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Final Thoughts as a f2p

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] CommonPosts: 0
    edited December 2016
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  • TheocritusTheocritus Member EpicPosts: 7,470
    Once again another game that couldnt make up its mind whether to be pvp or pve so it has mediocre at both....I had no interest in PVP so moved on once I hit 30.
  • farbegefarbege Member UncommonPosts: 305
    edited December 2016
    Loyalty is sold as an item, making and extra step to the labor points.

    <...>

    I guess we are supposed to be idiots or something....
    Are you really going to argue that because a whale hook is not sold with one currency but sold with another is different ? Also like the p2w scrolls in the "loyalty currency" . what a joke.

     
    You can't buy  loyalty as you please.
    You get loyalty  for the patron buff. the same amount as everyone that has patron.  Same for every person in same time.

    You can obtain the patron buff even with ingame gold and absolutely no money.

    loyalty is given to you automatically.  You cant get in shop and "buy loyalty" currency.
     
    its ridoculous to count in loyalty as pay to win.

    login badges is a currency too, do you count them as p2w as well ?
  • YashaXYashaX Member EpicPosts: 2,510
    Kyleran said:
    Pro tip.  Patron status really isn't optional.

    2nd tip. Companies trying to make money are not greedy, it's called running a business.
    How is tha pro tip. The game is based around an item mall.

    Here is a pro tip : either make the game completly subscription based with 7 day trial, or make the game free to play completely with a better subscription option for players.

    Because If I pay for patron or subscription, I sure as shit am not going to be limited in what I can do, and from what I;ve read , labor points are limited.

    So again, double dipping is a tasteless tacky monetize tactic that if kept fed, could ruin the mmo industry in a way that it will not recover.

    We can see the treadmill already. Players are bored, launch "fresh" servers.... its absolutely ridiculous. THe fresh servers are to get whales to pay in more to start a new, new account, same players, over and over an over again without fixing the real problems of the game.

    The point  in short, the game is a greed machine. You have limited game play as a f2p and subscriber, forcing players to roll new accounts which then dump more money in. It is almost by definition , a scam.

    This actually surpasses swtor in top greed list. Archeage IS the most greediest game ever produced imho.

    Bad Business Ethics, usually lead to a shutdown business, Just ask Enron.
    This was basically why I was so aghast with the game model when it came out over here. It had some great concepts as a game, but the double-dipping as you say was really offputting. Like Kyleran says, patron really isn't optional, and yet the game also has (or had when I played) an extremely p2w cash shop set up. Having both is just fucked, imo.

    I know they are trying to make a buck and all, but as a consumer I want to put my support behind great games with solid and consumer friendly payment models (for example GW2 and ESO), and I really think players are justified to (and should) protest strongly against games/products that seem to be set up to basically fleece us.
    ....
  • kitaradkitarad Member EpicPosts: 5,743
    edited December 2016
    I think that this game has been built around continuing contribution. The contribution is the subscription and spending a little more if you don't want to grind too much or are in a hurry. Games these days are no longer only relying on the person's ability to spend time on a game they still want monetary contribution but because the genre has moved past these types of games that are upfront with asking for a sub they give you the F2P option limiting what you can do . Then when you take a subscription thinking that should be enough you are then asked to fork out a little more if you wish to spend more time on the game and do more things.

    The games are designed around the concept that the content in the game is limited to how much you are willing to spend. So one can actually argue that the player who wants to do more and spend more time doing more in a game is taking a larger share of the resources and should contribute a little more. I know that sounds very anti player but just being a mini devil's advocate.

    Games require one to spend more if you do not wish to log off and wait for the regeneration of labour points. You could of course just play for the allotted labour points and come back later when you have enough to engage in other labour intensive activities. They are limiting you not for your health of course but to earn more money. The choice is yours in the end and I think calling them greedy when you share the same fault is for you to reconsider.

