I think it all boils down to jealousy and people's greed. "Its not fair that Johnny can play early and I cant." "Its not fair johnny has a uber epic sword and I dont." Like many have said you are not forced to buy founders packs or beta / alpha access. I think most people who beta test do it just to play the game early, not to actually test / report on things. If you cant control your urges enough to wait a few weeks or months to play a game and spend $150 to play it NOW! that is on you not the company. I just do not understand how people can complain about the prices. I want to buy a mansion that costs $10 million dollars, but because I want it so bad and dont have the money I think they should give it to me for free. I think it is a problem with society in general now everyone feels like they are entitled to everything instead of having to work / earn it.
Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.
If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
That's true, but they lay out what they offer for the price. They're not making a quality claim. It's just a package of stuff. That makes the rip off part harder to claim. How exactly are they ripping people off? Rip off carries the connotation that someone didn't get what they paid for or got an unfair deal. I'm not seeing that here.
"Rip off" can also just mean something is grossly overpriced. I guess you could say the deceit part of it is the game looks like crap and probably won't do well, and probably Trion knows this and is, as per the Trion way- grabbing cash where they can.
Trion knows it can charge stupid money for crap and people will pay for it. Those who think this is a terrible way to do business will continue thinking that and not spend money, those who think Trion can do no wrong will continue to suck up to them.
Simply put, Trion doesn't really lose anything -- their reputation is already poor, but they keep cashing in on this stuff.
I'll never forgive Trion for kicking Petroglyph out of the End of Nations project. May they one day shut down in eternal hell ! (I hate them even more than EA)
Some people have a strange view on ripping people off. To me its being sold something that's misrepresented. If you bought a car that broke down at 37k miles and was told the cars last 200k. Everyones car broke down at 200k and the company knew this would happen. Its a rip off.
Bad video games are almost always a rip off. The people who make the games know they're bad majority of the time and try to make them seem better in advertising.
For me a clear rip off game was Sim City 2013. That game restricted play time until release so you couldn't see the horrible flaws it had. This effect most players and reviewers.
How can this be a ripoff. You know what you get, and you can opt not to get it. I understand, you don't like Trion. At least make accurate statements.
I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a second, because...why not?
Let's say you love yourself a nice hamburger, but you're completely incapable of making one yourself or learning how to make one. McDonald's, in their infinite wisdom, starts charging $40+ for a fast food hamburger. No problem, you decide. McDonald's isn't the only burger joint in town. I'll just go to Burger King. You've made a perfectly reasonable and valid decision to opt out of paying $40+ for a McDonald's hamburger - fair enough. So you stroll into Burger King ready to bite into the juiciest Whopper you've had in your life, and you see that the entire Burger King menu is now $40+. "When...why did this happen," you ask. The clerk explains (because in this universe every cashier at Burger King understands business decisions) that McDonald's started charging $40+ for every burger on their menu, and believe it or not some clowns were buying them. Management decided that if McDonald's could charge $40+ for their burgers, then Burger King is just as qualified and capable.
No problem, you think. Not everyone is falling for this madness. I'm going to go to Wendy's. And now they're charging $40+ for their burgers. So is every other burger joint in town for that matter. And every clerk in every restaurant explains that it started with some clowns buying $40+ burgers from McDonald's.
You can see the problem here. The business of hamburgers wasn't influenced by your decision to not buy as much as it was influenced by other people making the decision to buy. This is largely the way business decisions seem to be made. People talk about "speaking with your wallet", but that's sort of a mixed position to take. In truth not buying something is not speaking with your wallet, and if you're not speaking then nobody is listening to you. Businesses make a decision and then seek out positive validation for their decisions. They have a confirmation bias.
In the above example it might have been perfectly acceptable to say you disliked McDonald's and not the practice of $40+ burgers when McDonald's was the only place doing it. Once it became a common business practice it was no longer about a dislike of McDonald's though. It became something bigger.
thats true until u notice u sell 10 hamburges instead of 1M ..... losing tons of meat wasted , paying bills and employers for 10 burguers...
