I am playing AA because it nicer on the eyes. I can't bare to look at clay, legos or the ground, on a game that I am going to play long-term.
And there lies the dreams of so many of us in the dust. Games which have such huge potential, when we are always calling for something new are not being looked at because they are not nice enough on the eyes.
But to be frank, this issue effects me, although I have done by bit trying out some of the old ones. The paradox is that if a good graphics sandbox was released, you would have a ton of players who had no interest in sandboxes descending on it. They would start demanding changes, changes which would make it move away from its sandbox origins.
For me the best type of MMO is a hybrid between the two genres anyway, Sandbox and Themepark. So yes, even more demanding and even harder for anyone to achieve with good graphics. But that old delusion hope does not go away.
I have no idea how I've never discovered Wurm Online before, but it definitely has the qualities of a solid sandbox game.
Started playing last night and it took me several hours to travel by foot to the village that offered to give me a guest house and a farm plot. It was interesting to see player built bridges, trade chat full of players saying "will only trade by boat." The massive scale of the game and the huge amounts of time to get things done, requiring cooperation and some degree of specialization, makes this sandbox unique in its class.
I wonder why the game has such a small population though? Is it because the game has been out for some time, or is this level of complexity and time investment not something that sandbox enthusiasts are looking for?
I can tell you why I personally am not playing Wurm now, if you want that as data. Who knows if its the same for other people though.
Anyway, I trialed Wurm, and here's what happened. From the beginning I was not enthusiastic about the medieval-ish setting or bland color palette, but I was fine ignoring that in favor of trying to figure out how to build myself a house. After completing the tutorial level which didn't seem to have a lot to do with newbie gameplay, I was spawned into the game on the side of a mountain where there was just nothing helpful. No NPCs, no quests, no menu pop-ups, not even a sign to read. I was immediately lost and I freaking hate being lost. At least it was day out. But it was winter in the game. I wandered around, and found some other players' houses and boats. A low level monster beat the crap out of me and I had to run away to avoid dying; I discovered through this encounter that the combat was a type I hate. Not necessarily a problem, I was in this game to farm and build anyway, but I crossed hunting off my list of possible fun in-game activities. I found a trading stand set up so I could see what they were using for currency, not that I had any or knew how to get any yet. It got dark and I couldn't see a damn thing so I logged out and came back later.
After some more wandering around, including spending half an hour stuck swimming before I could find a place that wasn't too steep to get out, and at least 15 minutes trapped by some player's giant wall, I finally found a spot I liked enough to want to build a house there, or at least start with a storage chest or a fire pit or something. I wanted to chop down one particular tree to make a bigger clearing to put my house in. I think I managed to make a fire, but had no clue how to make anything else. (Could I have read a wiki, yes, but it's a failure of the game's design and interface if you can't educate yourself within the game.) But meanwhile there was just nothing my character could pick up and eat, nor any way to get a fish from the water, so I eventually starved to death. And respawned on the mountain, only at half health now, not entirely sure how to even get back to my little clearing, nor sure what the point was of walking all that way just to die again. So I wandered around instead, found someone's mine. Walked into the mine only to fall down a shaft and discover I couldn't climb out, and had pretty much no option but to commit suicide. That had pretty much used up my enthusiasm for trying out the game.
You wanted a true sandbox and you couldn't handle it. Perhaps sandbox is not really what you are looking for. Check out my video link in an earlier post I made in this thread.
Every time ppl discuss sandbox we found alot of definition of sandbox. What i usually looking in a game is "political sandbox", i want my actions interfear with others gameplay and vice-versa, in a good or bad way. That is what makes a game alive for me. We cant considering the old L2 a sanbox game, but was in political terms, the relations between players and clans, a game where if someone mess around with the wrong player might have to reroll, i remember to not feel confortable next to some players and clans, had to leave some grinding spot for a strong clan because mine was weaker and we could face them, then start slowlly talk to them, create a certain relation and they start allow me grinding next to them. This is what i want, the game and the world is alive for me when this things hapened.
Thats why i love ArcheAge, will not discuss if is a sanbox or not, but the political part is amazing imo. Its a game where my actions interfear with others and vice-versa, even in safe zones. That makes for me the game wolrd alive, we create relations with others, good and bad ones, we have a list of friends and a lits of enemys and this both list might change everday. Im in a guild where we "dont play faction", we play with who we want, we are not the stronger ones but we allready been in war with most of the guilds green or reds, we dont care, if theres a motive to go war we go, if necessary to ally with reds to destroy some green guild, we do it, this part is amazing imo, Diplomats of each guilds allways have alot of work
So, for me sanbox games resume to this, i can do what i want but so the other player next to me, If we both want the same thing means only one of us can do it, even usually i lost i love it
I wonder why the game has such a small population though? Is it because the game has been out for some time, or is this level of complexity and time investment not something that sandbox enthusiasts are looking for?
