every player gets a *free* apartment for completing a fairly short quest. The best Yoshida can do in XIV, because of his poor planning, is to sell apartments for what, 500k gil?
    - Decorations in ESO's housing is far more wide-open and flexible than XIVs. As a "silly" but demonstrative example.. On the PTS (because ESO also has one of those), I was able to place my horse, in my house, upside down on the ceiling. 
    - Will be expanded on further over time in terms of functionality, not only adding more plots.

    ESO's existence, frankly, is a mockery of Yoshida's claims of what's "not possible" or "too difficult" to do in FFXIV. Put bluntly, there's a list of things in ESO that make Yoshida look either incompetent, out-of-touch with the rest of the genre, or plain dishonest. Housing is just one of those things.

    Another great example of how ESO makes him look ridiculous. RMT Spam. RMT Spam in FFXIV is awful. On some servers, you can be spammed several times in a minute. The only fix is a third-party add-on, which somehow accomplishes what Yoshida's team can't; and even that is limited in its efficacy. What's the excuse? "Well, RMT is unavoidable. It's everywhere. It's very very difficult to combat". Years into its service, and SE's best efforts have been temporary at best, and utterly insufficient overall.

    Meanwhile, you log into ESO - which is packed these days, anyone claiming otherwise is lying  or clueless - and there is *zero* RMT spam. Literally zero. Once again, ESO makes Yoshida look ridiculous by accomplishing something he claims is "very difficult", and tons of his apologists insist "can't be stopped". Well, log into ESO for a week, then come back here and tell me how "unpreventable" it is.

    I don't know how he has the gall to make some of the claims he does when there's another MMO out there that proves him wrong, time and again.
    Thank you. He acts like the things you mentioned are impossible where as games like RIFT and hell even EQ2 have implemented over ten years ago. Even damn Wildstar got it right and XL games (ArchAge) finally caved and put in instanced areas. I am giving them one more chance after Stormblood with one last expansion. After that if these things aren't fixed I'm dropping them like a hot rock.

    image

    Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!

  • BakoryoBakoryo Member UncommonPosts: 469
    In case you didn't know, the whole armory chest will be increased by a lot once 4.0 comes. About four times bigger per slot so there will be more than enough room on your person to keep a ton of gear at any given time. Glamor crystals are just fine, and there are barely any enjoyable low level glamors anyway except a few. 

    Housing might get adressed and hopefully a few more wards will be added when 4.0 comes. 

    You also have to keep in mind there are a ton of limitations currently due to Ps3's lack of memory and storage space. But this support will stop with 4.0.

    The speed of the mole and the power of steel is my weapon

  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 544
    edited February 2017
    Maquiame said:

    Thank you. He acts like the things you mentioned are impossible where as games like RIFT and hell even EQ2 have implemented over ten years ago. Even damn Wildstar got it right and XL games (ArchAge) finally caved and put in instanced areas. I am giving them one more chance after Stormblood with one last expansion. After that if these things aren't fixed I'm dropping them like a hot rock.

    Likewise!

    Honestly, I keep holding out and waiting for XIV to improve and reach the potential it showed even back while Yoshida was working with the 1.x series. It's like he's decided to run in the other direction. But you know what, maybe that's exactly what SE wants. Maybe he's delivering on exactly the experience his boss is telling him he must create. That would be a pity, but I could at least accept that it's "out of his hands". 

    But stop making these bogus, easily debunked claims of things being "too difficult" or "not possible" and all this, because that's just lies. The examples are numerous.

    And he's done this time and again. I only listed a couple examples of where he's talking nonsense to defend the short-sighted design choices and needlessly limited systems in FFXIV.

    Like you mentioned with Housing.. EQ2 was doing housing on a huge level over a decade ago, on far weaker hardware and fewer resources. Hell, even FFXI's housing system was better implemented, more accessible and functional from day  one.

    Just to throw yet one more example... official Player Addon support. Yoshida was promising Player Add-ons support since ARR was still in development, it was something he definitely wanted, and they intended to get it implemented soon after release. Welp, it's now several years later, coming up on the 2nd expansion, and it still isn't in the game. Further, there's still no mention of it being added, and when asked about it, Yoshida blurts out more excuses.  Meanwhile ESO has an active and thriving player addon community, with a great variety of utilities players make regular use of.

