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Whats the attraction of playing solo and solo mmos ?

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,771
    Loke666 said:

    The question is more why you should bother play an MMO in that case, single player games gives a far better solo experience then MMOs if playing alone if the prefered playing style.


    Because some MMOs gives a better solo experience than single player games?

    If i want to play an action RPG with marvel super heroes, Marvel Heroes is the only option out there (I do not count the ancient Marvel Ultimate Alliance 1 & 2). So I play MH as a single player game for its IP and gameplay.

    Is there a problem if I can enjoy a MMO as a single player game and do so? 
  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,771

    Yeah, you still have the right to do what you like but people still have the right to question it and whether this style of games is good for the industry . 

    Sure. And i have the right to say "why care what is good for the industry? Aren't you playing games just for your own fun?"

     And I can also call them out ... that what they claim as "good for the industry" is actually their preferences. I would say their preferences are not better than other people's. 
  • ErdaErda Member UncommonPosts: 211
    I enjoy the atmosphere of an MMO where I'm around other people, can listen to chat, play the economy, etc.  However, time for me these days is precious.  It always seems the moment a good group pops up, it is time for me to fix the family dinner, run a kid to some activity, etc.    My play time seems to be quite fragmented these days so a MMO where I can pop on, do a few quests or so then pop off is really convenient.   I could never play a completely group centric MMO at this point.  My schedule is just too flakey.


    I do enjoy grouping with folks but haven't really found a good guild that clicks for me in many years.  LoTRO was probably my best group MMO and I do miss those times.  My best experiences have been in guilds were folks were on the older side.   I remember spending many great evenings/weekends in the past gaming with some awesome folks.  Sadly, those days have passed for me.  As I'm getting older, I find that my patience with folks is a bit lower than in times past.  Some of the nonsense I see in groups or in guilds just makes we want to do my own thing.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 19,663
    Torval said:
    No, actually you don't have the right. Yeah, I get that it's an open forum and we can repeatedly ask all the same facile questions over and over again and poo out the same answers. Do you not see the difference between being able to ask a question and having the right to question others? One is for information gathering and the other is questioning the right, propriety or place of an individual to engage in that. It's not really a secret that groupers think they own the mmo/mmorpg space.

    The whole premise of the thread is about a grouper who wants soloers out of their playground. We already know the answers to their questions. DMKano answered it at first and the OP rebuked him for not seeing the real agenda. Loki's post is just further veiled railing on the soloer playing in the grouper's playground.

    And we already have a group vs solo thread stickied.
    Yeah, you still have the right to do what you like but people still have the right to question it and whether this style of games is good for the industry . By that train of thought we should not question what other people do or companies or anything. Also no there are many supper solo friendly games out there and hardly any group oriented MMO's (save old ones) and from what I can tell they stay alive through f2p and people can hop in and out of it instead of having a good game world people want to stick around in like in days past.
    Yes, and I can call him on that and claim he's out of line which is exactly what I did. It's all forum fapping anyway. We can go in this circle forever.
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  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    I am someone who plays MMOs as a solo player and I have often answered the question of why solos play MMOs and I am not sure I understand why its still a question unless one is new to gaming.

    The answer is game depth. If I can have a single player game that has the depth of a 'deep' MMO then yes I would play that as a single player game but usually the case in the past has been MMOs have more content then single player. Its a simple answer really

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,767
    edited July 2016
    Why do you think early MMORPGs were successful with small populations?
    Nothing has changed except developers trying to give mass appeal to an audience that truthfully doesn't exist.
  • AntiquatedAntiquated Member RarePosts: 1,415
    edited July 2016
    Why do you think early MMORPGs were successful with small populations?
    Nothing has changed except developers trying to give mass appeal to an audience that truthfully doesn't exist.
    Couldn't be because they couldn't attract larger populations? Poor marketing, user-unfriendly products?

    Until the Behemoth rolled in and expanded the total market by a couple of orders of magnitude.

    But those tens of millions of new players never existed. Truly.


  • BaitnessBaitness Member UncommonPosts: 656
    I like playing with others in MMOs, either in a group or just doing events.  I LOVE getting backstory and learning about lore through quests in a game, and that is almost entirely a solo affair.  When you do something with a group, it is considered 'normal' (and even polite) to rush through things as quickly as possible.  When I play solo I go at a snails pace because I like to read every bit of dialogue/flavor text, listen to the music, look at details in the game, and alt tab to google more info about interesting things.
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,182
    People will play most of the game solo and get to end game and can't play worth a crap in groups.
    So what, that's what socialization is all about, helping others learn. You also just highlighted why many do not play in groups, this type of judgmental attitude is one of the most detrimental things to socialized gaming there is.   

