I don't see where that says gear won't be carried over. I'm going to take it to pms. I don't want to dscuss an entirely different topic here anymore...
Progeny is just one more way to encourage players to revisit the early game, keeping it populated for new players while providing old players with some bonuses for sacrificing their character and starting fresh.
It doesn't sound like you are really familiar with what a progeny character entails. You aren't "throwing away" everything. Much (if not all) of what you achieved, you will get to inherit. Its simply a better twink that comes at the cost of your former character.
They haven't even given all the details yet, so your post is highly speculative.
That said, I'm not particularly excited about the feature, but I can see its value in keeping people playing, keeping the world populated, and providing someone for low level players to group with (which is the ultimate goal for an MMORPG).
you should probably read the screenshot i posted on the previous page. better yet
"it is optional so if you want to stay max level and farm AAs and end game content you can have fun with that, while others can retire their mains and start fresh with some small bonuses for their next playthrough"
"this is only for max level character, you have to choose to retire them forever never having access to them again to pass on a few bonuses to your child or stay at max and continue playing end game. It won't apply to alts or any other character it's a sacrifice you will have to make if you want the slight advantage"
i'm not just talking crap, i'm taking the infdrmation given by the devs.
Progeny is just one more way to encourage players to revisit the early game, keeping it populated for new players while providing old players with some bonuses for sacrificing their character and starting fresh.
It doesn't sound like you are really familiar with what a progeny character entails. You aren't "throwing away" everything. Much (if not all) of what you achieved, you will get to inherit. Its simply a better twink that comes at the cost of your former character.
They haven't even given all the details yet, so your post is highly speculative.
That said, I'm not particularly excited about the feature, but I can see its value in keeping people playing, keeping the world populated, and providing someone for low level players to group with (which is the ultimate goal for an MMORPG).
you should probably read the screenshot i posted on the previous page. better yet
"it is optional so if you want to stay max level and farm AAs and end game content you can have fun with that, while others can retire their mains and start fresh with some small bonuses for their next playthrough"
"this is only for max level character, you have to choose to retire them forever never having access to them again to pass on a few bonuses to your child or stay at max and continue playing end game. It won't apply to alts or any other character it's a sacrifice you will have to make if you want the slight advantage"
i'm not just talking crap, i'm taking the infdrmation given by the devs.
That really provided very little information on what the system will entail. There are more specifics out there, but I'm almost certain that they are still working on the details as it something that depends on the rest of the game being completed first.
Also, Kilsin is not a developer, he is the community manager.
I always like common sense reasoning in my games.All classes having pets doesn't make much sense,you are never going to see a 100% pet owners in real life,so why would you expect it in a game trying to replicate role playing?
I think the answer is obvious and should not be of any surprise,this is likely ONLY a feature or idea to support cash shop.We all know how much pets are used/sold in cash shops across the gaming genres,so yeah we should expect more the same here although i do not condone it.
Furthermore pets giving more storage is just a really stupid idea,unless you have a horse with a backpack but i am sure most of us have seen squirrel pets with added storage space,noting more than gimmicks to make CS sales. I NEED to see games focus on the game and not cash shops,it ruins everything for me and will turn me right off any game if i see too much focus on the CS.Of course this is not fact as of yet,but we can be pretty sure based on the last 15 years of gaming that it is indeed fact.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
When are gamers gonna learn that anything Brad is involved with is gonna fail, HARD.
Flame away; I don't care. It's simply the truth.
I guess you missed EverQuest; you know, the game that popularized the mmorpg genre.
EQ certainly contributed to the genre, but it was not popular considering that more than 2 million people tried the game and it never retained more than 500k at its peak. World of Warcraft is the game that popularized and mainstreamed MMOs. Before WoW, we were all deemed basement dwellers with poop socks and zero social lives.
