Action combat is one the best developments in MMORPG design ever. It's hard to go back to any other type of combat after you get the hang of it and enjoy it.
Any type of combat that let's you click on ability bars just feels very 20th century to me now.
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I like the combat system in Eve Online. However, I can't play that game anymore because its not really being developed any longer. Doing the same things all the time gets boring. The devs made too many bad decisions that wasted development time and money (e.g. DUST).
Im kinda lazy in combat...if I have to move around and dodge alot then I wear out pretty quick mentally....To me that is more work than fun....Ive played some good turn based so I wanted to choose that also....FPS can be fun also, depends on the game
I choose slower turn based games, because they usually have my favorite aspects.
Essentially I like constrained energy systems, where you and your opponent(s) are trying to outguess and out predict each other. Trying to bait out the enemies dodge so your heavy hitting moves can hit harder, or trying to bait out the enemies aces when you have your best defences out.
Iron Realms games are really good at this... I'm just not a fan of in your face P2W, and a large part of it being a MUD (This one I couldn't afford if I wanted to be "best in").
Tera does has instances where this does happen, even with NPCs. Though the characters are given SO MUCH ENERGY/MANA/HEALTH that it's just kind of easy and better to just be dumb with skill rotations.
Magic The Gathering does it very well, especially in the super limited formats like draft. But then it's all in the face about it's P2W in the more open formats (It's annoying to me and I can afford it if I choose to), and the min/maxing is so strong that it becomes RPS with some of the power decks.
GW1 has some builds that are really good at this.
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I tend to prefer combat based largely on mitigating damage by getting out of the way.
That sounds like some kind of action combat to me, parrying and dodging certainly belong in that category.
You could call it action combat, but it can also be tab targeting. And when people talk about "action RPGs", they usually seem to mean "point and click a mouse all over the screen really aggressively", which is quite far from what I'm looking for.
I've played action MMOs including Vindictus and Tera, and a lot of players played them with a gamepad, so there's no pointing and clicking at all.
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I always like WoW's combat system. Fast paced, actiony, but still sticks to the classic combat. With legion, its even better. I would never want to go back to vanilla WoW combat, but at the time it was decent for the time period. Combat is way better now though.
I kinda liked black desert online combat system. But it was too easy in PVE, and not that balanced. I'd go around 1-2 hitting everything. In WoW that only happens when leveling if you use heirlooms.
My all time favorite would have to go to auto assault though. The only MMO where you drove around in a car, going pew pew pew...and actually damaging the environment (though it was temporary). Second favorite would be City of Heroes, but that is more for all the awesome super hero abilities than anything else. And third favorite is WoW, but more so the modern version of their combat.
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Because some people do not play MMOs / MMORPGs for the combat and horizontal progression. This genre was not always like this.
Many MMORPGs from the original genre were quite heavily about grinding. I believe that for many people, staying on one spot with a bunch of friends killing monsters for 12-18 hours straight was much more comfortable with a tab target combat rather than action combat which is more demanding (unnecessarily in an MMORPG), in my opinion. The players were grinding at the spot because they wanted to develop their avatar, not because they wanted to play a fantasy shooter jumping around, dodging, aiming.
I also believe that in tab target combat, the player skills (horizontal) have less influence on the outcome of the combat encounters which is also more natural for MMORPGs which are about avatar development and its vertical strength and progression rather than about players' ability to dodge or aim attacks. In an MMORPG, you built a better avatar (distributed skill / stat points better, reached higher level, managed to get better or better combination of items, etc.), you win the combat.
Nowadays, people play ESO, BDO, GW, etc.. It is a different genre, in my opinion. Back then, you knew you were playing a PC MMORPG. Now if I look at videos from, for instance, your favorite BDO, I dont know if I am looking at someone playing from a couch with his XBOX controller or if its a PC MMO.
So I can as well ask "yeah...why would you want that?".
I feel that the difference is more the difficulty, you actually needed tactics in the old MMOs. When everything got so easy that a skill rotation was good enough even for many raids the action combat at least gave you something to do while waiting for the mobs to die.
You can certainly have action combat in hard games as well but while EQ and similar games were grindy combat generally wasn't as boring as it have become in modern games using similar mechanics.
If you neither have to think while fighting or reacting to other players/mobs combat becomes really dull.
Your choices of skills and timing actually mattered in the late 90s, if you messed up even trash mobs could kill you. That is the difference between today and back then.
Of course the grind did also have some impact but I don't think it was the main thing.
For an MMORPG I prefer tab targeting. Yet I don't think that is descriptive enough to describe what I prefer. I prefer a system such as SWG pre-cu had.
Where skills are attack moves not magical flashy powers, it also needs differing damage types, armor types, stats/states that truly matter IE Dodge truly leads to lots of dodging, Knock Down defenses and knockdowns, Dizzy effects, blind effects, posture changes; postures that effect damage dealt/taken and hit ratio. Without those things Tab targeting feels trite and unimaginative, the omission also kills the presence of strategy..
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There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
So far, only tab-targetting has provided depth to combat in the MMO world (well, out of the games I've played) but I recognise that other combat systems could provide depth if designed correctly.
Basically, I want to win a fight because I have been able to out-think my opponent. With FPS and action combat, there is very little thinking involved. You usually have a limited choice between a few skills and your movement abilities. This makes it very easy to think what you need to do next, so the winner (assuming balance) is usually the player with the best motor skills - the one who dodged/blocked quickest or who aimed most accurately. In most FPS and action games, this means the winner is often the person who has played the longest, as they've had the most time to develop their muscle memory.
Turn-based has the potential to have deep combat so I wouldn't be opposed to it, however I can't see how it would work on a large scale. I mean, if you had a 50v50 pvp fight in a turn-based game, you're going to get pretty bored waiting for everyone else to have their turn before it gets to you.
