How about great ideas from these games that did NOT get picked up? CoH had an incredible character creation ability. I think it might have affected the design of later games, in that you now see lots of options and sliders, but only the rival games Champions Online and DC Universe Online have comparable range -- humanoid, furries, robots, aliens, insectoids... I had 2 humanoid PLANT heroes. Well, the genre allows for more of that than most, but I think sci-fi games could use it (Genom come close?) and even some of the fantasy games could use some more variety.
I had high hopes when I found out about Tabula Rasa when it was expected to be released soon. They were talking about the world(s) changing according to what the players did, not everything always the same for every player and even individual NPC foes constantly respawning. They were also talking about have a class or two that would actually depend on a player's brains in a serious way, not just resource management or the ability to follow a "crafting" recipe. At least that's what I recall. But just when I expected to hear that it was ready to go... nothing happened, and it seemed to be abandoned. It actually ran? Was it just in Europe or something?
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I don't understand the pre-occupation with games stealing things from each other. In fact, I wish there was a game out there that would steal all of the best parts of other games and put them into one game. They don't even have to innovate one little bit.
Lets see. I'd like an MMORPG set in the Star Wars universe, with attributes and skills like GURPS/Shadowrun has, the combat system ripped straight from Shadows of Mordor, the crafting system lifted from EVE Online, the graphics pulled from BDO, the character animations and fatalities yanked from Age of Conan, fully voiced npc's like SWTOR has and a day/night life cycle for NPC's like Skyrim has.
That would be a damn near perfect game for me, and I didn't have to innovate a thing. Just pulled all the best parts from the games I like.
I don't understand the pre-occupation with games stealing things from each other. In fact, I wish there was a game out there that would steal all of the best parts of other games and put them into one game. They don't even have to innovate one little bit.
Lets see. I'd like an MMORPG set in the Star Wars universe, with attributes and skills like GURPS/Shadowrun has, the combat system ripped straight from Shadows of Mordor, the crafting system lifted from EVE Online, the graphics pulled from BDO, the character animations and fatalities yanked from Age of Conan, fully voiced npc's like SWTOR has and a day/night life cycle for NPC's like Skyrim has.
That would be a damn near perfect game for me, and I didn't have to innovate a thing. Just pulled all the best parts from the games I like.
That is a problem. Taking expensive parts of lots of games to make one and people think devs are lazy for not doing it. It costs too much to do that.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
As good as the design of Dynamic events is in GW2, I still think that the best example of taking PQs to the next level is seen in Rift just because of their zone-wide effect and the groups of mobs traveling across the landscape instead of just staying within their leash. They actually do feel like invasions in Rift.
Now it's time for someone to take THAT to the next level.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
CoH also had user-generated missions. I don't know if it was the first, but you had some pretty good tools to make unique adventures.
Sadly I never saw a single creative or interesting user created mission in CoH. All people did was make extreme power leveling rooms, which killed all group leveling (best part of the game imo), and contributed to the eventual shut down of the game.
CoH also had user-generated missions. I don't know if it was the first, but you had some pretty good tools to make unique adventures.
Sadly I never saw a single creative or interesting user created mission in CoH. All people did was make extreme power leveling rooms, which killed all group leveling (best part of the game imo), and contributed to the eventual shut down of the game.
You should have tried mine then. It had prostitutes rebelling against their abusive pimps. Of course if the GMs ever found out about it it would have been quickly deleted and my account would likely have been suspended for a short while for the content violation.
I've got a feevah, and the only prescription... is more cowbell.
CoH also had user-generated missions. I don't know if it was the first, but you had some pretty good tools to make unique adventures.
Sadly I never saw a single creative or interesting user created mission in CoH. All people did was make extreme power leveling rooms, which killed all group leveling (best part of the game imo), and contributed to the eventual shut down of the game.
That is the problem. Long before CoH added MA there has been talk about adding this type of thing to an mmoRPG. Players will naturally exploit anything you allow them to so don't give xp or loot/coin/etc. Let players be creative but don't reward people playing the missions.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
CoH also had user-generated missions. I don't know if it was the first, but you had some pretty good tools to make unique adventures.
