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Star Citizen: Smart Offers $1M to Investigate, RSI Responds to Concerns

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  • KatillaKatilla Member UncommonPosts: 807
    Originally posted by Xeno.phon
    You know whats even more shady? A failure of a developer having $1m.

    lol QFT.  This guy it taking his (now refunded) $250 way too seriously and looking for media attention because he has realized that he is a has been.

  • psiicpsiic Member RarePosts: 1,590

    Boggles I say it a month after it launches that it needs open books with fiscal accountability and I get laughed off the forums, along comes this guy 2 years later and everyone is oh ah go get em...

    Every kickstarter project should be required as part of the free money to make their accounting books open for everyone that has donated money to review at all times. 

  • ShodanasShodanas Member RarePosts: 1,933
    Originally posted by MrSnuffles
    Originally posted by Dren_Utogi
    Originally posted by MrSnuffles
    Originally posted by Shodanas
    Originally posted by ShortyBible
    Originally posted by Shodanas

    After all this ruckus i wen't and checked mr. Smart's latest project called Line Of Defense. Visited the forums, tried to find any development info (there is none) and checked a dozen reviews made by people who entered LoD's alpha. Well, i won't get into any details but i can say this: it all makes sense now. 

     

    Just one thing: the game is still in alpha (in an extremely poor state according to the vast majority of the reviewers) and Smart is already selling DLC content worth over 120 $ .

    That is all irrelevant. The point you are missing is that Mr. Smart is using his own money

    to develop his game. Not other peoples money.

    The point you're missing is that Smart put together a sorry excuse of a game in order to bait people in buying not even released DLC's and various premium packs. In fact, many reviewers (check steam) are stating that they want their money back.

    So does that make it O.K. for CIG to do the same and selling ships that they never finish? What are you trying to say here?

    Are you saying that because people on steam want their money back that backers of CIG want their money back too and should get it?

    What exactly is it you are trying to say here?

    News flash.,this just in......

     

    Star Citizen isn't even released. Why would someone go on a full frontel offensive on items they have no grounds to be concerned with. It is a risk taking venture to back kickstarter games, get over it.

    Are you two brothers because you make as much sense as shodanas.

    Yes the game is not released, that i think is common knowledge. Have a cookie!

    You mean a full front[a]l offensive. Who is going on a full frontal offensive? Shodanas? Me? Because i never said anything about a full frontal offensive over items. 

    What items? Shodanas was ranting about Derek Smart and his DLC's, you talking about that?

    Get over what exactly? I am well aware of the fact how Kickstarter works. Never said anything to the contrary.

    Have faith!

     

    PS: I am getting bored with this as there is now only nonsense being posted by a couple hardcore forum warriors that feel the need to have the last word [post]. I just can't lower myself to that level, i don't understand what these people say. So there you go, you can have the last word. I bet it will be glorious!

    A) He wasn't referring to you. 

    B) "full frontal offense on items they have no grounds to be concerned with" is an expression regarding mr. Smart. Now, i'm not going to further analyze the meaning of this expression to you. If you can't grasp it... tough luck, you should have paid more attention at your English classes in school. 

     

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 9,495
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71

    Do you have any idea what it means when 16% of investors want to pull funding for any product?

    BTW I'm sure that poll on the games official forums isn't being influenced (wink wink), it started out at 31% IIRC when it was brought to most peoples attention here on MMORPG via DSmart.

     

    There is a reason CIG could not receive investment funding for this game and had to turn to KS.  Why might be a little clearer now to some.

    Are you referrring to this poll ? If not, please link your source.

    https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/239006/star-citizen-detailed-finance-information-to-backers

    "backers of the game should have access to CIG Semi-detailed Finances ?"  (141 votes)

    Yes  17,02 %

    No   82,98 %

    You do realize that nothing there says "want to pull funding" ?