    And I could go on even further with examples. 
    Post edited by QuarterStack on
  • hatefulpeacehatefulpeace Member UncommonPosts: 621
    Khebeln said:
    Dude. Do you even play the game ?

    Apartments, and instanced hosing system was added recently and is available for everyone in game for a modest fee. On top of that if you where a part of FC you could get access to private housing space inside the guild house for a very long time now.

    You should get your facts straight.

    If you want the expensive house + rent for it you can move to less populated server. That said to keep the house you have to have active sub and pay hefty monthly fee to keep it. FC housing and Residences dont cost anything extra and are very affordable.


    And about glamours ? Who cares.

    Getting to lv 50 is super fast. 95% of population is at max lv anyway at this point. Or at least got 1 character at 50. Leveling is a lot faster now than it used to be 2 years ago due to various new systems.

    And while not available in western regions, there are a jumping potions available that get you instantly to lv 50 in all the other regions for FF14.

    Thanks, I was going to buy this game. I will steer clear now, I am glad I read this, or I would of wasted money. I hate games that give you instant almost max level, and no level grind. Should take 3 months to get lvl 50 if you played 8 hours a day. If its what your talking about, mise well just take leveling out cause it doesnt mean anything. 
  • NoxeronNoxeron Member UncommonPosts: 64
    Khebeln said:
    Thanks, I was going to buy this game. I will steer clear now, I am glad I read this, or I would of wasted money. I hate games that give you instant almost max level, and no level grind. Should take 3 months to get lvl 50 if you played 8 hours a day. If its what your talking about, mise well just take leveling out cause it doesnt mean anything. 
    It's not instant, and you have all classes, which you level up separately, on the same character. They made it quicker to get to lvl 50 because the new content is at lvl 60. If you like to grind you can grind all jobs to max level. Should take you awhile. There is a free trial I believe.
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    edited February 2017
    Maquiame said:


    Yoshida is stubborn, is convinced he knows best, and only "listens" to the playerbase now when it's already in line with something he wants to do, or can somehow be added to the Mog Station for more $$$.

    I've been with FFXIV since the very beginning of 1.0, and I've seen the transformation from when Yoshida took over up through to now.

    When he took over 1.x, and during the development of ARR, he was so much more open and receptive to the players, on just about everything. He was critical about how the game had been run previously, the arrogance displayed by SE and seemed determined to bring a change to how they approached the game and its playerbase. He swore he was going to change that, and did so until it became clear that ARR was not only doing well, but much better than they'd anticipated. From that point on, he began to recede from that openness and receptiveness.

    He began to say "no" far more often to players requests, no matter how popular the request might be. His reasoning would be somewhere along the lines of "it's too difficult to do in FFXIV", "it can't be done in FFXIV" or "that isn't how I want people playing FFXIV". He began to embody the very arrogance he'd once so strongly criticized.

    He's the only MMORPG Director/Producer I've ever known of to *remove* options from a game, giving players fewer choices in how they played or developed their character. Most developers build their titles in a very "additive" manner. Yoshida's approach is a decidedly "subtractive" one. It's not a matter of "less is more". It's just less.

    All that is bad enough. But then, if you were one of the relatively few people who looked at the game objectively and critically, you were - and still are - immediately trounced upon by the many who feel it's their sworn duty to apologetically and uncritically defend Yoshida's every word or action, no matter how poorly it was received by the player base at large. However egregious the screw-up, the excuses and denials just flow like Niagara Falls. I expect I'll get just such responses to this post.

    Housing is a wonderful example. It's been a train-wreck since day 1.

    Yoshida's tried to explain away the constant limitations with housing by claiming it's not possible to expand easily due to hardware restrictions and all this. The fact is, the limitation wasn't the hardware/resources, but his awful, short-sighted implementation of it.

    Meanwhile, he's ignored the suggestions by players who've said "Just make it instanced". He's ignored the requests of people who've asked to have housing be account-wide (not sure if that's changing for 4.0 or not; I've not seen any mention of it). His short-sightedness, obstinance, and arrogance prevent him from admitting he botched it. Instead, he's doubled-down on his design every step of the way, causing this on-going shortage.

    His short-sighted decisions in the Housing system have put him in a position where all housing, even apartments, have to have a fairly steep price tag on them, purely to mitigate how many would want to buy one. I suspect he had that same idea with the original implementation, and under-estimated just how many would actually want and have the means to buy one. Underestimating his own player-base is something he seems to do consistently, in a variety of ways.