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 11,826
    Distopia said:
    People will play most of the game solo and get to end game and can't play worth a crap in groups.
    So what, that's what socialization is all about, helping others learn. You also just highlighted why many do not play in groups, this type of judgmental attitude is one of the most detrimental things to socialized gaming there is.   
    Agreed. I always seek out helpful guilds and group and join them. I am a support type player. Not in class chosen but in manner of a community member. I like to mentor and help out a player. More so when the player is learning a class I know well. I like to spend my time in games with like minded people. I have noticed the more critical the player the more likely they are to be game hoppers. Not always, but a lot of the time.

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  • Vermillion_RaventhalVermillion_Raventhal Member EpicPosts: 3,936
    When people engage in an activity they enjoy, they will do the thing they like, and they will try and do the most efficient form of what they like. 

    If they don't like something, they won't do it, path of least resistance or not, it's done for enjoyment. They may do something they dislike for a short period but only because they know they will do something they like soon.

    Even if you ignore end game, grouping still delivers fasters xp, more coin and better/more loot during the leveling process. If you like to group, do it, they have all the advantages and tons of people are doing it.
    I disagree.  Players will do whatever gives them advantages or easiest if allowed in almost ever instance.  Many players are unsatisfied with symptoms of their own gameplay choices.

  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 19,663
    When people engage in an activity they enjoy, they will do the thing they like, and they will try and do the most efficient form of what they like. 

    If they don't like something, they won't do it, path of least resistance or not, it's done for enjoyment. They may do something they dislike for a short period but only because they know they will do something they like soon.

    Even if you ignore end game, grouping still delivers fasters xp, more coin and better/more loot during the leveling process. If you like to group, do it, they have all the advantages and tons of people are doing it.
    I disagree.  Players will do whatever gives them advantages or easiest if allowed in almost ever instance.  Many players are unsatisfied with symptoms of their own gameplay choices.
    Outside of competitive pvp what does that matter, disregarding the hypothetical nature of your claim.
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  • drivendawndrivendawn Member RarePosts: 2,124
    edited July 2016
    Distopia said:
    People will play most of the game solo and get to end game and can't play worth a crap in groups.
    So what, that's what socialization is all about, helping others learn. You also just highlighted why many do not play in groups, this type of judgmental attitude is one of the most detrimental things to socialized gaming there is.   
    I did not judge anyone in particular and have no problem teaching others when needed. I said certain game design can lead to people not knowing how to play properly in groups. Like making everything solo able up to end game. I don't know why you would try to insinuate I am some elitist because of that.
    Also I agree completely with Vermillion a couple of posts up for example: In XIV the fastest way to get tombs for getting the latest tomb gear is by doing expert roulette. After that spamming which ever of the two expert dungeons can be done the fastest. People hate doin this and even complain a good bit about it but do it anyways because its the fastest/ easy path of least resistance. When they could change it up with other dungeons that give less or treasure hunts and many many other fun things.
    Post edited by drivendawn on
  • TokkenTokken Member RarePosts: 2,194

    I think I get it and I guess I could see the attraction, kind of.

    We seem to have an equal split here.   However we DON'T have much choice anyway.  MMOs are designed for single players, even the classic's are completely single player driven.

    This is how I see the attraction:

    - The social media of it all.  You get to chat with your guild, compare what you have.

    - You get the feeling your not alone in the world, and a feeling of liveliness around you. 

    - The non-stressful feeling of not having to be responsible.  After all, others could be nasty.

    Things like this have to be it or more off line games would be popular like Elders Scrolls Oblivion.  MMO's come with their own style that separates them from RPGs.  The leveling and abilities style of play.  I call this the one potato chip at a time style.  I have to say I like this too.  I always find it intriguing to get that new ability that will greatly effect your character, then I want more !......This could be another attraction.


    Most here know I'm Old School driven, even to the point it's disgusting.  However half of us are Old School driven, just not as blunt.

    In my years, I've found a few things to be true. 

    - Most are shy    

    - Many are afraid of that bully 

    - Many don't like to get sucked in

    I guess I could understand these three points. Their real !


    But lets talk about the " shy " because this is the big one. This towers above all others.  In both real life and in game.  Everyone is afraid to ask that guy over their to play, he looks intense, better leave him alone.  ALMOST EVERYTIME THIS IS NOT THE CASE.  More often than not, he is a potential friend !........Try killing something next to him, then offer to play and chat !...... Now you have one friend.  This is what an mmo is suppose to be. This is how community's are built.....But now it's all automatic. Developers removed this for easy and a softer approach. Sure their doing it for you, but with consequence's..... MMO's turned into STRICTLY social media.