     

    The reason CIG did not get investment funding was that the Space Sim genre was essentially dead and anyone wanting to create a PC only game that was too high end for the mediocre console hardware was a NO GO for all big publishers. They want to sell cross platform crap by the millions, preferably as part of an existing series that can be milked to death over years with minimal extra work, EVERY year, like clockwork.

     

    Have fun

  • MMOGamer71MMOGamer71 Member UncommonPosts: 1,944
    Originally posted by Erillion
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71

    Do you have any idea what it means when 16% of investors want to pull funding for any product?

    BTW I'm sure that poll on the games official forums isn't being influenced (wink wink), it started out at 31% IIRC when it was brought to most peoples attention here on MMORPG via DSmart.

     

    There is a reason CIG could not receive investment funding for this game and had to turn to KS.  Why might be a little clearer now to some.

    Are you referrring to this poll ? If not, please link your source.

    https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/239006/star-citizen-detailed-finance-information-to-backers

    "backers of the game should have access to CIG Semi-detailed Finances ?"  (141 votes)

    Yes  17,02 %

    No   82,98 %

    You do realize that nothing there says "want to pull funding" ?

     

    The reason CIG did not get investment funding was that the Space Sim genre was essentially dead and anyone wanting to create a PC only game that was too high end for the mediocre console hardware was a NO GO for all big publishers. They want to sell cross platform crap by the millions, preferably as part of an existing series that can be milked to death over years with minimal extra work, EVERY year, like clockwork.

     

    Have fun

    No the other poll, something about refund process etc etc.

  • HorusraHorusra Member EpicPosts: 4,021
    Originally posted by psiic

    Boggles I say it a month after it launches that it needs open books with fiscal accountability and I get laughed off the forums, along comes this guy 2 years later and everyone is oh ah go get em...

    Every kickstarter project should be required as part of the free money to make their accounting books open for everyone that has donated money to review at all times. 

    That is why it is called a donation and not an investment.  You have not right to anything when you just give them money.  If people are willing to DONATE they should accept the risks that come with that.  There are civil courts to try and recoup if it was an outright lie, but in the end you give up most of your access to the company and rights when you donate.

  • MrSnufflesMrSnuffles Member UncommonPosts: 1,117
    Originally posted by Shodanas
    Originally posted by MrSnuffles
    Originally posted by Dren_Utogi
    Originally posted by MrSnuffles
    Originally posted by Shodanas
    Originally posted by ShortyBible
    Originally posted by Shodanas

    After all this ruckus i wen't and checked mr. Smart's latest project called Line Of Defense. Visited the forums, tried to find any development info (there is none) and checked a dozen reviews made by people who entered LoD's alpha. Well, i won't get into any details but i can say this: it all makes sense now. 

     

    Just one thing: the game is still in alpha (in an extremely poor state according to the vast majority of the reviewers) and Smart is already selling DLC content worth over 120 $ .

    That is all irrelevant. The point you are missing is that Mr. Smart is using his own money

    to develop his game. Not other peoples money.

    The point you're missing is that Smart put together a sorry excuse of a game in order to bait people in buying not even released DLC's and various premium packs. In fact, many reviewers (check steam) are stating that they want their money back.

    So does that make it O.K. for CIG to do the same and selling ships that they never finish? What are you trying to say here?

    Are you saying that because people on steam want their money back that backers of CIG want their money back too and should get it?

    What exactly is it you are trying to say here?

    News flash.,this just in......

     

    Star Citizen isn't even released. Why would someone go on a full frontel offensive on items they have no grounds to be concerned with. It is a risk taking venture to back kickstarter games, get over it.

    Are you two brothers because you make as much sense as shodanas.

    Yes the game is not released, that i think is common knowledge. Have a cookie!

    You mean a full front[a]l offensive. Who is going on a full frontal offensive? Shodanas? Me? Because i never said anything about a full frontal offensive over items. 

    What items? Shodanas was ranting about Derek Smart and his DLC's, you talking about that?