I can tell you why I personally am not playing Wurm now, if you want that as data. Who knows if its the same for other people though.
Anyway, I trialed Wurm, and here's what happened. From the beginning I was not enthusiastic about the medieval-ish setting or bland color palette, but I was fine ignoring that in favor of trying to figure out how to build myself a house. After completing the tutorial level which didn't seem to have a lot to do with newbie gameplay, I was spawned into the game on the side of a mountain where there was just nothing helpful. No NPCs, no quests, no menu pop-ups, not even a sign to read. I was immediately lost and I freaking hate being lost. At least it was day out. But it was winter in the game. I wandered around, and found some other players' houses and boats. A low level monster beat the crap out of me and I had to run away to avoid dying; I discovered through this encounter that the combat was a type I hate. Not necessarily a problem, I was in this game to farm and build anyway, but I crossed hunting off my list of possible fun in-game activities. I found a trading stand set up so I could see what they were using for currency, not that I had any or knew how to get any yet. It got dark and I couldn't see a damn thing so I logged out and came back later.
After some more wandering around, including spending half an hour stuck swimming before I could find a place that wasn't too steep to get out, and at least 15 minutes trapped by some player's giant wall, I finally found a spot I liked enough to want to build a house there, or at least start with a storage chest or a fire pit or something. I wanted to chop down one particular tree to make a bigger clearing to put my house in. I think I managed to make a fire, but had no clue how to make anything else. (Could I have read a wiki, yes, but it's a failure of the game's design and interface if you can't educate yourself within the game.) But meanwhile there was just nothing my character could pick up and eat, nor any way to get a fish from the water, so I eventually starved to death. And respawned on the mountain, only at half health now, not entirely sure how to even get back to my little clearing, nor sure what the point was of walking all that way just to die again. So I wandered around instead, found someone's mine. Walked into the mine only to fall down a shaft and discover I couldn't climb out, and had pretty much no option but to commit suicide. That had pretty much used up my enthusiasm for trying out the game.
You wanted a true sandbox and you couldn't handle it. Perhaps sandbox is not really what you are looking for. Check out my video link in an earlier post I made in this thread.
If "true sandbox" means "unintuitive and poorly designed game where a player can end up in a futile death spiral" then I don't really know anyone that wants a "true sandbox." It's not that they can't handle it - it's just not anyone's idea of fun.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
It is some peoples idea of fun, not quite as many as people think though. Even if this game were Triple AAA and dressed up in fancy graphics I think it would have a hard time being popular.
But then again Minecraft is huge and I absolutely hate that game, so I obviously know nothing, Jon Snow.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
If a game can be described as sandbox, it still doesn't mean you also like its mechanics. EVE for example, does things in a certain way that I don't really care for or even in some cases don't like. It is just not my game, even though I can really like sandbox games (SWG, Minecraft for example).
EvE is not a sandbox game. It was sandbox at launch. You jumped in a ship and did whatever you needed to take stuff. That's over with now, to take stuff now you follow a preset number of steps and do so repeatedly over and over to take more stuff. Same as running pvp bg in wow.
You wanted a true sandbox and you couldn't handle it. Perhaps sandbox is not really what you are looking for. Check out my video link in an earlier post I made in this thread.
I wanted a true sandbox? No, I tried a true sandbox because it was available and recommended to me. If you'll glance at my sig you'll see that I am a big sandpark fan, and specifically sandparks intended to support solo players. I fail to see why that video is relevant, and I already looked at it.
I want to help design and develop a PvE-focused, solo-friendly, sandpark MMO which combines crafting, monster hunting, and story. So PM me if you are starting one.
You wanted a true sandbox and you couldn't handle it. Perhaps sandbox is not really what you are looking for. Check out my video link in an earlier post I made in this thread.
I wanted a true sandbox? No, I tried a true sandbox because it was available and recommended to me. If you'll glance at my sig you'll see that I am a big sandpark fan, and specifically sandparks intended to support solo players. I fail to see why that video is relevant, and I already looked at it.
Your signature doesn't really exsist(as in that's the intended purpose). Most sandboxes are made into sandboxes because the developers realize they don't have the cash flow for one time use content, so they make easily repeatable content like crafting/farming/similar. Where the player does as they want but still fall into cycles. Then they toss on the ability for players to screw each other, and call it a sandbox. Which actually works pretty well in some cases.
