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Will Blizzard save WoW with Legions?

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  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,008
    Sephiroso said:
    Arthasm said:
     There's nothing left to do if you're not raider.
    Achievement runs. Pet Battles. Collection Runs(mounts/legendaries/transmog/etc). Farming runs to make gold. CM dungeons(best transmog). Events going on almost non-stop.

    gtfo with that "nothing left to do" bullshit.
    That stuff all sounds like things I used to do.  Now it just seems dull.  Luckily I have rarely hit level cap in WoW so there is tonnes for me to do.  PvP is what kept me busy.  I goess what Artasm was saying is that there was nothing entertaining for him to do.

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  • NukeGamerNukeGamer Member, AMA Guest UncommonPosts: 309
    Recore said:
    There is no saving WoW. The game is dying because its old and outdated. Its the life cycle of every mmo.
    I bet you were saying that same thing on post 1 of 5000...its probably time for you to move on bud.  
  • iDigDinosiDigDinos Member UncommonPosts: 34
    :( I guess I'm in the unpopular opinion camp of still playing + paying for WoW and finding WoD fun. I think a few people hit the nail on the head though:

    1. A lot of people are disbursing through MMOs because there are more choices for people to have. There are also a ton of different genres for people to invest their time and money into. I think we can also accredit the rise in WoW's peak time to a time when MMOs were becoming more mainstream.

    2. WoW definitely has declining subs but it still has a firm grip on the market. Much like Jack Sparrow.. even if people haven't played the game, they've likely heard of it. Can that be said about most other MMOs? Probably not.

    3. We're not adding the upcoming WoW movie into the equation. Everyone is relying on the xpac to bring in new subscribers. Let's stop and think. Maybe this movie was put on hold for a reason and released now that numbers were dwindling. Come on, let's think back here. What also aired around the time that Wrath was wildly popular? The South Park WoW episode. I bet if Blizz did (or published) a study, they'd find that after that episode aired, there was a sizeable flux of players.

    image
  • OldSchoolGamerOldSchoolGamer Member UncommonPosts: 226
    WoW doesn't need "saving".  When the game first launched 2004, it sold out all 270,000 copies within two weeks and had people on waiting lists to be able to buy the game.  It went on to peak at 13+ million concurrent paid subscribers.  I understand people will argue what that means and say Blizzard has changed the definition of paid subscriber over the years.  Bottom line, hate Blizzard and WoW all you want to.  They get the last laugh.  From 270,000 to over 13+ million can't be denied as more successful than Blizzard or anyone else could have dreamed.  Right game at the right time.  +1 Blizzard.
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,161
    edited October 2015
    WoW doesn't need "saving".  When the game first launched 2004, it sold out all 270,000 copies within two weeks and had people on waiting lists to be able to buy the game.  It went on to peak at 13+ million concurrent paid subscribers.  I understand people will argue what that means and say Blizzard has changed the definition of paid subscriber over the years.  Bottom line, hate Blizzard and WoW all you want to.  They get the last laugh.  From 270,000 to over 13+ million can't be denied as more successful than Blizzard or anyone else could have dreamed.  Right game at the right time.  +1 Blizzard.

    12M peak not 13M.

    I don't see people in this thread hating Blizzard; or suggesting that WoW hasn't been - still is - "hugely successful". Not sure why you brought that up.

    This thread exists because "most people" did not reasonably expect the huge decline in subs post WoD. Activision Blizzard probably didn't either reading their fiscal reports.

    And Activision Blizzard will be asking themselves the question: can Legion "save" WoW. Their definition of "save" being continue to make "loadsa money". And the way they will frame the question: how many people should we have working on the game. Will a small team producing an "average" expansion make more profit than a bigger team making a "better" expansion. The "how small can they make the expansion" question. (Why I think flying was cut from WoD). Profit first; subs secondary.

    They have the Q3 number - bad? They will assume a drop in Q4 .And another drop in Q1. (Called fiscal conservatism.) Maybe in Q2 the same as Q1. And the way things have gone this year they may only be assuming what - 2M - next year?

    PanAm, was a hugely successful airline; known the world over, featured in multiple films; top quality. Key word: was. AB will not want to "overspend" on a declining product.