I'm a casual gamer that loves to play with lots of alts. I don't see myself utilizing this feature primarily because I like to use my higher level characters to farm for gear or money to pass along to each new alt. It would have to be a very large bonus to sacrifice an old character for the new for me to even consider it.
When are gamers gonna learn that anything Brad is involved with is gonna fail, HARD.
Flame away; I don't care. It's simply the truth.
I guess you missed EverQuest; you know, the game that popularized the mmorpg genre.
EQ certainly contributed to the genre, but it was not popular considering that more than 2 million people tried the game and it never retained more than 500k at its peak. World of Warcraft is the game that popularized and mainstreamed MMOs. Before WoW, we were all deemed basement dwellers with poop socks and zero social lives.
I'm a casual gamer that loves to play with lots of alts. I don't see myself utilizing this feature primarily because I like to use my higher level characters to farm for gear or money to pass along to each new alt. It would have to be a very large bonus to sacrifice an old character for the new for me to even consider it.
Without EQ, there would be no WoW. Blizzard doesn't take risks. EQ established market viability.
I agree pets in games in general are dumb and I don't like them at all unless it is a core combat mechanic of your class. I would rather have whatever "benefit" that pet provides as an upgrade to my character earned by playing the game, not by having some extra pixels following me around, so yes I'm worried now too.
Yes pets are a "modern" MMO gimmick and I didn't expect that fluffy crap to be in Pantheon.
I agree pets in games in general are dumb and I don't like them at all unless it is a core combat mechanic of your class. I would rather have whatever "benefit" that pet provides as an upgrade to my character earned by playing the game, not by having some extra pixels following me around, so yes I'm worried now too.
Yes pets are a "modern" MMO gimmick and I didn't expect that fluffy crap to be in Pantheon.
Totally agree with your post. Pantheon is supposed to be for the old EQ crowd and we don't want this kiddie crap fluff. It worries me as well... Fingers crossed greed doesn't set in and they start wanting to appeal to "everyone".
I agree pets in games in general are dumb and I don't like them at all unless it is a core combat mechanic of your class. I would rather have whatever "benefit" that pet provides as an upgrade to my character earned by playing the game, not by having some extra pixels following me around, so yes I'm worried now too.
Yes pets are a "modern" MMO gimmick and I didn't expect that fluffy crap to be in Pantheon.
Totally agree with your post. Pantheon is supposed to be for the old EQ crowd and we don't want this kiddie crap fluff. It worries me as well... Fingers crossed greed doesn't set in and they start wanting to appeal to "everyone".
As another poster pointed out, okay yes there were "pets" in SWG, an old school game. But that's SWG were talking about, a game that had a little bit of everything and shipped with more content than most players could work through in a lifetime because they had time and money to build it and there were a bunch of weird little creatures in that universe you could bake into the lore.
This game is being made on a shoestring budget, with developers practically donating their time. So lets focus on the core game world, classes, combat, animations, skill sets and polish and leave the pets on the sidelines for now please. Don't even waste your breath fantasizing about adding them at some point until everything is wrapped up with a bow and playable.
I don't see the pet issue as VR going off on a tangent. They are designing the classes. A number of classes feature pets. As long as they are working on that, it makes sense to have a plan for pets generally.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
There are plenty of fluff pets in EQ. Or does that not count? Are we only counting that 1 year of EQ that was the golden year?
Anything that happened after Velious was drastically reduced in quality, the longer it went the worse it got. Pretty much the consensus of every EQ player I've ever met, even ones like myself who played well past PoP.
When are gamers gonna learn that anything Brad is involved with is gonna fail, HARD.
Flame away; I don't care. It's simply the truth.
I guess you missed EverQuest; you know, the game that popularized the mmorpg genre.
EQ certainly contributed to the genre, but it was not popular considering that more than 2 million people tried the game and it never retained more than 500k at its peak. World of Warcraft is the game that popularized and mainstreamed MMOs. Before WoW, we were all deemed basement dwellers with poop socks and zero social lives.
