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a unpopular opinion: EvE needs walking in station to grow

cosycosy Member UncommonPosts: 3,228

This is not a popular opinion for many actual EVE players I will say that their opinion on this is irrelevant unless they will open a secondary account.

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  • BladestromBladestrom Member UncommonPosts: 5,001
    its evident eve players cannot handle change, look at how they freaked out over monocles - a graphical asset you can purchase in game, in a gamewhere you can buy anything including game time lol...  As for walking in corridors, that's a pve thing, and PVE aka carebears are treated as second class citizens in that game,  unless you play pve to feed pvp activities.

    rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar

    Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D

  • BaitnessBaitness Member UncommonPosts: 675
    Originally posted by cosy

    This is not a popular opinion for many actual EVE players I will say that their opinion on this is irrelevant unless they will open a secondary account.

    Though I do not really understand what you wrote here, I understand the title, and I agree.  Right now the closest I have to an identity is my pod or my ship, though captains quarters and the avatars in chat help.

     

    I think WiS would be an important step in a necessary direction for eve - having people able to pilot a ship that is transporting another person's pod.  I do not mean like a rorq, I mean standard industrial ships carrying pods in their cargo.  Would scanners reveal the pod is in there?  Maybe, but it shouldn't reveal the player in the pod.  It would be awesome to have people pay to get transported through hi-sec, or for high bounty targets to get around.

     

    I think this is related to WiS because it is part of trying to make the player feel like their character rather than their ship.  Hell, maybe a trader wouldn't even bother to have their own ship?  The players always use new options in interesting ways...

     

    I also hope that WiS would lead to better questing.  You would actually walk up to the mission giver to get the mission, that would really help with how immersive the game is.  It would help if the missions were better too but eh...

  • JohnP0100JohnP0100 Member UncommonPosts: 401

    What kind of player would you attract with 'Walk in station'?

    And what does 'Walk in station' mean? What type of features are you looking for with 'Walk in station'?

    It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard

    Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi

  • HokieHokie Member UncommonPosts: 1,063

    I have to agree.

    I opened up a new EVE account when they had that Christmas special and even though the game looked pretty I personally just couldnt get back into it.

    WiS was promised to include running your own establisment among other things. Its some fresh snad for the sand box, and thats what it needs if it wants to bring me back for an extended amount of time.

    Im not slamming the game, I still think its the most incredible MMO out there. But it does lack something, something more personable.

    "I understand that if I hear any more words come pouring out of your **** mouth, Ill have to eat every fucking chicken in this room."

  • KrematoryKrematory Member UncommonPosts: 608
    Walking in stations is not what this game has been about since 2003. If you commit your developibg resources to something completely unrelated to the core of the game, people who already play will be unhappy, and new players will join the game for the wrong reasons.
    Oh, and ut has nothing to do with "handling change". There where some drastic changes in how Jump Bridged work recently, and people adapted no problem. Adding some stupid items for an outrageous prices, however, is something any good gaming community will reject in a heartbeat.

    "EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran

  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,587
    While the idea of walking in stations sounds attractive, it likely would not draw enough long term players to justify the cost.

    EVE offers a truly unique gaming experience, so much so that if it really appeals to a person, they really aren't going anywhere else and my guess is it has one of the higher return rates of any MMORPG out there.

    How many games have players regularly paying for more than one account? Two friends of mine recently returned and all 3 of us pay (in cash) for four accounts each. None of us really care about WIS, but there definitely are features we would like to see added.

    CCPs tongue in cheek motto is HTFU, because real EVE fans will overlook missing features here or there, because the total package is well worth the money.

    As for the monacle gate incident, darn right EVE players resisted a $75.00 cosmetic cash shop item, it is to their credit they didn't let the nonsense that has wrecked the rest of the genre infiltrate one of the last great MMORPGs remaining.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

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  • observerobserver Member RarePosts: 3,685
    I'm not sure what "walk in station" means, but do you mean controlling your avatars?  As someone who's been interested in EvE, the reason i always refuse to play it, is because there isn't an avatar to associate with.  I don't find the appeal of only controlling ships or vehicles.  From what i've seen, avatars are pretty much scripted.  Again, my knowledge only comes from videos i've seen on it.
  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,587
    Originally posted by observer
    I'm not sure what "walk in station" means, but do you mean controlling your avatars?  As someone who's been interested in EvE, the reason i always refuse to play it, is because there isn't an avatar to associate with.  I don't find the appeal of only controlling ships or vehicles.  From what i've seen, avatars are pretty much scripted.  Again, my knowledge only comes from videos i've seen on it.

