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  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    I think I am getting 70s flashbacks everytime I see the title of this thread as it makes me think of scheduling time to run my punchcards!
    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

    Epic Music:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1

    https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1

    Kyleran:  "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."

    John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."

    FreddyNoNose:  "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."

    LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"




  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard Member LegendaryPosts: 8,389
    What is amusing is that if I throw in a Fury X into my 2 years old rig, it'll be way better than this... and even then, my good old 290x would hold her own under DX12 vs the Fury.
    DDR4 is the most overrated performance progress these last years, and the 6700k is the entry level "K" class core I7 for the Skylake line.
    "The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn in Star Wars.
    After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.
    CPU: Intel Core I7 9700k (4.90ghz) - GPU: ASUS Dual GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER EVO 8GB DDR6 - RAM: 32GB Kingston HyperX Predator DDR4 3000 - Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra - PSU: Antec TruePower New 750W - Storage: Kingston KC1000 NVMe 960gb SSD and 2x1TB WD Velociraptor HDDs (Raid 0) - Main display: Samsung U32J590 32" 4K monitor - Second display: Philips 273v 27" monitor - VR: Pimax 8K headset - Sound: Sony STR-DH550 AV Receiver HDMI linked with the GPU and the TV, with Jamo S 426 HS 3 5.0 speakers and Pioneer S-21W subwoofer - OS: Windows 10 Pro 64 bits.


  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,171
    It's still a good solid build. No need to rip into someone about how your old system is better. He's not going to buy old outdated parts. That would be true lunacy. His old system wasn't better than this. He's buying current gen parts. That makes sense right?
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,240
    I've been having some stability issues, and I tracked it to the memory.  I think I've now fixed it, but the memory wasn't stable at its rated specifications.  I've now got it running at 2133 MHz, 1.5 V, and 12-14-14-35 latency timings, and it passes a stability test, so it should be fine.

    Actually, I didn't even try it at the rated speed of 2400 MHz, but I did try it at 2133 MHz, 1.65 V, and looser latency timings than rated (once you adjust for the clock speed difference) and that wasn't stable.  At what I've got it running at, it's still nice memory, assuming it's stable.  But overrating what the memory can do is a bad thing.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,240
    Upon further review, it looks like I haven't gotten it to set the memory to 1.5 V.  If I change it to 1.5 V, it says it saved it, but if I reboot, it change it back to 1.65 V.  If I set the memory clock speed to 1333 MHz, it is fine with the voltage at 1.5 V, but not at 2133 MHz.  It won't save a value of 1.64 V, either, so it's not like it's discovering that I set an unstable voltage and changing it.

    A BIOS update did add the option to set memory clock speeds of 1600 MHz and 1866 MHz, among other things.  Not sure why a motherboard would ship with a BIOS that didn't offer that, especially for a platform that has been around for so long.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,076
    Sometimes memory parameters will get locked to XMP profile settings unless you find the right BIOS switch to unlock them
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Quizzical. I'm not saying this to be malicious at all. I am glad to see that even people with far more knowledge than me have the same sorts of trouble that I  had when working the kinks out of my new system.  Hope you get stuff sorted to your liking! I also have been watching this thread and thanks for the progress updates. Just interesting to read even though I got nothing I could honestly add to benefit the thread.
  • TorvalTorval Member LegendaryPosts: 20,171
    Hulluck said:
    Quizzical. I'm not saying this to be malicious at all. I am glad to see that even people with far more knowledge than me have the same sorts of trouble that I  had when working the kinks out of my new system.  Hope you get stuff sorted to your liking! I also have been watching this thread and thanks for the progress updates. Just interesting to read even though I got nothing I could honestly add to benefit the thread.
    This is the exact thing that ran through my head when I read the thread. I was actually a bit shocked and surprised because I figured it was always just me, no how matter how much research I put in, that runs into these hurdles. It was very cool that Quizz posted the bumps along with the good. I got to the point where I got sick of building things a few years ago and figured that manufacturer builds would be more solid. My last Acer purchase has shot that idea all to hell. I honestly don't know what I'm going to do for my next build, but this thread really helped put things in perspective.
    Fedora - A modern, free, and open source Operating System. https://getfedora.org/

    traveller, interloper, anomaly, iteration


  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,240
    Ridelynn said:
    Sometimes memory parameters will get locked to XMP profile settings unless you find the right BIOS switch to unlock them
    Finding the option to disable XMP was easy.  What was hard was enabling it.  That required a BIOS update, as the BIOS that shipped with the motherboard had XMP grayed out.  After a BIOS update, I enabled the XMP settings and it's stable, so I'm going to leave it at that.  I'm guessing that the instability was caused by some other memory timings having something stupid set by default, but that's just a guess.