  • spikers14spikers14 Member UncommonPosts: 531
     Warcraft as an IP, will always maintain a great amount of value. If it would mean a new MMO and/or Warcraft product from Blizzard, I'm all for NOT saving World of Warcraft. Make a more Warcrafty Warcraft MMO. Go back and play WC2. Do what you gotta do Blizzard. There are devoted fans here for a reason, and we are waiting to be inspired.
  • Panther2103Panther2103 Member EpicPosts: 5,213
    I feel like the game itself will retain more people with Legion but only because of the PvP changes they are making. I have friends who have been waiting for seperate PvP balance since BC but for some reason Blizzard has never been able to successfully do it. 

    The game isn't dying. It's going to lose a lot of subs, but it will still be on top just because of the time people have put into their characters and accounts. There are a lot of people who are just comfortable playing it, and don't really want to leave.
  • josko9josko9 Member RarePosts: 577
    edited October 2015
    You people are forgetting something. There are over 100+mil players that tried out WoW and they managed to retain less than 5% over the years. Pretty much everyone in the gaming knows about WoW by now, and the big majority of them doesn't even bother playing it anymore. 

    Movie won't help. Legion will be another rushed piece of garbage (As seen at Gamescom it will feature even less content than WoD). I really think Legion might be the last WoW expansion, at least the last till WoW goes F2P. Losing 50% of subscribers in 6 months will have a domino-effect on the others, WoW is just not worth playing if you're not playing it with your friends.
  • BrenicsBrenics Member RarePosts: 1,939
    One thing coming true about WoW is WoW will kill WoW.  Old age gets us all even in gaming.
    I'm not perfect but I'm always myself!

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  • NukeGamerNukeGamer Member, AMA Guest UncommonPosts: 309
    josko9 said:
    You people are forgetting something. There are over 100+mil players that tried out WoW and they managed to retain less than 5% over the years. Pretty much everyone in the gaming knows about WoW by now, and the big majority of them doesn't even bother playing it anymore. 

    Movie won't help. Legion will be another rushed piece of garbage (As seen at Gamescom it will feature even less content than WoD). I really think Legion might be the last WoW expansion, at least the last till WoW goes F2P. Losing 50% of subscribers in 6 months will have a domino-effect on the others, WoW is just not worth playing if you're not playing it with your friends.
    Insert this for every mmorpg ever to exist.  You guys really need to stop trying so hard to bash a video game.  Don't worry buddy their retention rate will be back to 10% once legion releases.  Then you guys can come back and predict a drop in subs. It's a never ending cycle with you guys.  Why don't you focus on something you enjoy ?
  • simpliussimplius Member UncommonPosts: 1,134
    josko9 said:
    You people are forgetting something. There are over 100+mil players that tried out WoW and they managed to retain less than 5% over the years. Pretty much everyone in the gaming knows about WoW by now, and the big majority of them doesn't even bother playing it anymore. 

    Movie won't help. Legion will be another rushed piece of garbage (As seen at Gamescom it will feature even less content than WoD). I really think Legion might be the last WoW expansion, at least the last till WoW goes F2P. Losing 50% of subscribers in 6 months will have a domino-effect on the others, WoW is just not worth playing if you're not playing it with your friends.

    5% of 100 mio= 5 mio paying subs, a sure first place in mmos..this is bad? how?

    garrisons are bottomless time sinks, i think thats why they had a quicker drop , than before

    any other mmo would kill to get that much attention, and money

  • ShadoedShadoed Member UncommonPosts: 1,459
    gervaise1 said:
    Shadoed said:
    mark2123 said:
    <snip> you are making a huge assumption here that the whole player base of WoW has the same tastes as you which is a hell of an assumption to make.
    <snip>

    Personally i have always maintained that there is a core of players standing at around the 3 mill mark that has been around on and off since day one and never moved apart from maybe the odd break from
    <snip>

    I can't see that the game needs 'saving' at the moment but given it's age you would expect a natural drop off over time and eventually a move away alltogether, but i can't see that being any time too soon.
    You are making the same assumption that you level at mark2123 - that there is a core of (c. 3M) people like you who have never moved on.  We just don't know. Some sure but 3M would imply a huge percentage of the initial playerbase; unlikely imo.

    What we expect to find out in November is what the number of subs at the end of Sept was. Like you and others I am of the opinion that it doesn't need "saving" but - subconsciously maybe - I "took for granted" that subs will remain "significant" - say around 4M. A substantial drop but still significant.