    It is a bit of misnomer to say EVE has no avatars, they added a feature a few years back where you can build a full featured character model, however it is restricted to a private instance called "the Captain's Quarters" where all it can do is move around from a the ship hanger to a lounge area to a cash shop type store but cannot actually interact with other players or do anything really useful.

    But if this really is a game breaker for you, I'm pretty sure there are far more features about EVE that won't appeal either, so probably not the MMO for you.

    People should play EVE (and probably any other MMO ) more for the features they offer and not focus on one or two it lacks.

    Too often I find people saying they won't play a certain MMO because it lacks (or has) one or two features they consider totally essential to their game play (sometimes as minute as having  reverse mouse look) and they end up discarding the entire game.

    I suppose that is a fallout of having so much choice out there in the MMO world, players can afford to be very choosy as there's always another game they can play.  With EVE, it has features that no other title out there offers, so if you are looking for this particular experience, you learn to overlook what really isn't important.  To most EVE players, WIS isn't really high on their list of improvements.

    "True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde 

    "I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant

    Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm

    Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

    Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™

    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon






  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,380
    Originally posted by observer
    I'm not sure what "walk in station" means, but do you mean controlling your avatars?  As someone who's been interested in EvE, the reason i always refuse to play it, is because there isn't an avatar to associate with.  I don't find the appeal of only controlling ships or vehicles.  From what i've seen, avatars are pretty much scripted.  Again, my knowledge only comes from videos i've seen on it.

    I thought the same thing when I first played it in 2003, but when I gave it a second shot in 2005 I found that it's designed in such a way that you really don't think about your human avatar much.

    The spaceships and what you're doing with them are the game, and it's a game worth playing if for nothing else than the experience.  It's a MUCH easier game to get into in 2015 than it was in 2005, so I would definitely try it.

    That being said, I also believe that WiS will eventually become mandatory.  I've always been against it personally, but my reason for being against it was that CCP was going to spend several development cycles producing nothing more than dressing up barbie dolls.

    If WiS has more depth to it than what they were planning, then it would be worth having in the game.  However, the chance to play dress-up-barbie was absolutely not a reason to stop developing the spaceship side of the game, and I believe that many people shared the same belief.

    At some point this game will have to start competing with the half dozen of other spaceship/exploration/sci-fi games coming out in the near future, and some of that competition will indeed be against game where players will be able to get out of their ships and walk around.

    You can see CCP starting to compete already with Valkyrie.  Now that other games are starting to provide the ability to directly fly the spaceships, CCP must do something similar.

  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,916

    I completely disagree.

     

    Personally, I'd love to see the feature implemented and expanded, but I also believe that it is not a direction that EVE should go in. It doesn't really gel well with the concepts that define EVE.

     

    EVE is about grand strategy, not about small-unit or personal tactics. It caters to a clearly-defined set of preferences, and caters to them well. That is why it is a niche game. It explains why it has survived so well for so long without ever becoming a mass-appeal game.

     

    Having seen the horror of "walking-in-stations" as it was implemented in the X franchise (X-Rebirth, to be exact), it becomes obvious that interacting with NPC's on a "face-to-face" level is a VERY different type of game than flying around space and blowing stuff up. It requires a whole new skillset to produce that kind of game play attractively and convincingly.

     

    EVE has done very well in the last decade by doing "ships in space" as best as it can. CCP have wavered on occasion, but their players speak very loudly when things get too far off the desired track.

  • JakdstripperJakdstripper Member RarePosts: 2,410

    i also disagree somewhat. 

    walking in stations alone will note make EvE grow. sure, for a few months you would see some growth as people return to check out the new feature, and maybe a few more players join. however, eventually walking into station would become quite boring, much like the captains quarters  is. 

    just walking that is.

     

    the first time i saw the captain's quarters i was like " oh man, this looks awesome. i'm finally out of my ship. i'm a person!". that lasted a bout 1 week, and then i even stopped using it. it's eye candy, but not really useful, or in any way practical. the same would happen with walking inside stations. you would do it once or twice, but then, once you've seen that station a few times, you would get bored. 

     

    there needs purpose to "walking inside a station", and there needs to be a way to show off your ship/and or status when inside the station. only then will people never get bored.