    We had a formula for games that gave us everything for a subscription but that model does not work any more. Games want players who want to spend more time on a game to pay more. The subscription is now treated as a membership and if you want nice uniforms or to partake in more activities the club closes its doors to you if you have used up your time allowance. To open the doors you have to pay and to wear the nice uniforms you have to pay.  There is always the option to spend even more time grinding the money to buy what you need but they are making it as unpalatable as possible because it's how they make their money. You are fighting against their determination to wring out cash from you. The more tight fisted you are they more miserable you get. Relax and just play for awhile and log off.

  • farbegefarbege Member UncommonPosts: 305
    kitarad said:
    I think that this game has been built around continuing contribution. The contribution is the subscription and spending a little more if you don't want to grind too much or are in a hurry. Games these days are no longer only relying on the person's ability to spend time on a game they still want monetary contribution but because the genre has moved past these types of games that are upfront with asking for a sub they give you the F2P option limiting what you can do . Then when you take a subscription thinking that should be enough you are then asked to fork out a little more if you wish to spend more time on the game and do more things.

    The games are designed around the concept that the content in the game is limited to how much you are willing to spend. So one can actually argue that the player who wants to do more and spend more time doing more in a game is taking a larger share of the resources and should contribute a little more. I know that sounds very anti player but just being a mini devil's advocate.

    Games require one to spend more if you do not wish to log off and wait for the regeneration of labour points. You could of course just play for the allotted labour points and come back later when you have enough to engage in other labour intensive activities. They are limiting you not for your health of course but to earn more money. The choice is yours in the end and I think calling them greedy when you share the same fault is for you to reconsider.

    We had a formula for games that gave us everything for a subscription but that model does not work any more. Games want players who want to spend more time on a game to pay more. The subscription is now treated as a membership and if you want nice uniforms or to partake in more activities the club closes its doors to you if you have used up your time allowance. To open the doors you have to pay and to wear the nice uniforms you have to pay.  There is always the option to spend even more time grinding the money to buy what you need but they are making it as unpalatable as possible because it's how they make their money. You are fighting against their determination to wring out cash from you. The more tight fisted you are they more miserable you get. Relax and just play for awhile and log off.

    I am worried as much as everyone else about these trend in monetization of mmorpg's.

    As a player i want the best quality for a reliable amount of cost and not the feeling how much it will me cost next month.

    Even as a veteran player i know the good times with no free to play.

    One of the problems that made companies favour new models of monetizing (greed very likely aside) is customer behaviour on gamings IMO.

    I know so much folks who expects the game should be always there for them but they don't have any commitment to it. They jump around stop subscribing for months, come back for a month leave again etc.

    The developers as much as us players and customers  want reliable income and profit for further development as well.

    In the real world business subscitptions come very often with timely contract commitments of minimum a year (12 months).
    Dunno how much that would be acceptable within the playerbase .

    Would you want instead F2P that EVERYONE should sign a minimum contract commitment for a yearly subcription with auto renew for a new year ?
    I am not sure this would be very popular.....  
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  • DakeruDakeru Member EpicPosts: 3,790
    Totally hooked now, This is disgusting
    Nothing wrong with enjoying a game for a short time.

    The idea that a MMO is only good if it keeps you grinding for years is the result of a member'berry conspiracy.
    Harbinger of Fools
  • ste2000ste2000 Member EpicPosts: 6,194
    so we discussed all of the pitfalls and greed, yet I can;t stop playing it ???? WTF???????
    Archeage without the Cash Shop is one of the best games together with BDO and ESO (IMO).
    So if you can live with the Cash Shop there is nothing really wrong with AA.

  • BloodaxesBloodaxes Member EpicPosts: 4,231
    I remained playing the game while doing (Mostly) jack shit because of the guild I was in.

    So if you say you are finding a good community, It's probably the reason why you'll stick for a while. That is until you finally realise that you will be "working" for the patron.

