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Why no Shadowrun

SoraksisSoraksis Member UncommonPosts: 294
I have been seeing games come out centered around old school pen and paper style rpgs such as DDO, Neverwinter, WAR and the like.  But I have yet to see anyone do a Shadowrun MMO.  In my honest opinion that game could give the sandbox style feel with the complete ability to create your own character with a classless point and skill system like what exists in the pen and paper game.  Just think about it, cyberware implants, rigger controlled drones, deckers hacking the matrix, corporate (guild) cities or headquarters with pvp between rivals available.  And it would bring a somewhat new feel to the mmo world with a sci-fi/cyberpunk style.  I dont know it may be just me but this game is one game I would love to see as an MMO and not just the little turn based rpgs that live on steam atm.
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  • Stuka1000Stuka1000 Member UncommonPosts: 955
    edited September 2015
    There is already a Shadowrun online game out, Shadowrun Boston Lockdown I believe it's called.  It was originally going to be called Shadowrun Online but the reception was meh! so they changed the title and hid the online info in the small print.


    Apparently it changed again, it's called Shadowrun Chronicles now.
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Stuka1000 said:
    There is already a Shadowrun online game out, Shadowrun Boston Lockdown I believe it's called.  It was originally going to be called Shadowrun Online but the reception was meh! so they changed the title and hid the online info in the small print.


    Apparently it changed again, it's called Shadowrun Chronicles now.
    There is also a Hong kong version. But it is a browser game so it isn't what Soraksis (or me for that matter) is looking for.

    A full blown SR MMO would be awesome. I wouldn't mind one based on FASAs old "Crimson skies" either. Sadly they just got the boardgame out, the RPG was canceled just before release since the company went under. Dieselpunk would be a nice MMO setting. :)
  • Stuka1000Stuka1000 Member UncommonPosts: 955
    Loke666 said:
    Stuka1000 said:
    There is already a Shadowrun online game out, Shadowrun Boston Lockdown I believe it's called.  It was originally going to be called Shadowrun Online but the reception was meh! so they changed the title and hid the online info in the small print.


    Apparently it changed again, it's called Shadowrun Chronicles now.
    There is also a Hong kong version. But it is a browser game so it isn't what Soraksis (or me for that matter) is looking for.

    A full blown SR MMO would be awesome. I wouldn't mind one based on FASAs old "Crimson skies" either. Sadly they just got the boardgame out, the RPG was canceled just before release since the company went under. Dieselpunk would be a nice MMO setting. :)

    Returns, Dragonfall & HK are made by a different company to the one that made Chronicles so who actually owns the license I have no idea.
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Stuka1000 said:

    Returns, Dragonfall & HK are made by a different company to the one that made Chronicles so who actually owns the license I have no idea.
    Catalyst Game Labs, they are still publishing the pen and paper game. Microsoft actually had the computer game license for a while and were planning a MMO but their crappy FPS game flopped so they canned it.
  • blueturtle13blueturtle13 Member LegendaryPosts: 11,981
    One of my favorite gaming worlds for sure. I am finishing Dragonfall right now and have Hong Kong waiting for me. The world really does lend itself to an MMO. Even more so an MMO with a more skill based progression system. Classes are already in place and the crafting could be really special.

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  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,335
    I've got two decades of Shadowrun books with half as many publishers on the spine.  For some reason SR just never sold as well as D&D or WoD.  It's changed hands more than a red headed step child on prom night.  FASA, WizKids (Used the play the shit out of their Clix games), Fanpro, Catalyst... probably forgetting a couple in between.  

    Shadowrun is one of those niche RPG's that never seems to get a well made game.  I was hyped as hell about the 2007 game and after about ten minutes of playing that toilet paper I was so pissed that I broke the CD and threw it in the trash.