My ideal combat system is a hybrid between tab-targetting and action combat. I want the massive skill selection from tab-targetting which provides the depth (assuming designed right), but I want you to have to aim your skills rather than being locked on so that motor skills still play a part.
So far, only tab-targetting has provided depth to combat in the MMO world (well, out of the games I've played) but I recognise that other combat systems could provide depth if designed correctly.
Basically, I want to win a fight because I have been able to out-think my opponent. With FPS and action combat, there is very little thinking involved. You usually have a limited choice between a few skills and your movement abilities. This makes it very easy to think what you need to do next, so the winner (assuming balance) is usually the player with the best motor skills - the one who dodged/blocked quickest or who aimed most accurately. In most FPS and action games, this means the winner is often the person who has played the longest, as they've had the most time to develop their muscle memory.
Turn-based has the potential to have deep combat so I wouldn't be opposed to it, however I can't see how it would work on a large scale. I mean, if you had a 50v50 pvp fight in a turn-based game, you're going to get pretty bored waiting for everyone else to have their turn before it gets to you.
My ideal combat system is a hybrid between tab-targetting and action combat. I want the massive skill selection from tab-targetting which provides the depth (assuming designed right), but I want you to have to aim your skills rather than being locked on so that motor skills still play a part.
Try Blade & Soul. The PvP is all about mind games, baiting out skills and waiting for an opening. Several of the classes (especially Blade Master and Force Master) are quite complex with a lot of skills interacting in complex ways.
Action combat in the style of TERA. I liked the targeting mechanics and skill design. It takes the best ideas from action combat and tab target. Something like Black Desert while generally good, is just too demanding on my hands. Wildstar also falls into that category. GW2 and ESO don't hurt to play, but their action combat mechanics aren't as good as a game like TERA for me. So apparently it's hard to find that middle ground lol.
ESO and Wildstar are the two best examples for me. Although I hate animation cancelling in ESO and I see that as a flaw and weakness in the system, not a strength.
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I care more about the gameplay.
Any type of combat that let's you click on ability bars just feels very 20th century to me now.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Essentially I like constrained energy systems, where you and your opponent(s) are trying to outguess and out predict each other. Trying to bait out the enemies dodge so your heavy hitting moves can hit harder, or trying to bait out the enemies aces when you have your best defences out.
Iron Realms games are really good at this... I'm just not a fan of in your face P2W, and a large part of it being a MUD (This one I couldn't afford if I wanted to be "best in").
Tera does has instances where this does happen, even with NPCs. Though the characters are given SO MUCH ENERGY/MANA/HEALTH that it's just kind of easy and better to just be dumb with skill rotations.
Magic The Gathering does it very well, especially in the super limited formats like draft. But then it's all in the face about it's P2W in the more open formats (It's annoying to me and I can afford it if I choose to), and the min/maxing is so strong that it becomes RPS with some of the power decks.
GW1 has some builds that are really good at this.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
I kinda liked black desert online combat system. But it was too easy in PVE, and not that balanced. I'd go around 1-2 hitting everything. In WoW that only happens when leveling if you use heirlooms.
My all time favorite would have to go to auto assault though. The only MMO where you drove around in a car, going pew pew pew...and actually damaging the environment (though it was temporary). Second favorite would be City of Heroes, but that is more for all the awesome super hero abilities than anything else. And third favorite is WoW, but more so the modern version of their combat.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
You can certainly have action combat in hard games as well but while EQ and similar games were grindy combat generally wasn't as boring as it have become in modern games using similar mechanics.
If you neither have to think while fighting or reacting to other players/mobs combat becomes really dull.
Your choices of skills and timing actually mattered in the late 90s, if you messed up even trash mobs could kill you. That is the difference between today and back then.
Of course the grind did also have some impact but I don't think it was the main thing.
Where skills are attack moves not magical flashy powers, it also needs differing damage types, armor types, stats/states that truly matter IE Dodge truly leads to lots of dodging, Knock Down defenses and knockdowns, Dizzy effects, blind effects, posture changes; postures that effect damage dealt/taken and hit ratio. Without those things Tab targeting feels trite and unimaginative, the omission also kills the presence of strategy..
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I don't know if you heard but right now Ankama is developing Dofus 3 and it looks very promising. They announced it like 1 month ago.
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
So far, only tab-targetting has provided depth to combat in the MMO world (well, out of the games I've played) but I recognise that other combat systems could provide depth if designed correctly.
Basically, I want to win a fight because I have been able to out-think my opponent. With FPS and action combat, there is very little thinking involved. You usually have a limited choice between a few skills and your movement abilities. This makes it very easy to think what you need to do next, so the winner (assuming balance) is usually the player with the best motor skills - the one who dodged/blocked quickest or who aimed most accurately. In most FPS and action games, this means the winner is often the person who has played the longest, as they've had the most time to develop their muscle memory.
Turn-based has the potential to have deep combat so I wouldn't be opposed to it, however I can't see how it would work on a large scale. I mean, if you had a 50v50 pvp fight in a turn-based game, you're going to get pretty bored waiting for everyone else to have their turn before it gets to you.
My ideal combat system is a hybrid between tab-targetting and action combat. I want the massive skill selection from tab-targetting which provides the depth (assuming designed right), but I want you to have to aim your skills rather than being locked on so that motor skills still play a part.
Try Blade & Soul. The PvP is all about mind games, baiting out skills and waiting for an opening. Several of the classes (especially Blade Master and Force Master) are quite complex with a lot of skills interacting in complex ways.
I am a die hard old school MMO'er started in the 90s. But WoW's combat was just crazy fun.
The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.
The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...
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