    I think the real problem with the memory settings is a bug in MSI Control Center.  Several of the menus work, but trying to even open two of them causes the program to hang.  I don't know if it just doesn't play nicely with Windows 10 or what.  MSI probably didn't feel the need to put it in the BIOS because they figured that you'd adjust it through MSI Control Center from inside of Windows.
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Member LegendaryPosts: 22,240

    Torval said:
    Hulluck said:
    Quizzical. I'm not saying this to be malicious at all. I am glad to see that even people with far more knowledge than me have the same sorts of trouble that I  had when working the kinks out of my new system.  Hope you get stuff sorted to your liking! I also have been watching this thread and thanks for the progress updates. Just interesting to read even though I got nothing I could honestly add to benefit the thread.
    This is the exact thing that ran through my head when I read the thread. I was actually a bit shocked and surprised because I figured it was always just me, no how matter how much research I put in, that runs into these hurdles. It was very cool that Quizz posted the bumps along with the good. I got to the point where I got sick of building things a few years ago and figured that manufacturer builds would be more solid. My last Acer purchase has shot that idea all to hell. I honestly don't know what I'm going to do for my next build, but this thread really helped put things in perspective.
    Even hardware reviews from professionals who review hardware professionally say that this or that didn't work right.  They get stuck on trying to make stuff work right, and they have massively more experience with it than I do.  Some things, especially the motherboard problems I had, can be dismissed as a simple case of bugs happen.

    The trouble with the front case fans was really a problem of a lack of documentation.  It's the sort of thing that's fine to do if you document it well, but Corsair didn't.  I don't expect that I'll buy another Corsair case if they don't document it any better than that.  I understand how failing to document things happens, but that doesn't excuse it.

    But the enormous screw holes in the case for the fan mounts are just plain baffling.  Large screw holes aren't intrinsically bad, but if you're going to ship a case for which the screws that come with case fans typically won't fit, you'd better ship your own screws with the case.  Corsair didn't, and there's no good excuse for that.
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Quizzical said:

    Torval said:
    Hulluck said:
    Quizzical. I'm not saying this to be malicious at all. I am glad to see that even people with far more knowledge than me have the same sorts of trouble that I  had when working the kinks out of my new system.  Hope you get stuff sorted to your liking! I also have been watching this thread and thanks for the progress updates. Just interesting to read even though I got nothing I could honestly add to benefit the thread.
    This is the exact thing that ran through my head when I read the thread. I was actually a bit shocked and surprised because I figured it was always just me, no how matter how much research I put in, that runs into these hurdles. It was very cool that Quizz posted the bumps along with the good. I got to the point where I got sick of building things a few years ago and figured that manufacturer builds would be more solid. My last Acer purchase has shot that idea all to hell. I honestly don't know what I'm going to do for my next build, but this thread really helped put things in perspective.
    Even hardware reviews from professionals who review hardware professionally say that this or that didn't work right.  They get stuck on trying to make stuff work right, and they have massively more experience with it than I do.  Some things, especially the motherboard problems I had, can be dismissed as a simple case of bugs happen.

    The trouble with the front case fans was really a problem of a lack of documentation.  It's the sort of thing that's fine to do if you document it well, but Corsair didn't.  I don't expect that I'll buy another Corsair case if they don't document it any better than that.  I understand how failing to document things happens, but that doesn't excuse it.

    But the enormous screw holes in the case for the fan mounts are just plain baffling.  Large screw holes aren't intrinsically bad, but if you're going to ship a case for which the screws that come with case fans typically won't fit, you'd better ship your own screws with the case.  Corsair didn't, and there's no good excuse for that.
    That's what I am saying though. I am definitely not faulting you. I run into problems just as well that stumped the shit out of me.  Something that I knew must have had a simple solution. All I am saying is that it's nice to know I am not the only person who has teething problems with a new system. If that's even a good way to put it.