    I even tried the isometric view Shadowrun RPG that's on steam.  Shadowrun Returns.  I don't know, it just didn't grab me.  Now that the MMO craze is over and the big money is chasing MOBA's, I just don't think that Shadowrun will ever get a shot.
  • SpectralHunterSpectralHunter Member UncommonPosts: 422
    Like it was mentioned, Shadowrun is a niche world.

    Honestly, it would be better to make a pure cyberpunk MMO without all the fantasy elements.  I think it would attract more players.
  • Stuka1000Stuka1000 Member UncommonPosts: 955
    edited September 2015
    A Cyberpunk style MMO has been tried before, neither was particularly well made or received. http://www.neocron-game.com/
    There was also  http://wiki.fomportal.com/w/Main_Page

  • SpectralHunterSpectralHunter Member UncommonPosts: 422
    Stuka1000 said:
    A Cyberpunk style MMO has been tried before, neither was particularly well made or received. http://www.neocron-game.com/There was alsohttp://wiki.fomportal.com/w/Main_Page
    Yes good point.  I don't think cyberpunk has enough of a fan base either but I think it may do better than Shadowrun that is cyberpunk/fantasy.  Just my take.
  • BurntvetBurntvet Member RarePosts: 3,465
    Yeah, there was a Shadowrun Online game put out years ago, it was a 4th rate arena shooter that traded on the IP and was an instant failure.

    Might be that the rights for another online/MMO version were or are tied up because of it.
  • MadimorgaMadimorga Member UncommonPosts: 1,920
    I keep hoping for a real Shadowrun MMO as it was my first real foray into dice and paper gaming. Someday, maybe.

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  • Flyte27Flyte27 Member RarePosts: 4,574
    I believe CD Red Project (the Witcher games) is working on a new cyberpunk game.  It's not an MMO, but it's not turn based either.  I enjoy the Shadownrun games.  I brought one on steam, but I think I'm going to start getting more games off Good old Games when I can.  They are a better company IMO and their games have no DRM.  There are some good new games there like Divinity Original Sin, Pillars of Eternity, and the new Shadowrun game (forget what it is called).  They even have their own game client they are working on to compete with steam (in terms of ease of use). 
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    H0urg1ass said:
    I've got two decades of Shadowrun books with half as many publishers on the spine.  For some reason SR just never sold as well as D&D or WoD.  It's changed hands more than a red headed step child on prom night.  FASA, WizKids (Used the play the shit out of their Clix games), Fanpro, Catalyst... probably forgetting a couple in between.  

    Shadowrun is one of those niche RPG's that never seems to get a well made game.  I was hyped as hell about the 2007 game and after about ten minutes of playing that toilet paper I was so pissed that I broke the CD and threw it in the trash.

    I even tried the isometric view Shadowrun RPG that's on steam.  Shadowrun Returns.  I don't know, it just didn't grab me.  Now that the MMO craze is over and the big money is chasing MOBA's, I just don't think that Shadowrun will ever get a shot.
    Well, Shadowrun would make one cool Moba but I think you are right about MMO in this MMO wave. I think MMOs will become large again in a few years though and then it wont be impossible, a game like SR would fit well with virtual reality once that becomes common.
  • AxehiltAxehilt Member RarePosts: 10,504
    I think a lot of the perceived unpopularity just comes from the quality level of the limited games which have come out. The Shadowrun FPS a while back was really bad looking, the RPG from Kickstarter was solid but not amazing, and the action-strategy game linked in this thread looked barely acceptable.

    I suppose Invisible, Inc is fairly cyberpunk-ish, and it's reasonably good. I'm playing through it slowly right now.

    Dystopia (old HL2 mod) is easily my favorite cyberpunk-inspired game, with the punks facing off against the corps in an objective-based team FPS. In "meatspace" (real-world) you had a standard shooter with a mix of standard light/medium troops and power armored heavies. You'd escort your decker to a terminal and guard him (since he's sitting there vulnerable) while he infiltrated cyberspace which was its own level entirely with crazy physics and enemy hackers to eliminate, before bypassing security, and then doing things that mattered a lot back in meatspace (enable/disable turrets, unlock doors, and even one level where you opened the floor out from underneath a room which killed everyone inside.)  The interplay between cyberspace and meatspace was fantastic, as each side was reliant on the other to win the match.

