Quantcast

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

I would hope for a Skyrim style retention !

** I would hope for a Skyrim style retention ! **

But for this to happen, several things would have to go just right:
- The game will have to have extreme engaging content, one could only hope.
- An extreme community to keep people wanting to play, one can only hope.
- If all goes well, and the game is a money maker, developers would have to dump the money right back in for more development.

SOE and the EverQuest series were more greedy.  Blizzards World of Warcraft spent years of free patches and updates before marketing showed it's ugly face !


Sure this is another one of my bold statements.  Its my hopeful vision.  BUT, Skyrim does prove that people can STILL play a single game for years.  


The possibility is there !........ For every mmo designed in the last twelve years.....This was completely impossible.  With cash shops, short 30 days of content, strictly solo games and solo story lines.


I just wished they would charge a box price of like $59.99, It's really amazing how the so called bad economy, how people could come up with the cash !  

Comments

  • SavageHorizonSavageHorizon Member RarePosts: 3,432
    edited January 2017
    Lol, all the recent obsession with Pantheon is telling. 

    Your bold statement are starting to look like blantent trolling statements. 

    You know damn well the game is not going to have the same retention as Skyrim. 

    Mods should close this thread. 




  • delete5230delete5230 Member EpicPosts: 6,528
    Lol, all the recent obsession with Pantheon is telling. 

    Your bold statement are starting to look like blantent trolling statements. 

    You know damn well the game is not going to have the same retention as Skyrim. 

    Mods should close this thread. 

    Let me guess, you would like to talk about doom !.....I'm going to work, more later :)
  • frostymugfrostymug Member RarePosts: 643
    ** I would hope for a Skyrim style retention ! **

    But for this to happen, several things would have to go just right:
    - The game will have to have extreme engaging content, one could only hope.
    - An extreme community to keep people wanting to play, one can only hope.
    - If all goes well, and the game is a money maker, developers would have to dump the money right back in for more development.

    SOE and the EverQuest series were more greedy.  Blizzards World of Warcraft spent years of free patches and updates before marketing showed it's ugly face !


    Sure this is another one of my bold statements.  Its my hopeful vision.  BUT, Skyrim does prove that people can STILL play a single game for years.  


    The possibility is there !........ For every mmo designed in the last twelve years.....This was completely impossible.  With cash shops, short 30 days of content, strictly solo games and solo story lines.


    I just wished they would charge a box price of like $59.99, It's really amazing how the so called bad economy, how people could come up with the cash !  
    Skyrim is a single player game with no/virtually no operating costs. A single box price works great for that.

    99% of what keeps 99% of people interested in Skyrim is community mods. Done for free. From many different minds from many different directions. Some people want Thomas the Tank Engine and Macho Man flying around and destroying the countryside. Some people want realistic clouds. Some people want naked women. Some people want a complete overhaul of the world into a completely different world altogether. In a single player game like Skyrim all of those some peoples can get all of what they want. You can pretty much guarantee that no two Skyrim installs are the same and can double down on the bet that no Skyrim install that is played extensively is a base or Bethesda expansion only install.

    I hope for retention too. For any MMO I want to play. For single player games, like Skyrim, it is completely irrelevant though, and this comparison does not compute. I would try to give some analogy here, but anything would come off as completely ridiculous.
  • SavageHorizonSavageHorizon Member RarePosts: 3,432
    OK i get what you are saying, the game should have the staying power of Skyrim. Personally if it has the staying power of EQ it would be something. 

    Rather than compare it to Skyrim you are better off comparing it to EQ 1/2 or any other long running mmo. 

    It's the mention of Skyrim that threw me off but yeah, other than that I agree. 





  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916
    Give it up, lol

    There are two reasons why Skyrim has a high replayability (and retention):
    it is single-player
    it has a very active modding community supplying high-quality mods

    Pantheon has neither, and will never have either.

    Pantheon will have the standard MMO retention rate, i.e. it will lose 75% of its launch players in 6 weeks.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,497
    What you should be hoping for is an EVE like growth and retention curve, probably one of best for MMOs not made by Blizzard or NCSoft.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • XatshXatsh Member UncommonPosts: 383
    Give it up, lol

    There are two reasons why Skyrim has a high replayability (and retention):
    it is single-player
    it has a very active modding community supplying high-quality mods

    Pantheon has neither, and will never have either.

