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Chronicles of a New Eden - The Shepherd of Newbies | EVE Online | MMORPG.com

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
edited September 2015 in News & Features Discussion

imageChronicles of a New Eden - The Shepherd of Newbies | EVE Online | MMORPG.com

EVE Online has a new player problem. It doesn't exist just in attracting new players, but in turning those fledgling pilots into meaningful and contributing members of EVE Online. For years, CCP has toiled over the best way to introduce new players into the game, but for many, the answer has been quite obvious...

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Comments

  • RanyrRanyr Member UncommonPosts: 212
    edited September 2015
    Another reason they have a new player problem is forced PvP. While people will say "that's just the way it is" there are just more people who don't want to pvp or be destroyed and lose everything just because someone is bored, than there are hardcore pvpers.
  • ElsaboltsElsabolts Member RarePosts: 3,476
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    " Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who  Would Threaten It "
                                            MAGA
  • MukeMuke Member RarePosts: 2,614
    edited September 2015
    Ranyr said:
    Another reason they have a new player problem is forced PvP. While people will say "that's just the way it is" there are just more people who don't want to pvp or be destroyed and lose everything just because someone is bored, than there are hardcore pvpers.
    I am a 'hardcore' PVPer. I also was a industrialist and logistics guy for my corp+alliance. And I can honest say I have NEVER been suicide ganked in any of my Jump Freighters, normal freighters, industrials or miners in my 12+ years of playing EVE. I do not fall for the loot agro trick either. As for carebearing. Yes in lowsec-Null people will be there to hunt you, but that is because it is meant to be in those systems. Again, watch local, watch scan, and take precautions and you should be 99% safe. What can happen of course is a traitor in your alliance or corp that tackles you for the enemy, but that is just plain bad luck. But carebear in empty systems and you should be safe. (Unless I am in the neighbourhood of course tee hee) 99% of the so-called 'forced' PVP can be easily avoided. *Just do not auto pilot valuable cargo through bottle neck systems and use your brain.

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • ElsaboltsElsabolts Member RarePosts: 3,476
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    Muke said:
    Ranyr said:
    Another reason they have a new player problem is forced PvP. While people will say "that's just the way it is" there are just more people who don't want to pvp or be destroyed and lose everything just because someone is bored, than there are hardcore pvpers.
    I am a 'hardcore' PVPer. I also was a industrialist and logistics guy for my corp+alliance. And I can honest say I have NEVER been suicide ganked in any of my Jump Freighters, normal freighters, industrials or miners in my 12+ years of playing EVE. I do not fall for the loot agro trick either. 99% of the so-called 'forced' PVP can be easily avoided. *Just do not auto pilot valuable cargo through bottle neck systems and use your brain.

    Thank you for the support.
    " Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Those Who  Would Threaten It "
                                            MAGA
  • IAmMMOIAmMMO Member UncommonPosts: 1,462
    Unless you're willing to dig deep into your pocket and pay real money for everything, your better off not even bothering to join this game at this point, if you do you're just a little farm snack content, even in a Corp. In Corp you're just a meat shield. Real money trading on ISK drives this game too much.
  • BitterClingerBitterClinger Member UncommonPosts: 439
    Another problem that EVE, and a lot of older MMO games, have with new players is that the MMORPG player base has changed dramatically. 15 years ago, players would play an MMORPG and they would immerse themselves into that world, playing it solely or on a very dedicated basis. There are fewer and fewer players like that these days, but EVE is definitely one of those games that you have to get into and put some effort into learning.
    Classic WoW: Back to the Future
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,508
    edited September 2015