    The housing system in FFXIV has been a mess since its inception, and he's done nothing to actually *fix* the problems. Because of his stubbornness and refusal to admit he screwed up, all he's done is push the broken goalpost a bit further by applying band-aids.

    Meanwhile, there's ESO, whose housing system goes live in about a week or so, and right from launch will be better designed, better implemented and infinitely more accessible than XIV's even after all its updates and "fixes". This is despite also being a cross-platform MMO, and having the same limitations to deal with.

    At release, ESO's housing will:
    - Be instanced "per house", greatly eliminating the restrictions XIV's housing has suffered from day 1. Players have suggested this in FFXIV. Yoshida has refused to do it.
    - Allow players to buy one of each of the 40-odd houses available if they wish. You're lucky if you can successfully acquire *a* house in FFXIV, nevermind more than one, or the one that you actually want.
    - Be Account-wide - all your characters will have access to your house. Players have also requested this in XIV, and Yoshida has refused to implement it.
    - Every player gets a *free* apartment for completing a fairly short quest. The best Yoshida can do in XIV, because of his poor planning, is to sell apartments for what, 500k gil?
    - Decorations in ESO's housing is far more wide-open and flexible than XIVs. As a "silly" but demonstrative example.. On the PTS (because ESO also has one of those), I was able to place my horse, in my house, upside down on the ceiling. 
    - Will be expanded on further over time in terms of functionality, not only adding more plots.

    ESO's existence, frankly, is a mockery of Yoshida's claims of what's "not possible" or "too difficult" to do in FFXIV. Put bluntly, there's a list of things in ESO that make Yoshida look either incompetent, out-of-touch with the rest of the genre, or plain dishonest. Housing is just one of those things.

    Another great example of how ESO makes him look ridiculous. RMT Spam. RMT Spam in FFXIV is awful. On some servers, you can be spammed several times in a minute. The only fix is a third-party add-on, which somehow accomplishes what Yoshida's team can't; and even that is limited in its efficacy. What's the excuse? "Well, RMT is unavoidable. It's everywhere. It's very very difficult to combat". Years into its service, and SE's best efforts have been temporary at best, and utterly insufficient overall.

    Meanwhile, you log into ESO - which is packed these days, anyone claiming otherwise is lying  or clueless - and there is *zero* RMT spam. Literally zero. Once again, ESO makes Yoshida look ridiculous by accomplishing something he claims is "very difficult", and tons of his apologists insist "can't be stopped". Well, log into ESO for a week, then come back here and tell me how "unpreventable" it is.

    I don't know how he has the gall to make some of the claims he does when there's another MMO out there that proves him wrong, time and again.
    Thank you. He acts like the things you mentioned are impossible where as games like RIFT and hell even EQ2 have implemented over ten years ago. Even damn Wildstar got it right and XL games (ArchAge) finally caved and put in instanced areas. I am giving them one more chance after Stormblood with one last expansion. After that if these things aren't fixed I'm dropping them like a hot rock.
    It's just sad such a great game with great potential gone to waste...

    Look at how they could have designed it like Black Desert, or Elder Scrolls Online, even Final Fantasy XI was developed better, and had fair player housing FFXIV developers I don't know what is up with them.

    Not only the housing system, but the Glamour system is complete garbage too could be done better like ESO is.
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    First of all ,just because some post or someone or even MANY claim it needs a fix does not mean it does.
    Secondly,if you feel it needs a fix,you give your opinion on how to fix it.

    I can tell you that BOTH ideas mentioned by the OP,are really bad ideas which to me at least proves why a developer should NOT listen to gamer's.First of all ,my long time experience has taught me that MOST complaints are selfish ones,they are not in the best interest of the game.
    Number 1 rule to always remember,do NOT ever create any idea or mechanic that lets rmt in the door.If you create a market for selling houses guess who moves in?If you put that much value on houses guess what is NOT available anymore?

    Instance housing,sure but a vague comment.If you have 1 million players that is still an awful lot of plots and that is IF we all agree we want instancing.
    So when you create a thread that says FIX,i personally think it means it is not working ,broken,it should not mean ..I want to sell my home,I want to remove it from wherever.