I'm a casual gamer that loves to play with lots of alts. I don't see myself utilizing this feature primarily because I like to use my higher level characters to farm for gear or money to pass along to each new alt. It would have to be a very large bonus to sacrifice an old character for the new for me to even consider it.
Without EQ, there would be no WoW. Blizzard doesn't take risks. EQ established market viability.
That doesn't change the fact that the comment on which game popularized the genre was most definitely World of Warcraft. Before that, it was a very niche gaming audience. Doesn't matter that WoW drew its inspiration from EQ, what matters is that their version is what grew and popularized the genre with numbers of new gamers never before imagined possible.
That doesn't change the fact that the comment on which game popularized the genre was most definitely World of Warcraft. Before that, it was a very niche gaming audience. Doesn't matter that WoW drew its inspiration from EQ, what matters is that their version is what grew and popularized the genre with numbers of new gamers never before imagined possible.
I'm not knocking either game. But there are a few other factors to consider.
One is that computer technology and internet technology both advanced a great deal between 1999 and 2004, which brought a lot more potential mmorpg gamers into the market.
Two is that WoW's numbers include markets that EQ never entered, most significantly Asia.
Three is that EQ entered the market cold, whereas Blizzard already had a huge following for WoW based on its prior success with other types of games.
Four is that WoW already had EQ to look at, whereas EQ had fewer games that had gone before. Heck, WoW's raid encounters were designed in many respects by EQ raiders.
Five is that WoW had a spectacular development budget, with EQ having much less to work with.
So in terms of popularity, I think if you are going to compare the two games you have to make allowances for those and other considerations.
Post edited by Amathe on
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
That doesn't change the fact that the comment on which game popularized the genre was most definitely World of Warcraft. Before that, it was a very niche gaming audience. Doesn't matter that WoW drew its inspiration from EQ, what matters is that their version is what grew and popularized the genre with numbers of new gamers never before imagined possible.
I'm not knocking either game. But there are a few other factors to consider.
One is that computer technology and internet technology both advanced a great deal between 1999 and 2004, which brought a lot more potential mmorpg gamers into the market.
Two is that WoW's numbers include markets that EQ never entered, most significantly Asia.
Three is that EQ entered the market cold, whereas Blizzard already had a huge following for WoW based on its prior success with other types of games.
Four is that WoW already had EQ to look at, whereas EQ had fewer games that had gone before. Heck, WoW's raid encounters were designed in many respects by EQ raiders.
Five is that WoW had a spectacular development budget, with EQ having much less to work with.
So in terms of popularity, I think if you are going to compare the two games you have to make allowances for those and other considerations.
Again, he is not talking about which mmo was first. He said which one made mmos popular. WoW definitely takes the cake for that one. When I played DaoC and dabbled in EQ I didn't know a single person who played EQ. Niche is Niche. WoW broke that mold. That is literally all he is saying.
Again, he is not talking about which mmo was first. He said which one made mmos popular. WoW definitely takes the cake for that one. When I played DaoC and dabbled in EQ I didn't know a single person who played EQ. Niche is Niche. WoW broke that mold. That is literally all he is saying.
I understand his point and yours. I am just pointing out that EQ did a lot more to make mmorpgs popular than perhaps it gets credit for, and that once you take the factors I listed into account, EQ's playerbase was a lot more impressive than raw numbers alone would indicate.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
This is the first thing to really have me worried about this game. Not into it. Yes, many of those classes traditionally have pets of some sort, but they were almost never persistent. Not into it.
Originally posted by Scagweed22 is it the graphics? the repetativenesses? i mean what is the point? you could be so much more productive in real life Real life brings repetition and pointlessness too. The only thing real life offers is Great graphics. Its kinda expensive too and way to dependent on the cash shop. Totally pay to win as well. No thank you. Ill stick to my games.
They're getting off track, that much is evident in the recent blogs. Leave extras like this for the first expansion or later patches. They need to focus on making the CORE game as perfect as they possibly can. Without that all the fluff in the world won't matter.