    Ranyr said:
    Another reason they have a new player problem is forced PvP. While people will say "that's just the way it is" there are just more people who don't want to pvp or be destroyed and lose everything just because someone is bored, than there are hardcore pvpers.
    It's the challenge of it all.  I'm a total carebear, yet I survive and thrive in this hostile environment, sometimes being a very great challenge to do so.  EVE gives people a chance to grow beyond their self imposed boundaries. 
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    I'm a 7 year vet, and was "prey" this weekend, losing 5 skiffs.... but is OK, in the last month I made about 10B ISK, so the 1.4 B loss was worth it. (and almost entirely my fault and avoidable). That's how the game goes, survival in face of everyone trying to kill you.
    IAmMMO said:
    Unless you're willing to dig deep into your pocket and pay real money for everything, your better off not even bothering to join this game at this point, if you do you're just a little farm snack content, even in a Corp. In Corp you're just a meat shield. Real money trading on ISK drives this game too much.
    Not sure where this is coming from.  It's true, I pay for 5 account subs, if that's what you mean by real money, then yes.  But the real money trading on ISK has far less influence than you are giving it credit for.

    Now, back to the OP, which no one seems to be able to focus on, it's notable that the Goonswarm, oft maligned as a bunch of mindless gankers, is actually quite tactical in their thinking and working towards seeing the game survive by supporting initiatives such as Karmafleet.

    I used to be part of a corp that rented from them and they were very reasonable and businesslike in their approach, and in fact offered good systems at a great price which I didn't quite realize at the time.

    There are many corporation out there that provide the same service and help new players.  My corp exists to provide a safe haven for miners and ratters out in null sec, but providing the opportunity to fight when they are ready and willing to learn and take part of. Not really for new players, but for those with about 5M SP and beyond, not because we wouldn't like to start sooner, but you have to be able to at least fly a mining barge well to make ISK in null sec.


    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • Viper482Viper482 Member LegendaryPosts: 4,065
    As someone who has been interested in EVE but intimidated this article did nothing for me. It was written for people who already play, I did not even know what I was reading half the time. If you were writing this for EVE players good job, if you were writing this for potential players.....fail.
    Make MMORPG's Great Again!
  • KrematoryKrematory Member UncommonPosts: 608
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    I'm a member of a nullsec pvp corp, and you are just spreading bull shit. New players are potential recruits to us, and most definitely welcome to join our ranks if they qualify.

    "EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran

  • uidLuc1duidLuc1d Member UncommonPosts: 194
    Next maybe they can make the game entertaining.
  • Panserbjorne39Panserbjorne39 Member UncommonPosts: 142
    Viper482 said:
    As someone who has been interested in EVE but intimidated this article did nothing for me. It was written for people who already play, I did not even know what I was reading half the time. If you were writing this for EVE players good job, if you were writing this for potential players.....fail."

    Basically. This article was crap and well it's totally just a propaganda piece for Goonswarm and Karmafleet. The article didn't really touch on any real issues that new players face and believe me, joining a large corp in EVE is not going to get new players excited nor keep them around. My experience in the game as a new player trying to find a corp has been nothing but time wasted and frustration. These corps are too big and impersonal to ever keep a newb around.
      
    They HAVE to give away free shit cuz it's really the only thing that's attractive about them. It sure as hell isn't the friendly and outgoing corpmates. Recruiters can't even be bothered to reply to an email or initiate a conversation with a new bro. I've never really experienced anything like it in any other MMO. Apply to corp. Give them full API key. You get told to join half a dozen chat channels, and that you have to download Mumble, Jabber, and register an account with CORE before you can do anything. Plus read a dozen guides and wikis. Want to just get in and PvP with a fleet? Fat chance. Submit an application and API key, AGAIN, fly exactly what we tell you to fly and do what we say. Wow, how fun! 
     You have to be logged on voice comms whether you want to talk or not. No one talks at all in the in-game corp chat channels. 
     lol And a 500 million ISK skillbook? Who cares. I made that much over the weekend with no effort and very little playtime. 
    They also didn't mention in the article the stupid high tax rate Karmafleet has set for its newbros. It's 15%. Higher than NPC corp....great. 
     