    Honestly ,reading the entire thread i get the feeling the OP does not understand how RMT move in on ideas and how SE has been battling them for a long time since back in ffxi DAYS.Would people rather do like Blizzard and just COPOUT,like they did in Diablo removing the auction house?You see if there is a problem ,you fix it to thwart RMT but Blizzard chose the route of NOPE,we don't make money fixing that so we will just ignore it.Se tries to thwart problems BEFORE they need fixing,does not mean they are the best option or even ones i agree with ,but i can see what they are doing.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    Point is that if you have a legitimate beef with the way housing is done,like perhaps TOO expensive,too hard to get,sure sounds legit,then give  an option to fix it that is NOT selfish and in best interest of the game.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • F2PlagueF2Plague Member UncommonPosts: 232
    Prime example of new generation of entitled gamer's. "I want changes that make things better and easier for me". Okay. Lets just change systems that have been in place for years since the launch of ARR because you don't like it. I don't know if you have noticed but FFXIV is doing just fine without you. As others have said ESO housing is brand new and you have little to no idea what you are talking about. Sure you can decorate the outside of your house... which you can also do in FFXIV decorating your plot. And in my opinion instanced neighborhoods are infinitely better then individually instanced housing plots. Which is what ESO is providing. I am probably coming off as a douche right now but I feel like no one is getting the point across to you that these changes you are whining about have little to no value in the grand scheme of things. With the introduction of apartments for players who cant find or are waiting for a housing plot to open up. Say in the next expansion for example. There is really nothing to complain about. 

    In short, getting to 50 is easy. The glamour quest is easy. And the housing system has its flaws but in the end still better than individually instanced housing plots it at least gives a sense of being in a community. Rather than having your house on the other side of a magical wardrobe by yourself.

    I hope you enjoy which ever game you decide to play. You should try and look for the good in things rather than the bad, you will have a lot more fun.
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    edited February 2017
    Wizardry said:
    First of all ,just because some post or someone or even MANY claim it needs a fix does not mean it does.
    Secondly,if you feel it needs a fix,you give your opinion on how to fix it.

    I can tell you that BOTH ideas mentioned by the OP,are really bad ideas which to me at least proves why a developer should NOT listen to gamer's.First of all ,my long time experience has taught me that MOST complaints are selfish ones,they are not in the best interest of the game.
    Number 1 rule to always remember,do NOT ever create any idea or mechanic that lets rmt in the door.If you create a market for selling houses guess who moves in?If you put that much value on houses guess what is NOT available anymore?

    Instance housing,sure but a vague comment.If you have 1 million players that is still an awful lot of plots and that is IF we all agree we want instancing.
    So when you create a thread that says FIX,i personally think it means it is not working ,broken,it should not mean ..I want to sell my home,I want to remove it from wherever.

    Honestly ,reading the entire thread i get the feeling the OP does not understand how RMT move in on ideas and how SE has been battling them for a long time since back in ffxi DAYS.Would people rather do like Blizzard and just COPOUT,like they did in Diablo removing the auction house?You see if there is a problem ,you fix it to thwart RMT but Blizzard chose the route of NOPE,we don't make money fixing that so we will just ignore it.Se tries to thwart problems BEFORE they need fixing,does not mean they are the best option or even ones i agree with ,but i can see what they are doing.

    Well honestly they have two options...

    1.) Make housing like black desert which should be easy given modern day technology compared to in Final Fantasy XI where everyone had instanced housing loading screen and a mog house, this could be done a lot better, and if this isn't possible...

    2.) Then making an option for instanced housing as in like ESO, or older instance everyone is familiar with, isn't a bad Idea at least everyone gets what they want.

    Also I don't see why Square Enix is taking such a big stance on "RMT" who cares generally, if a player is botting, cheating, or hacking (BAN THEM) its deserved, trades items for goods outside of the game which have been obtained legally I honestly don't care, I see items on sale on the PA website which allows people to sell goods for real money houses and accounts with FC going from like $1500 and up right now.

    And 1 Million Plots is a lot, but this is where good development comes into play, a team of good developers can easily make a game that can handle 1 million houses depending on how they coded this into the game to begin with, I mean look at Elder Scrolls Online, and Black Desert, ESO uses the old type of instanced housing, while "BDO uses a newer type"... The only issue which could easily be fixed with coding would be to allow others to visit and view other peoples instanced houses if using a system like BDO, or simply enter other persons houses, or designate a house open to your Free Company...