    Get over what exactly? I am well aware of the fact how Kickstarter works. Never said anything to the contrary.

    Have faith!

     

    PS: I am getting bored with this as there is now only nonsense being posted by a couple hardcore forum warriors that feel the need to have the last word [post]. I just can't lower myself to that level, i don't understand what these people say. So there you go, you can have the last word. I bet it will be glorious!

    A) He wasn't referring to you. 

    B) "full frontal offense on items they have no grounds to be concerned with" is an expression regarding mr. Smart. Now, i'm not going to further analyze the meaning of this expression to you. If you can't grasp it... tough luck, you should have paid more attention at your English classes in school. 

     

    Well done, you really showed me this time!

    /smh

    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

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    Community Manager, MMORPG.com

    "As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law

    "I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." 
    - SEANMCAD

    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
  • TealaTeala Member RarePosts: 7,621

    OK, I think many people concede that Derek Smart asked some questions that needed asked.   With that said, Derek is just being a tool and a douche now.   RSI owes him nothing...absolutely nothing.   Derek can rant and rave all he wants and it will make not a bit of difference.   So why is anyone still giving him "attention"?

    I backed Star Citizen.  I even spent more than Derek did(Derek gave $250) and you don't see me making demands of Chris Roberts.   Why?   Because - when you back a crowd funded project it is like an investment in any type of business.   It either comes to fruition or it doesn't.   We're not at that point yet where we can say without a doubt that the "game" is vaporware yet.   It's not been long enough.   Games of this magnitude do take time.   I understand that RSI has gotten side tracked and produced a crappy "Arena Commander" proto-game to appease the backers and had planed to release Star Marines(both projects were supposedly test beds for technology that would lead to SQ42 and SC) - that still doesn't mean that the planed games SQ42 and SC won't be released(atleast not yet).

    Even if SQ42 or SC doesn't get released - guess what - I made the choice to invest.  It's a risk you take when you do business.  There is no guarantee that it will succeed.  Cut your losses and learn from your mistake.   If SQ42 and SC do fail to launch...then I'll have learned a valuable lesson and will probably never fund another crowd funded game again.   Chris Roberts will become synonymous for failing in a huge way(and probably never see any of his projects get made in the future) and the gaming industry will no doubt be turned on it's head for some time as they try to sort out how to proceed in the future with such endeavors. 

    Good thing is Elite:Dangerous looks to still be hitting their marks and the game is coming along quite nicely.  So not all my investments have been a bust.  But if I do get burned by Chris Roberts - that be that and I'll just move on.  

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 9,495
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71

    No the other poll, something about refund process etc etc.

    So you mean that one ? If not that one, please provide a link.

    https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/271799/are-refunds-for-our-packages-ships-from-cig-now-okay-to-be-requested

    "Would you like there to be a publically available refund process now, given this latest development?"

    Where 3/4th of 1173 votes are not interested in a refund process.

    That poll is not about the number of people that want a refund.

    However it is often misquoted as being about the number of people that want a refund, with a fictional 30 % most often named as the result of the poll.

     

    Have fun

  • FoomerangFoomerang Member UncommonPosts: 5,618

    Last time I heard anything from Mr Smart, he was trolling up the Planetside 2 forums. What's with this guy?

  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 12,164
    Originally posted by Foomerang

    Last time I heard anything from Mr Smart, he was trolling up the Planetside 2 forums. What's with this guy?

    Here's a quick synopsis: (Wikipedia)

     

    The Derek Smart Flame Wars, or simply The Great Flame War Of 1999 as it is sometimes called, is an ongoing internetflamewar that originated in the Usenet newsgroups in 1996 and has been in constant development since. It has since spread to virtually all internet fora. The subject matter of the war was originally Derek Smart's computer game Battlecruiser 3000AD. Derek Smart himself, until 1999 under the alias Supreme Commander was an active participant in the war.