    I'd be all over a modern cyberpunk game that was similarly well-executed. That said, the genre definitely isn't as popular overall as the more common themes we see in games. It's also questionable whether it'd make a good MMORPG; I think it's probably possible, but there definitely aren't examples out there (and no Neocron doesn't count as "a good MMORPG")

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  • zimboy69zimboy69 Member UncommonPosts: 395
    the big question is  why no paranoia

     i would love a paranoia  mmo

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  • mmoguy43mmoguy43 Member UncommonPosts: 2,770
    There hasn't been much qualty put into a cyberpunk game beyond singleplayer games. Due to it being unproven few developers with the resources to make a quality and large scale multiplayer game want to dare making one. So it's been in a rut for a while now and will continue until a good team is assembled and has an amazing kickstarter campaign. 

    Neocron (best comparison would be Judge Dredd universe with Deus Ex1 gameplay) was good in it's time(2003-2007) for what it offered even though everything was rustic and not always fully functional. Neocron still manages to live on, surprisingly, outlasting dozens of better or more successful MMOs.

    I believe there is a large enough interest in more multiplayer cyberpunk games, maybe an MMO. There certainly is plenty of cool directions they can do with it as far as story and design. Mostly it comes down to what developer would be up to making a hit in an fairly untapped smaller market.
  • SoraksisSoraksis Member UncommonPosts: 294
    Yeah I see many many good points here, I think the main reason most of these attempts at mmos that are made based on table top really dont do well is because they sacrifice too much of the soul of the game to get a quicker launch or whatever.  Such as Neverwinter it had D&D classes but it did not feel like D&D at all really.  DDO was much closer but for it to be a successful MMO you need a more open explorable world.  I imagine if they fashioned a SR MMO more akin to Anarchy online with the vast open world the Guild vs. Guild pvp the guild headquarters being attackable the areas of the world flagged for all out open pvp that you had to risk traveling sometimes to get where you need to go much like the many SR missions I found myself running.  And the matrix being similar to AO's grid but add security programs to missions that have options for you to hack where you actually have combat taking place in the matrix.  You replace the mission hubs with visits or communique from your fixer or fixers.  I really think its do able and could be very successful.  Multiple factions would be a big plus, that is why WAR did so poorly they stripped the soul of the warhammer universe out of the game by making it a two faction game. 

    I think something along these lines would be more than a niche game,  it would be very refreshing and new.  Which is what I see many complaining about or asking for.
  • Asm0deusAsm0deus Member EpicPosts: 3,066
    edited September 2015
    Would love a Shadowrun MMO, enjoyed it on the snes and really liked the novels and  the mix of tech and magic.

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  • AlumicardAlumicard Member UncommonPosts: 388
    Stuka1000 said:
    A Cyberpunk style MMO has been tried before, neither was particularly well made or received. http://www.neocron-game.com/There was alsohttp://wiki.fomportal.com/w/Main_Page
    Yes good point.  I don't think cyberpunk has enough of a fan base either but I think it may do better than Shadowrun that is cyberpunk/fantasy.  Just my take.
    I'd say the fantasy part is what makes Shadowrun great and maybe even unique. And in terms of a MMO it offers many things that a pure cyberpunk game coudln't. Especially the new races and the return of magic could add some different things to the genre.