    Like its also not the fact that I wan't things easier, its the fact that everyone is paying $14.95 a month I believe it is for a subscription to be able to access all content in Final Fantasy XIV, and yet content is being restricted by (RMT) (People Controling the housing market.) (No way to directly trade land to others.) 

    When instead if Houses are truly limited the Square Enix might as well either cut the subscriptions down for everyone who doesn't own a house which obviously they are not going to do, or Increase pricing of everyone who owns and holds a house by $5 per month per tier of the house making it go up to like $30 a month for the largest house in the game.

    ^ Like obviously I don't really mean it should be like this but generally "Housing" "Gardening" " The ability to freely customize, and swap costumes should be a thing in Final Fantasy XIV" and the thought of "Instanced Housing" Isn't too bad when you think about it especially if they can work it like in BDO it would be awesome.

    Throwing in Apartments was a Slap to the face to me and a band-aid which doesn't fix the problem.

    And as far as Glamours, I really don't care how easy it is I am sure its rather easy to do this, but there is no reason why someone should have to be level 50 to  use glamours, and no reason why they work the way they do when there is modern day technology its just flat out stupid, and I can only pray that developers one day become as smart as they were back in the year of like 1998-2005 when developers were halfway decent before this pandemic of bad MMORPGS...

    Final Fantasy XI better than Final Fantasy XIV, older game sure, better absolutely, only problem was finding parties that sucked fixed that I would have kept playing it longer.
  • QuarterStackQuarterStack Member RarePosts: 544
    edited February 2017
    Wizardry said:
    Point is that if you have a legitimate beef with the way housing is done,like perhaps TOO expensive,too hard to get,sure sounds legit,then give  an option to fix it that is NOT selfish and in best interest of the game.
    I just gotta say, Wizardry... You, of all people, lecturing people on how they should not complain unless they have better suggestions to offer is the height of irony.

    You rant, and complain and bitch at length about seemingly every MMORPG and Developer whose forums you choose to grace with  your presence.

    And further, since when do you defend FFXIV? When did that come about? Or are you just playing devil's advocate here?

    Further, people *have* suggested better options for housing in this game... here, and on the official forums, going back to after it was just introduced to the game and it became immediately obvious the system was flawed. Ways were suggested that have actually been used in other MMOs (before and since) and have -gasp- actually *worked*. 

    Yoshida has, in his usual arrogant manner, ignored those suggestions and continued to double and triple down on the broken design he implemented, adding layer upon broken layer onto a flawed foundation. Rather than admitting "oops... screwed up! We'll fix it!" and going back to the drawing board, he kept applying duct-tape and bubblegum to a fundamentally broken system, while ignoring and permitting glaring issues to persist which they knew were disruptive to players' experiences.

    So, not only is it ironic that you are suggesting it's unproductive for people to complain without suggestions, it's also incredibly disingenuous... because many people have done just that. For years now. All the constructive suggestions in the world mean squat when the guy with the final say on implementing them isn't listening.

    "After all, it's not easy banging your heart against some mad bugger's wall".  - Roger Waters

    At the end of the day, it's become all too clear to me that Yoshida is in over his head cointinuing to run FFXIV. He managed to turn it around, yes. But that was a long time ago. Frankly, Tanaka could have turned it around as well, if given the same orders/opportunity Yoshida was. Rebuilding a smaller world and implementing a new graphics engine and back-end infrastructure were *obvious* things, and matters of finding the right people for the job. Everything else - the races, the setting, the classes/jobs, the story, the world, the characters, etc... all that was already prepared for Yoshida. This is why 2.0 was so strong. He was riding out the wave left to him by Tanaka and his team.

    Once 2.0 brought closure to the story begun in 1.0, and it became all Yoshida's baby with 3.0, the cracks started to show. They continue to show even going into 4.0, and it's not even out yet. Adding two new DPS jobs to a game that already has them in abundance, and giving the rationalization he gave for it just demonstrates, yet again, how out of touch he is with the genre, with his own playerbase, and with his own game.

     There have been massive discussions and debates among long-time players of this game about what the new jobs could be. Any time someone suggested it could be two new DPS, the response was an immediate "No.. There's no way. That's the dumbest thing ever. That would be the absolute most retarded thing they could do to this game right now". Welp... they did it anyway. 