    If your still the " shy " type anyway, that's fine, to each their own...........I just wish their was an mmo for the other half of us !!!! 

    Solo = Not having to deal with group members that don't know how to play or work as a team?
    Make PvE GREAT Again!
  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,756
    There is almost zero appeal to me personally of playing an MMO solo.  Some of the makeshift excuses as to why solo-play can be OK are listed in the OP, but ultimately MMOs exist for multiplayer play.
  • TheScavengerTheScavenger Member EpicPosts: 3,321
    edited July 2016
    There is almost zero appeal to me personally of playing an MMO solo.  Some of the makeshift excuses as to why solo-play can be OK are listed in the OP, but ultimately MMOs exist for multiplayer play.
    WRONG

    Ultima Online, not the first MMO, but one of the oldest...I played solo just as easily as I can solo in most modern MMOs. But people grouped because they wanted to. Granted, you were safer in a group because PvP was death match style (until they nerfed that), but you could still just as easily solo.

    Asheron's Call, not the first MMO, but pretty old...about same age as Everquest 1. I could very easily solo, but people grouped because they wanted to

    Anarchy Online, very old, still easily to solo in, even at release

    Star Wars Galaxies, I soloed 99% of the time, but there was so much player interaction that the game was still a very social experience for me. Again, people grouped because they wanted to

    Everquest 1, okay you got me, a group based MMO

    DAOC, obviously group focused since it was pretty intensive PvP. However I actually soloed pretty good as far as PvE was concerned.

    So out of that small list, EQ1 is really the only old MMO that was group based (could MAYBE solo, but I would never have wanted to in EQ1). And DAOC for PvP, but PvE sorta doable if you had the right class.

    MMOs were never made to be forced grouping. Except EQ1 and DAOC for PvP stuff. However, ALL MMOs (older ones for sure) were made with a heavy social atmosphere. Outside EQ1 and if you wanted to PvP in DAOC, most MMOs have always been about doing your own thing, with a heavy social influence so people interacted with each other all the time. But most MMos never forced grouping on you, even old ones

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  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,756
    "WRONG"

    Oh you're going to tell me what appeals to me now?
  • SoloAnythingSoloAnything Member UncommonPosts: 308
    edited July 2016
    I don't care about group play anymore I was one of the lucky ones that played FF11 since release and had forced group play which really was the best thing ever. I don't miss it now cause I'm a parent of 2 and my schedule is unforgiving to forced group play. In other words I have a life now before when I played FF11 I was grouping in game but in real life I was completely alienated and had 0 life.

    note: this type of thread comes up over and over I would say just play games enjoy yourself and stop crying. We evolve the games evolve if you don't like it find something else that gives you joy.

    edit: Attraction to playing solo in a mmorpg: single player rpg don't have same gameplay as mmorpg I just disslike the movement skills the mobs everything. I like mmorpg gameplay 1000 times better so i don't care if it's solo or group.
  • KirzanKirzan Member UncommonPosts: 28
    TLDR:
    1. It feels like you're breaking the game, to achieve things solo when the game's normal way of playing is (ideally) with a group.
    2. People are dicks in random group finder systems due to no penalty or punishment, so people get turned off from interacting with others because it always results in time wasted.

    I can tell you as someone who's started MMOs way back in the EQ days, that the main attraction for us, was because it was literally gamebreaking to be able to do that. It was either an achievement, or a sign of great wealth (twinking a character so much you could solo a lot without mind-boggling downtime).

    Nowadays, I personally think that it's because players are younger and younger, and young kids are usually either dicks, or too emotional about everything and create issues. The second MMOs started having people group automatically, cross server, without ANY sense of responsibility required (as everyone's just a random twerp), then that's when shit hit the fan. Back then, you had your server, your community, and you HAD to engage with people to progress. Be a dick? You'll soon find yourself alone in a game where you just can't do much alone. So you actually tried being nice.

    Since all of that is gone, and most people are dicks, then a lot of people just don't want to deal with the toxicity of no-penalty insulting infested random groups. But the initial argument, that it "breaks the game" as the game is supposed to be played with multiple people, is still there.
  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,756
    I don't care about group play anymore I was one of the lucky ones that played FF11 since release and had forced group play which really was the best thing ever. I don't miss it now cause I'm a parent of 2 and my schedule is unforgiving to forced group play. In other words I have a life now before when I played FF11 I was grouping in game but in real life I was completely alienated and had 0 life.

    note: this type of thread comes up over and over I would say just play games enjoy yourself and stop crying. We evolve the games evolve if you don't like it find something else that gives you joy.

    edit: Attraction to playing solo in a mmorpg: single player rpg don't have same gameplay as mmorpg I just disslike the movement skills the mobs everything. I like mmorpg gameplay 1000 times better so i don't care if it's solo or group.
    That's a generally good attitude to have.