    Not mocking or making fun of you for any of the issues you have had. No need to explain. I been there. I learned that choosing a case is just as important as the components from my last build.  Think the next case I look it might be something like what.... what's the guys name.. Miag ....    talked about in the past on these boards. really simple looking metal cases. But I guess good quality.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,076
    My last case purchase was a Corsair, and it's all right - I didn't have any issues with installation, but I had replaced all the factory fans anyway, so there wasn't much to review other than if all the mounting holes lined up (which they did).

    Before that, I used Lian Li cases almost exclusively, and would have for this build except I had heard good things about the Corsair cases and wanted to give one a shot. Lian Li are usually just nice, clean no frills cases. They are all aluminum, so you pay a bit of a price for that compared to one with a steel frame and lot of plastic trim, but that makes them light weight, easy to mod, and they conduct heat out pretty well - apart from having good installation runs internally.

    Would I use a Corsair again? Maybe, but Lian Li remains on my short list.

    BIOS problems are a pain, and every motherboard is a little bit different, even those from the same manufacturer. But I can't think of any motherboard where settings are software-exclusive and you can't get into them from the BIOS - this would be the first I've heard of a company doing that, but honestly I'm surprised they haven't started doing this earlier or more often. Motherboard software is usually a mixed bag - it often looks great, but with a lot of bloat. I usually install it once, say "Wow" and then uninstall it and never look at it again.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] CommonPosts: 0
    edited September 2015
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    I was skeptical on the prefab water cooling solutions from coolmaster, until I tried them. Will never go back to air cooling. They have several different styles from one fan to two fans.

    I would also suggest getting a nice case like the http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7739032&CatId=1510
    The corsiar case is really nice and classy. Tons of ventilation and room for all the components to breath.

    I'm a purist with AMD so I will not comment on anythng else ;D

    Alot of the CPU prefabs look alright. Some of the gpu prefab solutions look horrible. Using a cpu cooler mounted in a frame which leaves parts out in the air. Horrible.  I want to build a loop just to keep heat (wear down) but I am not sure if it's over kill or not given the cost vs. how much my pc cost. It's a I5 4670k with a GTX 770 I built in dec. I think if I fork out for a top tier gpu at some point I'll probably do it then. Not sure I can justify it currently. I guess I could get a prefab cpu cooler until gpu upgrade time.
  • RidelynnRidelynn Member EpicPosts: 7,076
    Hulluck said:
    I was skeptical on the prefab water cooling solutions from coolmaster, until I tried them. Will never go back to air cooling. They have several different styles from one fan to two fans.

    I would also suggest getting a nice case like the http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7739032&CatId=1510
    The corsiar case is really nice and classy. Tons of ventilation and room for all the components to breath.

    I'm a purist with AMD so I will not comment on anythng else ;D

    Alot of the CPU prefabs look alright. Some of the gpu prefab solutions look horrible. Using a cpu cooler mounted in a frame which leaves parts out in the air. Horrible.  I want to build a loop just to keep heat (wear down) but I am not sure if it's over kill or not given the cost vs. how much my pc cost. It's a I5 4670k with a GTX 770 I built in dec. I think if I fork out for a top tier gpu at some point I'll probably do it then. Not sure I can justify it currently. I guess I could get a prefab cpu cooler until gpu upgrade time.
    I love water cooling. For the record.

    I have done water cooled GPUs in the past. They are a good deal more difficult than CPU installs, because the GPU card is removable, the CPU is pretty solidly mounted into the motherboard. Also, factory heatsinks aren't made to be easily removable off cards - a lot of times the VRAM or VRMs are epoxied to the heat sink, and it's extremely difficult to get off without breaking the card - and of course if you do anything with the factory heatsink you void any kind of warranty support. You can get factory water jackets, if you are willing to pay a good premium for them.

    But for a GPU - there are only a few of situations where I would recommend it:
    Because you just wanna play with it - there's always a case for that.
    Because you are putting a lot of GPU/Power Draw in a small footprint - this is why AMD has largely shifted to integral water coolers on their higher end products.
    Because you are trying to cram 3 or 4 double-slot cards into a single motherboard, and can get away with single-slot water jackets instead of double slot air coolers.
  • HulluckHulluck Member UncommonPosts: 830
    Guess that means I'll just buy one like Quizzical did if I do.
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