  • OptiqueMarquisOptiqueMarquis Member UncommonPosts: 860
    edited December 2016
    well as ive announced on the other thread I'm giving it a try... its been two days so I'm still cluelessly making my way up the ladder..


    the levelling and the world reminds me a lot of Vanguard back in the day, with a lot more polish obviously.


    yet, I can see there is a lot of depth that goes on in the game and the community has been great so far.


    cant wait to get into the crafting, the housing and what not !!


    As for patron, I just take it as a subscription id have to pay in another game. I suspect F2P attracts more people and as such its easier to populate the world... and no one wants to play on empty servers.


    cant comment on the P2W aspect of the cash shop since I'm not yet qualified to do so (don't understand what half of the items in there are used for) but ive seen a lot of cosmetic stuff..


    BTW, if there is anyone here in a friendly, pvp, pve, crafting guild on Vengeance server , West, hook me up please !! I'm with the name Khaelis, level 28 ranger. Thank you.
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  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    edited December 2016
    Troneas said:


    BTW, if there is anyone here in a friendly, pvp, pve, crafting guild on Vengeance server , West, hook me up please !! I'm with the name Khaelis, level 28 ranger. Thank you.
    Sadly you are the only person on who lives on this side of the Earth who is able to log into Vengeance server.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • cheyanecheyane Member EpicPosts: 7,032
    edited December 2016
    Bloodaxes said:
    I remained playing the game while doing (Mostly) jack shit because of the guild I was in.

    So if you say you are finding a good community, It's probably the reason why you'll stick for a while. That is until you finally realise that you will be "working" for the patron.
    The first hook was unprotected farming. I can grab some seeds, find a secluded area and farm .
    The second hook was the trade pack, which I said up down that I would not do, but then I saw how much gold I can make and was that greed took over .

    Soon ill have a fishing rod and who know where that will go.

    This game is literally all about crafting and trade, I see people in 4 farm wagon conveys drivng past me and my lil donkey and it is just inspiring that, maybe I can get a farm cart too !

    The fact is, you can actually reach patron status if you put your nose to the grind, is that a bad thing ?

    Could it be i'm in a mmo lull, not sure, but for some reason, Archeage is hitting all the write spots.

    I'm confused, literally on how I was sucked in, but now that I am , all I say when I'm hang gliding in the aire "haters gonna hate" and " I can fly higher then an eagles~ this is the wind beneath my wings " :D

    This is exactly how I felt in Black Desert Online when I started playing and I saw those wagons busily rumbling along and I wanted to get one too and as I watched all the different types I became interested and I planned out my empire of workers and I became engrossed in the game and tried to bring my trade goods to as far as I could go . Then the horses and boats got my interest as well and I became a fiend. It became an addiction earning the contribution points than exhausting them and than trying to earn enough from farming and fishing it became so addictive I got alarmed by the number of hours I was passing daily in the game without even realising it.

    It is truly fun to find something that makes you forget the hours in a day and so seldom these days do you find a game able to do that and honestly if you can have that much fun in a game I would not worry too much about justifying your interest. Come on you only live once after all.

    Just because certain aspects of a game may not be what you might like or even want to be involved in like me and PvP if the game manages to offer so much fulfilment in other areas there is no need to feel ashamed about playing in spite of what others might say or make fun of at the end of the day you play to enjoy yourself and to hell with anyone else.
    image
  • MrMelGibsonMrMelGibson Member EpicPosts: 3,022
    ...

    ...

    I like trion, I like Rift and I like Atlas reactor, but Archeage make them look like scammers, big time.


    You have to wonder why Archeage's monetization is so predatory considering Trion's other game offerings.

    It's probably because Trion has to comply with the wishes of the game developer. Heavy Cash Shops and P2W are standard practice in Korean and Chinese games. 

    I don't live in china or Korea. That is a piss poor excuse when games like blade and Soul and black Desert have done tremendously well in NA /EU . Absolute piss poor excuse. Lineage 2 was done more profressionally and NcSoft from what I read, is in Korea.... I'm not buying that , at all.