     

    You can start from there....

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  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,180
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71
    Originally posted by Victor_Kruger
    Originally posted by MMOGamer71
    Originally posted by Avarix
    Either the questions and issues he is raising are legitimate or they're not. I don't understand why his character and past are being brought up. By attacking his character instead of his concerns it's turning this into a bigger issue than it needs to be. He, as a person, doesn't matter. Even if he has an agenda against this company, it doesn't matter. The concerns are valid or they're not. It shouldn't matter who is asking them.

    It's easier to "dehumanize" a person(s)  than to address the issue(s) they may have.  Political playbook page 1.

    Smart crowned himself "Internet Warlord", he dehumanize himself to the point most people are not going to take what he says seriously anymore. 

    That explains why it's a 3-4 day story already, bottom line his "issues" have merit and it's on his own blog paid for buy his $.  BTW Internet Warlord is a pretty bad ass title, maybe CGI will sell it for $50.

    It's a story because it brings in 200+ posts and god knows how many clicks a day... that's goal number one for sites like this.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • RosenborgRosenborg Member UncommonPosts: 152
    Originally posted by Teala

    OK, I think many people concede that Derek Smart asked some questions that needed asked.   With that said, Derek is just being a tool and a douche now.   RSI owes him nothing...absolutely nothing.   Derek can rant and rave all he wants and it will make not a bit of difference.   So why is anyone still giving him "attention"?

    I backed Star Citizen.  I even spent more than Derek did(Derek gave $250) and you don't see me making demands of Chris Roberts.   Why?   Because - when you back a crowd funded project it is like an investment in any type of business.   It either comes to fruition or it doesn't.   We're not at that point yet where we can say without a doubt that the "game" is vaporware yet.   It's not been long enough.   Games of this magnitude do take time.   I understand that RSI has gotten side tracked and produced a crappy "Arena Commander" proto-game to appease the backers and had planed to release Star Marines(both projects were supposedly test beds for technology that would lead to SQ42 and SC) - that still doesn't mean that the planed games SQ42 and SC won't be released(atleast not yet).

    Even if SQ42 or SC doesn't get released - guess what - I made the choice to invest.  It's a risk you take when you do business.  There is no guarantee that it will succeed.  Cut your losses and learn from your mistake.   If SQ42 and SC do fail to launch...then I'll have learned a valuable lesson and will probably never fund another crowd funded game again.   Chris Roberts will become synonymous for failing in a huge way(and probably never see any of his projects get made in the future) and the gaming industry will no doubt be turned on it's head for some time as they try to sort out how to proceed in the future with such endeavors. 

    Good thing is Elite:Dangerous looks to still be hitting their marks and the game is coming along quite nicely.  So not all my investments have been a bust.  But if I do get burned by Chris Roberts - that be that and I'll just move on.  

    Well said. I've smoked tens of thousends of dollars in the air (through my lungs) and also bought ArcheAge founders pack so I honestly I don't really even care if I get the games or not.

    Kinda like what Gandhi once said,

    “There are two days in the year that we can not do anything, yesterday and tomorrow”

    Life goes on.

     

     

  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,768
    Originally posted by Teala

    OK, I think many people concede that Derek Smart asked some questions that needed asked.   With that said, Derek is just being a tool and a douche now.   RSI owes him nothing...absolutely nothing.   Derek can rant and rave all he wants and it will make not a bit of difference.   So why is anyone still giving him "attention"?

    I backed Star Citizen.  I even spent more than Derek did(Derek gave $250) and you don't see me making demands of Chris Roberts.   Why?   Because - when you back a crowd funded project it is like an investment in any type of business.   It either comes to fruition or it doesn't.   We're not at that point yet where we can say without a doubt that the "game" is vaporware yet.   It's not been long enough.   Games of this magnitude do take time.   I understand that RSI has gotten side tracked and produced a crappy "Arena Commander" proto-game to appease the backers and had planed to release Star Marines(both projects were supposedly test beds for technology that would lead to SQ42 and SC) - that still doesn't mean that the planed games SQ42 and SC won't be released(atleast not yet).