    Giant screens maybe, that show the current ships docked inside your station. or holograms that alternate between all the ships docked. or just a bar overviewing the hangar full of ships. 

    as far as purpose, you need to be able to interact directly with players at a "human to human" level (as opposed ship to ship). people need to be able to get into fights, or be able to physically arrest someone (that has a bounty), or just attempt to kill war decked enemies, and maybe even get into it with local authorities, all inside those stations. just walking around talking to people gets boring fast no matter how pretty everyone looks. 

  • Agent_JosephAgent_Joseph Member UncommonPosts: 1,361

    if ccp make  that crap  , I hope it ll be optional

     

  • BK2O1BK2O1 Member UncommonPosts: 91
    All I want to do is open my own establishment in space. A restaurant or something that people can stop in and eat or w/e. Maybe my double cheeseburger will give them +1 to a stat. Or a social club for players to interact with each other, trade goods, and RP. 

    WiS isn't about playing dress up. It's about giving players more options for social interaction. Imagine if they added the ability to walk in every single station. Being able to walk around in your corps HQ. Player built space cities where you could open up your own shop and sell those goods in a high traffic area station. Need to fit a new ship? No problem just get over to Franks Hull & Repair shop on the second level. 

    Anyway, thats what I think of when someone says space sandbox. 
  • jesteralwaysjesteralways Member RarePosts: 2,560
    Nope, what eve needs is more automated space combat, watching a EVE streamer engaging PvP and just talking and eating is boring, CCP should allow them to engage combat and then go take a dump or have sex or something while the game automatically fights for them.

    Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.

  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,000
    Just to walk around would be boring but shops and bars like in SWG where you had to travel to a certain planet to buy specially crafted items from the best of crafters in their class would be interesting.  Some items placed in the auction house sure but certain black market items or equipment that's only sold in one guys shop or one corps kiosk could work.

    "We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa      "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."  SR Covey

  • PalaPala Member UncommonPosts: 357
    edited August 2015
    Personally I think the naysayers are lacking creativity.

    How about you build station interiors where your PVE, trade and industry care bears reside, and that station comes under attack by another corp, alliance. How interpersonal would the interaction between these more carebear roles and PVP players be, maybe even build defensible space stations where players who are not into ship combat can man the AA guns, rockets or shields. Or you make a whole game in stations, FPS with missions, as well as entertainment. You are not going to get a new audience with the same old ships vs ships experience. That way you cater to your audience and I think WIS shouldnt even be aimed at them but at a whole new market segment.

    Of course it wouldnt be easy but there is a massive opportunity there. It would also be amazing to actually board ships and be a crewmember. Some of those ships are larger than the stations, just use slightly adapted interiors, doesnt have to be crazily detailed. Really I am talking about a babylon 5/star trek game in the EVE universe but why not, the world, the ships and the stations are there. Yes its a different game but all the players who want that would love to pay to be a part of that and I think there are more of them than the untapped ship to ship segment.

    Of course the investment would be massive but maybe not as big as a completely new MMO would be. 
  • killkoolkillkool Member UncommonPosts: 83
    Something what they promised in 2005 already, what did get your own chamber which feels like your solitairy hotel chamber. With tv,  bed, couch and a mirror. But not the walking in next room and talking too other captains who stayed  at that station. So it feeled like prison.

    Eve empire was save for miners in 2003. Anno 2015 they want 5 mil isk from you and they do not shoot down, under the mum we only shoot afk miners. 

    I was they called a carebear. The only carebear eve still have are afk carebears, who plex pay and earn a lot money from the game. The real dedicated miners are long gone. 

    Also what they intended EVE is becoming more and more a PVP game. 
    They digging there own grave eventually.

    AK
  • MukeMuke Member RarePosts: 2,614
    its evident eve players cannot handle change, look at how they freaked out over monocles - a graphical asset you can purchase in game, in a gamewhere you can buy anything including game time lol...  As for walking in corridors, that's a pve thing, and PVE aka carebears are treated as second class citizens in that game,  unless you play pve to feed pvp activities.
    It's about turning the game into one with full focus on advertising on the ingame cashshops, which many don't want.

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

  • user547user547 Member UncommonPosts: 150
    The game caters to the whims of a few online tyrants who run the few large pvp guilds that are in control of every other player's gaming experience.  These few players are the ones actually playing EVE ('s metagame), and every other person is just a pawn or a patsy.

    It's not likely they are ever going to do anything to bring in customers or have actual gameplay that would threaten this status quo, regardless of how much money CCP would stand to gain.  And it is a significant amount of money that CCP us throwing out the door, a fact that no doubt amuses the sociopaths who dominate the game currently.