Mcdonalds and the like sell TONS of cheap food thats how they make money
thats true until u notice u sell 10 hamburges instead of 1M ..... wasting meat and paying employs that are there for 10 persons....
It's not a perfect analogy for a lot of reasons. I couldn't think of a perfect analogy, and seeing as how it was more playing Devil's Advocate than a legitimate belief I didn't want to spend forever agonizing over the holes.
To your point, though, these founders packs are selling. Like it or hate it, people are buying them. Some people will continue to buy them, and nobody's opinions or beliefs or ideas about it will change that. I'm pretty indifferent to be honest. I've never bought a founders pack for any MMO, and I never intend to buy one. I have better things to do with my money than pay $150+ for early access to an unfinished game plus gain a few nonsense fringe benefits that will either be available or negated by the cash shop for much less than half the price. It doesn't matter if they sell 10 founders packs or thousands. Much like the hamburger analogy, all that matters is that they sell enough to change the standard practice - and they have to a large extent done so.
Just because you have the option to not buy something doesn't mean it's not a rip-off.
If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
The point is you would be stupid to buy it if you aren't certain of what you are getting. Being a lazy consumer is not an excuse. Having to have the game right now is not an excuse.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Some people have a strange view on ripping people off. To me its being sold something that's misrepresented. If you bought a car that broke down at 37k miles and was told the cars last 200k. Everyones car broke down at 200k and the company knew this would happen. Its a rip off.
Bad video games are almost always a rip off. The people who make the games know they're bad majority of the time and try to make them seem better in advertising.
For me a clear rip off game was Sim City 2013. That game restricted play time until release so you couldn't see the horrible flaws it had. This effect most players and reviewers.
Bad games are just bad games. They prove that marketing works. The question is to what extent marketers have an obligation to honestly reflect the product being sold. The line between company/marketing responsibility and consumer responsibility is a very, very blurry line. At what point should consumers be held accountable for falling for deceptive marketing? At what point is marketing too deceptive? These are big questions, and they require a total evaluation of the purpose, intent, goals, and methods of marketing to truly resolve.
I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?
To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.
Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?
To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.
Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.
Early access invites early adopters. That way the early adopters have already played the game and evangelized it by the release date so that (hopefully) there will be mass market anticipation by launch day.
I would like someone to ask these Publishers/developers ,what the heck is the meaning of an "Early access"?
To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.
Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.
Comments
If that were the case then nothing but food or shelter could be considered a rip-off.
Simply put, Trion doesn't really lose anything -- their reputation is already poor, but they keep cashing in on this stuff.
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2024: 47 years on the Net.
Bad video games are almost always a rip off. The people who make the games know they're bad majority of the time and try to make them seem better in advertising.
For me a clear rip off game was Sim City 2013. That game restricted play time until release so you couldn't see the horrible flaws it had. This effect most players and reviewers.
Mcdonalds and the like sell TONS of cheap food thats how they make money
To your point, though, these founders packs are selling. Like it or hate it, people are buying them. Some people will continue to buy them, and nobody's opinions or beliefs or ideas about it will change that. I'm pretty indifferent to be honest. I've never bought a founders pack for any MMO, and I never intend to buy one. I have better things to do with my money than pay $150+ for early access to an unfinished game plus gain a few nonsense fringe benefits that will either be available or negated by the cash shop for much less than half the price. It doesn't matter if they sell 10 founders packs or thousands. Much like the hamburger analogy, all that matters is that they sell enough to change the standard practice - and they have to a large extent done so.
The point is you would be stupid to buy it if you aren't certain of what you are getting. Being a lazy consumer is not an excuse. Having to have the game right now is not an excuse.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
To me it would sound like a game not finished ,you are joining in the early stages,but we all know this is not true,these games seldom see but a whimper of improvement beyond the initial cash grabs.
Early access simply means you get in before others and to do that you have to pay,i see no plausible reasoning for setting up such a money grab.To me it is like we have to start paying to be first into Wallmart...Oh wait a minute,you didn't pay me,wait outside the doors until paid people get in.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.