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Three Top Guilds Stripped of Mythic Helya Kill Honors - World of Warcraft - MMORPG.com

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
edited November 2016 in News & Features Discussion

imageThree Top Guilds Stripped of Mythic Helya Kill Honors - World of Warcraft - MMORPG.com

World of Warcraft News - Three of the first five guilds to take out Helya in the World of Warcraft: Legion raid, Trial of Valor, have been stripped of the achievement for doing so and all participants have been banned from the game for eight days. The three guilds (Exorsus, From Scratch and Limit) used a known exploit to take out Helya, the raid's final boss. Method and Serenity, the other two guilds in the top 5, did not use the exploit and their achievements stand, including Method's world first Helya kill.

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Comments

  • WarlyxWarlyx Member EpicPosts: 3,364
    others exploit with no consequence ? lets do it too .....sigh
  • josko9josko9 Member RarePosts: 577
    Who cares, raiding concept is nearly dead anyway.
  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Member RarePosts: 1,247
    josko9 said:
    Who cares, raiding concept is nearly dead to me anyways.
    Fixed for accuracy
  • josko9josko9 Member RarePosts: 577
    I hate to break it to you, however Raiders were always in the minority. It just so happens that in the last few years their numbers have declined even more.

    What's the reason for that? People rather play MMOs for the story nowadays, so basically solo.
  • anemoanemo Member RarePosts: 1,903
    edited November 2016
    When CCP saw us killing drifter bosses in ways they didn't like, they just changed the drifters to actually make it better for the way we choose.   I really think CCP was expecting us to drain like 2million+ capacitor to stop the doomsday or something equally silly, so to avoid such silliness EvE players being EvE players just choose to accept a lost ship or two OR fly a monster of a battle ship that could tank the doomsday outright.   In response CCP made the drifter doomsday act like it had tracking, allowing it to be dodged with the right sized ships and support fleet (tackle).

    <3 how sandbox devs respond to their player base, over a theme park dev that just takes the ball away when you don't play their way.

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  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 32,011
    punish the player for a developers error.....
    Or the players could have reported it and/or not used the exploit like the other groups who will keep their accomplishment?
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  • winghaven1winghaven1 Member RarePosts: 737

    Warlyx said:

    others exploit with no consequence ? lets do it too .....sigh



    Of course. That's only natural. Why play fair when others do not and aren't being punished for it? It's not a single-player game. It is an MMORPG so when cheaters prosper, those that actually play fairly are left in the dust. Blizzard is incredibly known for just slapping exploiters on the wrist and no more.

    It ruins the integrity of the game. This isn't the guy's fault for choosing the easy way, it's Blizzard's fault for making it such a feasible way to begin with. People were getting ahead of them despite them reporting the bug with no sign of punishment. Anyone would get upset and, like them, even decide to join them when the belief of Blizzard's indifference goes high enough.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,507
    Two guilds figured out how to beat it without an exploit, it would cheapen their accomplishment if the offenders went unpunished.

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  • ForgrimmForgrimm Member EpicPosts: 3,059
    anemo said:
    When CCP saw us killing drifter bosses in ways they didn't like, they just changed the drifters to actually make it better for the way we choose.   I really think CCP was expecting us to drain like 2million+ capacitor to stop the doomsday or something equally silly, so to avoid such silliness EvE players being EvE players just choose to accept a lost ship or two OR fly a monster of a battle ship that could tank the doomsday outright.   In response CCP made the drifter doomsday act like it had tracking, allowing it to be dodged with the right sized ships and support fleet (tackle).

    <3 how sandbox devs respond to their player base, over a theme park dev that just takes the ball away when you don't play their way.
    It's not a matter of playing their way or not, it's a matter of finding and exploiting a bug in the game mechanics, aka cheating. It doesn't have anything to do with sandbox vs themepark devs either. When people exploited Kraken on the NA Archeage servers, they were banned also.
  • donger56donger56 Member RarePosts: 443
    Thank heavens this horrible injustice was righted. You would think after a decade of this carrot on a stick game development that Blizzard would be better at this sort of thing. I just can't believe their are still people that take this PVE raid stuff seriously. Back in early WoW when it was actually challenging and had some sense of accomplishment it was fun, but now it's just a matter of who has the most rain man level players that can do the same content 300 times a week. I guess good for them if they are entertained by it, but I'd rather watch my lawn grow than do a PVE raid in WoW in its current state.
  • TillerTiller Member LegendaryPosts: 11,164


    punish the player for a developers error.....



    Seems to be the motto for Blizzard. If this had happened in any other game they would have fixed it silently and moved on. Blizzard seems to have this superiority complex. We are gods and if you take advantage of our shitty coding we will ban you.
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  • ShinamiShinami Member UncommonPosts: 825
    Raiding has declined and been reduced more to guild events in most games. I guess that now MMOs have evolved to a point where a person does not always need to be in a party and can do things alone...

    A lot of them feel like Online Singleplayers. 

    I feel like its been a very dark thing as of late to compare singleplayer games to MMORPGs as far as story experience goes. It kind of upsets me that I have to resort to such comparisons, but I find that the majority of singleplayer RPGs beat out most MMORPGs (There are still some good ones out there). 