    I am with you, too.  I played ff11 and loved it and thought it was the best thing ever.

    I just had a node war tonight.  No opposition showed up, but it was a lot of fun to see everyone from the guild.

    MMOs are built to be played with other people.  That's literally why these things exist.
  • drivendawndrivendawn Member RarePosts: 2,124
    edited July 2016
    There is almost zero appeal to me personally of playing an MMO solo.  Some of the makeshift excuses as to why solo-play can be OK are listed in the OP, but ultimately MMOs exist for multiplayer play.
    WRONG

    Ultima Online, not the first MMO, but one of the oldest...I played solo just as easily as I can solo in most modern MMOs. But people grouped because they wanted to. Granted, you were safer in a group because PvP was death match style (until they nerfed that), but you could still just as easily solo.

    Asheron's Call, not the first MMO, but pretty old...about same age as Everquest 1. I could very easily solo, but people grouped because they wanted to

    Anarchy Online, very old, still easily to solo in, even at release

    Star Wars Galaxies, I soloed 99% of the time, but there was so much player interaction that the game was still a very social experience for me. Again, people grouped because they wanted to

    Everquest 1, okay you got me, a group based MMO

    DAOC, obviously group focused since it was pretty intensive PvP. However I actually soloed pretty good as far as PvE was concerned.

    So out of that small list, EQ1 is really the only old MMO that was group based (could MAYBE solo, but I would never have wanted to in EQ1). And DAOC for PvP, but PvE sorta doable if you had the right class.

    MMOs were never made to be forced grouping. Except EQ1 and DAOC for PvP stuff. However, ALL MMOs (older ones for sure) were made with a heavy social atmosphere. Outside EQ1 and if you wanted to PvP in DAOC, most MMOs have always been about doing your own thing, with a heavy social influence so people interacted with each other all the time. But most MMos never forced grouping on you, even old ones
    You missed One MMO that was very group based called FFXI. :) Also what you said about a lot of older games being solo friendly is true. However the way many of them incentivized group play was by making lvling painfully slow on your own.That way many more people would want to group. Not to mention in many of them getting decent gear that wasn't crap or supper expensive meant grouping in dungeons, battling NM's or epic quests. Because there was not a lot of fetch quest you could just do on your own to get good gear and xp while lvling.
  • eddieg50eddieg50 Member UncommonPosts: 1,807
    I enjoy soloing and playing in groups, but I find that guilds usually suck
  • GeezerGamerGeezerGamer Member EpicPosts: 8,767
    edited July 2016
    Why do you think early MMORPGs were successful with small populations?
    Nothing has changed except developers trying to give mass appeal to an audience that truthfully doesn't exist.
    Couldn't be because they couldn't attract larger populations? Poor marketing, user-unfriendly products?

    Until the Behemoth rolled in and expanded the total market by a couple of orders of magnitude.

    But those tens of millions of new players never existed. Truly.


    And look what happened to this genre as a result of developers trying retain those new players. They wanted nothing to do with it. Maybe because all those tens of millions didn't really like what this genre had to offer as much as everyone thought, outside of that one game.
    Post edited by GeezerGamer on
  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Member EpicPosts: 16,775
    Distopia said:
    People will play most of the game solo and get to end game and can't play worth a crap in groups.
    So what, that's what socialization is all about, helping others learn. You also just highlighted why many do not play in groups, this type of judgmental attitude is one of the most detrimental things to socialized gaming there is.   
    I see people who cry for socialization in games as people who normally cant make friends on their own and likely have control issues and need something to control and despite them trying to get friends in real life they often fail because of this problem so they look to gaming to provide them with a platform so that they can control others.

    I am likely wrong but that is how I see those who cry for more socialization in gaming.

    Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.

    Please do not respond to me

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon Member EpicPosts: 27,771
    Distopia said:
    People will play most of the game solo and get to end game and can't play worth a crap in groups.
    So what, that's what socialization is all about, helping others learn. You also just highlighted why many do not play in groups, this type of judgmental attitude is one of the most detrimental things to socialized gaming there is.   
    So what. People play games to have fun, not to be "helpful" to socialized gaming. There is zero reason to tolerate anything one does not like about other players. You can always hit the quit group button, and find some other unknown strangers in 20 seconds. 
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