    This is singular to Archeage. No other mmo is limiting a part of the game to subscribers and selling that part on a cash shop. IT IS UNETHICAL. This is why Archage is at the top of the greed list. Even SWTOR  does not have a single game feature a subscriber has to buy in the item shop..... This is blowing my mind that I'm going to type this....

     SWTOR cash shop and subscription model, are better then Archage, I know, EPIC moment.
    Not sure why swtor comes up as greedy.  I alays sub when I play and there is literally nothing in the cash shop that is a must.  If there is something you really want, you can buy it off the GTN with in game currency.  Everything is good to go as a sub with zero restrictions.  I treat SWTOR the same way I would treat WoW.  A free trial for a sub mmo.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Because I actually own land now and have to think about stuff.  It has sucked me into the game.  Before owning land wasn't even on my list of things to do because of how pricey it was.  Now anyone can get it and for free.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • BloodaxesBloodaxes Member EpicPosts: 4,231
    Bloodaxes said:
    I remained playing the game while doing (Mostly) jack shit because of the guild I was in.

    So if you say you are finding a good community, It's probably the reason why you'll stick for a while. That is until you finally realise that you will be "working" for the patron.
    The first hook was unprotected farming. I can grab some seeds, find a secluded area and farm .
    The second hook was the trade pack, which I said up down that I would not do, but then I saw how much gold I can make and was that greed took over .

    Soon ill have a fishing rod and who know where that will go.

    This game is literally all about crafting and trade, I see people in 4 farm wagon conveys drivng past me and my lil donkey and it is just inspiring that, maybe I can get a farm cart too !

    The fact is, you can actually reach patron status if you put your nose to the grind, is that a bad thing ?

    Could it be i'm in a mmo lull, not sure, but for some reason, Archeage is hitting all the write spots.

    I'm confused, literally on how I was sucked in, but now that I am , all I say when I'm hang gliding in the aire "haters gonna hate" and " I can fly higher then an eagles~ this is the wind beneath my wings " :D

    If you love stealing unprotected farms (Hoping for a thunderstruck tree) I suggest getting a yata mount.

    Their jump ability next to a mountain will make you slide all the way up. That's where you'll find the rare loot.

    Trade packs was my main source of income but truthfully, grinding for purses is the best way to earn gold. You need a shit ton of labor tough which comes from the cash shop heh. 

  • ste2000ste2000 Member EpicPosts: 6,194
    filmoret said:
    Because I actually own land now and have to think about stuff.  It has sucked me into the game.  Before owning land wasn't even on my list of things to do because of how pricey it was.  Now anyone can get it and for free.
    You can get land for free?
    I thought only Patrons could own land.

  • BloodaxesBloodaxes Member EpicPosts: 4,231
    ste2000 said:
    filmoret said:
    Because I actually own land now and have to think about stuff.  It has sucked me into the game.  Before owning land wasn't even on my list of things to do because of how pricey it was.  Now anyone can get it and for free.
    You can get land for free?
    I thought only Patrons could own land.

    I believe you CAN'T pay taxes as a free player which makes you unable to set land.

  • ste2000ste2000 Member EpicPosts: 6,194
    Bloodaxes said:
    ste2000 said:
    You can get land for free?
    I thought only Patrons could own land.

    I believe you CAN'T pay taxes as a free player which makes you unable to set land.

    Yep, that's what I thought.

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    ste2000 said:
    Bloodaxes said:
    ste2000 said:
    You can get land for free?
    I thought only Patrons could own land.

    I believe you CAN'T pay taxes as a free player which makes you unable to set land.

    Yep, that's what I thought.

    Before they fixed everything you had to become patron and then purchase the land from a greedy player for about 300 gold.  Now you can just grab some land.  Yes you need to be a patron.  This game is unplayable if you aren't going to become patron.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
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