    Having read a lot of suggestions of around 3M  - well if the drop is 2M+ then yeah. 

    Is there a core of players? Probably. At what point though are global subs so spread out that there is "no one" around - resulting in more people leaving which feeds the decline? Which will drive the question: what of Q4?
    Hmm, not really the same thing, i was speaking from a personal point of view, not speaking for the feelings of the community at large. My point is only based on my own watching of the sway in subs over the years, accounting for what we knew of eastern vs western and allowing for that rollover of players who play but don't stay....nothing particularly scientific or accurate, just a personal feeling. Would be interesting to know how many statues Blizzard sent out to see how many maintained their accounts from around day one, the central core if you will.

    The ebb and flow of subs has changed markedly over the years as there are more players that come back for a taster of the new content, then realise that they have seen most of it before because the core of the game doesn't change and then wane away and as they peel away they take a few more with them each time.....inevitable i would have said after all this time.

    I can only see that we will just see the same pattern repeating again, small boost after Blizzcon towards Christmas with a small drop off while waiting for the expansion, then a steady rise on the build up to the expansion launch followed by a big jump at launch, followed by a sharp drop 60-90 days after launch followed by a steady drop off as the expansion grows older.......but i could be completely wrong and the whole thing could crash around our ears tomorrow.....who really knows?

    It must be Thursday, i never could get the hang of Thursdays.

  • mark2123mark2123 Member UncommonPosts: 450
    edited October 2015
    The fact that WoW still has even the subs that it does is a sad indictment on the MMO market as a whole.  I must admit to quitting WoW at WoD and I know it'll take something monumental to get me back because I no longer believe in Blizzard and see them as sucking money out of people for a poor return.  They are preying on the fact that people are mentally tied into WoW due to the huge time commitment and for some, it's addictive also.  I'm have some fun with ESO and Wildstar because they have content I haven't see, but I'm also enjoying Destiny on my XBox One and looking forward to Star Wars Battlefront and Fallout 4.  I must admit that MMOs are holding less and less interest for me because I'm feeling that it's the same games being presented in slightly different ways, but if you have played one, you've almost played them all.
  • PhryPhry Member LegendaryPosts: 10,821
    Will Legion save WoW, at this point i am not sure it even needs saving, but what will probably happen, is that once Legion is released, WoW subs will again increase to 10 million+, how long for is the only real question, how many months before they fall off back to present levels, 2, 3, 5 months maybe, in the end it doesn't matter as Legion will have been a success and Blizzard will have banked the profits, until the next expansion. WoW is a bit of a 'Boom and Bust' kind of scenario, chances are WoW will only die, if slowly, once they stop releasing expansions for the game.
  • AntiquatedAntiquated Member RarePosts: 1,415
    UO doesn't need "saving." Zomg, it's perfectly fine.

    Sorry, thought I'd try that on for size. A game approaching its 20th year, and still funded with subscriptions.
  • BlackWatchBlackWatch Member UncommonPosts: 972
    I will continue to sub to WoW until another game offers the same level of content with as much finish/polish.  While the game is 10+ years old and many believe Wow to be on the way to pasture, it has a lot of life left in it.
    Be that as it may, why do you think Blizzard is pushing into new territory with HoTS, Hearthstone, and Overwatch?  Blizzard understands that they have to add other games to their stable. 

    WoW (as hundreds have posted) is a phenomenon.  No other subscription based MMO has done what WoW has done.  And while I won't ever say 'never', I don't think any other MMO is going to touch the enduring success and staying power that WoW has possessed. 

    WoW may not have been 'the' MMO pioneer, but they essentially commoditized the MMO for the masses. And it did it in a way that was contagious. 

    I do believe that there are a number of options out there now, in regards to MMO's.  The population is spread amongst so many games.  WoW still has it's nice slice of the overall population pie, though.





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  • d_20d_20 Member RarePosts: 1,878
    edited October 2015
    There is no "saving" WoW. There is just going to be a very long and slow decline punctuated by outrageous box sales of each expansion in the millions. Blizzard will be laughing all the way to the bank with their bags of loot from a 2004 game that still dominates the market.
    Post edited by d_20 on


  • spikers14spikers14 Member UncommonPosts: 531
    d_20 said:
    There is no "saving" WoW. There is just going to be a very long and slow decline punctuated by outrageous box sales of each expansion in the millions. Blizzard will be laughing all the way to the bank with their bags of loot from a 2004 game that still dominates the market.
    Today's game is vastly different from 2004, they've done a little bit of work to it. Just a little bit...