    Pantheon will have the standard MMO retention rate, i.e. it will lose 75% of its launch players in 6 weeks.
    I agree it will lose alot of people in the first 2 months, Because alot of people will try it and absolutly despise it. This game is not really for those who love the new style solo player mmos with options for grouping or those who prefer the WoW model of gameplay, which is the majority of mmo players. It is why I am glad Pantheon will offer a free trial so people can see if they like they game before buying.

    But outside that I disagree with the retention rate following the norms. Pantheon is not built on the verticle BIS system. Where you do X quest to get gear good enough to beat X dungeon to get gear to beat X beginner raid to get gear good enough to beat X hardcore raid. Then every 6 months they release a new raid.

    Pantheon is having situational gear, meaning it seems to be more structured horizontally (not pure horizontal but a hell of alot more then every themepark out there). This will lead to multiple gearsets... which means multiple BIS sets for each specific situation you find yourself in.

    The game is also more group centric and focused. And trust me from playing oldschool EQ and FFXI for nearly 14 years. the community and your guild is what keeps people playing longterm. Fast forward to today and your guild is nothing but a chat channel... popular games like FFXIV actually remove the need to even socialize to succeed and progress.

    So the group aspect of Pantheon will help alot with retention in itself.

    And from reading this is a not a rush to endgame, game. Meaning content is meaningful and hopefully long lasting.

    As long as they add content quicker then the players can consume it retention for those who like the game will not be an issue. And for a game that is not primarily solo quest driven that should not be too hard.

    For an exact retention we need info about endgame though which is not released yet, at least not in any detail. Since even with a non-endgame focused game after time people will reside at endgame. IF it is good.

  • DullahanDullahan Member EpicPosts: 4,534
    People will be able to try the game for free. Because of this, most people subscribing will know they're interested, and Pantheon will defy the trend and keep the majority of their subscribers for much longer than recent MMOs.


  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid Member EpicPosts: 10,435
    edited January 2017
    The first step to achieve Skyrim levels of retention is to make a single player game with full modding support.

    The second step? There's none. In an mmo, retention will always be lower because modders cant keep the servers running for free/donations, enough paying customers do.




  • HorusraHorusra Member EpicPosts: 4,232
    Kyleran said:
    What you should be hoping for is an EVE like growth and retention curve, probably one of best for MMOs not made by Blizzard or NCSoft.

    What one that is dying away?  Last I heard up till his F2P bump, which remains to see how long that will last, Eve was fading away.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,161
    Horusra said:
    Kyleran said:
    What you should be hoping for is an EVE like growth and retention curve, probably one of best for MMOs not made by Blizzard or NCSoft.

    What one that is dying away?  Last I heard up till his F2P bump, which remains to see how long that will last, Eve was fading away.
    They built up the game the right way though. The decline in recent years is a completely separate issue.

    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    edited January 2017
    Retention - so about 1 in 5,000?


    Skyrim's "triumph" is not retention but high sales.
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 28,769
    gervaise1 said:
    Retention - so about 1 in 5,000?


    Skyrim's "triumph" is not retention but high sales.
    Actually it's both.

    There are still a lot of people who play the game. I'm definitely one of them.
  • SjorAndSkySjorAndSky Member UncommonPosts: 24
    edited January 2017
    Sovrath said:
    gervaise1 said:
    Retention - so about 1 in 5,000?


    Skyrim's "triumph" is not retention but high sales.
    Actually it's both.

    There are still a lot of people who play the game. I'm definitely one of them.
    Lmao right?

    Outside of GTA5 and FO4, Skyrim, a near 6 year old game has more active players then any other singleplayer RPG right now. Nearly DOUBLE the active players of the next highest if you combine Skyrim and Skyrim Special Edition. It's quite literally the best example of retention for it's genre LOL.

    http://store.steampowered.com/stats/

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,161
    Sovrath said:
    gervaise1 said:
    Retention - so about 1 in 5,000?

    Skyrim's "triumph" is not retention but high sales.
    Actually it's both.

    There are still a lot of people who play the game. I'm definitely one of them.
    The HD reboot was brilliant as was bringing the mods to console. By doing that they extended sales again on console and PC alike. Zenimax and Bethesda are rather brilliant in that regard. Same with FO4.

    Strong community means repeat sales. That's also how GTA rakes in the big bucks.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • LimnicLimnic Member RarePosts: 1,116
    Part of Skyrim's retention is the popularity of the series as well as the amount of things players can do with Beth titles.

    Pantheon doesn't have either of those things. They are kind of a square-one project and need to plan retention around the notion of being a niche title.
  • MendelMendel Member EpicPosts: 3,983
    Xatsh said:
    <snip>
    Pantheon is having situational gear, meaning it seems to be more structured horizontally (not pure horizontal but a hell of alot more then every themepark out there). This will lead to multiple gearsets... which means multiple BIS sets for each specific situation you find yourself in.