    In this setting you can do almost everything. From your basic raid a corp quest to hunting down vampires or zombies. And imo it is one thing to fight a boss of a corp with guns and what not but when this boss is a freaking dragon you better bring some heavy weapons and magic to the party!
  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441
    Alumicard said:
    Yes good point.  I don't think cyberpunk has enough of a fan base either but I think it may do better than Shadowrun that is cyberpunk/fantasy.  Just my take.
    I'd say the fantasy part is what makes Shadowrun great and maybe even unique. And in terms of a MMO it offers many things that a pure cyberpunk game coudln't. Especially the new races and the return of magic could add some different things to the genre.

    In this setting you can do almost everything. From your basic raid a corp quest to hunting down vampires or zombies. And imo it is one thing to fight a boss of a corp with guns and what not but when this boss is a freaking dragon you better bring some heavy weapons and magic to the party!
    Nah, it really comes down to how well the world is done. Any moron could mix fantasy and cyberpunk but Shadowrun have made it amazing.

    The cyberpunk RPG was never even close.
  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,335
    Loke666 said:
    H0urg1ass said:
    I've got two decades of Shadowrun books with half as many publishers on the spine.  For some reason SR just never sold as well as D&D or WoD.  It's changed hands more than a red headed step child on prom night.  FASA, WizKids (Used the play the shit out of their Clix games), Fanpro, Catalyst... probably forgetting a couple in between.  

    Shadowrun is one of those niche RPG's that never seems to get a well made game.  I was hyped as hell about the 2007 game and after about ten minutes of playing that toilet paper I was so pissed that I broke the CD and threw it in the trash.

    I even tried the isometric view Shadowrun RPG that's on steam.  Shadowrun Returns.  I don't know, it just didn't grab me.  Now that the MMO craze is over and the big money is chasing MOBA's, I just don't think that Shadowrun will ever get a shot.
    Well, Shadowrun would make one cool Moba but I think you are right about MMO in this MMO wave. I think MMOs will become large again in a few years though and then it wont be impossible, a game like SR would fit well with virtual reality once that becomes common.
    I hear you on that.  A Shadowrun MOBA might actually be the first one I would play.  Otherwise, they bore the ever living shit out of me.

    The thing with SR is that it's built around runs, which are essentially raids.  SR is 100% perfect for the MMO world.  Just as long as they don't fuck it up with classes and levels which SR never had.
  • Stuka1000Stuka1000 Member UncommonPosts: 955
    H0urg1ass said:
    Loke666 said:
    H0urg1ass said:
    I've got two decades of Shadowrun books with half as many publishers on the spine.  For some reason SR just never sold as well as D&D or WoD.  It's changed hands more than a red headed step child on prom night.  FASA, WizKids (Used the play the shit out of their Clix games), Fanpro, Catalyst... probably forgetting a couple in between.  

    Shadowrun is one of those niche RPG's that never seems to get a well made game.  I was hyped as hell about the 2007 game and after about ten minutes of playing that toilet paper I was so pissed that I broke the CD and threw it in the trash.

    I even tried the isometric view Shadowrun RPG that's on steam.  Shadowrun Returns.  I don't know, it just didn't grab me.  Now that the MMO craze is over and the big money is chasing MOBA's, I just don't think that Shadowrun will ever get a shot.
    Well, Shadowrun would make one cool Moba but I think you are right about MMO in this MMO wave. I think MMOs will become large again in a few years though and then it wont be impossible, a game like SR would fit well with virtual reality once that becomes common.
    I hear you on that.  A Shadowrun MOBA might actually be the first one I would play.  Otherwise, they bore the ever living shit out of me.

    The thing with SR is that it's built around runs, which are essentially raids.  SR is 100% perfect for the MMO world.  Just as long as they don't fuck it up with classes and levels which SR never had.

    Raids? no.  I would see the standard runs as something like instanced missions similar to what Ao offered back in the day.  Solo, Group or Solo with Ai Companions, there are a lot of options.
  • H0urg1assH0urg1ass Member EpicPosts: 2,335
    Stuka1000 said:
    H0urg1ass said:
    Loke666 said:
    H0urg1ass said:
    I've got two decades of Shadowrun books with half as many publishers on the spine.  For some reason SR just never sold as well as D&D or WoD.  It's changed hands more than a red headed step child on prom night.  FASA, WizKids (Used the play the shit out of their Clix games), Fanpro, Catalyst... probably forgetting a couple in between.  