Sadly I never saw a single creative or interesting user created mission in CoH. All people did was make extreme power leveling rooms, which killed all group leveling (best part of the game imo), and contributed to the eventual shut down of the game.
That is the problem. Long before CoH added MA there has been talk about adding this type of thing to an mmoRPG. Players will naturally exploit anything you allow them to so don't give xp or loot/coin/etc. Let players be creative but don't reward people playing the missions.
I disagree. While there were plenty of user made missions that were strictly for power leveling, there were several good mini TFs. I made a half dozen of them, and my SG spent a lot of time helping me fine tune them. Some ended up in the waste can, but others were very well received.
I don't think AE was a problem in and of itself. I think they needed a system where these were rated by players, honestly rated, and then sent to the devs for review. A mission or mission arc determined to be strictly for power leveling should have caused a penalty for the player, something serious like temporarily losing access to a half dozen powersets, and not allowed to make missions for say, 30 days first offense, 90 days second, and banned from doing anything after a third.
A good method could have been requiring SG approval, and then maybe have players that would be in a testing pool that got free sub-time for testing these. If they liked them they were sent to a dev who reviewed them, and if they liked them they were added to the mission stock.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
Comments
I had high hopes when I found out about Tabula Rasa when it was expected to be released soon. They were talking about the world(s) changing according to what the players did, not everything always the same for every player and even individual NPC foes constantly respawning. They were also talking about have a class or two that would actually depend on a player's brains in a serious way, not just resource management or the ability to follow a "crafting" recipe. At least that's what I recall. But just when I expected to hear that it was ready to go... nothing happened, and it seemed to be abandoned. It actually ran? Was it just in Europe or something?
Did WOW or WAR steal anything?
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
And speaking of GW, how about the limited skill bar/skill sets? Always loved coming up w/ new skill combinations to outwit the other players in HoH.
Lets see. I'd like an MMORPG set in the Star Wars universe, with attributes and skills like GURPS/Shadowrun has, the combat system ripped straight from Shadows of Mordor, the crafting system lifted from EVE Online, the graphics pulled from BDO, the character animations and fatalities yanked from Age of Conan, fully voiced npc's like SWTOR has and a day/night life cycle for NPC's like Skyrim has.
That would be a damn near perfect game for me, and I didn't have to innovate a thing. Just pulled all the best parts from the games I like.
That is a problem. Taking expensive parts of lots of games to make one and people think devs are lazy for not doing it. It costs too much to do that.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
Now it's time for someone to take THAT to the next level.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Sadly I never saw a single creative or interesting user created mission in CoH. All people did was make extreme power leveling rooms, which killed all group leveling (best part of the game imo), and contributed to the eventual shut down of the game.
You should have tried mine then. It had prostitutes rebelling against their abusive pimps. Of course if the GMs ever found out about it it would have been quickly deleted and my account would likely have been suspended for a short while for the content violation.
I've got a feevah, and the only prescription... is more cowbell.
That is the problem. Long before CoH added MA there has been talk about adding this type of thing to an mmoRPG. Players will naturally exploit anything you allow them to so don't give xp or loot/coin/etc. Let players be creative but don't reward people playing the missions.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
I disagree. While there were plenty of user made missions that were strictly for power leveling, there were several good mini TFs. I made a half dozen of them, and my SG spent a lot of time helping me fine tune them. Some ended up in the waste can, but others were very well received.
I don't think AE was a problem in and of itself. I think they needed a system where these were rated by players, honestly rated, and then sent to the devs for review. A mission or mission arc determined to be strictly for power leveling should have caused a penalty for the player, something serious like temporarily losing access to a half dozen powersets, and not allowed to make missions for say, 30 days first offense, 90 days second, and banned from doing anything after a third.
A good method could have been requiring SG approval, and then maybe have players that would be in a testing pool that got free sub-time for testing these. If they liked them they were sent to a dev who reviewed them, and if they liked them they were added to the mission stock.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!