  • Panserbjorne39Panserbjorne39 Member UncommonPosts: 142
    Krematory said:
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    I'm a member of a nullsec pvp corp, and you are just spreading bull shit. New players are potential recruits to us, and most definitely welcome to join our ranks if they qualify.
    But that's the problem. They don't qualify. And you guys want to make everyone jump through a dozen hoops to play the stupid game with you. 
  • KrematoryKrematory Member UncommonPosts: 608
    Panserbjorne39 said:
    Krematory said:
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    I'm a member of a nullsec pvp corp, and you are just spreading bull shit. New players are potential recruits to us, and most definitely welcome to join our ranks if they qualify.
    But that's the problem. They don't qualify. And you guys want to make everyone jump through a dozen hoops to play the stupid game with you. 
    Quit whining and put some effort into things. You'll be surprised of what newbros can achieve in EVE.

    "EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran

  • KenzeKenze Member UncommonPosts: 1,217
    spreadsheets in space! no thanks

    Watch your thoughts; they become words.
    Watch your words; they become actions.
    Watch your actions; they become habits.
    Watch your habits; they become character.
    Watch your character; it becomes your destiny.
    —Lao-Tze

  • Panserbjorne39Panserbjorne39 Member UncommonPosts: 142
    Krematory said:
    Panserbjorne39 said:
    Krematory said:
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    I'm a member of a nullsec pvp corp, and you are just spreading bull shit. New players are potential recruits to us, and most definitely welcome to join our ranks if they qualify.
    But that's the problem. They don't qualify. And you guys want to make everyone jump through a dozen hoops to play the stupid game with you. 
    Quit whining and put some effort into things. You'll be surprised of what newbros can achieve in EVE.
    Whining? Who's whining? I dont GAF about achieving anything in EVE, I just want to have fun.
  • happyfartshappyfarts Member UncommonPosts: 94
    Personally I only played EVE briefly. I was equally fascinated and intimidated by the depth of the game. I also love to hear of the intrigue etc that goes on there, that I don't think would be possible in a simpler game. I never got to hang out in nullsec, where I hear the real action happens, I'm too lazy for that. In fact one of my fondest memories of the game was warping through space in a new ship. In fact I don't think I ever engaged in PvP in the time I was there, since I stayed in high sec. Though this initiative is interesting
  • WaldemarTheWaldemarThe Member UncommonPosts: 6
    edited September 2015
    I enjoyed EvE when it was still new, like 1 or 2 years after release. Then I quit for a few years, when I wanted to come back I felt so far behind that I had zero fun. That's the problem with persistent never resetting games. In Themeparks you get expansion resets where everyone is equal again. I can't imagine a total newbie ever getting to experience the game the way an old school veteran that never quit the game can. I would play EvE, on a new server/reset. Game will, at one point, die because of lack of new players. Which is a shame, cause it's a good game.
  • OzmodanOzmodan Member EpicPosts: 9,726
    Using anything from the Goons just spells out LOSER in capital letters.  The goons lie more, cheat more, steal more, scam more than any other organization in any game.

    While I have met a few decent goon players, they are few and far between.  You can play Eve that way of course, but why in the world would you want to associate yourself with one of the most despicable organizations such as the Goons?
  • MyrradahMyrradah Member UncommonPosts: 102
    IAmMMO said:
    Unless you're willing to dig deep into your pocket and pay real money for everything, your better off not even bothering to join this game at this point, if you do you're just a little farm snack content, even in a Corp. In Corp you're just a meat shield. Real money trading on ISK drives this game too much.
    If you are referring t the Skill points issue people have - Skill points can only get you so far. granted, it takes about 6-8 months before your skills would be about on par with just about anyone else getting into pvp and having fun is a lot more than being a meat shield. You just joined a bad corp.
  • MyrradahMyrradah Member UncommonPosts: 102
    Kenze said:
    spreadsheets in space! no thanks
    I never used a spreadsheet to play eve....no idea where this comes from. Heck ive seen spreadhseets of info for other games - even secret world which I love.
  • MyrradahMyrradah Member UncommonPosts: 102
    WaldemarThe said:
    I enjoyed EvE when it was still new, like 1 or 2 years after release. Then I quit for a few years, when I wanted to come back I felt so far behind that I had zero fun. That's the problem with persistent never resetting games. In Themeparks you get expansion resets where everyone is equal again. I can't imagine a total newbie ever getting to experience the game the way an old school veteran that never quit the game can. I would play EvE, on a new server/reset. Game will, at one point, die because of lack of new players. Which is a shame, cause it's a good game.
    Now a days things have changed with skillpoints and things to train etc. Honestly, it takes about 2 weeks to have a lot of fun pvp or whatever with a good group of people. 4-6 months yer in a bomber and blapping people. no such thing as being behind with all the changes. I have had to relearn this game at least 4 times due to the changes in the past year and i have been with Eve since Beta.
  • HowbadisbadHowbadisbad Member UncommonPosts: 453
    Ranyr said:
    Another reason they have a new player problem is forced PvP. While people will say "that's just the way it is" there are just more people who don't want to pvp or be destroyed and lose everything just because someone is bored, than there are hardcore pvpers.
    Elsabolts said:
    New players are considered by most as Pray! Just giving you the facks,
    Reminder that new players who are killed by other players are more likely to stay playing EVE. Source: CCP