    As it is, there is no reason for a new player to join because you never really get to play.  You just take orders from a guild leader, or you don't get to experience the game at all.  It is always a bad idea for a company to let a few players become gatekeeper for your product.  They will always cost you more money than they would ever bring in.  CCP should be hauling in at least 10 times what they do, but they refuse to take even the tiniest steps toward adding things to their game, thanks to catering to the whims of a few cyberbullies.
  • klash2defklash2def Member EpicPosts: 1,949
    Krematory said:
    Walking in stations is not what this game has been about since 2003. If you commit your developibg resources to something completely unrelated to the core of the game, people who already play will be unhappy, and new players will join the game for the wrong reasons.
    Oh, and ut has nothing to do with "handling change". There where some drastic changes in how Jump Bridged work recently, and people adapted no problem. Adding some stupid items for an outrageous prices, however, is something any good gaming community will reject in a heartbeat.
    Sounds like the world is flat to me.

    Who cares about 2003.. its 2015-16 EVE needs to adapt to change. Who cares why new players join long as they have good intent? Who are you to say players join EVE for the wrong reason.. Eve is a great game but the general community of elitist baffles me.  Stop acting like you know how a new game mechanic like wis would work with the game experience because you don't know shit negative norman. 
    "Beliefs don't change facts. Facts, if you're reasonable, should change your beliefs."


    "The Society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools."



     
    Currently: Games Audio Engineer, you didn't hear what I heard, you heard what I wanted you to hear. 


  • Panserbjorne39Panserbjorne39 Member UncommonPosts: 142
    BK2O1 said:
    All I want to do is open my own establishment in space. A restaurant or something that people can stop in and eat or w/e. Maybe my double cheeseburger will give them +1 to a stat. Or a social club for players to interact with each other, trade goods, and RP. 

    WiS isn't about playing dress up. It's about giving players more options for social interaction. Imagine if they added the ability to walk in every single station. Being able to walk around in your corps HQ. Player built space cities where you could open up your own shop and sell those goods in a high traffic area station. Need to fit a new ship? No problem just get over to Franks Hull & Repair shop on the second level. 

    Anyway, thats what I think of when someone says space sandbox. 

    That sounds like what a sandbox should be. I think what EVE is now, and was at the beginning is very limited and restricting. From my understanding, it's not some great creative sandbox framework that EVE was based on. It was a real lack of funding that prevented them from doing more and creating more content. One of the creators in an interview I read basically said "Well, content is expensive and we didn't have enough money for it. So we thought, ok, we'll let the players create their own content."

    And now with their other failed ventures like Dust, and smalller team, CCP is not in any position to add anything significant to the game. EVE is an interesting game, no doubt. But I imagine that there will be a huge exodus of players when Star Citizen comes out. I see SC as what EVE could've been if CCP didn't only cater to its vets and was truly serious and ambitious about growing as a game, company, and attracting new players.  

  • Paradigm68Paradigm68 Member UncommonPosts: 890
    While it would be disliked by many, the fact is if implemented competently, WIS would open up a facet of the game that could bring in an influx of players who would support and and enhance the game for the players who have no interest in it.
  • yaminsuxyaminsux Member UncommonPosts: 973
    edited September 2015
    While it would be disliked by many, the fact is if implemented competently, WIS would open up a facet of the game that could bring in an influx of players who would support and and enhance the game for the players who have no interest in it.
    WiS have nothing to offer apart of immersion. Most of EvE activities are out there in space. 
  • thinktank001thinktank001 Member UncommonPosts: 2,144
    its evident eve players cannot handle change, look at how they freaked out over monocles - a graphical asset you can purchase in game, in a gamewhere you can buy anything including game time lol...  As for walking in corridors, that's a pve thing, and PVE aka carebears are treated as second class citizens in that game,  unless you play pve to feed pvp activities.

    I don't think the conversion of plex to aurum (or whatever their cash shop currency was called) would be a little effect.   It would probably turn EVE's entire economy upside down overnight, since it would become the most valuable resource overnight. 
  • sketocafesketocafe Member UncommonPosts: 950
    I'd still be playing if they had taken the resources they put into dust 874 and just turned 1/3 of the stations into optional, co-op Dead Space type experiences. If WiS is just a graphical replacement of menu screens, it's not going to have any large effect. Oh boy, I can walk down to the fitting area instead of opening my fitting screen. WiS needs to add something new, not replace something we already have.
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