    He's been riding on the goodwill of players because "he saved FFXIV" for a while now. But that ice is getting thinner with each screwed-up ass-backwards decision he makes. He helped give XIV new life, but now he's holding it back. It's time for Yoshida to go. Bring in someone with more vision, more imagination, more understanding of MMORPGs, and the balls to implement those ideas.
    Post edited by QuarterStack on
  • ZenislavZenislav Member RarePosts: 262
    edited February 2017
    What good is ESO housing when rest of game is bad? Combat is terrible, you get impression that you can play the way you want and that is far from truth (not talking about low lvls), they gave Skyrim type of inventory to MMO game (someone was probably on heavy drugs), no auction of any type or any good trading system but rather forcing players to join guilds that have stalls at X place hoping that some random guy will visit it and maybe buy what you sell. And that is just start.

    Btw what is so good with ESO housing anyway? Is there any function to it other than combat dummy? Just big money sink? Glorified trophy room?

    Oh and when you are trying to compare ESo and FF I can add this. Armor pieces in FF put ESO ones to shame. Its not even competition. Also in FF you actually have option to change how you look from countless of beautiful pieces of gear. And what you have in ESO? Few terrible costumes from cash shop? And they are one big pieces so you cant change them. Or fact if you don't want to use costume you are stuck looking like some random ugly clown.

    FF is one of if not only MMO that actually feels like finished product, has loads of content, looks beautiful, etc. If this are reasons why you don't want to play it than i guess you are here just to whine. Sad that your MMO is not even half as good as this? Something of that probably.
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    Zenislav said:
    What good is ESO housing when rest of game is bad? Combat is terrible, you get impression that you can play the way you want and that is far from truth (not talking about low lvls), they gave Skyrim type of inventory to MMO game (someone was probably on heavy drugs), no auction of any type or any good trading system but rather forcing players to join guilds that have stalls at X place hoping that some random guy will visit it and maybe buy what you sell. And that is just start.

    Btw what is so good with ESO housing anyway? Is there any function to it other than combat dummy? Just big money sink? Glorified trophy room?

    Oh and when you are trying to compare ESo and FF I can add this. Armor pieces in FF put ESO ones to shame. Its not even competition. Also in FF you actually have option to change how you look from countless of beautiful pieces of gear. And what you have in ESO? Few terrible costumes from cash shop? And they are one big pieces so you cant change them. Or fact if you don't want to use costume you are stuck looking like some random ugly clown.

    FF is one of if not only MMO that actually feels like finished product, has loads of content, looks beautiful, etc. If this are reasons why you don't want to play it than i guess you are here just to whine. Sad that your MMO is not even half as good as this? Something of that probably.
    The game could be great, but its the developers lack of brains that really get to me these days FFXI was a great game, but lacked UI Updates and all FFXIV just basically has a awful glamour system, and can't really obtain the housing you want where you want it. 

    ESO you can and they will likely add changes to eso.
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,852
    edited February 2017
    The only improvement glamours needs is maybe......and I mean maybe because it's not that big of a deal to me....... a dye system similar to GW2 in that I want to be able to alter all the colors on an item.
  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    The only improvement glamours needs is maybe......and I mean maybe because it's not that big of a deal to me....... a dye system similar to GW2 in that I want to be able to alter all the colors on an item.
    I don't get why there needs to be a glamour system anyways why can't they just give players a unlocked list to choose from and equip on their characters rather than Glamours, and choose colors and such its much easier, any level can do it and enjoy the game Especially since they sell items in their cash shop that can't be worn over  gear because it has to be made into a glamour...
  • SoulSurferSoulSurfer Member UncommonPosts: 1,024
    I just finished relic for my pld 275 ilvl and I'm not even happy about it since I know it will be obsolete in a few months lol... I do also miss the days of XI where you spent a long time getting gear, but that gear LASTED...
  • MrMelGibsonMrMelGibson Member EpicPosts: 3,029
    Wizardry said:
    Point is that if you have a legitimate beef with the way housing is done,like perhaps TOO expensive,too hard to get,sure sounds legit,then give  an option to fix it that is NOT selfish and in best interest of the game.

  • RenoakuRenoaku Member EpicPosts: 3,156
    edited March 2017
    I just finished relic for my pld 275 ilvl and I'm not even happy about it since I know it will be obsolete in a few months lol... I do also miss the days of XI where you spent a long time getting gear, but that gear LASTED...
    True I liked FFXI more, and I am sick of the Excuses the developed of FFXIV are giving, first a failed launch, and then claiming they can't fix wardrobe system without recoding like the entire game database of thousands of items.
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