    Waiting for:
    The Repopulation
    Albion Online

  • MukeMuke Member RarePosts: 2,614
    edited September 2015
    IAmMMO said:
    Unless you're willing to dig deep into your pocket and pay real money for everything, your better off not even bothering to join this game at this point, if you do you're just a little farm snack content, even in a Corp. In Corp you're just a meat shield. Real money trading on ISK drives this game too much.
    If you let yourself be used as a meat shield, is it the fault of those that do this to you? Are you the kind of player that takes the easy road and follows others and let those tell them how to play, or are you the kind of player that decides for himself how he wants to spend his time in the game? My guess is you are type 1. About sinking money into this game: With 15 mins/day market trading, even on a newb trial , you should be able to play for free after your first month. Again, all that stands in front of you and free play is your IQ and backbone. Don't rant on EVE when you are the weakest link in the chain.

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • PalaPala Member UncommonPosts: 356
    I played EVE for 2 years and I really dont understand this myth about EvE being particulary complex or intimidating. Personally it was about 3-4 days of discovery and that was it, you get everything that is going on. Flying the ships and fighting you figure out in 15 mins at least for PVE level. Also in 2 years I was killed once in low sec space, I spent time as a memeber of a null sec alliance and in high and nobody attacked me even once. In fact we spent alot of time looking for someone to attack. I blew through 1 gate ambush in null sec in all my time there. People who write these comments must be motivated by something else to do so as I just dont get that. I stopped playing because I tried everything including living in wormholes but I just couldnt connect to being a ship. Nothing else really was a problem.
  • Panserbjorne39Panserbjorne39 Member UncommonPosts: 142
    Pala said:
    I played EVE for 2 years and I really dont understand this myth about EvE being particulary complex or intimidating. Personally it was about 3-4 days of discovery and that was it, you get everything that is going on. Flying the ships and fighting you figure out in 15 mins at least for PVE level. Also in 2 years I was killed once in low sec space, I spent time as a memeber of a null sec alliance and in high and nobody attacked me even once. In fact we spent alot of time looking for someone to attack. I blew through 1 gate ambush in null sec in all my time there. People who write these comments must be motivated by something else to do so as I just dont get that. I stopped playing because I tried everything including living in wormholes but I just couldnt connect to being a ship. Nothing else really was a problem.
    I don't know what you actually did for that two years? Sit in space dock 98% of the time? I was blown up three times last night alone in low sec. lol. Two times were my fault, got caught slippin', no hard feelings. And what I'm doing involves risk. I still made a profit in what I was doing and didn't fly something I couldn't afford to lose as the saying goes. I do agree with you though the whole "EVE is so unique and amazingly deep and complex" idea is total exaggeration by the vets of the game who want to feel special and perpetuate that myth. It's really not any more complex than any other decent MMO. The thing that makes it difficult (not deep or complex!) is that the UI and tutorials are all utter garbage and the game explains almost nothing to you as a player.
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