    Even if SQ42 or SC doesn't get released - guess what - I made the choice to invest.  It's a risk you take when you do business.  There is no guarantee that it will succeed.  Cut your losses and learn from your mistake.   If SQ42 and SC do fail to launch...then I'll have learned a valuable lesson and will probably never fund another crowd funded game again.   Chris Roberts will become synonymous for failing in a huge way(and probably never see any of his projects get made in the future) and the gaming industry will no doubt be turned on it's head for some time as they try to sort out how to proceed in the future with such endeavors. 

    Good thing is Elite:Dangerous looks to still be hitting their marks and the game is coming along quite nicely.  So not all my investments have been a bust.  But if I do get burned by Chris Roberts - that be that and I'll just move on.  

    +1000

    Thank you Teala!

    http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html  

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  • OzmodanOzmodan Member EpicPosts: 9,354

    Funny, about the only thing the Star Citizen proponents can seem to do in this matter is flame Derek Smart.  What they should be doing is questioning how they have spent all this money on a game that will never be what was promised.

    When they started to sell those expensive ships, it was time to bail.   

  • shassshass Member UncommonPosts: 107
    Never be what it promised? Yep Smart would know about that.. http://www.gamespot.com/reviews/battlecruiser-3000-ad-review/1900-2538148/    The man is a joke.
  • vgamervgamer Member Posts: 195

    If derek smart wants it so badly, let him investigate. I am confident he won't find anything because CR would never ever cheat us backers. We, the people who have spent a lot of money would give our lives to see star citizen come through. I mean, if smart people like erillion have put thousands of dollars and countless hours into this, could the game realy turn out to be bad?

    I don't think so.

     

    Enjoy!

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,180
    Originally posted by Ozmodan

    Funny, about the only thing the Star Citizen proponents can seem to do in this matter is flame Derek Smart.  What they should be doing is questioning how they have spent all this money on a game that will never be what was promised.

    When they started to sell those expensive ships, it was time to bail.   

    I'm no SC proponent, I've done little more than watch a video or two on it, no backing, highly skeptical it will even release. That doesn't change my opinion that DS is completely manipulating this story to his favor. He's taking those real concerns people should have to exploit them. In order to get this level of attention and scrutiny to his chief rival at this time, if this game does release, he knows he'll lose many of if not most customers he does get with his attempts at games like this.

    On the other hand it could be said that folks who have obvious strong feelings against SC, crowdfunding etc (your statements make that obvious)... want so badly for these accusations to be true, you're willing to side with anyone site unseen in hopes to see the crash you so very much want to see happen to Roberts and his product.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • KefoKefo Member EpicPosts: 3,785
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by LacedOpium
     

     

    All CIG has to do is answer a short list of 8 demands?  That is all.  What is so unreasonable about that?  And there would be no lawsuit if they did that.  As matter of fact, this would all just go away and CIG can continue on their way to developing the game peacefully.  Not only that, it would probably garner them so much in terms of good relations PR that they would probably receive a substantial increase in contributions as a result.  The fact that CIG is refusing to answer to those 8 questions is an admission of guilt in and of itself.  Particularly when taking into account best and worst case scenarios.  Alas, it's not looking good for CIG at this point.  And it is all of their own doing.

    Sure that may be what  the backers want and all that backers want... I highly doubt that's where Smart would stop though.