Once they have perfected: Combat Progression Zone/Level Design Crafting Trade rules Animations
Then and ONLY then should this kind of thing ever even be considered. It's one thing if there's this bar napkin idea that nobody is devoting time/energy to, but the potential indication is that they might be serious about it.
Many posts flirt with this theme, but Kajdourden nailed it; previous games failed because they got off track and wasted intellectual effort on things not critical to the task at hand.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
Only thing that worries me about P:RotF is the fact people keep calling for it to be 'challenging' and I know that if they make this game hard, it will crash and burn, people have become so used to easier games that they no longer can handle a challenging game when it pops up from time to time.
The best example was with Wildstar, the game itself was ok, but the dungeons and raids were unforgiving and the amount of people who would fail them was unreal, it got to the point where we would only dungeon run with people we knew could already do them, and would never invite randoms to join us.
TBH I was playing on the Everquest time locked servers (new ones they opened 6 months+ ago) and the amount of people who couldn't handle even them was revealing, I think for to long now people have been coddled with easy games and no longer can handle harder ones.
It's not so much people can't handle consequences or "challenge", but they're already playing games/MMO's which give them what they want. Many are just playing old MMO's, like UO servers or EQ emulators or multitudes (*) of others. Some are playing niche single player games. The hard part for an MMO like Pantheon is how to advertise itself well enough to both get the attention of these gamers AND make them pay. It'll be hard because many of them are deeply entrenched and not paying anything to play. I--for example--have enjoyed Wurm Online immensely. I've paid for it. Could Pantheon pull me away from it? Probably. But I played EQ1 and favor Brad's style. Yet a lot of these gamers either didn't play EQ1 or don't care about Brad's style. They'll just keep playing what they're playing and ignore Pantheon.
I agree harsh consequences and other niche thigns definitely are a bad sign if an MMO wants a high population. This population segment is small. It's already hard enough for MMO's to succeed even if they're WOW clones. Many of those have failed. If it's hard to succeed as a WOW clone, imagine how hard it's to succeed by appealing to a population which must be a fraction of WOW's size?
(*) - there really are a lot of thigns out there to play. In the many years I've scoured the net, I've seen dozens of MMO's which could be classified as having harsh consequences and/or oldstyle mechanics. It's unbeleivable how many there're. The hard part is finding one which exactly fits what you want. Finding something exactly like EQ--for example--might be impossible. BUt if you're just looking for harsh consequences? That's much easier. And there're lots of single player games. You could play single player games for the rest of your life. I'm still playing games from the 1990's. I've only scratched the surface. Gog.com is a great intro but it also only scratches the surface.
What worries me is that some players have already made up their mind what this game "must be" as opposed to taking it for what it is.
It's going to launch (hopefully) and because it doesn't have features that some want or because it isn't brutal as brutal can be or because it does something different people are going to say "well, it had potential NEXT".
Don't know how many more "nexts" we will have with this type of game.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Comments
better yet
"it is optional so if you want to stay max level and farm AAs and end game content you can have fun with that, while others can retire their mains and start fresh with some small bonuses for their next playthrough"
"this is only for max level character, you have to choose to retire them forever never having access to them again to pass on a few bonuses to your child or stay at max and continue playing end game. It won't apply to alts or any other character it's a sacrifice you will have to make if you want the slight advantage"
i'm not just talking crap, i'm taking the infdrmation given by the devs.
Also, Kilsin is not a developer, he is the community manager.
Le sigh.
Waiting for something fresh to arrive on the MMO scene...
Flame away; I don't care. It's simply the truth.
I think the answer is obvious and should not be of any surprise,this is likely ONLY a feature or idea to support cash shop.We all know how much pets are used/sold in cash shops across the gaming genres,so yeah we should expect more the same here although i do not condone it.