    Saying there is going to be a long slow decline is to take the safe route in predicting the future of WoW. That, in and of itself, says nothing. The chances of a sharp drop off, are lesser. Everything ends at some point. Someday, you'll be right about WoW's decline.

    Here's my prediction: The goal at Blizzard is to achieve higher numbers than in the past, AND they will do just that. WoW's highest population has yet to arrive. There is another marketing push coming to attract new players. Players that show up, knowing nothing about you and me...this forum...or this post. They don't care about our predictions, they want to play something fun...Warcraft will deliver. 
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,022
    I wasn't aware WoW needed saving...

    Anyway, for me, Legion will be digital deluxe pre-order... I was never disapointed by a Blizzard expansion until now, there's no reason it starts with Legion.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that nor does the ability to write.
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  • WarlyxWarlyx Member RarePosts: 2,867
    spikers14 said:

    Here's my prediction: The goal at Blizzard is to achieve higher numbers than in the past, AND they will do just that. WoW's highest population has yet to arrive. There is another marketing push coming to attract new players. Players that show up, knowing nothing about you and me...this forum...or this post. They don't care about our predictions, they want to play something fun...Warcraft will deliver. 
    wow highest population has yet to arrive....lol, if they keep the idea of end of expansion = months of NOTHING ....how a game that has so many subs can keep doing that and ppl can keep saying "its ok" ....10 years of wow , and around 3 years of "nothing" , 10 months in woltk? (ruby sanctum ~~ ) , 9 months in cata , 1 year in MoP ...and how long until Legion? 


  • FlyinDutchman87FlyinDutchman87 Member UncommonPosts: 325
    Wow is still the most popular MMORPG on the planet with a MONTHLY income in the 100 million range.

    It needs saving about as much as Exon Mobile.
  • fodell54fodell54 Member RarePosts: 859
    UO doesn't need "saving." Zomg, it's perfectly fine.

    Sorry, thought I'd try that on for size. A game approaching its 20th year, and still funded with subscriptions.
    UO has a straight up cash shop that helps with funding. Also, most of the gold funneled through the game comes from outside gold sellers.  1 Million gold only cost 40 cents. Which in turn completely destroys an economy. If you aren't buying cost in UO you aren't buying anything from player vendors. It's as simple as that. So, yes UO does kind of need some saving.

    WoW on the other hand doesn't need saving, period. Even if this expansion failed to bring in a large number of players WoW will still remain top dog in the mmo world for years to come.
  • NarlhNarlh Member UncommonPosts: 18
    I'm still waiting for World (Galaxy?) of Starcraft.  Hell, just make it Warcraft with new textures, obviously classes, but keep the frame work.  People will say it's lazy, a rip off, and they'll throw millions of bucks at it anyway.  I'd play.  WoW itself?  Been there done that, and thanks for going back to the Demon story-well again Blizzard.
  • DEATHRAMENTDEATHRAMENT Member UncommonPosts: 700
    Alot of people say that the game should have stayed true to it's roots, (vanilla, bc) and i would have preferred it have done so as well but Blizzard is not stupid, they knew that the there audience was changing and so they changed to suit said audience.We  will never know what would have happened if they kept pushing out expansions like the Burning Crusade, but i suspect the numbers would have declined alot faster then they have otherwise. I think the low in subscribers we currently see are a result of an old game plus the worst expansion wow has ever given us. I think if Legion is good we will see a more stable player base next year.
  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,022
    Alot of people say that the game should have stayed true to it's roots, (vanilla, bc) and i would have preferred it have done so as well but Blizzard is not stupid, they knew that the there audience was changing and so they changed to suit said audience.We  will never know what would have happened if they kept pushing out expansions like the Burning Crusade, but i suspect the numbers would have declined alot faster then they have otherwise. I think the low in subscribers we currently see are a result of an old game plus the worst expansion wow has ever given us. I think if Legion is good we will see a more stable player base next year.
    Worst expansion was Cataclysm imho. Warlords is miles above.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that nor does the ability to write.
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