    Raiding is something that I actually like, but find that it has gone from being a necessity to simply being optional. I guess as far as content is option and equipment/gear is sufficient for basics and standard bosses (even in groups) as far as games go, raiding will keep on declining.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,769
    punish the player for a developers error.....

    They are getting punished for exploiting the error. 
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  • ForgrimmForgrimm Member EpicPosts: 3,059
    Tiller said:


    punish the player for a developers error.....



    Seems to be the motto for Blizzard. If this had happened in any other game they would have fixed it silently and moved on. Blizzard seems to have this superiority complex. We are gods and if you take advantage of our shitty coding we will ban you.
    Nonsense. Game developers have been issuing punishments for exploits since the days of The Sleeper in Everquest 1.
  • KahrekKahrek Member UncommonPosts: 68
    Forgrimm said:
    Tiller said:


    punish the player for a developers error.....



    Seems to be the motto for Blizzard. If this had happened in any other game they would have fixed it silently and moved on. Blizzard seems to have this superiority complex. We are gods and if you take advantage of our shitty coding we will ban you.
    Nonsense. Game developers have been issuing punishments for exploits since the days of The Sleeper in Everquest 1.
    Or the guy who ganked Lord British.
  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,754
    What aspect of life doesnt have rampant cheating anymore?
  • GrakulenGrakulen Staff WriterMMORPG.COM Staff LegendaryPosts: 894


    What aspect of life doesnt have rampant cheating anymore?



    Certainly not banking.
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    Kyleran said:
    Two guilds figured out how to beat it without an exploit, it would cheapen their accomplishment if the offenders went unpunished.

    I could see stripping them of the achievement and ant drops until they complete the boss legit, the ban seems unnecessary to me.

    image
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    edited November 2016
    Grakulen said:


    What aspect of life doesnt have rampant cheating anymore?



    Certainly not banking.
    Funny enough, a certain percentage of the population will, statistically speaking, always attempt to cheat when there's a benefit to be had by doing so.  The finding actually came from the work of an economist supported by his research into one of the most honor-laden sports in the world: Sumo wrestling.  Go figure!

    Incidentally, that's why I'm always for erring on the side of leniency when someone is taking advantage of a glitch in a game.  The stakes aren't high enough when we're talking about video game cheating, and you'll never stop some folks from trying, no matter how harsh the punishment looming over them.

    image
  • GhavriggGhavrigg Member RarePosts: 1,308
    Nice. Blizz is really cracking down on exploits since the reddit posts about them being too lenient got a ton of likes. Removing the AP earned from an exploit, stripping achievements and bans for days.
  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Member RarePosts: 1,607

    josko9 said:

    I hate to break it to you, however Raiders were always in the minority. It just so happens that in the last few years their numbers have declined even more.



    What's the reason for that? People rather play MMOs for the story nowadays, so basically solo.



    According to what? The random things you pulled out of your ass?
  • CryolitycalCryolitycal Member UncommonPosts: 205

    josko9 said:

    Who cares, raiding concept is nearly dead anyway.



    There's literally no escape, in any forum, any topic about MMOs, from you raiding haters. You are everywhere spreading bile about organized groups in MMOs, challenging content, doing your solo casual play-style promotion.
  • IkedaIkeda Member RarePosts: 2,751
    The problem as I see it is Blizzards fault (mostly):

    1) Raids are competing for firsts. Simple.
    2) Blizzard has tier'd the raids in such a way you need the gear from one to compete for the next one.
    3) 2 of the guilds cheated the raid and got the gear, so now they're fast tracked for the next raid (gear wise) and the ones that didn't are now further behind.

    Ultimately, the guilds made the decision but it's the inherent fostering of said competition that has caused all of this.

    Maybe Blizz should, I dunno, QA things before putting them on live servers. I thought this was exactly what PTS' are for.
  • McLeetMcLeet Member UncommonPosts: 18
    Ikeda said:

    3) 2 of the guilds cheated the raid and got the gear, so now they're fast tracked for the next raid (gear wise) and the ones that didn't are now further behind.

    Ultimately, the guilds made the decision but it's the inherent fostering of said competition that has caused all of this.

    Maybe Blizz should, I dunno, QA things before putting them on live servers. I thought this was exactly what PTS' are for.
    I don't think they have been fast tracked at all. An 8 day ban will basically lock them out of an entire week of raiding. They killed a boss, got 5 or so pieces of powerful gear but in the end lost access to 10 bosses worth of gear (Assuming they also clear Emerald Nightmare). Its quite the opposite of what you said, they are now the ones losing pace. 
     
    I can certainly agree that it is mostly Blizzards fault since they are the ones who developed the encounter and left the broken functionality in the game, but I don't blame them for not finding such unusual interactions in testing. If it was something horribly obvious then that would be terrible development but having a tank die during a specific period of time where the boss was targeting them with a skill and only during the final phase of the fight, I wouldn't say that is something you actively search for (Although now they are probably going to be sacrificing themselves to every targeted mechanic in the future).

    I find the biggest problem to be the players, they see and exploit and they take the risk. I've come to avoid those risks after seeing developers react over different games. (Guild Wars 2 Karma exploit for instance). Not to mention that Blizzards recent action against the AP exploit, the guilds should have been smart enough to realise that Blizzard would retaliate eventually. Thankfully Blizzard have taken action to the most recent exploits which is a big relief.
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