Furthermore pets giving more storage is just a really stupid idea,unless you have a horse with a backpack but i am sure most of us have seen squirrel pets with added storage space,noting more than gimmicks to make CS sales.
I NEED to see games focus on the game and not cash shops,it ruins everything for me and will turn me right off any game if i see too much focus on the CS.Of course this is not fact as of yet,but we can be pretty sure based on the last 15 years of gaming that it is indeed fact.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
EQ certainly contributed to the genre, but it was not popular considering that more than 2 million people tried the game and it never retained more than 500k at its peak. World of Warcraft is the game that popularized and mainstreamed MMOs. Before WoW, we were all deemed basement dwellers with poop socks and zero social lives.
I'm a casual gamer that loves to play with lots of alts. I don't see myself utilizing this feature primarily because I like to use my higher level characters to farm for gear or money to pass along to each new alt. It would have to be a very large bonus to sacrifice an old character for the new for me to even consider it.
I still thought it was a terrible grindfest, even back then, but there it is.
Yes pets are a "modern" MMO gimmick and I didn't expect that fluffy crap to be in Pantheon.
As another poster pointed out, okay yes there were "pets" in SWG, an old school game. But that's SWG were talking about, a game that had a little bit of everything and shipped with more content than most players could work through in a lifetime because they had time and money to build it and there were a bunch of weird little creatures in that universe you could bake into the lore.
This game is being made on a shoestring budget, with developers practically donating their time. So lets focus on the core game world, classes, combat, animations, skill sets and polish and leave the pets on the sidelines for now please. Don't even waste your breath fantasizing about adding them at some point until everything is wrapped up with a bow and playable.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
That doesn't change the fact that the comment on which game popularized the genre was most definitely World of Warcraft. Before that, it was a very niche gaming audience. Doesn't matter that WoW drew its inspiration from EQ, what matters is that their version is what grew and popularized the genre with numbers of new gamers never before imagined possible.
One is that computer technology and internet technology both advanced a great deal between 1999 and 2004, which brought a lot more potential mmorpg gamers into the market.
Two is that WoW's numbers include markets that EQ never entered, most significantly Asia.
Three is that EQ entered the market cold, whereas Blizzard already had a huge following for WoW based on its prior success with other types of games.
Four is that WoW already had EQ to look at, whereas EQ had fewer games that had gone before. Heck, WoW's raid encounters were designed in many respects by EQ raiders.
Five is that WoW had a spectacular development budget, with EQ having much less to work with.
So in terms of popularity, I think if you are going to compare the two games you have to make allowances for those and other considerations.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Originally posted by Scagweed22
is it the graphics? the repetativenesses? i mean what is the point? you could be so much more productive in real life
Real life brings repetition and pointlessness too. The only thing real life offers is Great graphics. Its kinda expensive too and way to dependent on the cash shop. Totally pay to win as well. No thank you. Ill stick to my games.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
I agree harsh consequences and other niche thigns definitely are a bad sign if an MMO wants a high population. This population segment is small. It's already hard enough for MMO's to succeed even if they're WOW clones. Many of those have failed. If it's hard to succeed as a WOW clone, imagine how hard it's to succeed by appealing to a population which must be a fraction of WOW's size?
(*) - there really are a lot of thigns out there to play. In the many years I've scoured the net, I've seen dozens of MMO's which could be classified as having harsh consequences and/or oldstyle mechanics. It's unbeleivable how many there're. The hard part is finding one which exactly fits what you want. Finding something exactly like EQ--for example--might be impossible. BUt if you're just looking for harsh consequences? That's much easier. And there're lots of single player games. You could play single player games for the rest of your life. I'm still playing games from the 1990's. I've only scratched the surface. Gog.com is a great intro but it also only scratches the surface.
It's going to launch (hopefully) and because it doesn't have features that some want or because it isn't brutal as brutal can be or because it does something different people are going to say "well, it had potential NEXT".
Don't know how many more "nexts" we will have with this type of game.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo