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Should blockades be considered pvp?

filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
edited October 2015 in ArcheAge
A blockade is when about 3-6 players use their farm carts to block the trade route of their own nation in a PVE zone. Trion calls it pvp even though it takes place in a pve zone and there is no viable way to deal with it. The enemy nation cannot do such a thing because you would be able to attack them for it.
Are you onto something or just on something?
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Comments

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Oh crap it posted before I could finish the last poll option.  Oh well if you say yes please describe further if it isn't already listed in the poll.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • JaggaSpikesJaggaSpikes Member UncommonPosts: 430
    sounds more like poorly implemented feature. could you elaborate for people that don't play ArchAge?
  • rodingorodingo Member RarePosts: 2,864
    It sounds more like exploiting a system or mechanic loop hole than PVP.  If those players or carts could be attacked like in Age of Wushu THEN it would be PVP.

    "If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    sounds more like poorly implemented feature. could you elaborate for people that don't play ArchAge?I
    In this game players do trading runs with farm carts full of goods.  Some players block the trade routes in PVE zones so other players of the same nation cannot pass to trade their goods.  You cant go around them because they block a bridge or place where there is no other way around.  You cannot go through them because the carts won't move.  You cannot attack them because its a pve zone.  And if you attacked them it would cause you to be a criminal.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • JaggaSpikesJaggaSpikes Member UncommonPosts: 430
    yeah, sounds like poorly implemented collision. like in Ultima where people would wall-in other peoples house entrance.

    and, to answer the pool: it IS pvp, just one-sided. obviously, not much fun.
  • VrikaVrika Member EpicPosts: 5,458
    They do it to cause harm to other players, so of course it's PvP.

    Question is, why would anyone play a game with that type of PvP. It's one of the worst implementations of PvP ever done.
     
  • DraGzielDraGziel Member UncommonPosts: 67
    Let me better clarify the situation. Yes players can do that in PVE zones BUT you CAN kill them if you are able to (gear score) or at the very least, destroy their carts. Will you get criminal points? YES! But, you can report what happened and in most cases, other players give innocent verdict to these people. It is a social game and such situations are bound to happen. Some people are @ssholes, but by killing them and their carts will harm them more than the 2-3 minutes you lost in doing so...

    So for me, yes it is a pvp scenario (they provoke you and you are able to act!) 

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  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 32,678
    I consider it more of a griefing scenario than actual PVP, but I guess if you can attack them even if it means you flag criminal it techically can be considered PVP.

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  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    DraGziel said:
    Let me better clarify the situation. Yes players can do that in PVE zones BUT you CAN kill them if you are able to (gear score) or at the very least, destroy their carts. Will you get criminal points? YES! But, you can report what happened and in most cases, other players give innocent verdict to these people. It is a social game and such situations are bound to happen. Some people are @ssholes, but by killing them and their carts will harm them more than the 2-3 minutes you lost in doing so...

    So for me, yes it is a pvp scenario (they provoke you and you are able to act!) 
    Kyleran said:
    I consider it more of a griefing scenario than actual PVP, but I guess if you can attack them even if it means you flag criminal it techically can be considered PVP.

    Sorry I wasn't very clear on the attacking part.  No they cannot attack the person doing the blockade.  Because it is normally done in a PVE zone.  Sometimes the PVE zone is a PVP zone in which you would be able to attack but at the expense of becoming a criminal.  Blockades aren't a problem in the pvp zones because you can simply attack them and deal with it.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • RhoklawRhoklaw Member EpicPosts: 6,270
    They had a similar problem in Ark: Survival Evolved when players would build around cave entrances to prevent anyone else from getting inside on PvE servers. Collision mechanics in a PvE scenario just begs for griefing. This goes all the way back to EverQuest and being that fat ogre standing at the exit of Guk, not letting that poor soul with a giant train behind him to escape death.

    At the very least, harpoon clippers should be able to drag the farm cart in port situations and portable cannons should also be able to harpoon for land based situations. But, I knew before my 90 day subscription ended that Trion and XLGames didn't give a shit about what players wanted. So I'm surprised people that still play this game, bother complaining about everything that's been wrong with it since day one.

  • RhimeRhime Member UncommonPosts: 272
    edited October 2015
    This is one of the main reasons why I cancelled two Paton accounts. Nice to see the douchebaggery continues to remind me of why I stay far away from this game and Trion's idea of what they call "emergent gameplay".
  • rawfoxrawfox Member UncommonPosts: 772
    lol@thread

    this salt ... ahahahahaha
  • BloodaxesBloodaxes Member RarePosts: 4,034
    edited October 2015
    I experienced this "feature" plenty of times so I feel for the people still playing.

    Best map for trades goes to peace? No problem, you will find either reds or people from your own factions blocking entrance to the npc just for the lols.

    Only thing trion bans if they cover the npc with their carts unable to be interacted with.

    A "work around" unless they block bridges is to use rider's escape but it has a 30 min cooldown.

  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 26,341
    If players can attack the carts and destroy them or if they can attack those placing the carts then "yes" it's pvp.

    If attacking the carts flags the attackers in a pve zone then that's poorly implemented.

    So the carts should be destroyable but not flag players when the zone is "pve".



  • JaggaSpikesJaggaSpikes Member UncommonPosts: 430
    Sovrath said:
    If players can attack the carts and destroy them or if they can attack those placing the carts then "yes" it's pvp.

    If attacking the carts flags the attackers in a pve zone then that's poorly implemented.

    So the carts should be destroyable but not flag players when the zone is "pve".
    but what about legit carts? maybe some flag for carts that aren't moved for a while? but then people could cycle multiple blocking carts.
  • SovrathSovrath Member LegendaryPosts: 26,341
    Sovrath said:
    If players can attack the carts and destroy them or if they can attack those placing the carts then "yes" it's pvp.

    If attacking the carts flags the attackers in a pve zone then that's poorly implemented.

    So the carts should be destroyable but not flag players when the zone is "pve".
    but what about legit carts? maybe some flag for carts that aren't moved for a while? but then people could cycle multiple blocking carts.
    It seems to me the issue is creating carts that block an area. And creating carts that block an area in a pve zone.

    Why would you leave a cart that blocks an area, especially if its multiple carts?

    Maybe make it so that if a person leaves a cart then that cart can be stolen from? Essentially if a cart is blocking an area and if that area is not supposed to be, at least at the moment, a pvp area, there should be a way for players to bypass it without flagging for pvp.



  • alkarionlogalkarionlog Member RarePosts: 2,364
    Sovrath said:
    If players can attack the carts and destroy them or if they can attack those placing the carts then "yes" it's pvp.

    If attacking the carts flags the attackers in a pve zone then that's poorly implemented.

    So the carts should be destroyable but not flag players when the zone is "pve".

    since a lot of poeple here are not sure what that means, they do it on safe zones, zones with no one can attack him, its just a griefing method to prevent others players to play the game and get gold, only way you can bypass such blockage is having friends to take your goods and transfer to another cart you can still jump over then or swin over the river, that is more a annoying thing to do with people without guilds and lowbies who are just trying to get some gold, with in the end make people rage quit and kills the game in the long run
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  • OldSchoolGamerOldSchoolGamer Member UncommonPosts: 217
    Griefing, pure and simple.  Question is, by design or banable player conduct?
  • AngryElfAngryElf Member UncommonPosts: 127
    Griefing, pure and simple.  Question is, by design or banable player conduct?
    Answer: problem since release. Dev doesn't give a shit. 
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    filmoret said:
    A blockade is when about 3-6 players use their farm carts to block the trade route of their own nation in a PVE zone. Trion calls it pvp even though it takes place in a pve zone and there is no viable way to deal with it. The enemy nation cannot do such a thing because you would be able to attack them for it.

    it is whatever Trion says it is.  Period.  End of story.
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  • KirzanKirzan Member UncommonPosts: 28
    edited October 2015
    Non instanced world. Check
    The absence of game-provided protection. Check
    Open world PVP. Check
    High risk vs reward. Check
    The ability to purchase the best gear in the game with real money. Check
    Cross-faction alliances. Check
    The REQUIREMENT of being a dick to your faction to become a pirate. Check

    Doesn't this sound like a troll haven to you? It's by design. It's the part of the sandbox features that wasn't cut. But I wouldn't worry though. If you complain hard enough, they might do something about it. They DID implement features to simplify locking your vehicle so people would stop crying about them being stolen and destroyed.

    To be clear, I'm not saying all of those features are directly related to the issue at hand. They just really, really help breeding a troll community which is probably the reason why blockades happen.
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    AngryElf said:
    Griefing, pure and simple.  Question is, by design or banable player conduct?
    Answer: problem since release. Dev doesn't give a shit. 
    waynejr2 said:
    filmoret said:
    A blockade is when about 3-6 players use their farm carts to block the trade route of their own nation in a PVE zone. Trion calls it pvp even though it takes place in a pve zone and there is no viable way to deal with it. The enemy nation cannot do such a thing because you would be able to attack them for it.

    it is whatever Trion says it is.  Period.  End of story.

    True Trion is too stupid to know better which is why no one plays this POS of a game now.  Its a troll haven.  They never understood that protecting trolls destroyed many paying players.  I'm as hardcore pvp as you can get but this game makes me sick sometimes.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • JabasJabas Member UncommonPosts: 1,249
    I dont like blockades, i dont do them and yes they are annoying when hapened, but they are easy to bypass with 1 or 2 friends. Blockades are only a big issue to those who want to play the game solo.

    And  i hope Trion/XLGames dont do nothing about it because i almost bet the solution will bring even more problems or kill more sanbox elements of AA.

    Theres at least 2 types of blockades, those that are only to annoy the others and blockades that is part of guild vs guild conflit for example, revenge against some scammer, annoy a guild that PK everywhere and those who dont have the power to fight them use blockades as a retaliation.
    Blockades is part of a sandbox elements of AA, some are trolling, some have a political propuse, some are only to get gold demand a payment fee, etc.
     

    Solo gamers are killing sandbox elements in any mmorpg since the 1st one come out asking devs to solve their issues with others changing the game rules.
    One of the fun part in a sandbox mmorpg is the ability of "survive", learn and use the imagination to solve problems related to other players behave.

    If a player dont want to deal with other players behave, dont want hes gamplay be interfeared by others why even play a sandbox game or a game with sandbox elements. 
    My guild during sometime try to denie "kraken" to all server even our faction except our oficial allies, it wasnt to annoy the others, there was a political objective and we get it. Ofc, the random solo players of our faction will never understand...


  • holdenhamletholdenhamlet Member EpicPosts: 3,756
    DraGziel said:
    Let me better clarify the situation. Yes players can do that in PVE zones BUT you CAN kill them if you are able to (gear score) or at the very least, destroy their carts. Will you get criminal points? YES! But, you can report what happened and in most cases, other players give innocent verdict to these people. It is a social game and such situations are bound to happen. Some people are @ssholes, but by killing them and their carts will harm them more than the 2-3 minutes you lost in doing so...

    So for me, yes it is a pvp scenario (they provoke you and you are able to act!) 
    It would actually be cool if it worked like this, but it happens in pve zones so no you can't attack these people.

    As for if it's pvp or not, it doesn't really matter.  Trion likes it and calls it "immergent sandbox gameplay".
  • farbegefarbege Member UncommonPosts: 305
    Its a tough decision and not a easy one but i voted, yes as for valid gameplay overall.

    To the answer if this is PvP i would vote no. But the situation is not simple.
    On one side of the equation we have people who try to use it for griefing purposes nad just to annoy others just because they can.
    On the other side we have a massive value genarating system with lower risk and the only startegy to counter this is the blockades even within safe zones.
    This outweight IMO the the possibility of simple douchbuggery. There will always be individuals who take advantages of systems. Because of that fact the overall freedom of having such an strategic option shouldt'n be taken away.
    It has become also lesser of a problem since TRION created alternative bridges and paths on crucials points and since Dominion wars (guild wars even within safe zones) are possible. 
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