    <snip>
    Is this confirmed?  I haven't seen any detailed exploration of an Inventory interface in any of the streams glimpses of loot with no 'evaluation' time.  And there certainly hasn't been any indication of the rogue character the latest gameplay stream followed needing to swap gear for DPS or resists or anything situational.  This sounds interesting, but is this just more wishful thinking (plus hype), or is this something else that is planned and hasn't been seen, or is it something just blurted out for this post?

    Let's try to nail this down to a True / False situation and avoid the rampant hype.

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • DullahanDullahan Member EpicPosts: 4,534
    Mendel said:
    Xatsh said:
    <snip>
    Pantheon is having situational gear, meaning it seems to be more structured horizontally (not pure horizontal but a hell of alot more then every themepark out there). This will lead to multiple gearsets... which means multiple BIS sets for each specific situation you find yourself in.

    <snip>
    Is this confirmed?  I haven't seen any detailed exploration of an Inventory interface in any of the streams glimpses of loot with no 'evaluation' time.  And there certainly hasn't been any indication of the rogue character the latest gameplay stream followed needing to swap gear for DPS or resists or anything situational.  This sounds interesting, but is this just more wishful thinking (plus hype), or is this something else that is planned and hasn't been seen, or is it something just blurted out for this post?

    Let's try to nail this down to a True / False situation and avoid the rampant hype.
    Pantheon is definitely featuring situational gear, and items that will be more enduring. They want items to be memorable, not something you will replace every few days. There will probably be your normal resist sets, but also items related to surviving environments.

    The characters in the streams were low level, so they wouldn't have as much dependence on such things.

    Situational Gear

    In Pantheon, there often won't simply be a weapon or piece of gear that is the absolute best item for your character’s class and level. Instead, many items will be more situational, and the player will need to ask himself, 'where am I?', 'what am I going to fight next?', and 'who in my group is what class, and what items do they have that may help defeat the next encounter?' Items that protect against climates/atmospheres (areas of extreme heat or cold, or disease, or absolute darkness) will often be important. So also will 'bane' items that are especially effective against certain types of mobs (for example, the Undead, or Dragonkind).


  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,161
    I seriously hope there would be no mid combat gear switching or even weapon swapping unless it's in an equipped slot. That whole combat swap macro thing in FF11 is ridiculous in my opinion. I never played so maybe it worked out fine, but objectively it just screams a design trope gone horribly wrong at some point.

    On top of that there needs to be good management of gear sets so you can organize and swap them out without needing to figure out which inv slot every piece is in.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • DarLorkarDarLorkar Member UncommonPosts: 1,082
    You know the worse things people can do to games not even released?

    Over hype..... and get themselves and others all lost in the clouds and lala land.

    Sure i can understand the hope here, and the wish for a good game. But come on.

    Some people are bound and determined to hype games so hard that when reality comes calling,  the self created disappointment is so bad that absolutely no game could ever get a fair shot.

    We really need some reality to come and hit some folks over the head here.....
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 36,497
    Horusra said:
    Kyleran said:
    What you should be hoping for is an EVE like growth and retention curve, probably one of best for MMOs not made by Blizzard or NCSoft.

    What one that is dying away?  Last I heard up till his F2P bump, which remains to see how long that will last, Eve was fading away.
    It's coming up on it's 14th year and still one can find 18 to 40K accounts logged in. (and they still are not ashamed to report it.

    Not many titles can claim similar success, this one would be lucky to follow the same curve.

    "See normal people, I'm not one of them" | G-Easy & Big Sean

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing FO76 at the moment.

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Sovrath said:
    gervaise1 said:
    Retention - so about 1 in 5,000?

    Skyrim's "triumph" is not retention but high sales.
    Actually it's both.

    There are still a lot of people who play the game. I'm definitely one of them.
    Indeed there are still a "lot" of people. About 1 in 5000 currently. Skyrim has sold a lot of copies. And it was a Steam top 100 game last year. 

    So if Pantheon sells 500k 1 in 5,000 would be only 100 people. So I think it needs to achieve levels far higher levels of retention than Skyrim.

    Which comes down to decisions made around design features. A group finder - "multiple" options are planned. Mentoring - is planned. Death penalties, factions, skill points, travel times, pricing ..... every decision will attract some people and repel others. They have to get it right





Sign In or Register to comment.