    Shadowrun is one of those niche RPG's that never seems to get a well made game.  I was hyped as hell about the 2007 game and after about ten minutes of playing that toilet paper I was so pissed that I broke the CD and threw it in the trash.

    I even tried the isometric view Shadowrun RPG that's on steam.  Shadowrun Returns.  I don't know, it just didn't grab me.  Now that the MMO craze is over and the big money is chasing MOBA's, I just don't think that Shadowrun will ever get a shot.
    Well, Shadowrun would make one cool Moba but I think you are right about MMO in this MMO wave. I think MMOs will become large again in a few years though and then it wont be impossible, a game like SR would fit well with virtual reality once that becomes common.
    I hear you on that.  A Shadowrun MOBA might actually be the first one I would play.  Otherwise, they bore the ever living shit out of me.

    The thing with SR is that it's built around runs, which are essentially raids.  SR is 100% perfect for the MMO world.  Just as long as they don't fuck it up with classes and levels which SR never had.

    Raids? no.  I would see the standard runs as something like instanced missions similar to what Ao offered back in the day.  Solo, Group or Solo with Ai Companions, there are a lot of options.
    Instanced mission... raid.   Tomayto... tomahto.
  • KonfessKonfess Member RarePosts: 1,667
    Where were y'all when Matrix Online (MxO) was around?  It didn't have the Fantasy of Shadowrun.  For those that don't know or don't remember.  MxO was a cyberpunk leveled but fluid class based ThemeBox MMO set in the Matrix world.  Your level gave a fixed number of skill points.  These skill points could be spend unlocking any class skill tree combinations.  That could be given up and redistributed at any time (I know Kung Fu.)

    The problem with MxO, every stood around the phone booth.  THis phone was the bank, trainer, Inn, and just about everything else in game.  So it was Goldshire, where every hung out to RP, Duel, craft, or just talk.  The game was a massive world with a Variety of RP nightclubs dotting the landscape.  That went ignored.

    BTW I have all the manuals 1st ed through 3rd ed.  Plus I have the first 9 paperback novels.  In '93 I got hooked by MtG, so I passed on the rest of the series.



    Back on Topic,  The problem I have with any form of cyber punk is visualizing or virtualizing the in game hacking or online nature of the "Net."  The best I could come up with is an instance that takes on the identity of the "Net" site.  For instance, if you hack a French Corp then that site takes on the appearance of Court of Louis XIV.  You hack a Japan server, you find yourself in the Edo period.  Hack an Australian server wind up in Mad Max / Thunderdome.  The other idea I had was a Tron (Program vs User) world.  But that aspect of the game would only be available to hacking types.

    I have decided.  Imagine you are runners.  The target is a DefSubCon Corp. located 3.2km in the "real" world and 2.6km in the "Net."   Your entire party can dive with you, because everyone buys a direct neural interface implant (Varying Tiers and quality).  Jack in from afar, run the risk of being caught and dealt with by countermeasures.  Jack in from close by and risk a "real" world counter attack.  

    If the party checks into a nearby hotel, goes up to their suite.  Sets up their diving rigs and assumes a diving position.  The game could detect this and start background loading "Net" assets to make the transition seamless.  So long as players don't rush it.  A scripted cutscene of checking in and going to the room and setting up could hide the background work.  So long as the players don't run around exploring everything and everywhere.

    I'm liking the sound of this, I might just make it.

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  • TivianTivian Member UncommonPosts: 168
    The Shadowrun Chronicles Boston Lockdown looks good as a turn based game. reminds me of Blood Bowl. and Warhammer 40k's Space Hulk..the new one....turn based combat. 
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