Though Ryzom does get pretty close. PvE focused(a lot of the player base hasn't even been in a duel), crafting(your skills/abilities, all of your gear, and pretty much everything about your character), monster hunting(plenty, and to properly min/max you need to learn seasons for when material drops change monster migrations, and similar). Story haven't really played it much but for as far as I got they did have a pretty normal questing system where you did get to learn quite a bit about lore if you bothered to learn it.
Runescape also gets pretty close as well... Quests/stories that are actually quests(to the extent that if Jagex announces that they released ONE new quest it's actually news worthy). PvE so very very much PvE and all the grind to go with it. Crafting has sadly fell to the near complete wayside with recent updates, and pretty much only exist as quest requirements now(even if all the old functionality is there). (PS: is unplayable for me, but for what it does it does really well).
Even EvE gets there in so many ways, if you don't mind also playing the role of the hunted wumpus at the same time(anywhere, but usually depending on where you are).
__________________________
Would totally love to see a sandbox MMO where rather than players competing directly, they're forced to compete/screw each other economically. Player factions gain the ability to screw other player factions by influencing NPCs, through PvE content and similar.
I'd love D&D/Patherfinder rogue abilities like "Steal the Story" actually matter and have a larger effect on players than just bashing their head in and taking their stuff.
Maybe even drive the point home by offering no way for players to directly get into combat with each other.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
Comments
And there lies the dreams of so many of us in the dust. Games which have such huge potential, when we are always calling for something new are not being looked at because they are not nice enough on the eyes.
But to be frank, this issue effects me, although I have done by bit trying out some of the old ones. The paradox is that if a good graphics sandbox was released, you would have a ton of players who had no interest in sandboxes descending on it. They would start demanding changes, changes which would make it move away from its sandbox origins.
For me the best type of MMO is a hybrid between the two genres anyway, Sandbox and Themepark. So yes, even more demanding and even harder for anyone to achieve with good graphics. But that old delusion hope does not go away.
What i usually looking in a game is "political sandbox", i want my actions interfear with others gameplay and vice-versa, in a good or bad way. That is what makes a game alive for me.
We cant considering the old L2 a sanbox game, but was in political terms, the relations between players and clans, a game where if someone mess around with the wrong player might have to reroll, i remember to not feel confortable next to some players and clans, had to leave some grinding spot for a strong clan because mine was weaker and we could face them, then start slowlly talk to them, create a certain relation and they start allow me grinding next to them. This is what i want, the game and the world is alive for me when this things hapened.
Thats why i love ArcheAge, will not discuss if is a sanbox or not, but the political part is amazing imo. Its a game where my actions interfear with others and vice-versa, even in safe zones. That makes for me the game wolrd alive, we create relations with others, good and bad ones, we have a list of friends and a lits of enemys and this both list might change everday.
Im in a guild where we "dont play faction", we play with who we want, we are not the stronger ones but we allready been in war with most of the guilds green or reds, we dont care, if theres a motive to go war we go, if necessary to ally with reds to destroy some green guild, we do it, this part is amazing imo, Diplomats of each guilds allways have alot of work
So, for me sanbox games resume to this, i can do what i want but so the other player next to me, If we both want the same thing means only one of us can do it, even usually i lost i love it
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
But then again Minecraft is huge and I absolutely hate that game, so I obviously know nothing, Jon Snow.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
Though Ryzom does get pretty close. PvE focused(a lot of the player base hasn't even been in a duel), crafting(your skills/abilities, all of your gear, and pretty much everything about your character), monster hunting(plenty, and to properly min/max you need to learn seasons for when material drops change monster migrations, and similar). Story haven't really played it much but for as far as I got they did have a pretty normal questing system where you did get to learn quite a bit about lore if you bothered to learn it.
Runescape also gets pretty close as well... Quests/stories that are actually quests(to the extent that if Jagex announces that they released ONE new quest it's actually news worthy). PvE so very very much PvE and all the grind to go with it. Crafting has sadly fell to the near complete wayside with recent updates, and pretty much only exist as quest requirements now(even if all the old functionality is there). (PS: is unplayable for me, but for what it does it does really well).
Even EvE gets there in so many ways, if you don't mind also playing the role of the hunted wumpus at the same time(anywhere, but usually depending on where you are).
__________________________
Would totally love to see a sandbox MMO where rather than players competing directly, they're forced to compete/screw each other economically. Player factions gain the ability to screw other player factions by influencing NPCs, through PvE content and similar.
I'd love D&D/Patherfinder rogue abilities like "Steal the Story" actually matter and have a larger effect on players than just bashing their head in and taking their stuff.
Maybe even drive the point home by offering no way for players to directly get into combat with each other.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."