    It shouldn't be all that hard to create a contract with both Derek's and CIG lawyers that would state that the money he is putting up is to be used only for the purpose of hiring a forensic accountant in order to see if there has been any financial mismanagement and if there has what scale it is. There could be a clause that says this 1m does not entitle him to any stake in the company or allow him to dictate terms or make demands on the basis that he used 1m of his own cash to hire these people. If he refuses to sign then you know exactly where it's headed

  • ShortyBibleShortyBible Member UncommonPosts: 409
    Originally posted by Shodanas
    Originally posted by ShortyBible
    Originally posted by Shodanas

    After all this ruckus i wen't and checked mr. Smart's latest project called Line Of Defense. Visited the forums, tried to find any development info (there is none) and checked a dozen reviews made by people who entered LoD's alpha. Well, i won't get into any details but i can say this: it all makes sense now. 

     

    Just one thing: the game is still in alpha (in an extremely poor state according to the vast majority of the reviewers) and Smart is already selling DLC content worth over 120 $ .

    That is all irrelevant. The point you are missing is that Mr. Smart is using his own money

    to develop his game. Not other peoples money.

    The point you're missing is that Smart put together a sorry excuse of a game in order to bait people in buying not even released DLC's and various premium packs. In fact, many reviewers (check steam) are stating that they want their money back.

    Still irrelevant. This is not about Mr. Smart. (He is the messenger) In short he is asking if all that money

    is being used to make a game, or if the money is being converted into company assets.

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,180
    Originally posted by Kefo

    Sure that may be what  the backers want and all that backers want... I highly doubt that's where Smart would stop though.

    It shouldn't be all that hard to create a contract with both Derek's and CIG lawyers that would state that the money he is putting up is to be used only for the purpose of hiring a forensic accountant in order to see if there has been any financial mismanagement and if there has what scale it is. There could be a clause that says this 1m does not entitle him to any stake in the company or allow him to dictate terms or make demands on the basis that he used 1m of his own cash to hire these people. If he refuses to sign then you know exactly where it's headed

    I was referring more to his troll tactics really, not exactly more legal proceedings or intrusions. He'll carry on the show as long as he can to drum up as much concern about this title as he can. That's just what he does, losing any part of the battle outright (say the forensic accountability)  will just strengthen his resolve. Not that that's important, it was just an observation.

     

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • dsmartdsmart Member UncommonPosts: 386

    I am going to make a single post to say that, once the mainstream media who have informed me that they are doing their investigations, start doing their own reporting, these people will - hopefully - stop making this about me.

    The fact is this - and I want all of you to remember this - I will be 100% vindicated when the truth comes out. No question about it.

    And when that happens, we can all sit back and ponder what has gone on here, and why people have found it necessary (race, jealousy, what?) to attack me, while trying to completely deflect from the questions being asked.

    It is only a matter of time. I am right. And I will be vindicated.

    You think the White Knights are pissed now? Wait till my NY Times ad article goes up. Then we'll see.

    Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
    If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
    ...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.

  • ShortyBibleShortyBible Member UncommonPosts: 409
    Originally posted by dsmart

    I am going to make a single post to say that, once the mainstream media who have informed me that they are doing their investigations, start doing their own reporting, these people will - hopefully - stop making this about me.

    The fact is this - and I want all of you to remember this - I will be 100% vindicated when the truth comes out. No question about it.

    And when that happens, we can all sit back and ponder what has gone on here, and why people have found it necessary (race, jealousy, what?) to attack me, while trying to completely deflect from the questions being asked.

    It is only a matter of time. I am right. And I will be vindicated.

    You think the White Knights are pissed now? Wait till my NY Times ad article goes up. Then we'll see.

    Looking forward to reading it Mr. Smart :)

    It is very simple. They try to discredit the messenger so as to drown the message.

  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,479
    I'm sorry but smart looks like that ultimate troll in all of this.

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  • SpottyGekkoSpottyGekko Member EpicPosts: 6,841
    Originally posted by dsmart

    ....

    You think the White Knights are pissed now? Wait till my NY Times ad article goes up. Then we'll see.

    Should be good for a laugh...

     

    When is the publishing date ? You're paying for it, so you should know that.

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